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K2 BFO CW alignment question

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Mark Petrovic

K2 BFO CW alignment question

I am performing the first alignment and test of the RF board of my K2 S/N
7809. On page 66 of the manual, I'm instructed to read page 91 of the
operating instructions to get familiar with the CAL FIL settings. Page 91
says to work through the CAL FIL examples on page 93, wherein we work
through setting the BFO frequencies. One of the steps says to hold CW RV
to switch to CW Reverse. When I press and hold CW RV, should I expect some
visual element to change to indicate that I am in this 'reverse' mode? I
don't see any visual indication. How do I know the press and hold of CW RV
was effective?

Thank you.
Mark
AE6RT

--
Mark
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Don Wilhelm

Re: K2 BFO CW alignment question

Mark,

The CW reverse is indicated by a bar over the "c" to the right of the
display. Holding the REV button should toggle it.
Likewise, that same button will toggle between USB and LSB.

73,
Don W3FPR

On 6/10/2018 3:37 PM, Mark Petrovic wrote:
> I am performing the first alignment and test of the RF board of my K2 S/N
> 7809. On page 66 of the manual, I'm instructed to read page 91 of the
> operating instructions to get familiar with the CAL FIL settings. Page 91
> says to work through the CAL FIL examples on page 93, wherein we work
> through setting the BFO frequencies. One of the steps says to hold CW RV
> to switch to CW Reverse. When I press and hold CW RV, should I expect some
> visual element to change to indicate that I am in this 'reverse' mode? I
> don't see any visual indication. How do I know the press and hold of CW RV
> was effective?
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Mark Petrovic

Re: K2 BFO CW alignment question

Thanks, Don. In CAL FIL mode, holding CW RV does not toggle a bar over the
"c". All my calibrations and tests have gone swimmingly til now. Any
suggestions on where to start to troubleshoot this? Is there another way
to verify if the toggle is being honored (could the over-bar LCD element be
bad?)?

Mark

On Sun, Jun 10, 2018 at 12:55 PM, Don Wilhelm <[hidden email]>
wrote:

> Mark,
>
> The CW reverse is indicated by a bar over the "c" to the right of the
> display. Holding the REV button should toggle it.
> Likewise, that same button will toggle between USB and LSB.
>
> 73,
> Don W3FPR
>
>
> On 6/10/2018 3:37 PM, Mark Petrovic wrote:
>
>> I am performing the first alignment and test of the RF board of my K2 S/N
>> 7809. On page 66 of the manual, I'm instructed to read page 91 of the
>> operating instructions to get familiar with the CAL FIL settings. Page 91
>> says to work through the CAL FIL examples on page 93, wherein we work
>> through setting the BFO frequencies. One of the steps says to hold CW RV
>> to switch to CW Reverse. When I press and hold CW RV, should I expect
>> some
>> visual element to change to indicate that I am in this 'reverse' mode? I
>> don't see any visual indication. How do I know the press and hold of CW
>> RV
>> was effective?
>>
>

--
Mark
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Don Wilhelm

Re: K2 BFO CW alignment question

Mark,

Get out of the CAL FIL menu and see if it does toggle the bar when in CW
mode. In SSB mode, it should toggle between LSB and USB.
If it works in SSB mode, but not in CW, you may have a display fault
that is not showing the bar - that is a different problem.

73,
Don W3FPR

On 6/10/2018 4:44 PM, Mark Petrovic wrote:
> Thanks, Don. In CAL FIL mode, holding CW RV does not toggle a bar
> over the "c". All my calibrations and tests have gone swimmingly til
> now. Any suggestions on where to start to troubleshoot this? Is
> there another way to verify if the toggle is being honored (could the
> over-bar LCD element be bad?)?

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Mark Petrovic

Re: K2 BFO CW alignment question

Don, thanks.

When I exit CAL FIL, and press and hold CW RV, I see "ST P 0.60" displayed
(with the B RIT and XIT annunciators on) whether in CW, USB or LSB mode.

On Sun, Jun 10, 2018 at 2:21 PM, Don Wilhelm <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Mark,
>
> Get out of the CAL FIL menu and see if it does toggle the bar when in CW
> mode. In SSB mode, it should toggle between LSB and USB.
> If it works in SSB mode, but not in CW, you may have a display fault that
> is not showing the bar - that is a different problem.
>
> 73,
> Don W3FPR
>
>
> On 6/10/2018 4:44 PM, Mark Petrovic wrote:
>
>> Thanks, Don. In CAL FIL mode, holding CW RV does not toggle a bar over
>> the "c". All my calibrations and tests have gone swimmingly til now. Any
>> suggestions on where to start to troubleshoot this? Is there another way
>> to verify if the toggle is being honored (could the over-bar LCD element be
>> bad?)?
>>
>
>

Don Wilhelm

Re: K2 BFO CW alignment question

Mark,

That indicates you are not getting the right button response.
Check the Front Panel Board. My immediate guess is that you have a
soldering problem on RP1, or that RP1 is inserted backwards. That is one
of the R-Paks that MUST be inserted in the proper orientation. Look at
the board silkscreen for the pin 1 location, and look for the dot at the
end of the R-Pak - they must be aligned.

You could also have a solder splash somewhere on the FP board.

73,
Don W3FPR

On 6/10/2018 5:31 PM, Mark Petrovic wrote:
> Don, thanks.
>
> When I exit CAL FIL, and press and hold CW RV, I see "ST P 0.60"
> displayed (with the B RIT and XIT annunciators on) whether in CW, USB
> or LSB mode.
>
> On Sun, Jun 10, 2018 at 2:21 PM, Don Wilhelm <[hidden email]
> <mailto:[hidden email]>> wrote:

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Mark Petrovic

Re: K2 BFO CW alignment question

Don, the soldering on RP1 is very clean, top (viewed from the side of the
board with a light and magnifying glass) and bottom. RP1 is aligned
correctly, and I've verified that it is the correct part for this location.

Worth mentioning is that the rubber spacer that installs onto the
bottom-side of the board in the corner nearest pin 10 of RP1 is attached
with a small drop of super glue (the original adhesive on the rubber pad
failed, as the pad fell off during casual handling of the board). My
understanding is that this cyanoacrylate super glue is non-conductive,
nor does the spacer w/glue bridge any solder pads. I've not inspected the
front panel board from the top, as this would require unsoldering the 4
leads holding the encoder board to the front panel board.

Mark

On Sun, Jun 10, 2018 at 2:48 PM, Don Wilhelm <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Mark,
>
> That indicates you are not getting the right button response.
> Check the Front Panel Board. My immediate guess is that you have a
> soldering problem on RP1, or that RP1 is inserted backwards. That is one of
> the R-Paks that MUST be inserted in the proper orientation. Look at the
> board silkscreen for the pin 1 location, and look for the dot at the end of
> the R-Pak - they must be aligned.
>
> You could also have a solder splash somewhere on the FP board.
>
> 73,
> Don W3FPR
>
> On 6/10/2018 5:31 PM, Mark Petrovic wrote:
>
>> Don, thanks.
>>
>> When I exit CAL FIL, and press and hold CW RV, I see "ST P 0.60"
>> displayed (with the B RIT and XIT annunciators on) whether in CW, USB or
>> LSB mode.
>>
>> On Sun, Jun 10, 2018 at 2:21 PM, Don Wilhelm <[hidden email]
>> <mailto:[hidden email]>> wrote:
>>
>
>

Don Wilhelm

Re: K2 BFO CW alignment question

Mark,

OK on that. Since you have the new encoder board, it could be touching
the pins on the back of the Control Board which can cause all kinds of
"strange happenings".
First step is to flush cut (diagonal cutters will not do the job) the
pins on the encoder board (cut right down into the solder). Then flush
cut the leads on the back of the Control Board where it can contact the
encoder board.
As an added protection measure, put a piece of card stock (business card
of part of a QSL card) between the encoder board and the Control Board -
or better yet a flat piece of plastic, like that used in many shrink
wrapped packages from the store.

Then see if the behavior settles down.
If it does not, you will have to find the problem in the Front Panel
switch matrix (not an easy task).

73,
Don W3FPR

On 6/10/2018 6:44 PM, Mark Petrovic wrote:

> Don, the soldering on RP1 is very clean, top (viewed from the side of
> the board with a light and magnifying glass) and bottom. RP1 is
> aligned correctly, and I've verified that it is the correct part for
> this location.
>
> Worth mentioning is that the rubber spacer that installs onto the
> bottom-side of the board in the corner nearest pin 10 of RP1 is
> attached with a small drop of super glue (the original adhesive on the
> rubber pad failed, as the pad fell off during casual handling of the
> board). My understanding is that this cyanoacrylate super glue is
> non-conductive, nor does the spacer w/glue bridge any solder pads.
> I've not inspected the front panel board from the top, as this would
> require unsoldering the 4 leads holding the encoder board to the front
> panel board.
>
>

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Mark Petrovic

Re: K2 BFO CW alignment question

Thanks, Don.

Would you mind outlining the approach for analyzing the front panel switch matrix?

> On Jun 10, 2018, at 3:55 PM, Don Wilhelm <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> Mark,
>
> OK on that. Since you have the new encoder board, it could be touching the pins on the back of the Control Board which can cause all kinds of "strange happenings".
> First step is to flush cut (diagonal cutters will not do the job) the pins on the encoder board (cut right down into the solder). Then flush cut the leads on the back of the Control Board where it can contact the encoder board.
> As an added protection measure, put a piece of card stock (business card of part of a QSL card) between the encoder board and the Control Board - or better yet a flat piece of plastic, like that used in many shrink wrapped packages from the store.
>
> Then see if the behavior settles down.
> If it does not, you will have to find the problem in the Front Panel switch matrix (not an easy task).
>
> 73,
> Don W3FPR
>
>> On 6/10/2018 6:44 PM, Mark Petrovic wrote:
>> Don, the soldering on RP1 is very clean, top (viewed from the side of the board with a light and magnifying glass) and bottom. RP1 is aligned correctly, and I've verified that it is the correct part for this location.
>>
>> Worth mentioning is that the rubber spacer that installs onto the bottom-side of the board in the corner nearest pin 10 of RP1 is attached with a small drop of super glue (the original adhesive on the rubber pad failed, as the pad fell off during casual handling of the board). My understanding is that this cyanoacrylate super glue is non-conductive, nor does the spacer w/glue bridge any solder pads. I've not inspected the front panel board from the top, as this would require unsoldering the 4 leads holding the encoder board to the front panel board.
>>
>>
>

Don Wilhelm

Re: K2 BFO CW alignment question

Mark,

Analyzing the switch matrix is an iterative process
The first thing to do is to determine which wrong responses are being
sent, and for that you must refer to the schematic. In your case of the
REV button and the STP 60 display, the hold of the REV button is
bringing up the PF1 display.
Check the TAP function of the same button (AGC) to see if it brings up
the RIT announciator (I think it will).
If so, it means that the D1 and D2 lines are somehow being activated at
the same time.
Your first check would be to see if there is continuity between pins 12
and 13 of U2. Also check for continuity to ground for both of those
lines. If you find U2 pins 12 and 13 shorted together, look for the
reason - a solder splash making a bridge or a bit of wire lead stuck
between the pins, look top and bottom of the board.
That is how the process goes - as I indicated, it is not 'nice'.

Hopefully those two buttons are the only ones involved.
At worst, it means removing the pushbuttons and replacing them with
new. If it comes to that, clip the leads on the switch side close to
the switch body and remove the leads one at a time, then troubleshoot
the board.

73,
Don W3FPR

On 6/10/2018 7:15 PM, Mark Petrovic wrote:
> Thanks, Don.
>
> Would you mind outlining the approach for analyzing the front panel switch matrix?
>
>
>

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Mark Petrovic

Re: K2 BFO CW alignment question

Don, thank for the excellent guidance. I'll begin the debug process.

By the way, I have eliminated spurious contact between the encoder board
and control board, as I debugged that some weeks ago:
https://www.mail-archive.com/elecraft@.../msg219585.html.
There is now room between the boards such that the plastic packing material
you mention moves freely about without friction. This spurious contact
possibility was one of the first things I checked today when the "c"
indicator would not light.

On Sun, Jun 10, 2018 at 4:43 PM, Don Wilhelm <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Mark,
>
> Analyzing the switch matrix is an iterative process
> The first thing to do is to determine which wrong responses are being
> sent, and for that you must refer to the schematic. In your case of the
> REV button and the STP 60 display, the hold of the REV button is bringing
> up the PF1 display.
> Check the TAP function of the same button (AGC) to see if it brings up the
> RIT announciator (I think it will).
> If so, it means that the D1 and D2 lines are somehow being activated at
> the same time.
> Your first check would be to see if there is continuity between pins 12
> and 13 of U2. Also check for continuity to ground for both of those
> lines. If you find U2 pins 12 and 13 shorted together, look for the reason
> - a solder splash making a bridge or a bit of wire lead stuck between the
> pins, look top and bottom of the board.
> That is how the process goes - as I indicated, it is not 'nice'.
>
> Hopefully those two buttons are the only ones involved.
> At worst, it means removing the pushbuttons and replacing them with new.
> If it comes to that, clip the leads on the switch side close to the switch
> body and remove the leads one at a time, then troubleshoot the board.
>
> 73,
> Don W3FPR
>
>
> On 6/10/2018 7:15 PM, Mark Petrovic wrote:
>
>> Thanks, Don.
>>
>> Would you mind outlining the approach for analyzing the front panel
>> switch matrix?
>>
>>
>>
>>
>

Mark Petrovic

Re: K2 BFO CW alignment question

In reply to this post by Don Wilhelm

I had an internal dialogue with myself as to whether I should reveal what
the problem was, and concluded that I should. Maybe it'll help someone
else. I was pushing the wrong button to activate CW RV. For some reason,
my brain said I should push and hold the button below (XIT). Problem
solved; rig works just fine.

Don, thanks. Sorry to put you through that, but I did read your notes
above and correlate them with the schematic. Something told me to double
check the button labels. Glad it did.

Mark
AE6RT

On Sun, Jun 10, 2018 at 4:43 PM Don Wilhelm <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Mark,
>
> Analyzing the switch matrix is an iterative process
> The first thing to do is to determine which wrong responses are being
> sent, and for that you must refer to the schematic. In your case of the
> REV button and the STP 60 display, the hold of the REV button is
> bringing up the PF1 display.
> Check the TAP function of the same button (AGC) to see if it brings up
> the RIT announciator (I think it will).
> If so, it means that the D1 and D2 lines are somehow being activated at
> the same time.
> Your first check would be to see if there is continuity between pins 12
> and 13 of U2. Also check for continuity to ground for both of those
> lines. If you find U2 pins 12 and 13 shorted together, look for the
> reason - a solder splash making a bridge or a bit of wire lead stuck
> between the pins, look top and bottom of the board.
> That is how the process goes - as I indicated, it is not 'nice'.
>
> Hopefully those two buttons are the only ones involved.
> At worst, it means removing the pushbuttons and replacing them with
> new. If it comes to that, clip the leads on the switch side close to
> the switch body and remove the leads one at a time, then troubleshoot
> the board.
>
> 73,
> Don W3FPR
>
> On 6/10/2018 7:15 PM, Mark Petrovic wrote:
> > Thanks, Don.
> >
> > Would you mind outlining the approach for analyzing the front panel
> switch matrix?
> >
> >
> >
>
>