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K3 Failure

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Gary Ferdinand

K3 Failure

When I powered the K3 up this morning I was greeted with the following behavior:

When it powered up, the LCD display was on (yellow) but nothing was displayed
No Audio
No band data sent to the computer
Nothing on the P3.
The K3 could not be powered off with its power switch.

Since my K3/P3/KAT/KPA configuration operated more or less flawlessly, I asked “What changed?”

My Acom 2000A was configured to be the amp
The power to the KAT500 was removed and repurposed
Appropriate coaxial cables were rerouted to put the 2000A in line (of course)

With the help of a good friend it was determined that the issue was that I had removed power from the KAT500 without unplugging the unit from the K3’s ACC jack. When I unplugged that line, the K3 powered up normally.

Why does this happen? Is a powered-off KAT500 an invalid state to the K3?

Thanks,

Gary W2CS

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Cady, Fred

Re: K3 Failure

Hi Gary,
If the K3 is turned on when the KAT500 is off, the tuner may pull down (almost ground) control signals in the K3-KPA Cable, specifically AUXBUS. If this happens you will be presented with a totally blank K3 display or hung up K3 and you must turn off the K3's power supply to recover. To avoid this problem you can either switch on the KAT500 before the K3 or switch them both on at the same time, which seems to work too (that's what I do).
Here is a procedure to restore the K3 to normal operation:
* Disconnect or turn off all power to the K3.
* If you have a KPA500, turn it off using the back panel AC power switch.
* Turn on the KAT500.
* If you have a KPA500, turn it back on also using the back panel AC power switch - you don't need to turn on the front panel power switch. (Some users have reported problems trying to restart their K3 when the KPA500 is off.)
* Restore power to the K3.
* Turn the K3 power on with the POWER switch.
If this procedure doesn't work, try this:
* Disconnect or turn off all power to the K3.
* Disconnect the K3-KPA Cable from the K3 ACC connector.
* Restore power to the K3.
* Turn the K3 power on with the POWER switch.
If this procedure doesn't work, you may have other problems and it may be time to call Elecraft Customer Service or to try the K3's EE INIT procedure . If the above does work, continue with the following:
* Turn the K3 power off with the POWER switch.
* Reconnect the K3-KPA Cable to the K3 ACC connector.
* Turn on the KAT500.
* If you have a KPA500, turn it on also.
* Turn the K3 power on with the POWER switch.

Cheers and 73,
Fred KE7X

"The Elecraft K3: Design, Configuration and Operation 2nd ed"
"The Elecraft KX3 - Going for the summit"
"The Elecraft KPA500 and KAT500 - the K-Line Dream Station"
Printed, coil bound copies of these are all available at www.elecraft.com, pdf's available from www.ke7x.com
KPA500 and KAT500 Quick Set Up Guide
http://www.ke7x.com/home/k-line-introduction-and-set-up-guide

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Elecraft [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of
> Gary Ferdinand
> Sent: Sunday, August 10, 2014 9:11 AM
> To: elecraft
> Subject: [Elecraft] K3 Failure
>
>
> When I powered the K3 up this morning I was greeted with the following
> behavior:
>
> When it powered up, the LCD display was on (yellow) but nothing was
> displayed No Audio No band data sent to the computer Nothing on the P3.
> The K3 could not be powered off with its power switch.
>
> Since my K3/P3/KAT/KPA configuration operated more or less flawlessly,
> I asked "What changed?"
>
> My Acom 2000A was configured to be the amp The power to the KAT500
> was removed and repurposed Appropriate coaxial cables were rerouted to
> put the 2000A in line (of course)
>
> With the help of a good friend it was determined that the issue was
> that I had removed power from the KAT500 without unplugging the unit
> from the K3's ACC jack. When I unplugged that line, the K3 powered up
> normally.
>
> Why does this happen? Is a powered-off KAT500 an invalid state to the
> K3?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Gary W2CS
>
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to [hidden email]

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Gary Ferdinand

Re: K3 Failure

Thanks Fred and Steve.

Removing the KAT from the K3 ACC connection did the trick. There are shack configurations where I have no power available to the KAT500, so looks like I yank the ACC plug every time I need that configuration. Strange design, that.

Tnx/73

Gary W2CS

On Aug 10, 2014, at 1:40 PM, Cady, Fred <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Hi Gary,
> If the K3 is turned on when the KAT500 is off, the tuner may pull down (almost ground) control signals in the K3-KPA Cable, specifically AUXBUS. If this happens you will be presented with a totally blank K3 display or hung up K3 and you must turn off the K3's power supply to recover. To avoid this problem you can either switch on the KAT500 before the K3 or switch them both on at the same time, which seems to work too (that's what I do).
> Here is a procedure to restore the K3 to normal operation:
> * Disconnect or turn off all power to the K3.
> * If you have a KPA500, turn it off using the back panel AC power switch.
> * Turn on the KAT500.
> * If you have a KPA500, turn it back on also using the back panel AC power switch - you don't need to turn on the front panel power switch. (Some users have reported problems trying to restart their K3 when the KPA500 is off.)
> * Restore power to the K3.
> * Turn the K3 power on with the POWER switch.
> If this procedure doesn't work, try this:
> * Disconnect or turn off all power to the K3.
> * Disconnect the K3-KPA Cable from the K3 ACC connector.
> * Restore power to the K3.
> * Turn the K3 power on with the POWER switch.
> If this procedure doesn't work, you may have other problems and it may be time to call Elecraft Customer Service or to try the K3's EE INIT procedure . If the above does work, continue with the following:
> * Turn the K3 power off with the POWER switch.
> * Reconnect the K3-KPA Cable to the K3 ACC connector.
> * Turn on the KAT500.
> * If you have a KPA500, turn it on also.
> * Turn the K3 power on with the POWER switch.
>
> Cheers and 73,
> Fred KE7X
>
> "The Elecraft K3: Design, Configuration and Operation 2nd ed"
> "The Elecraft KX3 - Going for the summit"
> "The Elecraft KPA500 and KAT500 - the K-Line Dream Station"
> Printed, coil bound copies of these are all available at www.elecraft.com, pdf's available from www.ke7x.com
> KPA500 and KAT500 Quick Set Up Guide
> http://www.ke7x.com/home/k-line-introduction-and-set-up-guide
>
>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Elecraft [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of
>> Gary Ferdinand
>> Sent: Sunday, August 10, 2014 9:11 AM
>> To: elecraft
>> Subject: [Elecraft] K3 Failure
>>
>>
>> When I powered the K3 up this morning I was greeted with the following
>> behavior:
>>
>> When it powered up, the LCD display was on (yellow) but nothing was
>> displayed No Audio No band data sent to the computer Nothing on the P3.
>> The K3 could not be powered off with its power switch.
>>
>> Since my K3/P3/KAT/KPA configuration operated more or less flawlessly,
>> I asked "What changed?"
>>
>> My Acom 2000A was configured to be the amp The power to the KAT500
>> was removed and repurposed Appropriate coaxial cables were rerouted to
>> put the 2000A in line (of course)
>>
>> With the help of a good friend it was determined that the issue was
>> that I had removed power from the KAT500 without unplugging the unit
>> from the K3's ACC jack. When I unplugged that line, the K3 powered up
>> normally.
>>
>> Why does this happen? Is a powered-off KAT500 an invalid state to the
>> K3?
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> Gary W2CS
>>
>>
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> Elecraft mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>> Message delivered to [hidden email]

Phil Wheeler-2

Re: K3 Failure

I wonder if you could simply power the KAT500 from
its own wall wart?

Phil W7OX

On 8/10/14, 2:42 PM, Gary Ferdinand wrote:

> Thanks Fred and Steve.
>
> Removing the KAT from the K3 ACC connection did the trick. There are shack configurations where I have no power available to the KAT500, so looks like I yank the ACC plug every time I need that configuration. Strange design, that.
>
> Tnx/73
>
> Gary W2CS
>
>
> On Aug 10, 2014, at 1:40 PM, Cady, Fred <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> Hi Gary,
>> If the K3 is turned on when the KAT500 is off, the tuner may pull down (almost ground) control signals in the K3-KPA Cable, specifically AUXBUS. If this happens you will be presented with a totally blank K3 display or hung up K3 and you must turn off the K3's power supply to recover. To avoid this problem you can either switch on the KAT500 before the K3 or switch them both on at the same time, which seems to work too (that's what I do).
>> Here is a procedure to restore the K3 to normal operation:
>> * Disconnect or turn off all power to the K3.
>> * If you have a KPA500, turn it off using the back panel AC power switch.
>> * Turn on the KAT500.
>> * If you have a KPA500, turn it back on also using the back panel AC power switch - you don't need to turn on the front panel power switch. (Some users have reported problems trying to restart their K3 when the KPA500 is off.)
>> * Restore power to the K3.
>> * Turn the K3 power on with the POWER switch.
>> If this procedure doesn't work, try this:
>> * Disconnect or turn off all power to the K3.
>> * Disconnect the K3-KPA Cable from the K3 ACC connector.
>> * Restore power to the K3.
>> * Turn the K3 power on with the POWER switch.
>> If this procedure doesn't work, you may have other problems and it may be time to call Elecraft Customer Service or to try the K3's EE INIT procedure . If the above does work, continue with the following:
>> * Turn the K3 power off with the POWER switch.
>> * Reconnect the K3-KPA Cable to the K3 ACC connector.
>> * Turn on the KAT500.
>> * If you have a KPA500, turn it on also.
>> * Turn the K3 power on with the POWER switch.
>>
>> Cheers and 73,
>> Fred KE7X
>>
>> "The Elecraft K3: Design, Configuration and Operation 2nd ed"
>> "The Elecraft KX3 - Going for the summit"
>> "The Elecraft KPA500 and KAT500 - the K-Line Dream Station"
>> Printed, coil bound copies of these are all available at www.elecraft.com, pdf's available from www.ke7x.com
>> KPA500 and KAT500 Quick Set Up Guide
>> http://www.ke7x.com/home/k-line-introduction-and-set-up-guide
>>
>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Elecraft [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of
>>> Gary Ferdinand
>>> Sent: Sunday, August 10, 2014 9:11 AM
>>> To: elecraft
>>> Subject: [Elecraft] K3 Failure
>>>
>>>
>>> When I powered the K3 up this morning I was greeted with the following
>>> behavior:
>>>
>>> When it powered up, the LCD display was on (yellow) but nothing was
>>> displayed No Audio No band data sent to the computer Nothing on the P3.
>>> The K3 could not be powered off with its power switch.
>>>
>>> Since my K3/P3/KAT/KPA configuration operated more or less flawlessly,
>>> I asked "What changed?"
>>>
>>> My Acom 2000A was configured to be the amp The power to the KAT500
>>> was removed and repurposed Appropriate coaxial cables were rerouted to
>>> put the 2000A in line (of course)
>>>
>>> With the help of a good friend it was determined that the issue was
>>> that I had removed power from the KAT500 without unplugging the unit
>>> from the K3's ACC jack. When I unplugged that line, the K3 powered up
>>> normally.
>>>
>>> Why does this happen? Is a powered-off KAT500 an invalid state to the
>>> K3?
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>>
>>> Gary W2CS

Wes (N7WS)

Re: K3 Failure

In reply to this post by Gary Ferdinand

I was astounded when I read the caution in the KAT500 manual saying to always
power it before the K3. Strange indeed.

Wes N7WS

On 8/10/2014 2:42 PM, Gary Ferdinand wrote:

N7US

Re: K3 Failure

I didn't realize that either, so I should buy Fred's KPA500/KAT500 book.

I just made the configuration change in the KAT500 program to always turn it
on when 12V is applied. It now comes on when my master power switch turns
on the small Astron P/S for accessories and my RS-35M for the K3. I turn on
the K3 with the front panel switch after that.

73, Jim N7US

-----Original Message-----

I was astounded when I read the caution in the KAT500 manual saying to
always power it before the K3. Strange indeed.

Wes N7WS

On 8/10/2014 2:42 PM, Gary Ferdinand wrote:
> Thanks Fred and Steve.
>
> Removing the KAT from the K3 ACC connection did the trick. There are
shack configurations where I have no power available to the KAT500, so looks
like I yank the ACC plug every time I need that configuration. Strange
design, that.
>
> Tnx/73
>
> Gary W2CS

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Geoffrey Downs

Re: K3 Failure

You don't need to have the KAT500 switched on before switching on the K3 -
all you need to do is have the KAT500's power supply on (and connected to
it) before you switch the K3 on. I power my K3 and KAT500 from the same
13.8v power supply so that when I switch on the K3 the KAT500 already has
power. I can then switch on the KAT500 if I need it or not if I don't.

73 to all

Geoff
G3UCK

-----Original Message-----
From: Jim N7US
Sent: Monday, August 11, 2014 2:14 AM

I just made the configuration change in the KAT500 program to always turn it
on when 12V is applied. It now comes on when my master power switch turns
on the small Astron P/S for accessories and my RS-35M for the K3. I turn on
the K3 with the front panel switch after that.

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Bill-3

Re: K3 Failure

Sounds like the old list of: if, and, or, nor, =, etc. we use in coding.
If you do not do it correctly and in order, things do not come out well.
Just more complexities to deal with - by habit: KAT500 on, KPA500 on,
then the K3 (which brings up the P3) on.

Reverse order when shutting down.

I have full battery backup, hence no sudden problems during a power outage.

Not as simple as a Swan 175 with just a few controls, but that is the
price of progress(???).

Bill W2BLC K-Line
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