K3 to K3S Upgrade Opinions
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I have a K3 with dual receivers that I purchased 5 years ago at Dayton.
It is the best radio I have ever owned hands down. My main use for the radio is chasing DX. I have read all the marketing materials about the improvements the K3S has over the K3. On paper and in the lab the radio is an upgrade. But in day to day operations at a home station can an operator tell the difference between the two radios? Those who have upgraded what is your opinion? Would you upgrade the K3 with new parts or buy a K3S and transfer modules? I am leaning toward NOT upgrading the radio as the K3 seems to work great. Am I missing something? Thanks for taking time to reply. 73, Frank K6FW ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to [hidden email] |
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Frank -
The K3 is a top quality radio as is. The "must have" improvement is the new synthesizer, the KSYN3A Synthesizer Upgrade. It will improve your ability to hear the pileup while chasing DX. The improvement is noticeable in normal operation. It also improves CW operation, but my CW isn't good enough to play in those leagues. I have also installed the KIO3B -- the internal sound card and USB <--> RS232, which reduces the number of cables in the shack and eliminates the external sound card for digital modes. I also have the KXV3B RX Ant., 2nd Pre-Amp which gives more gain in the pre-amp. I'm waiting for the sunspots to come back to the the maximum use from it, although I did get good value during a 6M opening New Years Eve. I am happy with the upgrades I have. 73 Bill AE6JV On 5/18/18 at 10:21 PM, [hidden email] (Frank) wrote: >I have a K3 with dual receivers that I purchased 5 years ago at >Dayton. It is the best radio I have ever owned hands down. >My main use for the radio is chasing DX. > >I have read all the marketing materials about the improvements >the K3S has over the K3. On paper and in the lab the radio is >an upgrade. But in day to day operations at a home station >can an operator tell the difference between the two radios? > >Those who have upgraded what is your opinion? > >Would you upgrade the K3 with new parts or buy a K3S and transfer modules? > >I am leaning toward NOT upgrading the radio as the K3 seems to work great. Am I missing something? > >Thanks for taking time to reply. Bill Frantz |Security, like correctness, is| Periwinkle (408)356-8506 |not an add-on feature. - Attr-| 16345 Englewood Ave www.pwpconsult.com |ibuted to Andrew Tanenbaum | Los Gatos, CA 95032 ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to [hidden email] |
Re: K3 to K3S Upgrade Opinions
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In reply to this post by Frank Westphal
Hello Frank,
As of recently I have both a K3 (without upgrades) and a K3S. The improvements which stick out for me are the improved CW timing of the new synthesizer at speeds above 32WPM or so, the easiness and ruggedness of the new internal soundcard when setting up digital modes, the selectable attenuation levels between 0 and 15db per band and, yes, the soft-touch VFO A grip. I have not seen the need to use preamp 2 but this may be because of my noisy environment causing S-meter action even on a dead 10m band. Others love it for weak-signal work. While the new attenuator is not available as an upgrade most other things are. It boils down to your personal needs. If you have been happy with the rig as it is then there is little reason to upgrade. Personally I had given up on the K3 early on because of the CW timing issues which are explained in great detail by N6TV (see links). Now, the K3S is my preferred CW rig. http://lists.f5mzn.org/pipermail/support/2013-November/083384.html http://mldxcc.org/n6tv-k3.pdf You may consider selling your K3 as it is (maybe saving the roofing filters) and get a used K3S depending on prices on the second-hand market. 73, Stefan DL1IAO, SA3CWW/SM9A -- Stefan v. Baltz [hidden email] http://www.dl1iao.com > Am 19.05.2018 um 07:21 schrieb Frank <[hidden email]>: > > I have a K3 with dual receivers that I purchased 5 years ago at Dayton. It is the best radio I have ever owned hands down. My main use for the radio is chasing DX. > > I have read all the marketing materials about the improvements the K3S has over the K3. On paper and in the lab the radio is an upgrade. But in day to day operations at a home station can an operator tell the difference between the two radios? > > Those who have upgraded what is your opinion? > > Would you upgrade the K3 with new parts or buy a K3S and transfer modules? > > I am leaning toward NOT upgrading the radio as the K3 seems to work great. Am I missing something? > > Thanks for taking time to reply. > > 73, > > Frank > > K6FW > > ______________________________________________________________ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:[hidden email] > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > Message delivered to [hidden email] ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to [hidden email] |
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In reply to this post by Frank Westphal
I have both. I haven't even upgraded the synthesizer in the K3, which by
general consensus is a must do. The old K3 is deaf on 6 and 10 meters, if that matters to you. The USB and internal sound card are nice in the K3S, but my serial-to-USB adapter worked fine and the shack computer sound card was as good on RTTY as some highly recommended external boxes like Tascam. I also had less grief getting levels set with the old system. I actually preferred the old tuning knob. I was able to glue in a larger felt washer in the knob and run it against the slick bezel and get reasonably good feel out of a primitive system. The "soft-touch" knob and textured bezel are not amenable to this. Personally, I don't think you're missing anything, but I'm sure the faithful will have other ideas. Wes N7WS On 5/18/2018 10:21 PM, Frank wrote: > I have a K3 with dual receivers that I purchased 5 years ago at Dayton. It is > the best radio I have ever owned hands down. My main use for the radio is > chasing DX. > > I have read all the marketing materials about the improvements the K3S has > over the K3. On paper and in the lab the radio is an upgrade. But in day to > day operations at a home station can an operator tell the difference between > the two radios? > > Those who have upgraded what is your opinion? > > Would you upgrade the K3 with new parts or buy a K3S and transfer modules? > > I am leaning toward NOT upgrading the radio as the K3 seems to work great. Am > I missing something? > > Thanks for taking time to reply. > > 73, > > Frank > > K6FW ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to [hidden email] |
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In reply to this post by Frank Westphal
My experience is similar to Stefan's. In so2r I typically used k3 as the S and P radio (but only after getting the the DSP board swap change). I used Orion as the run radio (and before that, Omni VI).
Other than on-the-air experience with radio equipment (my own as well as at ny4a M/M), the guide for me vis-a-vis radio performance is in two texts: Solid State Design for the Radio Amateur (1977, Wes Hayward and Doug DeMaw) and Introduction to Radio Frequency Design (1982, Wes Hayward). On the one hand, this dates me (ok, so I am 67 years old, but I am still here and every day counts)! On the other hand, how long does it take to understand and use a given level of technological excellence (as noted in the two texts), say in a cw contest (answer: far longer than the next "best ever produced" radio)? BTW, after reading the above texts it was easy to understand the superior performance of Ten-Tec Omni series of radios compared to imports. Ten-Tec radios had later-to-be-named "roofing filters." I was using Orion (revolution in synthesizer performance), mainly, but with the introduction of the new Elecraft synthesizer, I had my 2008 K3 fitted with one (plus any other mod that Elecraft wanted to include while they had the radio) and I purchased another K3. So since early 2015? (anyway, right before K3s was released), I have been so2r K3, with dynamic range and phase noise second to no other radio. In short, a (late model) K3 with synthesizer board (or an updated early K3 like one of mine) is as good as K3s for my purpose. This perception has come from on-the-air experience, guided by the above text, as well as integration of the so2r system. In K3s, the second preamp is not needed on 10m; you may need the preamp on 6m. I use K3 160m-10m, HF contest bands only. Having the ability to disable the K3 preamp and/or put in 10 db of attenuation works fine 160m through 20m. K3S has 10db more blocking (150db!), but 140 db of blocking in K3 is already remarkable in that 130 db is outstanding. The digital mode change of K3s would be desirable by digital mode ops, I suspect. My so2r system, here and now, is far more integrated and functional compared to anything I have used in the past. One reason I don't want to change anything is because everything works as I wish, for the first time (this also includes software, tr4w preferred)! Of course my purpose is defined by cw only, and not by all modes. I can think of small changes in preferences only (tied to using other radios), or different ergonomics. But at this point in time I have been trained by the K3 radios. When I see other radios offering "this or that" function or performance, my main thought is "you don't know me that well;" the main part of the equation is me and what I have learned over the years. Excluding so2r cw challenges, then I would find other radios to be just as good as K3 and better is some specific way, or another, or certainly more "cutting edge" SDR (but for what purpose?). 73, Will, wj9b CWops #1085 CWA Advisor levels II and III http://cwops.org/ -------------------------------------------- On Sat, 5/19/18, Stefan von Baltz, DL1IAO <[hidden email]> wrote: Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3 to K3S Upgrade Opinions To: [hidden email] Date: Saturday, May 19, 2018, 3:49 AM Hello Frank, As of recently I have both a K3 (without upgrades) and a K3S. The improvements which stick out for me are the improved CW timing of the new synthesizer at speeds above 32WPM or so, the easiness and ruggedness of the new internal soundcard when setting up digital modes, the selectable attenuation levels between 0 and 15db per band and, yes, the soft-touch VFO A grip. I have not seen the need to use preamp 2 but this may be because of my noisy environment causing S-meter action even on a dead 10m band. Others love it for weak-signal work. While the new attenuator is not available as an upgrade most other things are. It boils down to your personal needs. If you have been happy with the rig as it is then there is little reason to upgrade. Personally I had given up on the K3 early on because of the CW timing issues which are explained in great detail by N6TV (see links). Now, the K3S is my preferred CW rig. http://lists.f5mzn.org/pipermail/support/2013-November/083384.html http://mldxcc.org/n6tv-k3.pdf You may consider selling your K3 as it is (maybe saving the roofing filters) and get a used K3S depending on prices on the second-hand market. 73, Stefan DL1IAO, SA3CWW/SM9A -- Stefan v. Baltz [hidden email] http://www.dl1iao.com > Am 19.05.2018 um 07:21 schrieb Frank <[hidden email]>: > > I have a K3 with dual receivers that I purchased 5 years ago at Dayton. It is the best radio I have ever owned hands down. My main use for the radio is chasing DX. > > I have read all the marketing materials about the improvements the K3S has over the K3. On paper and in the lab the radio is an upgrade. But in day to day operations at a home station can an operator tell the difference between the two radios? > > Those who have upgraded what is your opinion? > > Would you upgrade the K3 with new parts or buy a K3S and transfer modules? > > I am leaning toward NOT upgrading the radio as the K3 seems to work great. Am I missing something? > > Thanks for taking time to reply. > > 73, > > Frank > > K6FW > > ______________________________________________________________ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:[hidden email] > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > Message delivered to [hidden email] ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to [hidden email] ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to [hidden email] |
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In reply to this post by Wes Stewart-2
On 5/19/2018 8:25 AM, Wes Stewart wrote:
> The old K3 is deaf on 6 and 10 meters, if that matters to you. Which is why to replace (or add) the newer KXVB board, which includes a second preamp that can be selected above 15M. 73, Jim K9YC ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to [hidden email] |
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