Elecraft

Balun suggestions

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David Cutter

Re: Balun suggestions

DJ0IP must be one of, if not the post prolific testers of baluns and chokes
*attached to aerials* ever. He does not measure them in the lab. His
measurements are practical and done with rigour using modest equipment. He has
done thousands of measurements for common mode current, only a fraction of which
are on his website. Some of his results are not complimentary to commercial
balun manufacturers. Caveat emptor. I'm glad his work is beginning to be
recognised.

David, G3UNA

>
> On 04 February 2016 at 23:10 Bob McGraw K4TAX <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>
> As one that has personally used a balanced fed antennas for years, I
> suggest you review the info on this site.
> http://www.dj0ip.de/balun-stuff/ <http://www.dj0ip.de/balun-stuff/>
>
> Good stuff on evaluating or building a proper balun.
>
> And for open wire fed antennas:
> http://www.dj0ip.de/open-wire-fed-ant/
>
> To answer your question, a high power 1:1 current balun is likely best.
> Of course you could built a balanced tuner as I did. Problem solved.
> That's another story.
>
> Keep in mind that balun power ratings are for "matched" conditions.
> Which in fact is never the case with a center fed wire and open wire or
> a balanced feed line. At a mighty 5 watts it would not be of concern.
>
> If at all possible, run the balanced feed line from the antenna feed
> point all the way to the operating position. Keep the coax run between
> the tuner output and balun input as short as practical. After all, the
> reason to use balanced feed line is to take advantage of the low loss
> properties.
>
> Never fear, the use of balanced feed line is not near as critical or
> fussy as the "masses" will so tout. Many hams express fear in using
> balanced feed systems, largely because of what they have heard. Mostly
> because it frankly isn't fact. Mine feeds a 256 ft center fed wire and
> comes down the tower supported on home made 9" PVC stand-offs, through
> the attic eve vent, across the roof rafters, and drops down through the
> ceiling to the tuner on the shelf above the desk. Not bad for a 160M -
> 10M antenna. {see my pix on QRZ.COM that shows a bit of the line
> going up the wall.}
>
> 73
> Bob, K4TAX
>
> <http://www.dj0ip.de/open-wire-fed-ant/>
>
> On 2/4/2016 2:55 PM, Jim Allen wrote:
> > K2/100 and KAT100 here.
> >
> > I am changing around my modest antenna configuration now. I have been
> > using the K2/100 with my AH-4, and now wish to use the KAT100 with
> > balanced feedline antennas.
> >
> > What balun, homebrew or commercial, if any, should I use? I almost
> > always run 5 watts, all CW.
> >
> > 73 de W6OGC Jim Allen
> >
> > Sent from my iPad
> > ______________________________________________________________
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> > Post: mailto:[hidden email]
> >
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> >
>
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Eric Swartz - WA6HHQ

Re: Balun suggestions

Administrator

In reply to this post by Wes (N7WS)

Guys - please take this off reflector until you are in agreement.

73

Eric
List Moderator
/elecraft.com/

On 2/5/2016 8:15 PM, Ron D'Eau Claire wrote:

> Gee, Wes. It's only basic RF engineering.
>
> If you'd care to be specific about any objection, please do so. I'll be glad
> to get into details on or off the reflector.
>
> 73, Ron AC7AC
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Elecraft [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Wes
> (N7WS)
> Sent: Thursday, February 4, 2016 4:18 PM
> To: [hidden email]
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Balun suggestions
>
> I just pinched myself; I'm not dreaming and it's not April 1st, so I guess
> you're serious.
>
> You are also so wrong on so many points, I'm not going to waste time trying
> to refute or correct them.
>
> Jim, please ignore everything said below.
>
> Wes N7WS
>
>
>
> On 2/4/2016 3:05 PM, Ron D'Eau Claire wrote:
>> Your feed line will do the job by itself so no additional "balun" is
> needed.
>> Keep in mind that a 1:1 balun is really just a length of feed line,
>> usually wound on a toroidal core to make the required length shorter
>> than if it was in open air. The "old-school" baluns were just a pair of
> air wound coils.
>> If your balanced feed line is at least 1/4 wavelength long, the
>> currents will be "balanced" (equal and out of phase) at the antenna.
>> That assumes your antenna is perfectly balanced to provide a perfectly
>> balanced load, which "balanced" antennas almost never do. There are
>> just too many variables. So expect excellent results even with shorter
>> feed lines. The amount of radiation (or pickup) from the feed line
>> even at the rig end is small in any case.
>>
>> Connect one side of the open wire feed line to the KAT100 SO-239
>> center pin and the other to the KAT100 ground terminal.
>>
>> 73, Ron AC7AC
>>
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> K2/100 and KAT100 here.
>>
>> I am changing around my modest antenna configuration now. I have been
>> using the K2/100 with my AH-4, and now wish to use the KAT100 with
>> balanced feedline antennas.
>>
>> What balun, homebrew or commercial, if any, should I use? I almost
>> always run 5 watts, all CW.
>>
>> 73 de W6OGC Jim Allen
>>
>>
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> Elecraft mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email
>> list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to
>> [hidden email]
>>
> ______________________________________________________________
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> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message
> delivered to [hidden email]
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
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>

Eric Swartz - WA6HHQ

Re: Balun suggestions

Administrator

Ignore my last - I mistakenly replied to an old email.

Eric
/elecraft.com/

On 2/9/2016 1:04 PM, Eric Swartz - WA6HHQ, Elecraft wrote:

> Guys - please take this off reflector until you are in agreement.
>
> 73
>
> Eric
> List Moderator
> /elecraft.com/
>
> On 2/5/2016 8:15 PM, Ron D'Eau Claire wrote:
>> Gee, Wes. It's only basic RF engineering.
>>
>> If you'd care to be specific about any objection, please do so. I'll be glad
>> to get into details on or off the reflector.
>>
>> 73, Ron AC7AC
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Elecraft [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Wes
>> (N7WS)
>> Sent: Thursday, February 4, 2016 4:18 PM
>> To: [hidden email]
>> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Balun suggestions
>>
>> I just pinched myself; I'm not dreaming and it's not April 1st, so I guess
>> you're serious.
>>
>> You are also so wrong on so many points, I'm not going to waste time trying
>> to refute or correct them.
>>
>> Jim, please ignore everything said below.
>>
>> Wes N7WS
>>
>>
>>
>> On 2/4/2016 3:05 PM, Ron D'Eau Claire wrote:
>>> Your feed line will do the job by itself so no additional "balun" is
>> needed.
>>> Keep in mind that a 1:1 balun is really just a length of feed line,
>>> usually wound on a toroidal core to make the required length shorter
>>> than if it was in open air. The "old-school" baluns were just a pair of
>> air wound coils.
>>> If your balanced feed line is at least 1/4 wavelength long, the
>>> currents will be "balanced" (equal and out of phase) at the antenna.
>>> That assumes your antenna is perfectly balanced to provide a perfectly
>>> balanced load, which "balanced" antennas almost never do. There are
>>> just too many variables. So expect excellent results even with shorter
>>> feed lines. The amount of radiation (or pickup) from the feed line
>>> even at the rig end is small in any case.
>>>
>>> Connect one side of the open wire feed line to the KAT100 SO-239
>>> center pin and the other to the KAT100 ground terminal.
>>>
>>> 73, Ron AC7AC
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> K2/100 and KAT100 here.
>>>
>>> I am changing around my modest antenna configuration now. I have been
>>> using the K2/100 with my AH-4, and now wish to use the KAT100 with
>>> balanced feedline antennas.
>>>
>>> What balun, homebrew or commercial, if any, should I use? I almost
>>> always run 5 watts, all CW.
>>>
>>> 73 de W6OGC Jim Allen
>>>
>>>
>>> ______________________________________________________________
>>> Elecraft mailing list
>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>>
>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email
>>> list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to
>>> [hidden email]
>>>
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> Elecraft mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message
>> delivered to [hidden email]
>>
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> Elecraft mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>>
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>