Elecraft › [K3]

[K3] Auto Shift/Width - Possible?

Classic

List

Threaded

17 messages Options

Pete Smith N4ZR

[K3] Auto Shift/Width - Possible?

I am one of those semi-tone-deaf people -- which means that my
zero-beating is unsure, and when I need to narrow my CW bandpass, I have
trouble quickly and accurately manipulating the Shift and Width controls
to narrow the bandpass and center it on the desired signal. This really
came home to me in this weekend's WAE CW contest.

Given that the audio is being digitally manipulated anyway, is there any
possibility of implementing an automatic process for picking out one of
2 or 3 signals and centering the narrower bandpass characteristic on
it? I realize that the processor couldn't tell which signal was the
desired one, so you would have to have the option of using a button push
or a CAT command to step quickly through the signals in the original
bandpass to select the correct one.

--
73, Pete N4ZR

The World Contest Station Database, updated daily at www.conteststations.com
The Reverse Beacon Network at http://reversebeacon.net, blog at reversebeacon.blogspot.com,
spots at telnet.reversebeacon.net, port 7000

______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

Don Wilhelm-4

Re: [K3] Auto Shift/Width - Possible?

Pete,

I believe the Auto-Spot feature is the closest thing to what you are
looking for.
If you need to get more sophisticated than that, I would suggest you
connect the K3 to the soundcard input and use something like Spectrogram
or some other FFT based audio spectrum analyzer to give you a view of
the receive passband and the signals in it.

Normally, you should center the filter passband at your CW sidetone
(spot) frequency, and use the VFO to move the signal to that frequency.
Once you get close, auto-spot will move it 'right-on'.

A bit of practice with Spectrogram (or other) could give you a better
feel for the effects of the width and shift controls. You can download
version 5 of Spectrogram from Tom Hammond's website www.n0ss.net. Tom
has some setup information on his site as well. Try it and see if that
helps. If nothing else, it will give you some practice "training your
brain" to recognize tones a little better.

73,
Don W3FPR

Pete Smith wrote:

> I am one of those semi-tone-deaf people -- which means that my
> zero-beating is unsure, and when I need to narrow my CW bandpass, I have
> trouble quickly and accurately manipulating the Shift and Width controls
> to narrow the bandpass and center it on the desired signal. This really
> came home to me in this weekend's WAE CW contest.
>
> Given that the audio is being digitally manipulated anyway, is there any
> possibility of implementing an automatic process for picking out one of
> 2 or 3 signals and centering the narrower bandpass characteristic on
> it? I realize that the processor couldn't tell which signal was the
> desired one, so you would have to have the option of using a button push
> or a CAT command to step quickly through the signals in the original
> bandpass to select the correct one.
>
>

______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

The Smiths

Re: [K3] Auto Shift/Width - Possible?

In reply to this post by Pete Smith N4ZR

If your ears don't work Pete, how about you use your eyes. There's a great free program that works with your computers sound card input. It's called Spectrogram and it's FREE. You can download it here: http://w5big.com/Spectrogram517.zip
with this program you can set up a marker for your "zero beat" PITCH freq. and you can visually see all the signals within your pass band area. When you have decided which is the one that you want to tune in, all you have to do is move your VFO until that particular signal is sitting right on top of the Marker line (pitch freq marker).

The great thing about it is it works Post filters, notch, width and shift because it's using the audio out of your rig. This means that you can not only see the signals, but you will be able to adjust your manual notch freq. and see how it effects the signals around the marker. You'll also be able to narrow or widen your width filter then shift around so that you can visually watch how you are cutting off other signals to the side of your Pitch marker freq.

It's a great too to have, and from what you've said about not being able to tune someone in, I think that this would be a perfect tool for you. One last benefit for you to have this program would be for setting up your REF CAL alignment in the K3 too. This program will get you within 1 Hz (or less) of Zero Beat. (Config: Ref Cal)

Of course there's always the CWT marker that you could move around until you've lined the K3 in Zero beat, and if you put the right signal in the display and hit SPOT (while in CWT mode) it will automatically set that for you as well (+/-2 Hz). The combination of looking at the Spectrogram, cleaning out the unwanted signals, then hitting auto spot on the K3 is your best bet for fast automation.
Hope this helps solve your issue.

> Date: Mon, 16 Aug 2010 07:49:16 -0400
> From: [hidden email]
> To: [hidden email]
> Subject: [Elecraft] [K3] Auto Shift/Width - Possible?
>
> I am one of those semi-tone-deaf people -- which means that my
> zero-beating is unsure, and when I need to narrow my CW bandpass, I have
> trouble quickly and accurately manipulating the Shift and Width controls
> to narrow the bandpass and center it on the desired signal. This really
> came home to me in this weekend's WAE CW contest.
>
> Given that the audio is being digitally manipulated anyway, is there any
> possibility of implementing an automatic process for picking out one of
> 2 or 3 signals and centering the narrower bandpass characteristic on
> it? I realize that the processor couldn't tell which signal was the
> desired one, so you would have to have the option of using a button push
> or a CAT command to step quickly through the signals in the original
> bandpass to select the correct one.
>
> --
> 73, Pete N4ZR
>
> The World Contest Station Database, updated daily at www.conteststations.com
> The Reverse Beacon Network at http://reversebeacon.net, blog at reversebeacon.blogspot.com,
> spots at telnet.reversebeacon.net, port 7000
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

The Smiths

Re: /Spectrogram517.zip

No problems here, I opened the file here. Make sure that you included that "p" at the end of the string. I noticed that it was no bolded. I've sent you the files direct in the mean time.

From: [hidden email]
To: [hidden email]; [hidden email]
Subject: /Spectrogram517.zip
Date: Mon, 16 Aug 2010 17:44:09 +0000

Anyone have success in running the zip file? My copy of WinZip returns error msg.

Howard..K2HK

> If your ears don't work Pete, how about you use your eyes. There's a great free program that works with your computers sound card input. It's called Spectrogram and it's FREE. You can download it here: http://w5big.com/Spectrogram517.zip
> with this program you can set up a marker for your "zero beat" PITCH freq. and you can visually see all the signals within your pass band area. When you have decided which is the one that you want to tune in, all you have to do is move your VFO until that particular signal is sitting right on top of the Marker line (pitch freq marker).

______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

Chester Alderman

Re: /Spectrogram517.zip

But aren't you running Spectragram under Win XP? I didn't think it worked on
Win 7? It says it does not work with 32-bit op systems.

-----Original Message-----
From: [hidden email]
[mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of The Smiths
Sent: Monday, August 16, 2010 2:21 PM
To: Elecraft Reflector
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] /Spectrogram517.zip

No problems here, I opened the file here. Make sure that you included that
"p" at the end of the string. I noticed that it was no bolded. I've sent
you the files direct in the mean time.

From: [hidden email]
To: [hidden email]; [hidden email]
Subject: /Spectrogram517.zip
Date: Mon, 16 Aug 2010 17:44:09 +0000

Anyone have success in running the zip file? My copy of WinZip returns error
msg.

Howard..K2HK

> If your ears don't work Pete, how about you use your eyes. There's a great
free program that works with your computers sound card input. It's called
Spectrogram and it's FREE. You can download it here:
http://w5big.com/Spectrogram517.zip
> with this program you can set up a marker for your "zero beat" PITCH freq.
and you can visually see all the signals within your pass band area. When
you have decided which is the one that you want to tune in, all you have to
do is move your VFO until that particular signal is sitting right on top of
the Marker line (pitch freq marker).

______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

The Smiths

Re: /Spectrogram517.zip

Yes, I use it with Win XP pro. 32 bit. I'm sure there must be a way to force it to work on Win7 I'm not able to tell you that because I don't have a win7 system here to test with. Perhpas someone else can give a hand in that area.

> From: [hidden email]
> To: [hidden email]
> Date: Mon, 16 Aug 2010 15:19:44 -0400
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] /Spectrogram517.zip
>
> But aren't you running Spectragram under Win XP? I didn't think it worked on
> Win 7? It says it does not work with 32-bit op systems.
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [hidden email]
> [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of The Smiths
> Sent: Monday, August 16, 2010 2:21 PM
> To: Elecraft Reflector
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] /Spectrogram517.zip
>
>
> No problems here, I opened the file here. Make sure that you included that
> "p" at the end of the string. I noticed that it was no bolded. I've sent
> you the files direct in the mean time.
>
>
>
> From: [hidden email]
> To: [hidden email]; [hidden email]
> Subject: /Spectrogram517.zip
> Date: Mon, 16 Aug 2010 17:44:09 +0000
>
>
>
>
> Anyone have success in running the zip file? My copy of WinZip returns error
> msg.
>
> Howard..K2HK
>
>
> > If your ears don't work Pete, how about you use your eyes. There's a great
> free program that works with your computers sound card input. It's called
> Spectrogram and it's FREE. You can download it here:
> http://w5big.com/Spectrogram517.zip
> > with this program you can set up a marker for your "zero beat" PITCH freq.
> and you can visually see all the signals within your pass band area. When
> you have decided which is the one that you want to tune in, all you have to
> do is move your VFO until that particular signal is sitting right on top of
> the Marker line (pitch freq marker).
>
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

Mike Reublin

Re: /Spectrogram517.zip

I just downloaded V5. It starts up OK on Win7 Home Premium 64 bit. It can't find
the volume controls. The mixer app has changed. It's fairly trivial to detect the OS
version, and call the new mixer.

I didn't have any sound in to see what it actually does on Win 7.

73, Mike NF4L

On 8/16/2010 3:45 PM, The Smiths wrote:

> Yes, I use it with Win XP pro. 32 bit. I'm sure there must be a way to force it to work on Win7 I'm not able to tell you that because I don't have a win7 system here to test with. Perhpas someone else can give a hand in that area.
>
>> From: [hidden email]
>> To: [hidden email]
>> Date: Mon, 16 Aug 2010 15:19:44 -0400
>> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] /Spectrogram517.zip
>>
>> But aren't you running Spectragram under Win XP? I didn't think it worked on
>> Win 7? It says it does not work with 32-bit op systems.
>>
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: [hidden email]
>> [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of The Smiths
>> Sent: Monday, August 16, 2010 2:21 PM
>> To: Elecraft Reflector
>> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] /Spectrogram517.zip
>>
>>
>> No problems here, I opened the file here. Make sure that you included that
>> "p" at the end of the string. I noticed that it was no bolded. I've sent
>> you the files direct in the mean time.
>>
>>
>>
>> From: [hidden email]
>> To: [hidden email]; [hidden email]
>> Subject: /Spectrogram517.zip
>> Date: Mon, 16 Aug 2010 17:44:09 +0000
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Anyone have success in running the zip file? My copy of WinZip returns error
>> msg.
>>
>> Howard..K2HK
>>
>>
>>> If your ears don't work Pete, how about you use your eyes. There's a great
>> free program that works with your computers sound card input. It's called
>> Spectrogram and it's FREE. You can download it here:
>> http://w5big.com/Spectrogram517.zip
>>> with this program you can set up a marker for your "zero beat" PITCH freq.
>> and you can visually see all the signals within your pass band area. When
>> you have decided which is the one that you want to tune in, all you have to
>> do is move your VFO until that particular signal is sitting right on top of
>> the Marker line (pitch freq marker).
>>

Dr. Detlef Petrausch

Re: /Spectrogram517.zip

Spectrogram16 works on Windows 7 Home Premium 64 bit without any problem.

Detlef, DL7NDF

______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

Don Wilhelm-4

Re: /Spectrogram517.zip

In reply to this post by Mike Reublin

For those who have trouble with Spectrogram 5.17, you might try
Spectrogram 16. The author also made that freeware. There are more
bells and whistles than version 5, and operates with slight differences,
but the basics are still the same.
Tom Hammond's setup information will not be exactly correct but can
still give you some clues. Version 16 has a good help file.
Google will show you a number of download locations.

73,
Don W3FPR

Mike wrote:

> I just downloaded V5. It starts up OK on Win7 Home Premium 64 bit. It can't find
> the volume controls. The mixer app has changed. It's fairly trivial to detect the OS
> version, and call the new mixer.
>
> I didn't have any sound in to see what it actually does on Win 7.
>
> 73, Mike NF4L
>
>
>

John Ragle

Re: /Spectrogram517.zip

I have some significant problems with various suggestions about
SpectroGram using WIN 7 Ultimate (32 bit).

1. The URL given for the home page (Horne) comes back as non-existent.
2. Downloading and installing Ver. 5 from "gram50.zip" goes without
problems, but the program can't find the WIN 7 volume mixer utility, and
there seems to be no .cfg or .ini file in which one can modify the mixer
location/specification.
3. The versions called variously "Spectrogram 16" etc. are only
available behind Bit-torrent or bit-torrent-like locations, which are
definitely NOT free, and are troublesome in other ways..
4. Similar comments apply to various other "versions" of Spectrogram
found in Google.

Suggestions?

John Ragle -- W1ZI

=====

On 8/16/2010 4:32 PM, Don Wilhelm wrote:
> For those who have trouble with Spectrogram 5.17, you might try
> Spectrogram 16.
>

______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

The Smiths

Re: /Spectrogram517.zip

You should be able to get it from this link:
http://jx.newhua.com/down/files/gram16_setup.zip

> Date: Mon, 16 Aug 2010 17:14:23 -0400
> From: [hidden email]
> To: [hidden email]
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] /Spectrogram517.zip
>
> I have some significant problems with various suggestions about
> SpectroGram using WIN 7 Ultimate (32 bit).
>
> 1. The URL given for the home page (Horne) comes back as non-existent.
> 2. Downloading and installing Ver. 5 from "gram50.zip" goes without
> problems, but the program can't find the WIN 7 volume mixer utility, and
> there seems to be no .cfg or .ini file in which one can modify the mixer
> location/specification.
> 3. The versions called variously "Spectrogram 16" etc. are only
> available behind Bit-torrent or bit-torrent-like locations, which are
> definitely NOT free, and are troublesome in other ways..
> 4. Similar comments apply to various other "versions" of Spectrogram
> found in Google.
>
> Suggestions?
>
> John Ragle -- W1ZI
>
> =====
>
> On 8/16/2010 4:32 PM, Don Wilhelm wrote:
> > For those who have trouble with Spectrogram 5.17, you might try
> > Spectrogram 16.
> >
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

John Ragle

Re: /Spectrogram517.zip

For the reflector: This is a Japanese site. No such file comes up in the
English version, and unfortunatlely I don't read Japanese.

John Ragle -- W1ZI

=====

On 8/16/2010 5:21 PM, The Smiths wrote:
> You should be able to get it from this link:
> http://jx.newhua.com/down/files/gram16_setup.zip
>

______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

The Smiths

Re: /Spectrogram517.zip

In reply to this post by John Ragle

Okay, try this link, select something like Mirror 15... it should work fine.

http://www.onlinedown.com/detail/6597.htm

Date: Mon, 16 Aug 2010 17:25:43 -0400
From: [hidden email]
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] /Spectrogram517.zip

"Should" but can't. The URL you give is a Japanese site. When I go to the English version and search on keywords using spec, Spec, etc. nothing comes up.

Further suggestions?

JLR

=====

On 8/16/2010 5:20 PM, The Smiths wrote:

You should be able to get it from this link:

http://jx.newhua.com/down/files/gram16_setup.zip

______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

The Smiths

Re: /Spectrogram517.zip

In reply to this post by John Ragle

What do you mean you don't read japanese.. LOL... Okay fine, for the rest of you:

http://www.onlinedown.com/detail/6597.htm
Pick mirror 15 or 16, they should work well.

> Date: Mon, 16 Aug 2010 17:28:06 -0400
> From: [hidden email]
> To: [hidden email]
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] /Spectrogram517.zip
>
> For the reflector: This is a Japanese site. No such file comes up in the
> English version, and unfortunatlely I don't read Japanese.
>
> John Ragle -- W1ZI
>
> =====
>
> On 8/16/2010 5:21 PM, The Smiths wrote:
> > You should be able to get it from this link:
> > http://jx.newhua.com/down/files/gram16_setup.zip
> >
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

John Ragle

Re: /Spectrogram517.zip

Download goes OK. Program starts. No connection with sound card or audio
mixer utility. Help doesn't work. QuickStart doesn't work. Both latter
want Adobe Reader installed, which it is. I tried moving the Adobe
Reader shortcut to the Spectrogram 16 folder, but the program still
can't find it. No .cfg or .ini files associated with program.

I am beginning to think I should move to Japan.

John Ragle -- W1ZI

=====

On 8/16/2010 5:31 PM, The Smiths wrote:
> What do you mean you don't read japanese.. LOL... Okay fine, for the
> rest of you:
>
> http://www.onlinedown.com/detail/6597.htm
> Pick mirror 15 or 16, they should work well.

______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

John Ragle

Re: /Spectrogram517.zip

Spectrogram 16 works fine with WIN 7 Ultimate (32 bit). It keeps several
useful
files, including a manual in its folder, in c:\program
files\visualization software\spectrum 16. The manual
clarifies matters a bit wrt to the WIN 7 mixer, etc. even though it
stops with VISTA.

Thanks to all the Japanese who contributed help...

John Ragle -- W1ZI
______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

Pete Smith N4ZR

Re: /Spectrogram517.zip

It also works fine on a minimal Pentium 4 under XP, although at the
lowest sample rate it is still using ~50 percent of the CPU's
resources. I would hesitate to combine that with all the computing
burdens imposed by a contest logging program and a heavy spot flow from
the Internet.

73, Pete N4ZR

The World Contest Station Database, updated daily at www.conteststations.com
The Reverse Beacon Network at http://reversebeacon.net, blog at reversebeacon.blogspot.com,
spots at telnet.reversebeacon.net, port 7000

On 8/16/2010 6:24 PM, John Ragle wrote:

> Spectrogram 16 works fine with WIN 7 Ultimate (32 bit). It keeps several
> useful
> files, including a manual in its folder, in c:\program
> files\visualization software\spectrum 16. The manual
> clarifies matters a bit wrt to the WIN 7 mixer, etc. even though it
> stops with VISTA.
>
> Thanks to all the Japanese who contributed help...
>
> John Ragle -- W1ZI
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>
>
>