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Does a K4 need an external sound card for FT8?

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Dennis Dinga

Does a K4 need an external sound card for FT8?

This question keeps coming up but, but the answers are either
incomplete or confusing. Courtney KD6X asked it again on Jan 3 and
has not received an answer.

Here's the way I'd like to ask it: I use a West Mountain RIGblaster
advantage instead of the sound card in my computer. Why? So that I
have the convenience of adjusting TX and RX levels with physical
knobs instead of using sliders on a monitor. So how do you set
levels with the K4? Does it require fiddling with menus and going
through several steps? And like Courtney asked, is there anything
else to gained by using an external 24 bit card?

-Dennis N6DD

++++++++++++++++++

Here is the way that Courtney KD6X put it:

"Any value in using a Microkeyer III with a K3S or K4D?

I have a K3... the best radio I've ever owed in my 50+ year ham
life. I'm currently using a US Interface Navigator with it for
digital modes. This is now sold as the Time Wave Navigator and has
worked really well for me for many years.

My understanding is that the K3S and now the incoming K4's have sound
cards built-in via the USB port. So perhaps I won't need the
Navigator anymore when my K4 eventually arrives. But my question is
whether there is still something to be gained using a newer
transceiver interface with the K3S or K4? I've been looking at the
Microkeyer III with its 24 bit audio processing. Does anyone have
any hands-on experience with the Microkeyer III with Elecraft
radios? I'm particularly interested if it has a lower noise floor or
other features that might not be found in the stock K3S or K4.

Thanks for any input or feedback!

-- Courtney KD6X"

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wayne burdick

Re: Does a K4 need an external sound card for FT8?

Administrator

Hi Dennis,

The sound card is built into the K4 (stereo line out for RX, line in for TX). Adjustment is simple. There is no advantage whatsoever to using an external sound card.

The K4 also has analog line in/out for backwards compatibility, and supports digital audio streaming over Ethernet as well.

73,
Wayne
N6KR

> On Jan 4, 2021, at 5:11 PM, Dennis Dinga <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> This question keeps coming up but, but the answers are either incomplete or confusing. Courtney KD6X asked it again on Jan 3 and has not received an answer.
>
> Here's the way I'd like to ask it: I use a West Mountain RIGblaster advantage instead of the sound card in my computer. Why? So that I have the convenience of adjusting TX and RX levels with physical knobs instead of using sliders on a monitor. So how do you set levels with the K4? Does it require fiddling with menus and going through several steps? And like Courtney asked, is there anything else to gained by using an external 24 bit card?
>
> -Dennis N6DD
>
> ++++++++++++++++++
>
> Here is the way that Courtney KD6X put it:
>
> "Any value in using a Microkeyer III with a K3S or K4D?
>
> I have a K3... the best radio I've ever owed in my 50+ year ham life. I'm currently using a US Interface Navigator with it for digital modes. This is now sold as the Time Wave Navigator and has worked really well for me for many years.
>
> My understanding is that the K3S and now the incoming K4's have sound cards built-in via the USB port. So perhaps I won't need the Navigator anymore when my K4 eventually arrives. But my question is whether there is still something to be gained using a newer transceiver interface with the K3S or K4? I've been looking at the Microkeyer III with its 24 bit audio processing. Does anyone have any hands-on experience with the Microkeyer III with Elecraft radios? I'm particularly interested if it has a lower noise floor or other features that might not be found in the stock K3S or K4.
>
> Thanks for any input or feedback!
>
> -- Courtney KD6X"
>
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
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>
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Bill Frantz

Re: Does a K4 need an external sound card for FT8?

In an ideal world, we would not have any analog audio in use for
digital modes. Analog RF to the ADC in the front end of the
radio. Digital through the "radio" to the digital path to the
computer to the digital processing for digital modes.

The K3S actually goes through a DtoA conversion and then a AtoD
again within the radio. Does the K4 also do this?

For audio, of course, somewhere we need to do DtoA conversion.

73 Bill AE6JV

On 1/4/21 at 8:36 PM, [hidden email] (Wayne Burdick) wrote:

>The sound card is built into the K4 (stereo line out for RX,
>line in for TX). Adjustment is simple. There is no advantage
>whatsoever to using an external sound card.
>
>The K4 also has analog line in/out for backwards compatibility,
>and supports digital audio streaming over Ethernet as well.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------
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(408)348-7900 | services. The market doesn't | 150
Rivermead Rd #235
www.pwpconsult.com | want to pay for them. |
Peterborough, NH 03458

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Rick Tavan-2

Re: Does a K4 need an external sound card for FT8?

In reply to this post by Dennis Dinga

The K4 has an internal sound card but its use is optional. I've used it on
AFSK but not yet on other digital modes. Level setting is via soft
controls, not dedicated physical knobs. This requires tapping the
touch-screen several times, then turning the main tuning knob to adjust
each level. You might want to download the available *Introduction to the
Elecraft K4* or the *Builtin Operating Manual* files at
https://elecraft.com/pages/manuals-downloads. Click Support, then Manuals,
then K4 and you'll see it.

Setting up the K4 for RTTY using its internal sound card required no
additional cables beyond what I was already using for computer control (a
USB A-B cable). YMMV, though, and if you want dedicated level knobs, you
can connect an external sound card through analog 1/8" LINE IN/OUT phone
jacks. You will still need to use the soft controls to tell K4 which type
of connection you're using.

73,

/Rick N6XI

On Mon, Jan 4, 2021 at 5:12 PM Dennis Dinga <[hidden email]> wrote:

> This question keeps coming up but, but the answers are either
> incomplete or confusing. Courtney KD6X asked it again on Jan 3 and
> has not received an answer.
>
> Here's the way I'd like to ask it: I use a West Mountain RIGblaster
> advantage instead of the sound card in my computer. Why? So that I
> have the convenience of adjusting TX and RX levels with physical
> knobs instead of using sliders on a monitor. So how do you set
> levels with the K4? Does it require fiddling with menus and going
> through several steps? And like Courtney asked, is there anything
> else to gained by using an external 24 bit card?
>
> -Dennis N6DD
>
> ++++++++++++++++++
>
> Here is the way that Courtney KD6X put it:
>
> "Any value in using a Microkeyer III with a K3S or K4D?
>
> I have a K3... the best radio I've ever owed in my 50+ year ham
> life. I'm currently using a US Interface Navigator with it for
> digital modes. This is now sold as the Time Wave Navigator and has
> worked really well for me for many years.
>
> My understanding is that the K3S and now the incoming K4's have sound
> cards built-in via the USB port. So perhaps I won't need the
> Navigator anymore when my K4 eventually arrives. But my question is
> whether there is still something to be gained using a newer
> transceiver interface with the K3S or K4? I've been looking at the
> Microkeyer III with its 24 bit audio processing. Does anyone have
> any hands-on experience with the Microkeyer III with Elecraft
> radios? I'm particularly interested if it has a lower noise floor or
> other features that might not be found in the stock K3S or K4.
>
> Thanks for any input or feedback!
>
> -- Courtney KD6X"
>
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>

--
--

Rick Tavan
Truckee and Saratoga, CA
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Gwen Patton

Re: Does a K4 need an external sound card for FT8?

In reply to this post by Dennis Dinga

The Advantage has a soundcard in it. I have one too, but I used it in my
old Icom 746 pro.

73,
Gwen, NG3P

On Mon, Jan 4, 2021, 8:11 PM Dennis Dinga <[hidden email]> wrote:

Ed Muns

Re: Does a K4 need an external sound card for FT8?

In reply to this post by Dennis Dinga

There are multiple aspects to this question. As another K4 field tester,
here's my take, trying to objectively outline the choices for all users.

1. Any of the following soundcard alternatives can be used with the K4:
a. PC soundcard, either integrated or added, e.g., via USB or
plug-in card to a desktop
b. USB ham radio "interface" box, e.g., RigBlaster, microHAM
microKeyer or SO2R controller
c. K4 internal soundcard

In all cases, the Windows Sound Control has level controls for all these
alternatives. In addition, the b and c alternatives have their own level
controls that can be thought of as logically in "series" with the Windows
level controls. Generally, the Windows level controls are set to result in
a "reasonable" range of control by the additional level controls of
alternatives b and c. In the case of alternative b, there are often
physical knobs. The K4 (alternative c) has on-screen level controls that
can be varied with on-screen up/down arrows or by using the VFO-A knob.

2. All of these alternatives are equally adequate performance-wise. The
exception might be low-end soundcards in alternative a. Another exception
might be minimizing A-D and D-A conversions, in which case the K4 soundcard,
c, is ideal. There are no analog audio cables, or signals, between the
radio's digital audio and the PC application, pure K4 digital audio direct
to the software.

3. Choosing one of the above alternatives is a personal preference we all
get to make. If you like physical knobs readily available, then the
alternative b is good. If, like me, you prefer simplicity and seldom touch
the soundcard levels, then the minimalist K4 soundcard solution c is nice.
If you have need for other features, e.g., SO2R control, then you'll have
that alternative b anyway and will use its sound card and user interface.

Each of us can consider the alternatives and decide which is appealing and
suits our operating needs best. I suspect it boils down to choosing between
alternatives b and c.

73,
Ed W0YK

-----Original Message-----
From: [hidden email] <[hidden email]> On
Behalf Of Dennis Dinga
Sent: 04 January, 2021 17:11
To: [hidden email]
Subject: [Elecraft] Does a K4 need an external sound card for FT8?

This question keeps coming up but, but the answers are either
incomplete or confusing. Courtney KD6X asked it again on Jan 3 and
has not received an answer.

Here's the way I'd like to ask it: I use a West Mountain RIGblaster
advantage instead of the sound card in my computer. Why? So that I
have the convenience of adjusting TX and RX levels with physical
knobs instead of using sliders on a monitor. So how do you set
levels with the K4? Does it require fiddling with menus and going
through several steps? And like Courtney asked, is there anything
else to gained by using an external 24 bit card?

-Dennis N6DD

++++++++++++++++++

Here is the way that Courtney KD6X put it:

"Any value in using a Microkeyer III with a K3S or K4D?

I have a K3... the best radio I've ever owed in my 50+ year ham
life. I'm currently using a US Interface Navigator with it for
digital modes. This is now sold as the Time Wave Navigator and has
worked really well for me for many years.

My understanding is that the K3S and now the incoming K4's have sound
cards built-in via the USB port. So perhaps I won't need the
Navigator anymore when my K4 eventually arrives. But my question is
whether there is still something to be gained using a newer
transceiver interface with the K3S or K4? I've been looking at the
Microkeyer III with its 24 bit audio processing. Does anyone have
any hands-on experience with the Microkeyer III with Elecraft
radios? I'm particularly interested if it has a lower noise floor or
other features that might not be found in the stock K3S or K4.

Thanks for any input or feedback!

-- Courtney KD6X"

______________________________________________________________
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Post: mailto:[hidden email]

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______________________________________________________________
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