Fwd: Re: Full duplex for Sat work?

[Edward R Cole]

>Date: Mon, 17 Aug 2015 12:41:45 -0800
>To: Elecraft Reflector
>From: Edward R Cole <[hidden email]>
>Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Full duplex for Sat work?
>
>Jerry,
>
>Its tempting to think maybe the sub-Rx could be used duplex with
>main-Tx in the K3, but as you discovered its not possible as DSP is
>in use for Tx or Rx, but not both simultaneously.
>
>There is a kind of solution, though, if you own both K3 and KX3:
>
>Set K3-2M to listen on 145-MHz and use K3 with 432 transverter to
>transmit 435 (or vice versa).  The "big" issue is linking frequency
>control of both radios for tracking Doppler changes.  This will take
>sw via ports in each radio.
>This will be a third-party sw source an not "likely" accomplished
>thru firmware updates. Amsat has had what they call the "One true
>way of tracking"; have to research that to find out if it still exists.
>
>I know a ham that might develop such sw but have not contacted him, as yet.
>
>73, Ed - KL7UW
>http://www.kl7uw.com
>     "Kits made by KL7UW"
>Dubus Mag business:
>     [hidden email]

73, Ed - KL7UW
http://www.kl7uw.com
     "Kits made by KL7UW"
Dubus Mag business:
     [hidden email]

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[James Rogers]

I believe the software is available on the AMSAT website and if you sign
up for AMSAT membership they will allow the download and send a CD of
the available software etc.

Jim, W4ATK


On 8/17/2015 8:08 PM, Edward R Cole wrote:

>
>> Date: Mon, 17 Aug 2015 12:41:45 -0800
>> To: Elecraft Reflector
>> From: Edward R Cole <[hidden email]>
>> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Full duplex for Sat work?
>>
>> Jerry,
>>
>> Its tempting to think maybe the sub-Rx could be used duplex with
>> main-Tx in the K3, but as you discovered its not possible as DSP is
>> in use for Tx or Rx, but not both simultaneously.
>>
>> There is a kind of solution, though, if you own both K3 and KX3:
>>
>> Set K3-2M to listen on 145-MHz and use K3 with 432 transverter to
>> transmit 435 (or vice versa).  The "big" issue is linking frequency
>> control of both radios for tracking Doppler changes. This will take
>> sw via ports in each radio.
>> This will be a third-party sw source an not "likely" accomplished
>> thru firmware updates. Amsat has had what they call the "One true way
>> of tracking"; have to research that to find out if it still exists.
>>
>> I know a ham that might develop such sw but have not contacted him,
>> as yet.
>>
>> 73, Ed - KL7UW
>> http://www.kl7uw.com
>>     "Kits made by KL7UW"
>> Dubus Mag business:
>>     [hidden email]
>
> 73, Ed - KL7UW
> http://www.kl7uw.com
>     "Kits made by KL7UW"
> Dubus Mag business:
>     [hidden email]
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>

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[Jerry Moore]

It may merit further research. The owner's manual block indicates the Rx DSP
as "DSP2" ? It may be doable with firmware IF the hardware path would allow
it. IF the hardware paths allow it then it's probably configured in firmware
to protect the DSP/circuits... no clue.. looking for the schematic now.. not
a high priority but fun and educational.
jer

-----Original Message-----
From: Elecraft [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Jim
Rogers
Sent: Tuesday, August 18, 2015 7:46 AM
To: Edward R Cole; [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Fwd: Re: Full duplex for Sat work?

I believe the software is available on the AMSAT website and if you sign up
for AMSAT membership they will allow the download and send a CD of the
available software etc.

Jim, W4ATK


On 8/17/2015 8:08 PM, Edward R Cole wrote:

>
>> Date: Mon, 17 Aug 2015 12:41:45 -0800
>> To: Elecraft Reflector
>> From: Edward R Cole <[hidden email]>
>> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Full duplex for Sat work?
>>
>> Jerry,
>>
>> Its tempting to think maybe the sub-Rx could be used duplex with
>> main-Tx in the K3, but as you discovered its not possible as DSP is
>> in use for Tx or Rx, but not both simultaneously.
>>
>> There is a kind of solution, though, if you own both K3 and KX3:
>>
>> Set K3-2M to listen on 145-MHz and use K3 with 432 transverter to
>> transmit 435 (or vice versa).  The "big" issue is linking frequency
>> control of both radios for tracking Doppler changes. This will take
>> sw via ports in each radio.
>> This will be a third-party sw source an not "likely" accomplished
>> thru firmware updates. Amsat has had what they call the "One true way
>> of tracking"; have to research that to find out if it still exists.
>>
>> I know a ham that might develop such sw but have not contacted him,
>> as yet.
>>
>> 73, Ed - KL7UW
>> http://www.kl7uw.com
>>     "Kits made by KL7UW"
>> Dubus Mag business:
>>     [hidden email]
>
> 73, Ed - KL7UW
> http://www.kl7uw.com
>     "Kits made by KL7UW"
> Dubus Mag business:
>     [hidden email]
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email
> list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to
> [hidden email]
>

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[Lyle Johnson]

The K3 is not a full-duplex radio.

At the time of the design of the K3 I was hoping we could make it a full
duplex radio with external transverters, as I was responsible for and/or
participated in the design of several subsystems in AO-40 and other
Amateur spacecraft.

The Subreceiver has its own DSP.  The issue is signal isolation between
Tx and Rx and a few other
bottlenecks.  Full-duplex capability would have impacted the cost and
complexity of the radio significantly, and would have been a cost borne
by all buyers of the product.

Since the initial design time of the K3, the primary focus of most
Amateur satellites has been for use with dual-band HTs using FM.

73,

Lyle KK7P

> It may merit further research. The owner's manual block indicates the Rx DSP
> as "DSP2" ? ...
...
> Its tempting to think maybe the sub-Rx could be used duplex with
> main-Tx in the K3,...

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[David Giles-3]

Hello Lyle,

So using the K3 in test mode with the main transmitter on 10m or 6m
driving a transverter at 1mW and the subreceiver fed from a downlink
transverter isn't possible?  A pity since I have been using my K3 (and
K2) on the birds for quite some time but always hoped I could use it
full duplex.

FM sats may be the primary focus for North America with AMSAT-NA's FOX
series, the rest of the world is building linear transponders.  (I use
both types, no need to discuss the merits of either).

73 de David VK5DG

On 18/08/2015 23:48, Lyle Johnson wrote:

> The K3 is not a full-duplex radio.
>
> At the time of the design of the K3 I was hoping we could make it a
> full duplex radio with external transverters, as I was responsible for
> and/or participated in the design of several subsystems in AO-40 and
> other Amateur spacecraft.
>
> The Subreceiver has its own DSP.  The issue is signal isolation
> between Tx and Rx and a few other
> bottlenecks.  Full-duplex capability would have impacted the cost and
> complexity of the radio significantly, and would have been a cost
> borne by all buyers of the product.
>
> Since the initial design time of the K3, the primary focus of most
> Amateur satellites has been for use with dual-band HTs using FM.
>
> 73,
>
> Lyle KK7P
>
>> It may merit further research. The owner's manual block indicates the
>> Rx DSP
>> as "DSP2" ? ...
> ...
>> Its tempting to think maybe the sub-Rx could be used duplex with
>> main-Tx in the K3,...
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>

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