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Concentric knobs??

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tomb18

Concentric knobs??

Ok,

I have found my first glitch with the K3. The concentric knob holes are so out of round that I cannot get the knobs to work unless the smaller one is way above the other. Is this a problem with my knobs or are they all like that? When all is said and done, I paid over 5k for this radio and the knobs are really poor whereas everything else is top notch.
If they are all like that, are there alternatives that look the same?

Thanks

wayne burdick

Re: Concentric knobs??

Administrator

This should *never* happen. If you email k3support you'll get
replacements immediately.

73,
Wayne
N6KR

On Jun 21, 2011, at 8:06 PM, tomb18 wrote:

> Ok,
>
> I have found my first glitch with the K3. The concentric knob holes
> are so
> out of round that I cannot get the knobs to work unless the smaller
> one is
> way above the other. Is this a problem with my knobs or are they
> all like
> that? When all is said and done, I paid over 5k for this radio and
> the knobs
> are really poor whereas everything else is top notch.
> If they are all like that, are there alternatives that look the same?
>
> Thanks
>

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hb9ari@bluewin.ch

Re: Concentric knobs??

In reply to this post by tomb18

Hello,

I also have a "problem" with concentric knobs.(K3 #1212)
An external one was broken since the beginning.
The 1st time i move it, he was slipping over the shaft;
as it's related to the sub-receiver, i don't ask for a new one.

The only annoying problem i get since some time is an
unstable contact at the rear line-out min-jack (3.5mm) connector.
(i suspect the audio input too) As the #1212 is out of warranty,
i've planned to find a more reliable solution, excluding these
2 mini-jacks. One of my task during next vacations ( in 3 weeks)

Otherwise, always 100% fan of my K3 !

73 QRO,
Rudi, HB9ARI

On 22.06.2011 05:06, tomb18 wrote:

> Ok,
>
> I have found my first glitch with the K3. The concentric knob holes are so
> out of round that I cannot get the knobs to work unless the smaller one is
> way above the other. Is this a problem with my knobs or are they all like
> that? When all is said and done, I paid over 5k for this radio and the knobs
> are really poor whereas everything else is top notch.
> If they are all like that, are there alternatives that look the same?
>
> Thanks
>
> --
> View this message in context: http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/Concentric-knobs-tp6502754p6502754.html
> Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

Don Wilhelm-4

Re: Concentric knobs??

Rudi,

Why are you suffering with that broken knob problem? Elecraft
recognized that the early knobs were breaking and had them
re-constructed with stronger material. Replacement knobs have been
available at no cost. Send an email to [hidden email] and ask for
the new knobs.

73,
Don W3FPR

On 6/22/2011 2:16 AM, hb9ari wrote:

> Hello,
>
> I also have a "problem" with concentric knobs.(K3 #1212)
> An external one was broken since the beginning.
> The 1st time i move it, he was slipping over the shaft;
> as it's related to the sub-receiver, i don't ask for a new one.
>
> The only annoying problem i get since some time is an
> unstable contact at the rear line-out min-jack (3.5mm) connector.
> (i suspect the audio input too) As the #1212 is out of warranty,
> i've planned to find a more reliable solution, excluding these
> 2 mini-jacks. One of my task during next vacations ( in 3 weeks)
>
> Otherwise, always 100% fan of my K3 !
>
> 73 QRO,
> Rudi, HB9ARI
>
>
>
>
> On 22.06.2011 05:06, tomb18 wrote:
>> Ok,
>>
>> I have found my first glitch with the K3. The concentric knob holes are so
>> out of round that I cannot get the knobs to work unless the smaller one is
>> way above the other. Is this a problem with my knobs or are they all like
>> that? When all is said and done, I paid over 5k for this radio and the knobs
>> are really poor whereas everything else is top notch.
>> If they are all like that, are there alternatives that look the same?
>>
>> Thanks
>>
>> --
>> View this message in context: http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/Concentric-knobs-tp6502754p6502754.html
>> Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> Elecraft mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>

Bill W4ZV

Re: Concentric knobs??

In reply to this post by wayne burdick

wayne burdick wrote

This should *never* happen. If you email k3support you'll get
replacements immediately.

...just to define "immediately". Ordered a set of knobs on Monday morning and they were in my mailbox today (Wednesday morning). Kudos to Elecraft and the US Postal Service's First Class Mail.

73, Bill

hb9ari@bluewin.ch

Re: Concentric knobs??

In reply to this post by hb9ari@bluewin.ch

Hi Buck,

Thank you for this information !

As these knobs are hard to find in EU (may be impossible...?), i will
send a note to Elecraft.
I will wait to add an order to this request...

73 QRO,
Rudi, HB9ARI

PS I had this same "problem" on an oscilloscope many years ago..
Seems to be the "thin"plastic wall for locking screw ?

On 22.06.2011 17:13, Buck - k4ia wrote:

> They had trouble with some of the early knobs. Elecraft will send you
> replacements at no charge. Just send them a note.
> Buck
> k4ia
>
> On 6/22/2011 2:16 AM, hb9ari wrote:
>> Hello,
>>
>> I also have a "problem" with concentric knobs.(K3 #1212)
>> An external one was broken since the beginning.
>> The 1st time i move it, he was slipping over the shaft;
>> as it's related to the sub-receiver, i don't ask for a new one.
>>
>> The only annoying problem i get since some time is an
>> unstable contact at the rear line-out min-jack (3.5mm) connector.
>> (i suspect the audio input too) As the #1212 is out of warranty,
>> i've planned to find a more reliable solution, excluding these
>> 2 mini-jacks. One of my task during next vacations ( in 3 weeks)
>>
>> Otherwise, always 100% fan of my K3 !
>>
>> 73 QRO,
>> Rudi, HB9ARI
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On 22.06.2011 05:06, tomb18 wrote:
>>> Ok,
>>>
>>> I have found my first glitch with the K3. The concentric knob holes are so
>>> out of round that I cannot get the knobs to work unless the smaller one is
>>> way above the other. Is this a problem with my knobs or are they all like
>>> that? When all is said and done, I paid over 5k for this radio and the knobs
>>> are really poor whereas everything else is top notch.
>>> If they are all like that, are there alternatives that look the same?
>>>
>>> Thanks
>>>
>>> --
>>> View this message in context:http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/Concentric-knobs-tp6502754p6502754.html
>>> Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
>>> ______________________________________________________________
>>> Elecraft mailing list
>>> Home:http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>>> Help:http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>>> Post:mailto:[hidden email]
>>>
>>> This list hosted by:http://www.qsl.net
>>> Please help support this email list:http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> Elecraft mailing list
>> Home:http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>> Help:http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post:mailto:[hidden email]
>>
>> This list hosted by:http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list:http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

Bill W4ZV

Re: Concentric knobs??

hb9ari wrote

As these knobs are hard to find in EU (may be impossible...?), i will
send a note to Elecraft.
I will wait to add an order to this request...

Grüße Ari,

Elecraft will send these knobs at their expense...not yours! It's nice that you offer to combine orders but it's not necessary.

CU on Topband next season!

73, Bill

Brian - K1NW

Re: Concentric knobs??

In reply to this post by hb9ari@bluewin.ch

I had the same problem at the time I built K3 #4974. Elecraft sent replacements right away (the usual excellent service), and coached me not to over tighten the set screws (two per knob). The knobs are pretty soft and deform easily if over tightened.

Brian, op K1NW

hb9ari@bluewin.ch

Re: Concentric knobs??

In reply to this post by hb9ari@bluewin.ch

Hello Tim,

Thank you for your message and "parts" email address.
As my number is #1212, it's certainly the same batch !

Have a nice day.

73 QRO,
Rudi, HB9ARI

On 23.06.2011 00:50, Tim Heasman wrote:

> Hi Rudi,
> Just send an e-mail to [hidden email] with the serial number of
> your K3, and they will send you a new set of knobs for af and rf
> controls. There was a lot of trouble with broken knobs with the first
> batch of K3s. Mine is s/n 1245 and I have had to replace mine.
> 73
> Tim
> GM4LMH
>
>
>

hb9ari@bluewin.ch

Re: Concentric knobs??

In reply to this post by Bill W4ZV

Hi Bill,

rr , i will ask to Elecraft for new "external" knob(s).

Just looking for something to order for my K3...

My best 73,
Rudi, HB9ARI

On 22.06.2011 18:29, Bill W4ZV wrote:

> wayne burdick wrote:
>> This should *never* happen. If you email k3support you'll get
>> replacements immediately.
>>
> ...just to define "immediately". Ordered a set of knobs on Monday morning
> and they were in my mailbox today (Wednesday morning). Kudos to Elecraft
> and the US Postal Service's First Class Mail.
>
> 73, Bill
>
>
> --
> View this message in context: http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/Concentric-knobs-tp6502754p6504988.html
> Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

hb9ari@bluewin.ch

Re: Concentric knobs??

In reply to this post by Brian - K1NW

Hi Brian,

Thank you for the reply.
As i bought an assembled K3, i don't
tighten the screws.
As Tim explained in his message, this "problem"
was present sometimes in a particular batch.

I will send an email to the "parts" department.

My best 73,
Rudi, HB9ARI

On 23.06.2011 00:50, Brian Maynard wrote:

> I had the same problem at the time I built K3 #4974. Elecraft sent
> replacements right away (the usual excellent service), and coached me not to
> over tighten the set screws (two per knob). The knobs are pretty soft and
> deform easily if over tightened.
>
> -----
> Brian, op K1NW
> --
> View this message in context: http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/Concentric-knobs-tp6502754p6506455.html
> Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

Guy, K2AV

Re: Concentric knobs??

Having managed to break a few myself (have to remind myself I'm not
rebuilding an auto engine), I think what is going on is that the knobs
are (or were) still curing, causing them to shrink a tiny bit after
being tightened on the shaft.

I think the curing accelerates after being put on the radio because
they have free air around them, instead of being in a bin or box. I
found the screws TIGHTER a week after I put the knobs on. I simply
loosened and retightened them to "pinky torque" and no problems since.

Pinky torque is to use your pinky ONLY as pressure on the allen wrench
when tightening. One probably does not even need that much.

73, Guy.

On Thu, Jun 23, 2011 at 1:46 AM, hb9ari <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Hi Brian,
>
> Thank you for the reply.
> As i bought an assembled K3, i don't
> tighten the screws.
> As Tim explained in his message, this "problem"
> was present sometimes in a particular batch.
>
> I will send an email to the "parts" department.
>
> My best 73,
> Rudi, HB9ARI
>
>
>
> On 23.06.2011 00:50, Brian Maynard wrote:
>> I had the same problem at the time I built K3 #4974. Elecraft sent
>> replacements right away (the usual excellent service), and coached me not to
>> over tighten the set screws (two per knob). The knobs are pretty soft and
>> deform easily if over tightened.
>>
>> -----
>> Brian, op K1NW
>> --
>> View this message in context: http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/Concentric-knobs-tp6502754p6506455.html
>> Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> Elecraft mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>

hb9ari@bluewin.ch

Re: Concentric knobs??

Hello Guy,

I think that you have found the good explanation!

May be some of these knobs don't get a correct or sufficient pre-aging (?)
procedure before leaving the factory; at my QRL pro, we get this kind
of problem with molded plastic enclosure breaking some time after
they were bee assembled.

In French, we are speaking of "retrait" but i don't find
the correct translation!

My best 73,
Rudi, HB9ARI

On 23.06.2011 19:31, Guy Olinger K2AV wrote:

> Having managed to break a few myself (have to remind myself I'm not
> rebuilding an auto engine), I think what is going on is that the knobs
> are (or were) still curing, causing them to shrink a tiny bit after
> being tightened on the shaft.
>
> I think the curing accelerates after being put on the radio because
> they have free air around them, instead of being in a bin or box. I
> found the screws TIGHTER a week after I put the knobs on. I simply
> loosened and retightened them to "pinky torque" and no problems since.
>
> Pinky torque is to use your pinky ONLY as pressure on the allen wrench
> when tightening. One probably does not even need that much.
>
> 73, Guy.
>
> On Thu, Jun 23, 2011 at 1:46 AM, hb9ari<[hidden email]> wrote:
>> Hi Brian,
>>
>> Thank you for the reply.
>> As i bought an assembled K3, i don't
>> tighten the screws.
>> As Tim explained in his message, this "problem"
>> was present sometimes in a particular batch.
>>
>> I will send an email to the "parts" department.
>>
>> My best 73,
>> Rudi, HB9ARI
>>
>>
>>
>> On 23.06.2011 00:50, Brian Maynard wrote:
>>> I had the same problem at the time I built K3 #4974. Elecraft sent
>>> replacements right away (the usual excellent service), and coached me not to
>>> over tighten the set screws (two per knob). The knobs are pretty soft and
>>> deform easily if over tightened.
>>>
>>> -----
>>> Brian, op K1NW
>>> --
>>> View this message in context: http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/Concentric-knobs-tp6502754p6506455.html
>>> Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
>>> ______________________________________________________________
>>> Elecraft mailing list
>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>>
>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> Elecraft mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>>

Ken G Kopp

Splitting knobs - a thought

I've often wondered if the threads in the batch
of knobs that tend to split were incorrectly tapped
with a taper tap instead of a straight tap.

A taper tap would not be able to run fully through
the set-screw hole due to hitting the opposite side
of the shaft hole.

This would result in a tapered thread that would
force the knob apart as the straight set-screw is
screwed in.

It would be a hard-to-catch error on the part of
the vendor of the knobs that even they themselves
or the employee that did the actual tapping may
not have been aware of.

73! Ken - K0PP

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Vic K2VCO

Re: Concentric knobs??

In reply to this post by hb9ari@bluewin.ch

This happened more than 30 years ago so I can tell the story. I worked at a kibbutz
factory in Israel where we made plastic faucets by injection molding. The correct
adjustment of the temperature profile of the molding cycle was critical to many
characteristics of the finished parts.

Our engineer was going to Germany to demonstrate some products, so we carefully tested his
samples so that he would not be embarrassed in front of the quality-conscious Germans.

At the demonstration, he turned the knob on the hot-water side of the faucet: snap. Then
he tried the cold-water side: snap. Both stems broke off neatly inside the faucet!

The German engineers were not amused. Ultimately we learned how to adjust the molding
machines properly!

On 6/24/2011 7:12 AM, hb9ari wrote:

> Hello Guy,
>
> I think that you have found the good explanation!
>
> May be some of these knobs don't get a correct or sufficient pre-aging (?)
> procedure before leaving the factory; at my QRL pro, we get this kind
> of problem with molded plastic enclosure breaking some time after
> they were bee assembled.
>
> In French, we are speaking of "retrait" but i don't find
> the correct translation!
>
> My best 73,
> Rudi, HB9ARI

--
Vic, K2VCO
Fresno CA
http://www.qsl.net/k2vco/
______________________________________________________________
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Post: mailto:[hidden email]

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hb9ari@bluewin.ch

Re: Concentric knobs??

In reply to this post by hb9ari@bluewin.ch

Hi Terry,

Thank you for the translation !
Correct, opposite of "expand".

My best 73,
Rudi, HB9ARI

On 24.06.2011 16:25, Terry Posey wrote:

> Retrait = contract or shrink (the opposite of "expand")
>
> 73, Terry K4RX
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [hidden email]
> [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of hb9ari
> Sent: Friday, June 24, 2011 10:13 AM
> To: Elecraft-forum
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Concentric knobs??
>
>
> Hello Guy,
>
> I think that you have found the good explanation!
>
> May be some of these knobs don't get a correct or sufficient pre-aging (?)
> procedure before leaving the factory; at my QRL pro, we get this kind
> of problem with molded plastic enclosure breaking some time after
> they were bee assembled.
>
> In French, we are speaking of "retrait" but i don't find
> the correct translation!
>
> My best 73,
> Rudi, HB9ARI
>

hb9ari@bluewin.ch

Re: Concentric knobs??

In reply to this post by Vic K2VCO

Hi Vic,

Thank you for this "demonstration".
In my case, for little enclosures used
with optical encoders, for delivery
delay reasons, the factory don't execute
the post molding process, (some heating
with a well defined temp=f(time) profile.
The contract or shrink (tnx to Terry, K4RX)
was not done before assembly.
Between 1 or 2 months after, ~75%
of the enclosure were broken...

My best 73,
Rudi, HB9ARI

On 24.06.2011 18:02, Vic K2VCO wrote:

> This happened more than 30 years ago so I can tell the story. I worked at a kibbutz
> factory in Israel where we made plastic faucets by injection molding. The correct
> adjustment of the temperature profile of the molding cycle was critical to many
> characteristics of the finished parts.
>
> Our engineer was going to Germany to demonstrate some products, so we carefully tested his
> samples so that he would not be embarrassed in front of the quality-conscious Germans.
>
> At the demonstration, he turned the knob on the hot-water side of the faucet: snap. Then
> he tried the cold-water side: snap. Both stems broke off neatly inside the faucet!
>
> The German engineers were not amused. Ultimately we learned how to adjust the molding
> machines properly!
>
> On 6/24/2011 7:12 AM, hb9ari wrote:
>> Hello Guy,
>>
>> I think that you have found the good explanation!
>>
>> May be some of these knobs don't get a correct or sufficient pre-aging (?)
>> procedure before leaving the factory; at my QRL pro, we get this kind
>> of problem with molded plastic enclosure breaking some time after
>> they were bee assembled.
>>
>> In French, we are speaking of "retrait" but i don't find
>> the correct translation!
>>
>> My best 73,
>> Rudi, HB9ARI