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K3 Hissy and Noisy Audio

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Roy Morris-6

K3 Hissy and Noisy Audio

I concur with what has been said regarding the "hissy" audio. The receiver audio seems to be on the mid-range to high frequency side without enough low frequencies in the passband. Experiments with RX EQ apparently have not done anything to eliminate this hiss, but maybe the firmware can be adjusted to increase the low-end response of the receiver passband. If this doesn't work, maybe a component change is in order.

I also think the noise reduction is too sharp in both SSB and CW. Perhaps NR could also be improved with more low frequencies in the passband.

Roy Morris W4WFB
K2 #2225
K3 #323
K3 #2810
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Steve Ellington

Re: K3 Hissy and Noisy Audio

Roy
Is what you call "hissy" just a lack of bass? I think of "hissy" as high
pitched white noise, like wind blowing through a narrow pipe. Is that what
you hear? Adding low freq. audio won't reduce hiss at all but I don't think
we are dealing with hiss. I think the lack of bass gives us the perception
of a tinny, narrow sound, not hiss.
Steve Ellington
[hidden email]
----- Original Message -----
From: "Roy Morris" <[hidden email]>
To: <[hidden email]>
Sent: Monday, April 06, 2009 2:01 PM
Subject: [Elecraft] K3 Hissy and Noisy Audio

>I concur with what has been said regarding the "hissy" audio. The receiver
>audio seems to be on the mid-range to high frequency side without enough
>low frequencies in the passband. Experiments with RX EQ apparently have
>not done anything to eliminate this hiss, but maybe the firmware can be
>adjusted to increase the low-end response of the receiver passband. If
>this doesn't work, maybe a component change is in order.
>
> I also think the noise reduction is too sharp in both SSB and CW. Perhaps
> NR could also be improved with more low frequencies in the passband.
>
> Roy Morris W4WFB
> K2 #2225
> K3 #323
> K3 #2810
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
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Bill Johnson-9

Re: K3 Hissy and Noisy Audio

Have you tried setting the receive equalizer? I set mine for the audio I
like to hear I don't have the issue, sometimes I find exactly the opposite
depending on all my settings and then decide whether I would like to touch
the settings up a bit. (I did just get high marks from a recent hearing
test. I told the wife I in fact must have selective hearing :-)

73,

Bill
K9YEQ

-----Original Message-----
From: [hidden email]
[mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Steve Ellington
Sent: Monday, April 06, 2009 1:22 PM
To: Roy Morris; [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3 Hissy and Noisy Audio

Roy
Is what you call "hissy" just a lack of bass? I think of "hissy" as high
pitched white noise, like wind blowing through a narrow pipe. Is that what
you hear? Adding low freq. audio won't reduce hiss at all but I don't think
we are dealing with hiss. I think the lack of bass gives us the perception
of a tinny, narrow sound, not hiss.
Steve Ellington
[hidden email]
----- Original Message -----
From: "Roy Morris" <[hidden email]>
To: <[hidden email]>
Sent: Monday, April 06, 2009 2:01 PM
Subject: [Elecraft] K3 Hissy and Noisy Audio

>I concur with what has been said regarding the "hissy" audio. The receiver

>audio seems to be on the mid-range to high frequency side without enough
>low frequencies in the passband. Experiments with RX EQ apparently have
>not done anything to eliminate this hiss, but maybe the firmware can be
>adjusted to increase the low-end response of the receiver passband. If
>this doesn't work, maybe a component change is in order.
>
> I also think the noise reduction is too sharp in both SSB and CW. Perhaps

> NR could also be improved with more low frequencies in the passband.
>
> Roy Morris W4WFB
> K2 #2225
> K3 #323
> K3 #2810
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
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Arie Kleingeld PA3A-2

Re: K3 Hissy and Noisy Audio

I have tried to adjust the audio of the K3 to my liking.

Hi side of spectrum: To get rid of the higher freq's I set the RX-eq 8
to minus 8dB.
Lo side of the spectrum: I tried out the RX-eq 1 and 2. Absolutely no
difference! Not even with the lo cut set to zero.
RX-eq 3 (200Hz) responded better. Set this to plus 8dB

This gives a 'rounder' sound to my ears.

I sure wish that the 100Hz and 50Hz (RX-eq 1 and 2) would show some
response. Low frequencies seem to be absent.

K3 #1255, IF-setting:
Mode LSB
2.7k 5-pole roofing
DSP to norm first, adjusted lo cut to seek for lo freq response

Headset: Heil-pro type, 320 ohm measured resistance.

73,
Arie PA3A

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Bill Johnson-9

Re: K3 Hissy and Noisy Audio

After reading all the postings about audio, I tried a couple of different
ear sets. I set all but my equalizer to normal settings for SSB. My
equalizer I didn't touch until I tried to see the impact when I tried
different earbuds.

I do not have Heil pro's as I don't like the cover the ear devices because
they cause me to sweat and I cannot hear the wife when she's needing
something. I find the adjustments for all the settings on the equalizers
work for me with the earbuds. I can distinguish changes. I also tried the
offset and that can help with either base or treble boost as well. The
first headset was an inexpensive Sony stereo earbuds(108 dbm sensitivity
which is very good). Then I tried my studio quality Shure e5c's which have
much greater sensitivity, I forget the amount, but it is enough to hear the
audio hiss or noise floor of the K3. The K3 is not studio quality audio and
I doubt any of them are and I did not try this on any other radio). I
generally don't use headsets so with the speakers, audio quality seems
superior to other rigs I own (TS2000 and IC7000). I have always liked my 3
K2's!

Perhaps there is a relationship between some of the radios and audio devices
which are connected to the K3 that create the issues.

I use a Vertex MLS-100 mobile external speaker, and I have it literally in
front of me so I can hear it with light audio settings. There is zero hiss
from the radio and the audio is excellent.

I don't know if this is of any help, but the time taken keeps me from
avoiding other work. Hope you and others are able to find a suitable
solution.

73,

Bill
K9YEQ
K2 #35; KX1 #35; K3 #1744; mini mods
ATS-3B

-----Original Message-----
From: [hidden email]
[mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Arie Kleingeld PA3A

I have tried to adjust the audio of the K3 to my liking.

Hi side of spectrum: To get rid of the higher freq's I set the RX-eq 8
to minus 8dB.
Lo side of the spectrum: I tried out the RX-eq 1 and 2. Absolutely no
difference! Not even with the lo cut set to zero.
RX-eq 3 (200Hz) responded better. Set this to plus 8dB

I sure wish that the 100Hz and 50Hz (RX-eq 1 and 2) would show some
response. Low frequencies seem to be absent.

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Joe Subich, W4TV-4

Re: K3 Hissy and Noisy Audio

In reply to this post by Roy Morris-6

> Perhaps NR could also be improved with more low
> frequencies in the passband.

Please NO! I already run RX Audio bands 1 and 2 at -16 dB to
eliminate excessive bass - no more bass, please!

The hiss many seem to be complaining about is broadband noise
in the audio (speaker) and/or headphone amplifier. It is more
noticeable when driving low impedance loads (8/16 Ohm) due to
the relatively high gain (14 dB) of the speaker amplifier
and the high frequency boosting effect of the 33 pF capacitors
in parallel with the gain setting (feedback resistors).

73,

... Joe, W4TV

> -----Original Message-----
> From: [hidden email]
> [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Roy Morris
> Sent: Monday, April 06, 2009 2:01 PM
> To: [hidden email]
> Subject: [Elecraft] K3 Hissy and Noisy Audio
>
>
> I concur with what has been said regarding the "hissy" audio.
> The receiver audio seems to be on the mid-range to high
> frequency side without enough low frequencies in the
> passband. Experiments with RX EQ apparently have not done
> anything to eliminate this hiss, but maybe the firmware can
> be adjusted to increase the low-end response of the receiver
> passband. If this doesn't work, maybe a component change is in order.
>
> I also think the noise reduction is too sharp in both SSB and
> CW. Perhaps NR could also be improved with more low
> frequencies in the passband.
>
> Roy Morris W4WFB
> K2 #2225
> K3 #323
> K3 #2810
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
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Jay Bromley

Re: K3 Hissy and Noisy Audio

Hi Joe,
Looking at Spectra right out of the Phones output, I don't see where bands
1or 2 do all that much in lowering K3's bass.

Having the rig on SSB using the 2.7 Khz filter, the "Lo" on 0, I see no
change on bands 1 and 2 when I set them to -16. What I am missing here? I
have never seen or heard too much bass in the K3.

I did a plot at 0 dB, one at -16 on band 1 and another one on -16 on band 2
if anyone would like to see them.

73 de w5jay/jay..

>
>> Perhaps NR could also be improved with more low
>> frequencies in the passband.
>
> Please NO! I already run RX Audio bands 1 and 2 at -16 dB to
> eliminate excessive bass - no more bass, please!
>
> The hiss many seem to be complaining about is broadband noise
> in the audio (speaker) and/or headphone amplifier. It is more
> noticeable when driving low impedance loads (8/16 Ohm) due to
> the relatively high gain (14 dB) of the speaker amplifier
> and the high frequency boosting effect of the 33 pF capacitors
> in parallel with the gain setting (feedback resistors).
>
> 73,
>
> ... Joe, W4TV
>
>
>
>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: [hidden email]
>> [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Roy Morris
>> Sent: Monday, April 06, 2009 2:01 PM
>> To: [hidden email]
>> Subject: [Elecraft] K3 Hissy and Noisy Audio
>>
>>
>> I concur with what has been said regarding the "hissy" audio.
>> The receiver audio seems to be on the mid-range to high
>> frequency side without enough low frequencies in the
>> passband. Experiments with RX EQ apparently have not done
>> anything to eliminate this hiss, but maybe the firmware can
>> be adjusted to increase the low-end response of the receiver
>> passband. If this doesn't work, maybe a component change is in order.
>>
>> I also think the noise reduction is too sharp in both SSB and
>> CW. Perhaps NR could also be improved with more low
>> frequencies in the passband.
>>
>> Roy Morris W4WFB
>> K2 #2225
>> K3 #323
>> K3 #2810
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> Elecraft mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>
> ______________________________________________________________
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Ken Kopp-3

K3 Audio

In reply to this post by Joe Subich, W4TV-4

As Joe sez, PLEASE, no more bass without the means
to avoid it. I'm interested in a communications transceiver,
not a "hi-fi" receiver for my home audio system. (:-))

73! Ken Kopp - K0PP
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Steve Ellington

Re: K3 Hissy and Noisy Audio

In reply to this post by Jay Bromley

You are right Jay. Bands 1 and 2 do nothing. There's nothing to reduce!

Steve Ellington
[hidden email]
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jay Bromley" <[hidden email]>
To: <[hidden email]>; "'Roy Morris'" <[hidden email]>;
<[hidden email]>
Sent: Monday, April 06, 2009 7:47 PM
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3 Hissy and Noisy Audio

> Hi Joe,
> Looking at Spectra right out of the Phones output, I don't see where bands
> 1or 2 do all that much in lowering K3's bass.
>
> Having the rig on SSB using the 2.7 Khz filter, the "Lo" on 0, I see no
> change on bands 1 and 2 when I set them to -16. What I am missing here?
> I
> have never seen or heard too much bass in the K3.
>
> I did a plot at 0 dB, one at -16 on band 1 and another one on -16 on band
> 2
> if anyone would like to see them.
>
> 73 de w5jay/jay..
>
>
>
>>
>>> Perhaps NR could also be improved with more low
>>> frequencies in the passband.
>>
>> Please NO! I already run RX Audio bands 1 and 2 at -16 dB to
>> eliminate excessive bass - no more bass, please!
>>
>> The hiss many seem to be complaining about is broadband noise
>> in the audio (speaker) and/or headphone amplifier. It is more
>> noticeable when driving low impedance loads (8/16 Ohm) due to
>> the relatively high gain (14 dB) of the speaker amplifier
>> and the high frequency boosting effect of the 33 pF capacitors
>> in parallel with the gain setting (feedback resistors).
>>
>> 73,
>>
>> ... Joe, W4TV
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: [hidden email]
>>> [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Roy Morris
>>> Sent: Monday, April 06, 2009 2:01 PM
>>> To: [hidden email]
>>> Subject: [Elecraft] K3 Hissy and Noisy Audio
>>>
>>>
>>> I concur with what has been said regarding the "hissy" audio.
>>> The receiver audio seems to be on the mid-range to high
>>> frequency side without enough low frequencies in the
>>> passband. Experiments with RX EQ apparently have not done
>>> anything to eliminate this hiss, but maybe the firmware can
>>> be adjusted to increase the low-end response of the receiver
>>> passband. If this doesn't work, maybe a component change is in order.
>>>
>>> I also think the noise reduction is too sharp in both SSB and
>>> CW. Perhaps NR could also be improved with more low
>>> frequencies in the passband.
>>>
>>> Roy Morris W4WFB
>>> K2 #2225
>>> K3 #323
>>> K3 #2810
>>> ______________________________________________________________
>>> Elecraft mailing list
>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>>
>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>>
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> Elecraft mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
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>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>
> ______________________________________________________________
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Jim-168

Re: K3 Audio

In reply to this post by Ken Kopp-3

Ken, I am with you. I like the K-3 receive audio on phone and am not a fan
of the down to "0" audio. For many years I have referred to this as, "Low
order distortion". Also, I don't like that dull thud sound some of the guys
exhibit with the excessive wide audio and external equipment.

Too much base can be bad. I remember many years ago the horrible basey audio
from a Kenwood MC-50 and the toilet roll fix.

Back to hissy receive audio it's pretty noticeable in the Yaesu FT-1000 MP.
The fix is to turn the DSP off and set the carrier point in the menu.

Still, I don't hear any appreciable hiss in the K3.

73 de KE4WY Jim

-----Original Message-----
From: [hidden email]
[mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Ken Kopp
Sent: Monday, April 06, 2009 8:10 PM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: [Elecraft] K3 Audio

As Joe sez, PLEASE, no more bass without the means

to avoid it. I'm interested in a communications transceiver,

not a "hi-fi" receiver for my home audio system. (:-))

73! Ken Kopp - K0PP

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P.B. Christensen

Re: K3 Hissy and Noisy Audio

In reply to this post by Steve Ellington

> You are right Jay. Bands 1 and 2 do nothing. There's nothing to reduce!

On my modified K3, adjusting band 2 (100Hz) will produce bone-jarring bass
when boosted above +5 dB.

However, even though my moded K3 easily produces audible beats down to 30
Hz, adjusting Rx EQ band 1 (50 Hz) has no effect whatsoever. I just tired
this by approaching zero-beat on a CW carrier, then backing off the display
frequency in 50 Hz and 100 Hz increments. Band 2 works quite well while
band 1 seems to produce no change in Rx EQ.

Lyle/Wayne, can you confirm that band 1 is actually engaged in the firmware?
If it is, then there's some other causation pre-AF amp.

Paul, W9AC

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Joe Subich, W4TV-4

Re: K3 Hissy and Noisy Audio

In reply to this post by Jay Bromley

> Looking at Spectra right out of the Phones output, I don't
> see where bands 1or 2 do all that much in lowering K3's bass.

You won't see much on the headphone output because of the 10 uF
coupling capacitors. The effect is quite obvious on both the
speaker output and the line output (if you have made the line
out modification [R19/20] in K3AF Mod Rev 3).

If you replace the 10 uF headphone coupling capacitors with
330 uF caps as recommended by W9AC the headphone output will
more like a good external speaker.

73,

... Joe, W4TV

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Jay Bromley [mailto:[hidden email]]
> Sent: Monday, April 06, 2009 7:47 PM
> To: [hidden email]; 'Roy Morris'; [hidden email]
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3 Hissy and Noisy Audio
>
>
> Hi Joe,
> Looking at Spectra right out of the Phones output, I don't
> see where bands
> 1or 2 do all that much in lowering K3's bass.
>
> Having the rig on SSB using the 2.7 Khz filter, the "Lo" on
> 0, I see no
> change on bands 1 and 2 when I set them to -16. What I am
> missing here? I
> have never seen or heard too much bass in the K3.
>
> I did a plot at 0 dB, one at -16 on band 1 and another one on
> -16 on band 2
> if anyone would like to see them.
>
> 73 de w5jay/jay..
>
>
>
> >
> >> Perhaps NR could also be improved with more low
> >> frequencies in the passband.
> >
> > Please NO! I already run RX Audio bands 1 and 2 at -16 dB to
> > eliminate excessive bass - no more bass, please!
> >
> > The hiss many seem to be complaining about is broadband
> noise in the
> > audio (speaker) and/or headphone amplifier. It is more noticeable
> > when driving low impedance loads (8/16 Ohm) due to the
> relatively high
> > gain (14 dB) of the speaker amplifier and the high
> frequency boosting
> > effect of the 33 pF capacitors in parallel with the gain setting
> > (feedback resistors).
> >
> > 73,
> >
> > ... Joe, W4TV
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >> -----Original Message-----
> >> From: [hidden email]
> >> [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Roy Morris
> >> Sent: Monday, April 06, 2009 2:01 PM
> >> To: [hidden email]
> >> Subject: [Elecraft] K3 Hissy and Noisy Audio
> >>
> >>
> >> I concur with what has been said regarding the "hissy" audio. The
> >> receiver audio seems to be on the mid-range to high frequency side
> >> without enough low frequencies in the passband.
> Experiments with RX
> >> EQ apparently have not done anything to eliminate this hiss, but
> >> maybe the firmware can be adjusted to increase the low-end
> response
> >> of the receiver passband. If this doesn't work, maybe a component
> >> change is in order.
> >>
> >> I also think the noise reduction is too sharp in both SSB and CW.
> >> Perhaps NR could also be improved with more low frequencies in the
> >> passband.
> >>
> >> Roy Morris W4WFB
> >> K2 #2225
> >> K3 #323
> >> K3 #2810
> >> ______________________________________________________________
> >> Elecraft mailing list
> >> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> >> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> >> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
> >>
> >> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> >> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> >
> > ______________________________________________________________
> > Elecraft mailing list
> > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> > Post: mailto:[hidden email]
> >
> > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>

Jay Bromley

Re: K3 Hissy and Noisy Audio

Hi Joe,

You wrote:
>> > Please NO! I already run RX Audio bands 1 and 2 at -16 dB to
>> > eliminate excessive bass - no more bass, please!

You also wrote:
> You won't see much on the headphone output because of the 10 uF
> coupling capacitors. The effect is quite obvious on both the
> speaker output and the line output (if you have made the line
> out modification [R19/20] in K3AF Mod Rev 3).
>
> If you replace the 10 uF headphone coupling capacitors with
> 330 uF caps as recommended by W9AC the headphone output will
> more like a good external speaker.

On Paul's mods, I've been there and done that on both a stock K3 and a
modified one. I still don't hear the excessive bass you were mentioning and
more important I can't measure it! I went back this morning and measured
the speaker out and for that matter all other outputs for fun. When I go to
RX EQ bands 1 and 2 and put them at -16 dB I see a gentle roll off starting
at 200 hz. However I see the same gentle roll off at zero dB on RX EQ bands
1 and 2. On the line output I see a little less bass than the other outputs
and I would expect this since it has a transformer in line that the speaker
and phone output doesn't. In fact I don't see a change if I go crazy
boosting RX RQ bands 1 and 2.

Joe, I am not complaining mind you, I am just not seeing this excessive bass
you posted in your message at zero or a huge reduction in bass response
at -16 on bands 1 and 2. LO cut is still at 0, I am still on LSB at 2.8 BW.

So I am still must be missing something here. BTW this K3 has all the AF,
speaker mods, per the K3 Enhancement and Application Notes page. Also I do
run from time to time a nice bookshelve and external amp speaker system.
The walls are very safe here from excessive bass response.

73 de jay/w5jay..

>
>> Looking at Spectra right out of the Phones output, I don't
>> see where bands 1or 2 do all that much in lowering K3's bass.
>
> You won't see much on the headphone output because of the 10 uF
> coupling capacitors. The effect is quite obvious on both the
> speaker output and the line output (if you have made the line
> out modification [R19/20] in K3AF Mod Rev 3).
>
> If you replace the 10 uF headphone coupling capacitors with
> 330 uF caps as recommended by W9AC the headphone output will
> more like a good external speaker.
>
> 73,
>
> ... Joe, W4TV
>

>>
>>
>> Hi Joe,
>> Looking at Spectra right out of the Phones output, I don't
>> see where bands
>> 1or 2 do all that much in lowering K3's bass.
>>
>> Having the rig on SSB using the 2.7 Khz filter, the "Lo" on
>> 0, I see no
>> change on bands 1 and 2 when I set them to -16. What I am
>> missing here? I
>> have never seen or heard too much bass in the K3.
>>
>> I did a plot at 0 dB, one at -16 on band 1 and another one on
>> -16 on band 2
>> if anyone would like to see them.
>>
>> 73 de w5jay/jay..
>>
>>
>>
>> >
>> >> Perhaps NR could also be improved with more low
>> >> frequencies in the passband.
>> >
>> > Please NO! I already run RX Audio bands 1 and 2 at -16 dB to
>> > eliminate excessive bass - no more bass, please!
>> >
>> > The hiss many seem to be complaining about is broadband
>> noise in the
>> > audio (speaker) and/or headphone amplifier. It is more noticeable
>> > when driving low impedance loads (8/16 Ohm) due to the
>> relatively high
>> > gain (14 dB) of the speaker amplifier and the high
>> frequency boosting
>> > effect of the 33 pF capacitors in parallel with the gain setting
>> > (feedback resistors).
>> >
>> > 73,
>> >
>> > ... Joe, W4TV
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> I concur with what has been said regarding the "hissy" audio. The
>> >> receiver audio seems to be on the mid-range to high frequency side
>> >> without enough low frequencies in the passband.
>> Experiments with RX
>> >> EQ apparently have not done anything to eliminate this hiss, but
>> >> maybe the firmware can be adjusted to increase the low-end
>> response
>> >> of the receiver passband. If this doesn't work, maybe a component
>> >> change is in order.
>> >>
>> >> I also think the noise reduction is too sharp in both SSB and CW.
>> >> Perhaps NR could also be improved with more low frequencies in the
>> >> passband.
>> >>
>> >> Roy Morris W4WFB
>> >> K2 #2225
>> >> K3 #323

P.B. Christensen

Re: K3 Hissy and Noisy Audio

> 1 and 2. On the line output I see a little less bass than the other
> outputs
> and I would expect this since it has a transformer in line that the
> speaker
> and phone output doesn't. In fact I don't see a change if I go crazy
> boosting RX RQ bands 1 and 2.

Jay,

Here are my SpectraPlus FFT plots for the IC-7800 (Magenta), IC-7700 (Blue),
Ten Tec Omni VII (Red), and Elecraft K3 (Yellow). Each plot was taken from
the respective headphone output and the volume level adjusted in order to
show an uncluttered overlay.

http://216.229.20.37/images/ResponsePlots.JPG

To achieve a reasonably flat low-end response on the K3 requires an FC shift
to about 1.25 from 1.50. But in doing so, note how the high end response is
now limited to about 3.2 kHz (See yellow trace).

Not surprising, the IC-7700 and IC-7800 traces can be laid on top of each
with a nearly identical response. Both produce a response bump between 100
Hz - 300 Hz. The Ten Tec Omni VII produces the best overall Rx response of
the four rigs tested. I wish I still had the TS-870 for these tests as it
measured ruler-flat out of the box from 30 Hz to 6 kHz.

Regarding the K3's Rx EQ, I see substantial Rx EQ changes on bands 2-8 when
adjustments are made, but no change on band 1 when adjusted from one extreme
to the other. It simply has no effect. I've tried various alternate
settings to see if I could engage band 1 to move, but so far, no luck. It
doesn't bother me as I leave the EQ flat.

Paul, W9AC

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Paul Gates, KD3JF

Re: K3 Hissy and Noisy Audio

In reply to this post by Roy Morris-6

At present I do not have a K3. I do have an old Tentec 580 Delta and a Icom 703 plus, KX1. The enclosed speakers in both rigs perform nicely. However, I use a ADCOM digital Speaker on both rigs and it makes a big difference. I have had a lot of rigs like Drake, Swan Etc, If the speaker was in the same enclosure with the Power supply no improvement was needed. On the KX1 I have an old, really old Audio Amp. from Radio Shack and it produces some beautiful audio. It seems when the speaker is in the radio... It is tolerable bur an outboard speaker is better. Just my opinion.

Paul Gates, KD3JF
--- On Mon, 4/6/09, John Klewer <[hidden email]> wrote:

From: John Klewer <[hidden email]>
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3 Hissy and Noisy Audio
To: [hidden email]
Date: Monday, April 6, 2009, 11:46 PM

Perhaps I'm in the minority here....using some nice quality hi-fi
bookshelf speakers.....I love the way the K3 sounds.

YMMV

John, N6AX

Mike Scott wrote:

>> Audio is notorious for having a very subjective vocabulary, and this may
>>
> make it hard to understand what is meant. I hear terms like hissy, rounder,
> lack of bass etc in this discussion. In an attempt to make this discussion
> more to the point I would suggest this list compiled by Bruce Bartlett from
> Pro Audio 1997. I find it helpful in making discussions focused:
> http://www.linkwitzlab.com/images/graphics/sd-qulty.gif
>
>
>
>
>> According to the list, I would suggest that those who have a problem with
>>
> the K3 audio look up these terms:
>
>
>
>
>> 'bright', 'edgy', 'grainy', 'grungy', 'hard', 'harsh', 'muddy',
>>
> 'piercing', 'thin'
>
>
>
>
>> to find what best describes what they hear. That may give a common ground
>>
> for describing the effects.
>
>
>
> Okay, based on the referenced descriptions I can 100% definitely with
> absolute assurance say that my K3 audio is edgy, grainy, grungy and
> strident. Now can we get on with a solution?
>
>
>
>
>
> Mike Scott
>
> Tarzana, CA
>
>
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>
>
>

Jay Bromley

Re: K3 excessive bass

In reply to this post by P.B. Christensen

Thanks Paul,
That makes a lot of sense and like I said I am not complaining one bit on
the K3 audio. I main point I was trying to make was the K3 doesn't have
excessive bass in stock form or from what I have seen in any form.

I will send you my plots later, I have a QRP meeting tonight to get ready
for.

However I still don't see much difference on bands 2 on any output, but I
will experiment more tonight. To be honest I don't use the EQ at all, my K3
stays on digital most of the time!

The problem is one guy will add a comment to this thread, then a guy like me
will comment on that and now it is getting away from the original subject
line. So I am changing this now and will be my last post on this subject
unless someone would like me to run a test, etc.

Just commenting on what I see, hear, and can measure.

73 de jay/w5jay..

>> 1 and 2. On the line output I see a little less bass than the other
>> outputs
>> and I would expect this since it has a transformer in line that the
>> speaker
>> and phone output doesn't. In fact I don't see a change if I go crazy
>> boosting RX RQ bands 1 and 2.
>
> Jay,
>
> Here are my SpectraPlus FFT plots for the IC-7800 (Magenta), IC-7700
> (Blue), Ten Tec Omni VII (Red), and Elecraft K3 (Yellow). Each plot was
> taken from the respective headphone output and the volume level adjusted
> in order to show an uncluttered overlay.
>
> http://216.229.20.37/images/ResponsePlots.JPG
>
> To achieve a reasonably flat low-end response on the K3 requires an FC
> shift to about 1.25 from 1.50. But in doing so, note how the high end
> response is now limited to about 3.2 kHz (See yellow trace).
>
> Not surprising, the IC-7700 and IC-7800 traces can be laid on top of each
> with a nearly identical response. Both produce a response bump between
> 100 Hz - 300 Hz. The Ten Tec Omni VII produces the best overall Rx
> response of the four rigs tested. I wish I still had the TS-870 for these
> tests as it measured ruler-flat out of the box from 30 Hz to 6 kHz.
>
> Regarding the K3's Rx EQ, I see substantial Rx EQ changes on bands 2-8
> when adjustments are made, but no change on band 1 when adjusted from one
> extreme to the other. It simply has no effect. I've tried various
> alternate settings to see if I could engage band 1 to move, but so far, no
> luck. It doesn't bother me as I leave the EQ flat.
>
> Paul, W9AC
>