Front/Rear MIC Input Level
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Hi all. Can you please tell me the recommended MIC Input Level?
73, Hank WB4ROA |
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Hank,
The correct level depends on your microphone, your voice, and your shack. Put the K3 into TX TEST and talk into the mic - increase the mic gain until your voice peaks produce 7 bars on the ALC scale. 73, Don W3FPR hsa0210 wrote: > Hi all. Can you please tell me the recommended MIC Input Level? > > 73, Hank WB4ROA > > _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
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hi Don,
Don Wilhelm schrieb am 11 Jan 2009 um 10:14: > The correct level depends on your microphone, your voice, and your shack. > Put the K3 into TX TEST and talk into the mic - increase the mic gain until > your voice peaks produce 7 bars on the ALC scale. I cannot get 7 bars on the ALC scale whatever I try. When I whistle I can get 6 bars, but not with normal voice. Power out is 80 W when I whistle, 100W with tune at full power. Microphone is the Heil headset with HC5 element, connected to the rear connector with rPH setting. Do you think there is something wrong with my K3? I get good reports btw. 73! de Werner OE9FWV -- An atheist is a man who has no invisible means of support. Email powered by Pegasus Mail free at <http://www.pmail.com> Homepage: <http://www.qsl.net/oe9fwv/> Fone +43 5522 75013 Fax +43 5522 75013 15 Mobile +43 664 6340014 Elecraft K2 #5203 K3 #656 _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
Re: Front/Rear MIC Input Level
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Dr. Werner Furlan wrote: > hi Don, > > Don Wilhelm schrieb am 11 Jan 2009 um 10:14: > >> The correct level depends on your microphone, your voice, and your shack. >> Put the K3 into TX TEST and talk into the mic - increase the mic gain until >> your voice peaks produce 7 bars on the ALC scale. > > I cannot get 7 bars on the ALC scale whatever I try. When I whistle I can get > 6 bars, but not with normal voice. Power out is 80 W when I whistle, 100W > with tune at full power. Microphone is the Heil headset with HC5 element, > connected to the rear connector with rPH setting. > Do you think there is something wrong with my K3? I get good reports btw. Sounds like something's not quite right... I have MIC set to 20 for my ProSet Plus (either element). ~Iain / N6ML _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
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In reply to this post by oe9fwv
Werner,
Do you have the menu MIC SEL set to FP.L or to FP.H. With the lower output of the HC-5 element, you will need the higher range. If that does not allow you to obtain 7 bars, I would suggest a note to [hidden email]. 73, Don W3FPR Dr. Werner Furlan wrote: > hi Don, > > Don Wilhelm schrieb am 11 Jan 2009 um 10:14: > > >> The correct level depends on your microphone, your voice, and your shack. >> Put the K3 into TX TEST and talk into the mic - increase the mic gain until >> your voice peaks produce 7 bars on the ALC scale. >> > > I cannot get 7 bars on the ALC scale whatever I try. When I whistle I can get > 6 bars, but not with normal voice. Power out is 80 W when I whistle, 100W > with tune at full power. Microphone is the Heil headset with HC5 element, > connected to the rear connector with rPH setting. > Do you think there is something wrong with my K3? I get good reports btw. > > > 73! de Werner OE9FWV > > Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
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I get way too much drive using an HC5 with FP.H. or rp.H I use FP.L. or
rP.L. Mike level set at 23. 73, N2TK, Tony -----Original Message----- From: [hidden email] [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Don Wilhelm Sent: Sunday, January 11, 2009 3:25 PM To: [hidden email] Cc: [hidden email] Subject: Re: [Elecraft] [K3] Front/Rear MIC Input Level Werner, Do you have the menu MIC SEL set to FP.L or to FP.H. With the lower output of the HC-5 element, you will need the higher range. If that does not allow you to obtain 7 bars, I would suggest a note to [hidden email]. 73, Don W3FPR Dr. Werner Furlan wrote: > hi Don, > > Don Wilhelm schrieb am 11 Jan 2009 um 10:14: > > >> The correct level depends on your microphone, your voice, and your shack. >> Put the K3 into TX TEST and talk into the mic - increase the mic gain until >> your voice peaks produce 7 bars on the ALC scale. >> > > I cannot get 7 bars on the ALC scale whatever I try. When I whistle I can get > 6 bars, but not with normal voice. Power out is 80 W when I whistle, 100W > with tune at full power. Microphone is the Heil headset with HC5 element, > connected to the rear connector with rPH setting. > Do you think there is something wrong with my K3? I get good reports btw. > > > 73! de Werner OE9FWV > > _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
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In reply to this post by Don Wilhelm-4
hi Don,
Don Wilhelm schrieb am 11 Jan 2009 um 15:24: > Do you have the menu MIC SEL set to FP.L or to FP.H. With the lower > output of the HC-5 element, you will need the higher range. > If that does not allow you to obtain 7 bars, I would suggest a note to > [hidden email]. Yes, I have set MIC SEL to RP.H. Do you see 7 bars with normal speech or when you say "ooola" ? 73! de Werner OE9FWV -- Illegal aliens have always been a problem in the United States. Ask any North American Indian. Email powered by Pegasus Mail free at <http://www.pmail.com> Homepage: <http://www.qsl.net/oe9fwv/> Fone +43 5522 75013 Fax +43 5522 75013 15 Mobile +43 664 6340014 Elecraft K2 #5203 K3 #656 _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
Re: Front/Rear MIC Input Level
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In reply to this post by Iain MacDonnell - N6ML-2
I just checked mine #2306, cannot get ALC above 7 bars either, Heil proset,Dr. Werner Furlan wrote: mic setting of 8 to 10 is plenty to get full power out. But even if setting mic to 60 ALC is still 7 bars max. But I notice that below the ALC bar scale ALC brackets go to 7 bars, perhaps that means full scale? I am using the rear panel jack also, manual states 5 to 7 bars max. As far as power output less, thats normal check the CONFIG: TXG VCE menu and set the gain up a small amount, will bring SSB up to CW power level. Use an external meter as the K3 bar may not respond fast enough to show peaks on SSB. Merv KH7C _______________________________________________ _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
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hi Merv,
Merv Schweigert schrieb am 11 Jan 2009 um 11:51: > I just checked mine #2306, cannot get ALC above 7 bars either, Heil > proset, mic setting of 8 to 10 is plenty to get full power out. But even > if setting mic to 60 ALC is still 7 bars max. But I notice that below the > ALC bar scale ALC brackets go to 7 bars, perhaps that means full scale? I > am using the rear panel jack also, manual states 5 to 7 bars max. As far > as power output less, thats normal check the CONFIG: TXG VCE menu and set > the gain up a small amount, will bring SSB up to CW power level. Use an > external meter as the K3 bar may not respond fast enough to show peaks on > SSB. Merv KH7C I checked again and it is exactly the same here. I have a LP-100 peak meter and it shows 100 Watt out in SSB with MIC GAIN 20 COMP 20. With normal speech I have only 2-4 bars of ALC, with OOOOLA I get 5-6. 73! de Werner OE9FWV -- Viele Hunde gehen gern ins Wasser. Manche leben sogar immer dort, das sind die Seehunde. Email powered by Pegasus Mail free at <http://www.pmail.com> Homepage: <http://www.qsl.net/oe9fwv/> Fone +43 5522 75013 Fax +43 5522 75013 15 Mobile +43 664 6340014 Elecraft K2 #5203 K3 #656 _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
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In reply to this post by oe9fwv
Werner, Merv,
In that case I do suspect something is wrong. Can I assume you are running the latest firmware? There was a change in the ALC and the recommended 'number of bars' about 3 months ago which increased the normal 'number of bars'. If you are back-level I recommend you upgrade to the latest beta and try it again. One other consideration is how far away from the mic are you speaking - if using the headset, the microphone should be a max of only 2 inches (5 cm) away from your mouth, and the flat side of the mouthpiece should face your mouth. With a desk mic, it should be placed about the same distance from the mouth as well. Those mics are designed to 'close-talk' which helps with pickup of room noise too, and the microphone output drops off dramatically if you speak off-axis. I normally operate with the Elecraft MD2, but I went down to the workbench and brought up my D-104 that has been modified with an HC-5 element. I plugged it in a tried it at the same settings as I used with my MD2 (but with bias off) and could not talk it up to any ALC bars at all without shouting, but I did see an occasional bar or two on the CMP meter.. I switched to FP.H and still had to increase the mic gain up to 43 before I could see 7 bars on voice peaks with normal speech, like "Hello from W3FPR". My compression was set at 23 for all those tests. From that experience, I must conclude that any who say they run with the mic range on Low and a mic gain setting of 23 for their HC5 element either have more mic gain than my K3 or they are shouting into the mic, or have a mic preamp in the AF input - no offense to anyone intended, but my K3 just does not behave that way with the HC5 element (unamplified). I do consider my setting to be in an acceptable range because the HC4/5 elements are the lowest output mics that I will likely use with my K3. 73, Don W3FPR Dr. Werner Furlan wrote: > hi Merv, > > Merv Schweigert schrieb am 11 Jan 2009 um 11:51: > > >> I just checked mine #2306, cannot get ALC above 7 bars either, Heil >> proset, mic setting of 8 to 10 is plenty to get full power out. But even >> if setting mic to 60 ALC is still 7 bars max. But I notice that below the >> ALC bar scale ALC brackets go to 7 bars, perhaps that means full scale? I >> am using the rear panel jack also, manual states 5 to 7 bars max. As far >> as power output less, thats normal check the CONFIG: TXG VCE menu and set >> the gain up a small amount, will bring SSB up to CW power level. Use an >> external meter as the K3 bar may not respond fast enough to show peaks on >> SSB. Merv KH7C >> > > I checked again and it is exactly the same here. I have a LP-100 peak meter > and it shows 100 Watt out in SSB with MIC GAIN 20 COMP 20. > With normal speech I have only 2-4 bars of ALC, with OOOOLA I get 5-6. > > 73! de Werner OE9FWV > > Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
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hi Don, Merv,
thank you for testing with your HC-5 element! yes I am using the latest Beta firmware. I use comp 20 and mic gain 20. when I push mic gain up to 60, I get a little more ALC reading, but never over 7 bars, but not more output. VCE gain is set to 2.0, I have the feeling that my voice sounds more natural when I don't drive MIC GAIN over 25. (in monitor). My LP100 wattmeter shows peaks with 100 W out with this setting. (same as CW) From this point of view all seems o.k. Do you have any official statement from Elecraft regarding the ALC reading? 73! de Werner OE9FWV On 11 Jan 2009 at 18:25, Don Wilhelm wrote: > Werner, Merv, > > In that case I do suspect something is wrong. Can I assume you are > running the latest firmware? There was a change in the ALC and the > recommended 'number of bars' about 3 months ago which increased the > normal 'number of bars'. If you are back-level I recommend you > upgrade to the latest beta and try it again. > > One other consideration is how far away from the mic are you speaking > - if using the headset, the microphone should be a max of only 2 > inches (5 cm) away from your mouth, and the flat side of the > mouthpiece should face your mouth. With a desk mic, it should be > placed about the same distance from the mouth as well. Those mics are > designed to 'close-talk' which helps with pickup of room noise too, > and the microphone output drops off dramatically if you speak > off-axis. > > I normally operate with the Elecraft MD2, but I went down to the > workbench and brought up my D-104 that has been modified with an HC-5 > element. I plugged it in a tried it at the same settings as I used > with my MD2 (but with bias off) and could not talk it up to any ALC > bars at all without shouting, but I did see an occasional bar or two > on the CMP meter.. I switched to FP.H and still had to increase the > mic gain up to 43 before I could see 7 bars on voice peaks with normal > speech, like "Hello from W3FPR". My compression was set at 23 for all > those tests. > > From that experience, I must conclude that any who say they run with > the mic range on Low and a mic gain setting of 23 for their HC5 > element either have more mic gain than my K3 or they are shouting into > the mic, or have a mic preamp in the AF input - no offense to anyone > intended, but my K3 just does not behave that way with the HC5 element > (unamplified). > > I do consider my setting to be in an acceptable range because the > HC4/5 elements are the lowest output mics that I will likely use with > my K3. > > 73, > Don W3FPR > > Dr. Werner Furlan wrote: > > hi Merv, > > > > Merv Schweigert schrieb am 11 Jan 2009 um 11:51: > > > > > >> I just checked mine #2306, cannot get ALC above 7 bars either, > >> Heil proset, mic setting of 8 to 10 is plenty to get full power > >> out. But even if setting mic to 60 ALC is still 7 bars max. But > >> I notice that below the ALC bar scale ALC brackets go to 7 bars, > >> perhaps that means full scale? I am using the rear panel jack > >> also, manual states 5 to 7 bars max. As far as power output less, > >> thats normal check the CONFIG: TXG VCE menu and set the gain up a > >> small amount, will bring SSB up to CW power level. Use an external > >> meter as the K3 bar may not respond fast enough to show peaks on > >> SSB. Merv KH7C > >> > > > > I checked again and it is exactly the same here. I have a LP-100 > > peak meter and it shows 100 Watt out in SSB with MIC GAIN 20 COMP > > 20. With normal speech I have only 2-4 bars of ALC, with OOOOLA I > > get 5-6. > > > > 73! de Werner OE9FWV > > > > -- Pour réfléchir: Quand les riches se font la guerre, ce sont les pauvres qui meurent. -- Sartre, Jean-Paul PGP-Key: <http://www.qsl.net/oe9fwv/furlan.asc> Fone +43 5522 75013 Fax +43 820 555 85 2621 Mobile +43 664 6340014 _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
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Werner, Merv,
I cannot get more than 7 bars of ALC and any mic setting either, and that does seem to be the max. The official statement is in the manual 5 to 7 bars. The way I interpret that is that normal speech should produce 5 bars while the peaks should be flickering the 7th bar. Note also that if the TX GATE is turned on, the amount of ALC meter indication could possibly vary depending on the noise gate threshold. We have heard from Lyle Johnson, after he made the last major change, that the 5 to 6+ bars was the designed operating point. The DSP controls the modulating level and the 5th bar indicates the first level of ALC control from what I can interpret. With data modes, the gain should be adjusted to 4 bars. He has also indicated that the ALC meter action does not actually indicate ALC compression - it is operating more like a VU meter to allow one to set the gain properly. The latest information is in the new K3 manual is correct. The most recent *major* change was in MCU 1.87 / DSP 1.69 dated in may 2008. The manual was released in July. Additional information is at the Elecraft website - click on the K3 link in the opening page then scroll to the bottom of the page that opens, click on "Elecraft K3 FAQ" and from that list, click "SSB Power control and ALC metering. Bottom line, the ALC should go up to 5 with normal speech, and the peaks should indicate 6+ (7) bars. Additionally, for data modes where no ALC is wanted, the gain should be set for 4 bars deflection. 73, Don W3FPR Dr. Werner Furlan wrote: > hi Don, Merv, > > thank you for testing with your HC-5 element! > yes I am using the latest Beta firmware. I use comp 20 and mic gain 20. > when I push mic gain up to 60, I get a little more ALC reading, but never > over 7 bars, but not more output. VCE gain is set to 2.0, I have the feeling > that my voice sounds more natural when I don't drive MIC GAIN over 25. > (in monitor). My LP100 wattmeter shows peaks with 100 W out with this > setting. (same as CW) From this point of view all seems o.k. Do you have > any official statement from Elecraft regarding the ALC reading? > > 73! de Werner > OE9FWV > > Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
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