Elecraft CW Net Report for July 27th & 28th, 2008
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RE: Sidetone Monitor Preference Opinions
 
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Dear Ron,
Hear ! Hear ! You have said it so very well. My kudos ! TR, WB6TMY At 11:03 AM 7/28/2008 -0700, you wrote: >Then there are those of us who set the AF gain and "forget" it, since we >use the RF gain control to adjust the volume for each signal. > >Whether or not the sidetone level tracks the audio gain is of little >concern. > >We turn off the AGC, so its characteristics are of no consequence. > >We give *real* signal reports based on what we hear, not on what an >"S-Meter" tells us. > >There's a reason why a great many radiomen have preferred to operate >that way over the years. For many of us, it's the easiest, fastest, and >surest way to hear signals at their best. > >Frequently it's easier to do the simple stuff ourselves instead of >expecting a box of parts and a gazillion lines of code to do it for >us... > >Ron AC7AC > > >_______________________________________________ >Elecraft mailing list >Post to: [hidden email] >You must be a subscriber to post to the list. >Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): > http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > >Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm >Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com Tel: . . . 707-832-4304 _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
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In reply to this post by AC7AC
I've been very happy with the AGC-NR on the K3, so turning off AGC is
starting to become a last resort for me. And the configurable AGC parameters give you a lot of options, not "one AGC fits all". (I do adjust the RF gain even with AGC on.) I also give signal reports corresponding to the s-meter reading. This is convenient with the K3's absolute meter mode (doesn't matter whether attenuator or preamp is on). It's just for my own interest, comparing signal strengths at the antenna terminals. Can't see why I wouldn't want to record them as long as I'm going to the trouble of making RST notations anyway. 73, Drew AF2Z On Mon, 28 Jul 2008 11:03:27 -0700, Ron AC7AC wrote: >Then there are those of us who set the AF gain and "forget" it, since we >use the RF gain control to adjust the volume for each signal. > >Whether or not the sidetone level tracks the audio gain is of little >concern. > >We turn off the AGC, so its characteristics are of no consequence. > >We give *real* signal reports based on what we hear, not on what an >"S-Meter" tells us. > >There's a reason why a great many radiomen have preferred to operate >that way over the years. For many of us, it's the easiest, fastest, and >surest way to hear signals at their best. > >Frequently it's easier to do the simple stuff ourselves instead of >expecting a box of parts and a gazillion lines of code to do it for >us... > >Ron AC7AC > > _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
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In reply to this post by AC7AC
On Mon, 28 Jul 2008 11:03:27 -0700, "Ron D'Eau Claire" <[hidden email]> wrote:
>Then there are those of us who set the AF gain and "forget" it, since we >use the RF gain control to adjust the volume for each signal. > >Whether or not the sidetone level tracks the audio gain is of little >concern. > >We turn off the AGC, so its characteristics are of no consequence. > >We give *real* signal reports based on what we hear, not on what an >"S-Meter" tells us. > >There's a reason why a great many radiomen have preferred to operate >that way over the years. For many of us, it's the easiest, fastest, and >surest way to hear signals at their best. > >Frequently it's easier to do the simple stuff ourselves instead of >expecting a box of parts and a gazillion lines of code to do it for >us... > >Ron AC7AC > Tom, N5GE - SWOT 3537 - Grid EM12jq "Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety deserve neither Liberty nor Safety" An excerpt from a letter written in 1755 from the Assembly to the Governor of Pennsylvania. Support the entire Constitution, not just the parts you like. http://www.n5ge.com http://www.eQSL.cc/Member.cfm?N5GE _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Amateur Radio Operator N5GE
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Re: Sidetone Monitor Preference Opinions
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In reply to this post by N4LQ-2
I hadn't noticed that they didn't track until this thread, so I guess
status quo is OK with me. Just now, I found that in swapping between speaker and phones, I do not feel the need to adjust the sidetone level. While transmitting ... well, it can be disconcerting to start transmitting full QSK and the band noise is so loud you can't hear your sidetone. But as one poster said, you could turn down the AF gain in that case as a quick interim cure. During noisy contests, I like the keep the sidetone level high. A dedicated knob would be nice, but not worth the panel space for just that function. I'm well pleased with the ease of accessing both pitch and sidetone level -- much easier than on the FT-1000 I sold to buy the K3. Adjust pitch without hearing it? I can't imagine that. Bonus opinion: I like the CCW for less bandwidth of the Width control. "Can I have a little more banjo in the monitor?" 73--Nick, WA5BDU _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
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Using a set of computer speakers which have their own gain control allows
you to adjust the overall AF gain, including the sidetone then use the AF gain control on the K3 to adjust for band noise. That's how I avoid having to fiddle with the sidetone level. Steve Ellington [hidden email] ----- Original Message ----- From: "Nick-WA5BDU" <[hidden email]> To: <[hidden email]> Sent: Monday, July 28, 2008 7:21 PM Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Sidetone Monitor Preference Opinions >I hadn't noticed that they didn't track until this thread, so I guess >status quo is OK with me. Just now, I found that in swapping between >speaker and phones, I do not feel the need to adjust the sidetone level. > > While transmitting ... well, it can be disconcerting to start transmitting > full QSK and the band noise is so loud you can't hear your sidetone. But > as one poster said, you could turn down the AF gain in that case as a > quick interim cure. During noisy contests, I like the keep the sidetone > level high. A dedicated knob would be nice, but not worth the panel space > for just that function. I'm well pleased with the ease of accessing both > pitch and sidetone level -- much easier than on the FT-1000 I sold to buy > the K3. > Adjust pitch without hearing it? I can't imagine that. > Bonus opinion: I like the CCW for less bandwidth of the Width control. > > "Can I have a little more banjo in the monitor?" > > 73--Nick, WA5BDU > > > _______________________________________________ > Elecraft mailing list > Post to: [hidden email] > You must be a subscriber to post to the list. > Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): > http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm > Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: > 270.5.6/1578 - Release Date: 7/28/2008 5:13 PM > > > _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
Re: Sidetone Monitor Preference Opinions
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On Mon, 28 Jul 2008 19:42:17 -0400, n4lq wrote:
>Using a set of computer speakers which have their own gain control Most speakers with built-in electronics have RFI problems! 73, Jim K9YC _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
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In reply to this post by Nick Kennedy
On Mon, 28 Jul 2008 18:21:17 -0500, Nick, WA5BDU wrote:
> >Adjust pitch without hearing it? I can't imagine that. > I wasn't suggesting that the ability to adjust sidetone pitch be eliminated. Merely that we have the additional ability to interactively adjust the pitch of the received signal. Yes, both pitches are the same. But as it is now you cannot hear the effect on the signal itself while adjusting PITCH-- the received audio is cut off and the sidetone comes on. This makes it difficult to tell what pitch is optimum for the particular signal and the given reception conditions. IOW, I don't really care what the sidetone pitch is-- one is as good as another. It is the offset pitch of the signal that is important. So why not be able to adjust it for best copy under current conditions? We can adjust the volume of a signal while listening to it; so why not the pitch? Depending on noise, QRM, keying characteristics, speed, etc. you might want to alter the pitch for better copy. I think it would be useful. 73, Drew AF2Z _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
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How about eliminating the tone when pushing either "pitch" or "mon" and only
producint the tone when pushing "spot"? That seems like a good compromise. That way we could change pitch or st level mid-QSO and still have the tone available when we want it. Steve Ellington [hidden email] ----- Original Message ----- From: <[hidden email]> To: <[hidden email]> Sent: Monday, July 28, 2008 10:25 PM Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Sidetone Monitor Preference Opinions > On Mon, 28 Jul 2008 18:21:17 -0500, Nick, WA5BDU wrote: > >> >>Adjust pitch without hearing it? I can't imagine that. >> > > I wasn't suggesting that the ability to adjust sidetone pitch be > eliminated. Merely that we have the additional ability to > interactively adjust the pitch of the received signal. Yes, both > pitches are the same. But as it is now you cannot hear the effect on > the signal itself while adjusting PITCH-- the received audio is cut > off and the sidetone comes on. This makes it difficult to tell what > pitch is optimum for the particular signal and the given reception > conditions. > > IOW, I don't really care what the sidetone pitch is-- one is as good > as another. It is the offset pitch of the signal that is important. So > why not be able to adjust it for best copy under current conditions? > We can adjust the volume of a signal while listening to it; so why not > the pitch? Depending on noise, QRM, keying characteristics, speed, > etc. you might want to alter the pitch for better copy. I think it > would be useful. > > 73, > Drew > AF2Z > > _______________________________________________ > Elecraft mailing list > Post to: [hidden email] > You must be a subscriber to post to the list. > Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): > http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm > Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com > Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.5.6/1578 - Release Date: 7/28/2008 > 5:13 PM > > > _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
Re: Sidetone Monitor Preference Opinions
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In reply to this post by Jim Brown-10
Jim Brown wrote:
> On Mon, 28 Jul 2008 19:42:17 -0400, n4lq wrote: > >> Using a set of computer speakers which have their own gain control > > Most speakers with built-in electronics have RFI problems! Indeed they do. If you have a GSM phone, each text message is announced with a "rattle rattle rattle" in the computer speakers. LA4RT Jon, Trondheim, Norway _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
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In reply to this post by N4LQ-2
Yes, PITCH would seem like a good choice for the signal pitch
adjustment. Or perhaps signal pitch could be made an additional option for the RIT/XIT control when RIT/XIT is off? (RIT is already an optional coarse tune control and has also been suggested as an optional band switch.) For sidetone pitch adjustment, perhaps MON could allow it with a 2nd push? Then you'd have sidetone pitch and volume with a single control. Makes sense? 73, Drew AF2Z On Mon, 28 Jul 2008 22:50:48 -0400, Steve Ellington wrote: >How about eliminating the tone when pushing either "pitch" or "mon" and only >producint the tone when pushing "spot"? That seems like a good compromise. >That way we could change pitch or st level mid-QSO and still have the tone >available when we want it. >Steve Ellington >[hidden email] >----- Original Message ----- >From: <[hidden email]> >To: <[hidden email]> >Sent: Monday, July 28, 2008 10:25 PM >Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Sidetone Monitor Preference Opinions > > >> On Mon, 28 Jul 2008 18:21:17 -0500, Nick, WA5BDU wrote: >> >>> >>>Adjust pitch without hearing it? I can't imagine that. >>> >> >> I wasn't suggesting that the ability to adjust sidetone pitch be >> eliminated. Merely that we have the additional ability to >> interactively adjust the pitch of the received signal. Yes, both >> pitches are the same. But as it is now you cannot hear the effect on >> the signal itself while adjusting PITCH-- the received audio is cut >> off and the sidetone comes on. This makes it difficult to tell what >> pitch is optimum for the particular signal and the given reception >> conditions. >> >> IOW, I don't really care what the sidetone pitch is-- one is as good >> as another. It is the offset pitch of the signal that is important. So >> why not be able to adjust it for best copy under current conditions? >> We can adjust the volume of a signal while listening to it; so why not >> the pitch? Depending on noise, QRM, keying characteristics, speed, >> etc. you might want to alter the pitch for better copy. I think it >> would be useful. >> >> 73, >> Drew >> AF2Z >> _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
RE: Sidetone Monitor Preference Opinions
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Sidetone pitch and signal pitch should always be the same. Otherwise its
kinda hard to zerobeat a station to make sure the auto zero beat did things right. I realize there are too many people who don't understand how to zero beat a station but that doesn't mean we should add functionality to make it even harder for people to do things right. :) -----Original Message----- From: [hidden email] [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of [hidden email] Sent: Tuesday, July 29, 2008 6:25 AM To: [hidden email] Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Sidetone Monitor Preference Opinions Yes, PITCH would seem like a good choice for the signal pitch adjustment. Or perhaps signal pitch could be made an additional option for the RIT/XIT control when RIT/XIT is off? (RIT is already an optional coarse tune control and has also been suggested as an optional band switch.) For sidetone pitch adjustment, perhaps MON could allow it with a 2nd push? Then you'd have sidetone pitch and volume with a single control. Makes sense? 73, Drew AF2Z On Mon, 28 Jul 2008 22:50:48 -0400, Steve Ellington wrote: >How about eliminating the tone when pushing either "pitch" or "mon" and only >producint the tone when pushing "spot"? That seems like a good compromise. >That way we could change pitch or st level mid-QSO and still have the tone >available when we want it. >Steve Ellington >[hidden email] >----- Original Message ----- >From: <[hidden email]> >To: <[hidden email]> >Sent: Monday, July 28, 2008 10:25 PM >Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Sidetone Monitor Preference Opinions > > >> On Mon, 28 Jul 2008 18:21:17 -0500, Nick, WA5BDU wrote: >> >>> >>>Adjust pitch without hearing it? I can't imagine that. >>> >> >> I wasn't suggesting that the ability to adjust sidetone pitch be >> eliminated. Merely that we have the additional ability to >> interactively adjust the pitch of the received signal. Yes, both >> pitches are the same. But as it is now you cannot hear the effect on >> the signal itself while adjusting PITCH-- the received audio is cut >> off and the sidetone comes on. This makes it difficult to tell what >> pitch is optimum for the particular signal and the given reception >> conditions. >> >> IOW, I don't really care what the sidetone pitch is-- one is as good >> as another. It is the offset pitch of the signal that is important. So >> why not be able to adjust it for best copy under current conditions? >> We can adjust the volume of a signal while listening to it; so why not >> the pitch? Depending on noise, QRM, keying characteristics, speed, >> etc. you might want to alter the pitch for better copy. I think it >> would be useful. >> >> 73, >> Drew >> AF2Z >> _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
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Brett,
I'm not suggesting that offset pitch and sidetone pitch be different. They are the same. I'm suggesting that sometimes you want to adjust this pitch by listening to the sidetone and sometimes you want to adjust it by listening to the received signal. Currently you can't hear the signal while you adjust PITCH-- the received audio is blocked. Why would you want to vary the signal pitch? Because a different pitch can provide better copy under different reception condtions. But it's pretty hard to tell what that optimum pitch might be without listening to the signal as you adjust it, right? Now, you can vary the VFO in order to change the signal's pitch, but then you have detuned it. I want to vary the pitch of a signal without detuning it. The K3 can do this, only it doesn't let us hear the signal while doing it. 73, Drew AF2Z On Tue, 29 Jul 2008 09:50:15 -0700, Brett Howard wrote: >Sidetone pitch and signal pitch should always be the same. Otherwise its >kinda hard to zerobeat a station to make sure the auto zero beat did things >right. I realize there are too many people who don't understand how to zero >beat a station but that doesn't mean we should add functionality to make it >even harder for people to do things right. :) > _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
RE: Sidetone Monitor Preference Opinions
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-----Original Message from Drew, AF2Z ----- Why would you want to vary the signal pitch? Because a different pitch can provide better copy under different reception condtions. But it's pretty hard to tell what that optimum pitch might be without listening to the signal as you adjust it, right? Now, you can vary the VFO in order to change the signal's pitch, but then you have detuned it. I want to vary the pitch of a signal without detuning it. The K3 can do this, only it doesn't let us hear the signal while doing it. ------------------------------------------- Which brings us to the "old fashioned" way to adjust the pitch of the RX signal - RIT. It keeps the TX on the same frequency and as long as you don't adjust it too far, the signal will stay in the passband. Better yet, combine it with an IF Shift and you can go farther with RIT while keeping the signal where you want it in the passband. Do I remember correctly? Didn't the TS-930s have a CW Offset control that would adjust sidetone pitch, TX-RX offset and IF Shift at the same time? I used to want one of those rigs something bad. Then I borrowed one for a weekend and decided I liked my TenTec Corsair II better. - Keith N1AS - - K3 711 - _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
RE: Sidetone Monitor Preference Opinions
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In reply to this post by drewko
I understand that but I'm not so sure that both adjustment while hearing the
pitch and adjustment while hearing a signal is needed. Why not just adjustment while hearing sigs? -----Original Message----- From: [hidden email] [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of [hidden email] Sent: Tuesday, July 29, 2008 10:21 AM To: [hidden email] Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Sidetone Monitor Preference Opinions Brett, I'm not suggesting that offset pitch and sidetone pitch be different. They are the same. I'm suggesting that sometimes you want to adjust this pitch by listening to the sidetone and sometimes you want to adjust it by listening to the received signal. Currently you can't hear the signal while you adjust PITCH-- the received audio is blocked. Why would you want to vary the signal pitch? Because a different pitch can provide better copy under different reception condtions. But it's pretty hard to tell what that optimum pitch might be without listening to the signal as you adjust it, right? Now, you can vary the VFO in order to change the signal's pitch, but then you have detuned it. I want to vary the pitch of a signal without detuning it. The K3 can do this, only it doesn't let us hear the signal while doing it. 73, Drew AF2Z On Tue, 29 Jul 2008 09:50:15 -0700, Brett Howard wrote: >Sidetone pitch and signal pitch should always be the same. Otherwise its >kinda hard to zerobeat a station to make sure the auto zero beat did things >right. I realize there are too many people who don't understand how to zero >beat a station but that doesn't mean we should add functionality to make it >even harder for people to do things right. :) > _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
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In reply to this post by Darwin, Keith
On Tue, 29 Jul 2008 10:41:24 -0700, Keith N1AS wrote:
> > >Which brings us to the "old fashioned" way to adjust the pitch of the RX >signal - RIT. It keeps the TX on the same frequency and as long as you >don't adjust it too far, the signal will stay in the passband. Better >yet, combine it with an IF Shift and you can go farther with RIT while >keeping the signal where you want it in the passband. > > Keith, Say you have managed to tune in a very weak signal to the very optimum... no further adjustment on the K3 controls could improve it. Except, your offset is 400 Hz; but some combination of QRM, noise, his code speed, keying characteristics and your own psycho-acoustics would make it easier to copy at, say, 800 Hz. Turning the VFO (or RIT) 400 Hz will put him out of the passband (then use SHIFT, etc, i know...). Why not just be able to vary the pitch; the K3 keeps the signal centered in the passband. This seems like the obvious simple solution. I wonder if it would be possible to just have received audio when PITCH is engaged. Then we could turn the sidetone volume to zero and observe the pitch variation of the received signals directly. It is a little clumsy but I wouldn't mind and I don't think this feature would upset anyone with more control functions, etc. 73, Drew AF2Z _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
RE: Sidetone Monitor Preference Opinions
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I don't disagree at all Drew. I would fancy having the RIT / XIT knob
operate as a CW Pitch control so one knob could vary all required parameters in real time. Until that day comes, I'm thinking I can get most of the functionality using 2 knobs (RIT & Shift). Actually, using 2 knobs makes me feel more like a "real ham radio operator" since I'm actually using 2 knobs plus my brain to make an adjustment LOL! - Keith N1AS - - K3 711 - -----Original Message----- Say you have managed to tune in a very weak signal to the very optimum... no further adjustment on the K3 controls could improve it. Except, your offset is 400 Hz; but some combination of QRM, noise, his code speed, keying characteristics and your own psycho-acoustics would make it easier to copy at, say, 800 Hz. Turning the VFO (or RIT) 400 Hz will put him out of the passband (then use SHIFT, etc, i know...). Why not just be able to vary the pitch; the K3 keeps the signal centered in the passband. This seems like the obvious simple solution. I wonder if it would be possible to just have received audio when PITCH is engaged. Then we could turn the sidetone volume to zero and observe the pitch variation of the received signals directly. It is a little clumsy but I wouldn't mind and I don't think this feature would upset anyone with more control functions, etc. -------------------------- _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
RE: Sidetone Monitor Preference Opinions
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In reply to this post by drewko
Yea this is kinda what I figured would need to happen. I wasn't sure though
so I wasn't going to speak on it till I'd gotten a chance to go home and try it. -----Original Message----- From: [hidden email] [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of [hidden email] Sent: Tuesday, July 29, 2008 11:18 AM To: [hidden email] Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Sidetone Monitor Preference Opinions On Tue, 29 Jul 2008 10:41:24 -0700, Keith N1AS wrote: > > >Which brings us to the "old fashioned" way to adjust the pitch of the RX >signal - RIT. It keeps the TX on the same frequency and as long as you >don't adjust it too far, the signal will stay in the passband. Better >yet, combine it with an IF Shift and you can go farther with RIT while >keeping the signal where you want it in the passband. > > Keith, Say you have managed to tune in a very weak signal to the very optimum... no further adjustment on the K3 controls could improve it. Except, your offset is 400 Hz; but some combination of QRM, noise, his code speed, keying characteristics and your own psycho-acoustics would make it easier to copy at, say, 800 Hz. Turning the VFO (or RIT) 400 Hz will put him out of the passband (then use SHIFT, etc, i know...). Why not just be able to vary the pitch; the K3 keeps the signal centered in the passband. This seems like the obvious simple solution. I wonder if it would be possible to just have received audio when PITCH is engaged. Then we could turn the sidetone volume to zero and observe the pitch variation of the received signals directly. It is a little clumsy but I wouldn't mind and I don't think this feature would upset anyone with more control functions, etc. 73, Drew AF2Z _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
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In reply to this post by Darwin, Keith
On Tue, 29 Jul 2008 12:16:16 -0700, Keith N1AS wrote:
>I don't disagree at all Drew. I would fancy having the RIT / XIT knob >operate as a CW Pitch control so one knob could vary all required >parameters in real time. Until that day comes, I'm thinking I can get >most of the functionality using 2 knobs (RIT & Shift). Actually, using >2 knobs makes me feel more like a "real ham radio operator" since I'm >actually using 2 knobs plus my brain to make an adjustment LOL! > >- Keith N1AS - >- K3 711 - > Well, Keith... the next thing you will be telling me is you prefer a straight key or bug over a keyer... hee,hee. 73, Drew AF2Z _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
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In reply to this post by Brett Howard
On Tue, 29 Jul 2008 10:58:27 -0700, Brett Howard wrote:
>I understand that but I'm not so sure that both adjustment while hearing the >pitch and adjustment while hearing a signal is needed. Why not just >adjustment while hearing sigs? > Brett, You got me... if while adjusting the pitch we could hear the signal I can't think of any reason to prefer the sidetone. 73, Drew AF2Z _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
RE: Sidetone Monitor Preference Opinions
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In reply to this post by drewko
-----Original Message----- >Actually, using >2 knobs makes me feel more like a "real ham radio operator" since I'm >actually using 2 knobs plus my brain to make an adjustment LOL! > >- Keith N1AS - >- K3 711 - Well, Keith... the next thing you will be telling me is you prefer a straight key or bug over a keyer... hee,hee. ------------------------------------------------------------------ Awe, man, Drew, you've ratted me out! If you look on my operating desk, you'll see a straight key hooked in parallel with a bug. My paddles are on a shelf in the same room but safely tucked away in a zip lock bag to keep dust off. My microphone is ... well, give me a few minutes ... I know I have one ... somewhere :-) Your other point not needing to hear the sidetone to adjust pitch (just do it using the RX signal) is a good one. I think most times, adjusting offset while listening to the receiver and just having the sidetone pitch follow along would be just fine. But, if some crazy OT has decided to adjust RIT and SHIFT, then the received pitch will thrown off. Other than that, I think the idea is a grand one! I guess if I had the choice between adjusting pitch only while hearing the sidetone or only while hearing the received signal, I'd choose the latter - assuming I still get the pitch readout in Hz during the adjustment. 73 all! - Keith N1AS - - K3 711 - _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
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