[K3] Key Clicks or just Key Click Artifacts ?

[Phil Hystad-3]

I was hunting around for some action today on the 20 meter band with CW.  Did not find anything but I discovered an unusual key click which I am not sure if it is a real key click or not or maybe just some artifact of the sidetone monitor.

Since I was looking for stations, I was playing with the RF control a little bit and I noticed that if the RF control is advanced much past 12 oclock or maybe 1 oclock that key clicks were generated.  As you advance the RF control, the key clicks get stronger and bolder (whatever I mean by that).  At the time, my filter was fairly wide at about 1000 Hz so I started closing it down and about 350 Hz or so the key clicks disappeared.  These values though change depending on how far my RF is advanced versus the filter width.  With the filter down to 250 Hz or so, I can have the RF advanced almost all the way and the monitored signal is clean.  By the way, my smallest roofing filter is 400 Hz 8-pole.

Now, those are the symptoms.  I am guessing that I am filtering out the key clicks by tightening it up with a smaller width.  These clicks occur whether in TX or in TEST mode and exactly the same symptoms.  I did about 20 minutes of testing and playing around with all kinds of adjustments in TEST mode.

So, does anyone else see these clicks.  Are they a generated artifact of the sidetone monitor or are these clocks actually TX'd and sent out.  No, I am not setup to listen to my own signal over the air and besides, given the interaction with the RF control, I really think they are not part of my TX signal.

Does anyone else see these?

I am still not an expert on a correct setting for the RF control versus the AF level.  I have a tendency to play between the two to get the best signal but without too much noise.  By the way, I very rarely use noise reduction (NR) -- it is almost always off on my K3 because I have not yet learned how to use it.  Most of the time, the noise is not an issue and NR does not really seem to be needed.

Thanks for any comments or help.  If someone could confirm that this is normal and generated internally only (not TX'd) then I am fine (sort of) --- when TXing I can always back off the RX control anyway to remove the clicks.

73, phil, K7PEH

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[Steve Ellington]

You should not be hearing clicks when sending cw unless what you are hearing
is just the band noise between cw characters. You say it goes away when
turning down the RFG? Well then that's probably all you are hearing, just
band noise popping off and on. I seriously doubt if you are transmitting
clicks with a K3.

Steve
N4LQ
----- Original Message -----
From: "Phil Hystad" <[hidden email]>
To: "Elecraft Reflector" <[hidden email]>
Sent: Sunday, July 04, 2010 7:18 PM
Subject: [Elecraft] [K3] Key Clicks or just Key Click Artifacts ?

>I was hunting around for some action today on the 20 meter band with CW.
>Did not find anything but I discovered an unusual key click which I am not
>sure if it is a real key click or not or maybe just some artifact of the
>sidetone monitor.
>
> Since I was looking for stations, I was playing with the RF control a
> little bit and I noticed that if the RF control is advanced much past 12
> oclock or maybe 1 oclock that key clicks were generated.  As you advance
> the RF control, the key clicks get stronger and bolder (whatever I mean by
> that).  At the time, my filter was fairly wide at about 1000 Hz so I
> started closing it down and about 350 Hz or so the key clicks disappeared.
> These values though change depending on how far my RF is advanced versus
> the filter width.  With the filter down to 250 Hz or so, I can have the RF
> advanced almost all the way and the monitored signal is clean.  By the
> way, my smallest roofing filter is 400 Hz 8-pole.
>
> Now, those are the symptoms.  I am guessing that I am filtering out the
> key clicks by tightening it up with a smaller width.  These clicks occur
> whether in TX or in TEST mode and exactly the same symptoms.  I did about
> 20 minutes of testing and playing around with all kinds of adjustments in
> TEST mode.
>
> So, does anyone else see these clicks.  Are they a generated artifact of
> the sidetone monitor or are these clocks actually TX'd and sent out.  No,
> I am not setup to listen to my own signal over the air and besides, given
> the interaction with the RF control, I really think they are not part of
> my TX signal.
>
> Does anyone else see these?
>
> I am still not an expert on a correct setting for the RF control versus
> the AF level.  I have a tendency to play between the two to get the best
> signal but without too much noise.  By the way, I very rarely use noise
> reduction (NR) -- it is almost always off on my K3 because I have not yet
> learned how to use it.  Most of the time, the noise is not an issue and NR
> does not really seem to be needed.
>
> Thanks for any comments or help.  If someone could confirm that this is
> normal and generated internally only (not TX'd) then I am fine (sort
> of) --- when TXing I can always back off the RX control anyway to remove
> the clicks.
>
> 73, phil, K7PEH
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html 

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[drewko]

I have noticed the same thing, if I am understanding you correctly:

The "key click" sound in the audio is generated by your own keying;
It is present even if the K3 is in TEST mode.
It is evident only if the AF gain is turned up; otherwise, sidetone sounds fine when receiver AF gain is at minimum;
It is band-dependent,  20m and 17m are bad. Other bands are practically unnoticeable.  

I assume You are using a mechanical key, a bug perhaps.

Try setting your NB to "IF NAR 3". The DSP NB also works but not as well; likewise for NR.

I don't think you are generating any clicks on the air. I'm guessing it is some kind of audio processing artifacts. Why such artifacts should be worse on some bands than others is beyond me.

73,
Drew
AF2Z

Phil Hystad-3 wrote

I was hunting around for some action today on the 20 meter band with CW.  Did not find anything but I discovered an unusual key click which I am not sure if it is a real key click or not or maybe just some artifact of the sidetone monitor.

Since I was looking for stations, I was playing with the RF control a little bit and I noticed that if the RF control is advanced much past 12 oclock or maybe 1 oclock that key clicks were generated.  As you advance the RF control, the key clicks get stronger and bolder (whatever I mean by that).  At the time, my filter was fairly wide at about 1000 Hz so I started closing it down and about 350 Hz or so the key clicks disappeared.  These values though change depending on how far my RF is advanced versus the filter width.  With the filter down to 250 Hz or so, I can have the RF advanced almost all the way and the monitored signal is clean.  By the way, my smallest roofing filter is 400 Hz 8-pole.

Now, those are the symptoms.  I am guessing that I am filtering out the key clicks by tightening it up with a smaller width.  These clicks occur whether in TX or in TEST mode and exactly the same symptoms.  I did about 20 minutes of testing and playing around with all kinds of adjustments in TEST mode.

So, does anyone else see these clicks.  Are they a generated artifact of the sidetone monitor or are these clocks actually TX'd and sent out.  No, I am not setup to listen to my own signal over the air and besides, given the interaction with the RF control, I really think they are not part of my TX signal.

Does anyone else see these?


73, phil, K7PEH