43 Ft Vertical and Elecraft Tuners

[Charlie T, K3ICH]

Remember the old Hy-Gain "Hy-Tower" ?  It had tuning stubs brought out from
various places in order to provide resonance on 10, 15 & 20 M, maybe even
one for 40M.  I have a manual around here but am too lazy to go find it.
Anyway, I believe it was 57 feet overall and was rated for 80 - 10 M.  You
could add a base loading coil and an additional length of wire off the top
mast for 160M.  With an adequate radial system, they were the "cat's meow"
of verticals back then.   I always wondered how the connection points for
those "resonators" was determined.  Probably to limit interaction with other
bands (??)  Maybe some sort of similar set-up could be done with parallel
wire stubs.

I remember trying to tune a four pair parallel wire dipole for 20, 17 , 15
and 10 M.  What a bear.  Tweak one band and it would screw up the others.  I
finally got it tuned, but had to completely replace all the wires since I
had chopped and re-soldered all of them so many times.   I used ½" PVC pipe
spreaders which kept the four wires about 2" from each other.   Once up, it
would have been impossible to re-deploy due to tangles.

73, Charlie k3ICH


----- Original Message -----
From: "Jim Brown" <[hidden email]>
To: <[hidden email]>
Sent: Tuesday, September 03, 2013 11:03 PM
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] 43 Ft Vertical and Elecraft Tuners

> On 9/3/2013 7:30 PM, Fred Jensen wrote:
>> With the KPA500 at 500W, on 40m, I get a lot of RF from the GAP screwing
>> up things like the WinKey, the laptop, and various other digital gadgets.
>
> The first thing I would do is put a serious ferrite choke on the coax at
> the antenna.  If that doesn't fix it, I'd say it's radiation from the
> antenna itself.
>
> 73, Jim
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html 

______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

[EricJ-2]

I had a HyTower in the late 60's. It worked well for me for several
years in two locations. Istill haven't figured out how it worked
exactly. I would sure like to hear an explanation of what those stubs
actually did and how they were determined. Somebody must have written an
analysis, but I have yet to find one.

Eric
KE6US

On 9/3/2013 8:35 PM, Charlie T, K3ICH wrote:

> Remember the old Hy-Gain "Hy-Tower" ?  It had tuning stubs brought out
> from various places in order to provide resonance on 10, 15 & 20 M,
> maybe even one for 40M.  I have a manual around here but am too lazy
> to go find it. Anyway, I believe it was 57 feet overall and was rated
> for 80 - 10 M.  You could add a base loading coil and an additional
> length of wire off the top mast for 160M.  With an adequate radial
> system, they were the "cat's meow" of verticals back then.   I always
> wondered how the connection points for those "resonators" was
> determined. Probably to limit interaction with other bands (??)  Maybe
> some sort of similar set-up could be done with parallel wire stubs.
>
> I remember trying to tune a four pair parallel wire dipole for 20, 17
> , 15 and 10 M.  What a bear.  Tweak one band and it would screw up the
> others.  I finally got it tuned, but had to completely replace all the
> wires since I had chopped and re-soldered all of them so many times.  
> I used ½" PVC pipe spreaders which kept the four wires about 2" from
> each other.   Once up, it would have been impossible to re-deploy due
> to tangles.
>
> 73, Charlie k3ICH
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jim Brown"
> <[hidden email]>
> To: <[hidden email]>
> Sent: Tuesday, September 03, 2013 11:03 PM
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] 43 Ft Vertical and Elecraft Tuners
>
>
>> On 9/3/2013 7:30 PM, Fred Jensen wrote:
>>> With the KPA500 at 500W, on 40m, I get a lot of RF from the GAP
>>> screwing up things like the WinKey, the laptop, and various other
>>> digital gadgets.
>>
>> The first thing I would do is put a serious ferrite choke on the coax
>> at the antenna.  If that doesn't fix it, I'd say it's radiation from
>> the antenna itself.
>>
>> 73, Jim
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> Elecraft mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html 
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>
>

______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

[Don Wilhelm-4]

I use paralleled dipoles here, and I have limited the number of bands on
a single feedline to 3 bands, so I have one for 20, 15, and 10 meters,
and another for 30, 17, and 12.  The wires are spaced about 1 foot apart
with PVC spreaders.

Tuning them is a bit of a challenge, but if one tunes the lowest band
first, and then progresses to the next higher band, it can be done.  Do
not try to mix 3rd harmonic bands such as 40 meters and 15 meters, or 80
meters and 30 meters.

I do have a 3rd dual band for 80 and 40, but the radiators are arranged
at right angles to each other so there is little interactions between
those 2 bands.

73,
Don W3FPR

On 9/3/2013 11:35 PM, Charlie T, K3ICH wrote:
> I remember trying to tune a four pair parallel wire dipole for 20, 17
> , 15 and 10 M.  What a bear.  Tweak one band and it would screw up the
> others.  I finally got it tuned, but had to completely replace all the
> wires since I had chopped and re-soldered all of them so many times.  
> I used ½" PVC pipe spreaders which kept the four wires about 2" from
> each other. Once up, it would have been impossible to re-deploy due to
> tangles.
>

______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

[Jim Brown-10]

On 9/3/2013 9:16 PM, Don Wilhelm wrote:
> I use paralleled dipoles here, and I have limited the number of bands
> on a single feedline to 3 bands, so I have one for 20, 15, and 10
> meters, and another for 30, 17, and 12.  The wires are spaced about 1
> foot apart with PVC spreaders.

I like fan dipoles a lot, and quickly came to all of the same
conclusions you did. One thing I learned from modeling is that the
lowest frequency band has the same SWR bandwidth of a single dipole, but
the dipoles for higher frequencies have roughly half the SWR bandwidth.

73, Jim K9YC
______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html