K3 Spot Tone Level
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The K3 "Spot" tone level apparently tracks the "Monitor" sidetone level. I like to keep the sidetone level as low as possible to minimize fatigue, but at that level the Spot tone is inaudible. If I haven't just been transmitting, I lose track of just where the sidetone was, so the Spot tone would help me zero-beat accurately. Anyone else have that problem? (CWT isn't useful if there are multiple signals in the passband, as there usually are in contests.)
73, Scott Scott Ellington Madison, Wisconsin USA ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html |
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No! When sending CW I prefer a LOUD sidetone and would NOT like to see it
changed from its adjustability it presently has. Tom - W4BQF -----Original Message----- From: [hidden email] [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Scott Ellington Sent: Monday, January 31, 2011 3:16 PM To: Elecraft Reflector Subject: [Elecraft] K3 Spot Tone Level The K3 "Spot" tone level apparently tracks the "Monitor" sidetone level. I like to keep the sidetone level as low as possible to minimize fatigue, but at that level the Spot tone is inaudible. If I haven't just been transmitting, I lose track of just where the sidetone was, so the Spot tone would help me zero-beat accurately. Anyone else have that problem? (CWT isn't useful if there are multiple signals in the passband, as there usually are in contests.) 73, Scott Scott Ellington Madison, Wisconsin USA ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html |
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How about independent control of sidetone and spot level?
Scott K9MA On Jan 31, 2011, at 3:42 PM, Tommy Alderman wrote: > No! When sending CW I prefer a LOUD sidetone and would NOT like to see it > changed from its adjustability it presently has. > > Tom - W4BQF > > > -----Original Message----- > From: [hidden email] > [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Scott Ellington > Sent: Monday, January 31, 2011 3:16 PM > To: Elecraft Reflector > Subject: [Elecraft] K3 Spot Tone Level > > The K3 "Spot" tone level apparently tracks the "Monitor" sidetone level. I > like to keep the sidetone level as low as possible to minimize fatigue, but > at that level the Spot tone is inaudible. If I haven't just been > transmitting, I lose track of just where the sidetone was, so the Spot tone > would help me zero-beat accurately. Anyone else have that problem? (CWT > isn't useful if there are multiple signals in the passband, as there usually > are in contests.) > Scott Ellington Madison, Wisconsin USA ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html |
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These two sounds are intended for two entirely different psychoacoustic tasks. The spot function involves perception of the pitch of the tone. The monitor function involves merely hearing the presence of the tone, and intervals of absence of the tone.
The effectiveness of these sounds is different as their respective volume changes. If precisely the same loudness works equally for both, it is probably a fortunate coincidence. There is every reason to provide two separate volume controls. ....and no useful reason for them to be adjusted by a single volume control. Richard K5BWV Sent from my iPhone On Jan 31, 2011, at 15:47, Scott Ellington <[hidden email]> wrote: > How about independent control of sidetone and spot level? > > Scott K9MA > >> ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html |
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Richard,
While "common logic" will say to adjust the spot volume to match the AF gain level of the signal to be spotted, that is too much trouble and involves a lot of "button pushing and knob twiddling". A simpler solution is to just adjust the AF Gain control to bring the signal down to the spot tone level. That works no matter where the spot/sidetone level may be set. Try it, it works and is a lot faster than trying to change the spot/sidetone level. 73, Don W3FPR On 1/31/2011 6:45 PM, Richard wrote: > These two sounds are intended for two entirely different psychoacoustic tasks. The spot function involves perception of the pitch of the tone. The monitor function involves merely hearing the presence of the tone, and intervals of absence of the tone. > > The effectiveness of these sounds is different as their respective volume changes. If precisely the same loudness works equally for both, it is probably a fortunate coincidence. > > There is every reason to provide two separate volume controls. ....and no useful reason for them to be adjusted by a single volume control. > > Richard K5BWV > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Jan 31, 2011, at 15:47, Scott Ellington<[hidden email]> wrote: > >> How about independent control of sidetone and spot level? >> >> Scott K9MA >> > ______________________________________________________________ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:[hidden email] > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html |
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Don:
Please provide us a description of the "problem" for which you are offering a solution. We may be able to recognize your comments as intended to address an issue that is not what is at the center of the comments of Scott, Tommy or me. Richard. On 1/31/11 5:52 PM, Don Wilhelm wrote: > Richard, > > While "common logic" will say to adjust the spot volume to match the AF > gain level of the signal to be spotted, that is too much trouble and > involves a lot of "button pushing and knob twiddling". > > A simpler solution is to just adjust the AF Gain control to bring the > signal down to the spot tone level. That works no matter where the > spot/sidetone level may be set. > > Try it, it works and is a lot faster than trying to change the > spot/sidetone level. > > 73, > Don W3FPR > ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html |
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Richard,
The "problem" brought up on the reflector implied that the operator had to continuously adjust the spot level in order to zero beat - it helps a lot if the spot tone and the signal are at about the same volume. It is easier to adjust the AF gain to change the level of the received signal than it is to change the level of the spot tone. 73, Don W3FPR On 1/31/2011 11:40 PM, Richard Davis wrote: > Don: > > Please provide us a description of the "problem" for which you are > offering a solution. We may be able to recognize your comments as > intended to address an issue that is not what is at the center of the > comments of Scott, Tommy or me. > > Richard. > > On 1/31/11 5:52 PM, Don Wilhelm wrote: >> Richard, >> >> While "common logic" will say to adjust the spot volume to match the AF >> gain level of the signal to be spotted, that is too much trouble and >> involves a lot of "button pushing and knob twiddling". >> >> A simpler solution is to just adjust the AF Gain control to bring the >> signal down to the spot tone level. That works no matter where the >> spot/sidetone level may be set. >> >> Try it, it works and is a lot faster than trying to change the >> spot/sidetone level. > Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html |
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In reply to this post by Don Wilhelm-4
During the CQ 160 contest, I found myself leaving the APF on and using
that on top of a .4 KHz DSP bandwidth. Signals just jump up as you tune across, making zeroing easy even for someone like me that has very little tone discrimination ability. Of course, I got used to doing this with a TS-930, and have relatively high tolerance for ringing and distortion. 73, Pete N4ZR The World Contest Station Database, updated daily at www.conteststations.com The Reverse Beacon Network at http://reversebeacon.net, blog at reversebeacon.blogspot.com, spots at telnet.reversebeacon.net, port 7000 On 1/31/2011 6:52 PM, Don Wilhelm wrote: > Richard, > > While "common logic" will say to adjust the spot volume to match the AF > gain level of the signal to be spotted, that is too much trouble and > involves a lot of "button pushing and knob twiddling". > > A simpler solution is to just adjust the AF Gain control to bring the > signal down to the spot tone level. That works no matter where the > spot/sidetone level may be set. > > Try it, it works and is a lot faster than trying to change the > spot/sidetone level. > > 73, > Don W3FPR > > On 1/31/2011 6:45 PM, Richard wrote: >> These two sounds are intended for two entirely different psychoacoustic tasks. The spot function involves perception of the pitch of the tone. The monitor function involves merely hearing the presence of the tone, and intervals of absence of the tone. >> >> The effectiveness of these sounds is different as their respective volume changes. If precisely the same loudness works equally for both, it is probably a fortunate coincidence. >> >> There is every reason to provide two separate volume controls. ....and no useful reason for them to be adjusted by a single volume control. >> >> Richard K5BWV >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Jan 31, 2011, at 15:47, Scott Ellington<[hidden email]> wrote: >> >>> How about independent control of sidetone and spot level? >>> >>> Scott K9MA >>> >> ______________________________________________________________ >> Elecraft mailing list >> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft >> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm >> Post: mailto:[hidden email] >> >> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net >> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html >> > ______________________________________________________________ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:[hidden email] > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > > Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html |
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In reply to this post by Richard Davis-5
I agree, but I would say that the tasks aren't entirely different. While only the sidetone provides the monitor function, BOTH give you the pitch required for zero beat. The spot tone just allows you to hear that when you're not transmitting. (This is true only of rigs with tracking sidetones, as most modern rigs.)
73, Scott K9MA On Jan 31, 2011, at 5:45 PM, Richard wrote: > These two sounds are intended for two entirely different psychoacoustic tasks. The spot function involves perception of the pitch of the tone. The monitor function involves merely hearing the presence of the tone, and intervals of absence of the tone. > > The effectiveness of these sounds is different as their respective volume changes. If precisely the same loudness works equally for both, it is probably a fortunate coincidence. > > There is every reason to provide two separate volume controls. ....and no useful reason for them to be adjusted by a single volume control. > > Richard K5BWV > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Jan 31, 2011, at 15:47, Scott Ellington <[hidden email]> wrote: > >> How about independent control of sidetone and spot level? >> >> Scott K9MA >> >>> Scott Ellington Madison, Wisconsin USA ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html |
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In reply to this post by Scott Ellington
I've been requesting separate Sidetone and Spot volume controls since my K3 (#1001) was new. My Omni VII has them and it is very convenient. Even though the volumes are identical on the K3, it doesn't seem like it---perhaps because the Spot tone is heard amidst band noise and other signals.
Gary W7TEA
73,
Gary W7TEA K3 #1001, #5763 |
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Exactly. The receiver is muted on transmit, so it's much easier to hear the sidetone.
Scott K9MA On Feb 1, 2011, at 3:31 PM, Gary, W7TEA wrote: > Even > though the volumes are identical on the K3, it doesn't seem like > it---perhaps because the Spot tone is heard amidst band noise and other > signals. Scott Ellington Madison, Wisconsin USA ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html |
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