K3 STATUS

[VA3TUFHAM]

As a long-time observer of the Elecraft scene and owner of a K2, I  can't
help but marvel at the impatience exhibited by some hams while awaiting  the
arrival of their K3.  These are exciting times for the Elecraft  family of clients.
 
This new radio represents a giant leap in a kit radio and the effort to get  
it right the first time by Elecraft is commendable. But it takes time and
there  can be unexpected delays, sometimes beyond Elecraft control, as has been  
explained from time to time.
 
I for one, would like to congratulate Eric, Wayne and the entire Elecraft  
gang for creating some of the best value amateur radio equipment currently  
available in today's marketplace. Moreover, I think that the level of  support and
their willingness to listen to their "family of clients" is  exemplary.
 
If I could offer any suggestions, it would be for those who are awaiting  
their new K3, to have a little patience! I have no doubt that Elecraft is doing  
its utmost to get your K3 to you and when it arrives, I'm sure that you will
not  be disappointed with either its quality or performance.
 
That's my two cents!
 
Mike Pinfold
VA3TUF



   
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[Don Ehrlich]

Well said, Mike and duly noted.  But, as one of the impatient ones I should
remind you that it is not the waiting that is annoying to so many of us but
the *lack of accurate information*.  When there are only vague
generalizations ("more than 20", "definetly higher than 30") then those who
have made plans for their K3 on specific dates are left to wonder and all of
the others to speculate wildly as to what is up at Aptos.

I am one of those who have been worshiping at the church of Elecraft (and
been an active missionary on many occassions) I feel justified in raising
these concerns.  All of this will be soon forgotten if, indeed, Eric follows
through with his committment to provide some actual information next week.
More vague suggestions that all is well will only fuel unseemly
speculations.

Waiting as patiently as I can ...

Don K7FJ

> As a long-time observer of the Elecraft scene and owner of a K2, I  can't
> help but marvel at the impatience exhibited by some hams while awaiting
> the
> arrival of their K3.  These are exciting times for the Elecraft  family of
> clients.
>
> This new radio represents a giant leap in a kit radio and the effort to
> get
> it right the first time by Elecraft is commendable. But it takes time and
> there  can be unexpected delays, sometimes beyond Elecraft control, as has
> been
> explained from time to time.
>
> I for one, would like to congratulate Eric, Wayne and the entire Elecraft
> gang for creating some of the best value amateur radio equipment currently
> available in today's marketplace. Moreover, I think that the level of
> support and
> their willingness to listen to their "family of clients" is  exemplary.
>
> If I could offer any suggestions, it would be for those who are awaiting
> their new K3, to have a little patience! I have no doubt that Elecraft is
> doing
> its utmost to get your K3 to you and when it arrives, I'm sure that you
> will
> not  be disappointed with either its quality or performance.
>
> That's my two cents!
>
> Mike Pinfold
> VA3TUF

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[Dave Martin-2]

I'm anxious, too, having sold my Icom with all its design flaws when I
had a chance four months ago.  So I have no HF radio.  But I'm keeping
in mind that Elecraft is not a customer owned co-op.  It's enough for
me to remember the quality we've seen for years in the products and
the staff, and trust that they're doing their best.  I'd hate to be
the one(s) responsible for such a project.  More power to 'em.

Dave  W5DHM


On 11/1/07, [hidden email] <[hidden email]> wrote:
> As a long-time observer of the Elecraft scene and owner of a K2, I  can't
> help but marvel at the impatience exhibited by some hams while awaiting  the
> arrival of their K3.
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[M0XDF]

Most of what Don (K7FJ) said goes for me.
This will be my 1st 'K', I naively (I do mean that literally) thought it
would be shipping at the end of July. When the announcement said end of Aug,
I was disappointed, but accepted that it was beyond Elecrafts' control and
that it was better to get the rig right rather than out the door (I still
do).
When that date was missed and it was Oct, I thought - ok, they have a
revised date and have added contingency - at least it will be this time.

That date was over 3 weeks ago and it still hasn't shipped. Yes I'm
impatient ("annoyed by being kept waiting or by being delayed"), at lot of
you asking why we are so impatient already have a 'K' - I have an FT-857.

Like many others, I want to get my hands on the rig and I have to say, no
mater how much I appreciate Elecraft are doing their best and how good I
understand (not 1st hand), the company to be, I am annoyed (if only
slightly) at having been given 4 dates and (mine) has still not shipped yet.

I'm sure it will be worth the wait and yes, it will be exciting - but it
doesn't stop being impatient (and no amount of me mailing that or you
saying, please don't be, will change it).


Believe it or not, my email client picks the signatures at random!

On 1/11/07 16:55, "[hidden email]" <[hidden email]> sent:

> As a long-time observer of the Elecraft scene and owner of a K2, I  can't
> help but marvel at the impatience exhibited by some hams while awaiting  the
> arrival of their K3. ...

--
Patience serves as a protection against wrongs as clothes do against cold.
For if you put on more clothes as the cold increases, it will have no power
to hurt you.
So in like manner you must grow in patience when you meet with great wrongs,
and they will then be powerless to vex your mind.
-Leonardo da Vinci,  painter, engineer, musician, and scientist (1452-1519)


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[Darwin, Keith]

It is unfortunate that those of us who ordered early, expecting a
delivery in July, didn't get a rig when we thought we would, or even
when the updates said it would be finished.

But I believe that is the ONLY thing that hasn't been according to plan.

- Price has not changed.

- Performance has been as good or better than promised.

- Quality is as promised if not better.

- The order of delivery remains constant.  The ones who ordered first
get their rigs first.

I've worked in engineering too long.  I know that you cannot believe an
engineer when he gives you a schedule.  Sorry, but we engineers are not
good at it.  Elecraft is doing their best and fortunately for us, their
best means we get a great performing radio that is a great price.
Personally, I've taken every schedule from Elecraft with a large grain
of salt, thus keeping my expectations rather low.

- Keith N1AS -
- K2 5411.ssb.100 -
- K3 Wave 3 -

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[michael taylor-3]

On 11/1/07, Don Ehrlich <[hidden email]> wrote:
> Well said, Mike and duly noted.  But, as one of the impatient ones I should
> remind you that it is not the waiting that is annoying to so many of us but
> the *lack of accurate information*.  When there are only vague
> generalizations ("more than 20", "definetly higher than 30") then those who

I understand entirely, I love shiny new gadgets and high tech toys and
prefer instant gratification, but personally I prefer vague but
accurate and honest answers over the specific lies of sales people
from too many other companies.

Maybe Elecraft will offer the Super-Duper-Express delivery K3 option,
kitted by a team of untrained chimps and with colour photos in the
place of any missing parts.

My approach is to say just order a K2 or K1 to assemble and play with
while you wait....

That said, with tongue firmly in cheek. :-)

Wait a minute, actually I am assembling a K2 as I wait.

-Michael, VE3TIX
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[Bruce Bowman]

I have to agree.

You probably recall this pearl of engineering scheduling wisdom:

"The first 90% of the work takes the first 90% of the schedule; the
remaining 10% of the work takes the other 90% of the schedule."

When you're exploring new territory, sometimes there are surprises and
you have to deal with them one at a time. Yeah, once you're into
production you can do a much better job of forecasting, but this isn't
production yet. They may be out of design development, but they've only
started manufacturing development. What we're talking about here- and
waiting for- are production prototypes that are defining the
manufacturing and testing processes thru which all following producution
must follow. Each of these K3s are being nurtured to life by hand. It's
going to get better, but not yet. I'm willing to bet that the mfg.
documents look like somebody bled on them from each days accumulated
redlines!

The inferred good news from all this is that we so far haven't heard
that the design has changed. That says a lot for the thoroughness of the
design phase and will hopefully make the passage to true production less
troublesome.

Bruce, NM5B
Santa Fe, NM


> ... I've worked in engineering too long.  I know that you cannot
> believe
> an engineer when he gives you a schedule.  Sorry, but we engineers are
> not good at it.  Elecraft is doing their best and fortunately for us,
> their best means we get a great performing radio that is a great
> price.
> Personally, I've taken every schedule from Elecraft with a large grain
> of salt, thus keeping my expectations rather low.


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[Darwin, Keith]

 
-----Original Message-----
Maybe Elecraft will offer the Super-Duper-Express delivery K3 option,
kitted by a team of untrained chimps and with colour photos in the place
of any missing parts.
-------------------------

And THAT is exactly what has me concerned.  Yea, I know it was
originally said in jest, but the more we whine, the more pressure we put
on Elecraft to hurry up & get 'er done, the more likely it is that they
will feel forced to go to heroic measures to get the boxes out the door.

Personally, I'm content to know that they are working hard and are doing
the right things.  If they were sitting on their duffs eating bon-bons
and watching soap operas, then it would be time to grouse at them.  As
it is, they are apparently working long hours.  I don't want to push
them any harder because I think we have far more to lose than we have to
gain.

Yes, I want my K3, but I want a good K3, one that was carefully built
and tested, not something rushed out the door.

I don't think Elecraft is to that point yet, but the pressure we as
customers put on them isn't helping, that's for sure.

What makes this whole thing rather tough is that people put 1/2 down on
a rig with a ship date of July / Aug.  Here we are in November with many
of them still with no rig and no money.  It does indeed serve to create
unrest amongst the natives.

73 all!

- Keith N1AS -
- K2 5411.ssb.100 -
- K3 wave 3 -
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[Don Ehrlich]

I can feel Eric warming up his "This is not an appropriate topic" keyboard
right now.  He's right.

No more on this from me for at least several weeks, if ever.  Anyone else
taking the pledge?

Don K7FJ

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[Simon (HB9DRV)]

I'm considering unholy orders, but never the pledge.

What Elecraft are achieving is unique in Amateur Radio, not just equalling
but surpassing the quality of all other players. The K3 really will be worth
waiting for, mine should be heading for a white box with a shipping label
very soon :-)

Simon Brown, HB9DRV

----- Original Message -----
From: "Don Ehrlich" <[hidden email]>
>
> Anyone else taking the pledge?
>

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[Craig Rairdin]

> but the more we whine, the more pressure we put
> on Elecraft to hurry up & get 'er done, the more likely it is that
> they will feel forced to go to heroic measures to get the boxes out
> the door.

The fact of the matter is that no amount of whining is going to change
anything. The more we whine, the more we whine. The product won't
necessarily be better, the building experience won't be sweeter, the radio
won't have more performance. It will just happen when it happens. Nothing is
changed when one person complains to the other 3000 of us on the reflector.

I finally came to the conclusion that I either needed to ask for a refund or
just wait. I think that's good advice.

Craig
NZ0R

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[Ian Stirling, G4ICV, AB2GR]

On Thursday 01 November 2007 17:07:51 Simon Brown (HB9DRV) wrote:

> What Elecraft are achieving is unique in Amateur Radio, not just equalling
> but surpassing the quality of all other players.

  With the K3 being as good as is said, and the predictions on this list
about the demand for it, Elecraft needs a good business consultant and
a big loan from the bank.
  Elecraft is now competing with the big players, not filling a niche
in the kit market.
  A bad business practice is not being able to meet the demand, unless
the product is unique. The K3 is unique so far, but I suspect Icom and
Vertex Standard have noticed. Unless some aspect of the K3 that makes it
better than the competition's can be patented, Elecraft is going to have
a small window of time in which to sell the K3, and rely heavily on
customer loyalty.

Ian, G4ICV, AB2GR, K2 #4962
--
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[Rich Ardolino]

Don Ehrlich wrote:
>  But, as one of the impatient ones I should remind you that it is not
> the waiting that is annoying to so many of us but the *lack of
> accurate information*.  
I've subscribed to the Elecraft reflector since I first became aware of
the existence of the K2 and subsequently ordered #1102. My present
financial situation precludes my ordering a K3 at this time. I'm envious
of those who did order a K3. I  wish I was waiting.

As to the "lack of accurate information", I think that is mainly because
Elecraft does not have control of outside vendors who don't deliver
components when promised. Would you rather have more regular situation
reports that turn out to be inaccurate due to circumstances beyond
Elecraft's control.? I don't think so. I think Eric is right to only
report the facts as they occur, not on some artificial schedule.

Just my opinion. Firesuit being donned  :-')

Rich  k2cpe
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[dave.wilburn]

My experience tends to be just the opposite.  You tend to get a good
schedule from engineering as they often take their best estimate and
multiply it by 1.5 or 2.  This gives a cushion for delays and oppsies.
Project managers and marketing, now that is another level.  They tend to
never want to leave a cushion, expecting beyond all past experience that
things will go -perfectly- "this" time.
-  

David Wilburn
[hidden email]
K4DGW
K2 S/N 5982


On Thu, 2007-11-01 at 12:37 -0700, Darwin, Keith wrote:

> It is unfortunate that those of us who ordered early, expecting a
> delivery in July, didn't get a rig when we thought we would, or even
> when the updates said it would be finished.
>
> But I believe that is the ONLY thing that hasn't been according to plan.
>
> - Price has not changed.
>
> - Performance has been as good or better than promised.
>
> - Quality is as promised if not better.
>
> - The order of delivery remains constant.  The ones who ordered first
> get their rigs first.
>
> I've worked in engineering too long.  I know that you cannot believe an
> engineer when he gives you a schedule.  Sorry, but we engineers are not
> good at it.  Elecraft is doing their best and fortunately for us, their
> best means we get a great performing radio that is a great price.
> Personally, I've taken every schedule from Elecraft with a large grain
> of salt, thus keeping my expectations rather low.
>
> - Keith N1AS -
> - K2 5411.ssb.100 -
> - K3 Wave 3 -
>
> _______________________________________________
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>
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[Richard-3]

OK, I have to share two project truisms:

1.  A project is a thing that starts slowly then moves too fast, reaches 95%
completion, and stays there forever.

2.  The only accurate schedule is the one delivered with the final invoice.

Rich
NU6T



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[k6dgw]

David Wilburn wrote:
> My experience tends to be just the opposite.  You tend to get a good
> schedule from engineering as they often take their best estimate and
> multiply it by 1.5 or 2.  This gives a cushion for delays and oppsies.
> Project managers and marketing, now that is another level.  They tend to
> never want to leave a cushion, expecting beyond all past experience that
> things will go -perfectly- "this" time.

I was once a Proj Engr, assigned to rescue a failed project involving a
number of circuit boards, racks, and land mobile radios.  As we were
redesigning the circuit boards to withstand installation in trucks and
to actually be manufacturable, I was keeping track of the unit cost of
each of them.  Those costs were declining as we got control of the
engineering, and better manufacturability.  The Division Manager asked
me to keep him in the loop, and being the very naive engineer I was, I
did that.  Then, someone explained to me that he was using my unit cost
estimates, multiplying by the contract quantities, and moving the
difference out of my budget and onto yet another failed project in the
hopes of keeping the corporate weenies at bay.  My unit costs
immediately went back up some "due to vendor delays and back-orders,
among other things ... I'm really sorry Sir," and I became quite a bit
less naive about the workings of the business side of the business.

If any of the K3 field testers or early arrivals have fooled with the RX
audio equalizer, I'd like to hear the results.  Since I can't use my
hearing aids under the headfones, I'm hoping I can use the equalizer to
beef up my hearing a little and start enjoying SSB contests.  My K3 is
in batch 3 [I think] and will arrive sometime after the first of the year.

73,

Fred K6DGW
- Northern California Contest Club
- CU in the 2008 Cal QSO Party  4-5 Oct 08
- www.cqp.org


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[k6dgw]

Richard HIll wrote:
> OK, I have to share two project truisms:
>
> 1.  A project is a thing that starts slowly then moves too fast, reaches 95%
> completion, and stays there forever.
>
> 2.  The only accurate schedule is the one delivered with the final invoice.

Well, unless you're a DoD contractor.  In that case, the final invoice
will be for the entire contract price plus all the change orders and
other time-and-materials work, and will be accompanied by proposal with
a new schedule to finish the original work.  Oddly, this almost always
works :-)

73,

Fred K6DGW
- Northern California Contest Club
- CU in the 2008 Cal QSO Party  4-5 Oct 08
- www.cqp.org
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[Richard-3]

Of course, I forgot the most important one:

3.  Cheaper, better, faster: pick two.

-----Original Message-----
From: [hidden email]
[mailto:[hidden email]]On Behalf Of Richard HIll
Sent: Thursday, November 01, 2007 4:43 PM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: RE: [Elecraft] K3 STATUS


OK, I have to share two project truisms:

1.  A project is a thing that starts slowly then moves too fast, reaches 95%
completion, and stays there forever.

2.  The only accurate schedule is the one delivered with the final invoice.

Rich
NU6T



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