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K3Util version history?

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Barry

K3Util version history?

I see a relatively new update for K3Util on the web site. However, I don't see a version history with what's changed. Am I missing it?
Tnx,
Barry W2UP

vk4tux

K3Util Firmware version

I would assume the default K3Util firmware lookup would point to;

ftp://ftp.elecraft.com/K3/firmware/

Could an option in K3Util provide old and beta defaults with a menu select,
such that to revert firmware the k3Util would look at;

ftp://ftp.elecraft.com/K3/firmware/old/

or to try beta;

ftp://ftp.elecraft.com/K3/firmware/beta/

Like a user repository select function in K3Util, giving the user quick easy selection of older, current or beta firmware. The programming change should be simple to enable deault ftp url links to menu description.

Is this a good idea for simplicity?

Some op's find the download , unzip then manual browsing for other than current versions, etc a bit brainswelling.

Adrian ... vk4tux

Guy, K2AV

Re: K3Util Firmware version

Beta firmware should not be installable by accident. Should have to go
somewhere else on purpose, get it on purpose and install it quite on
purpose. Same thing for retrograde firmware.

Needing to go backward on an Elecraft firmware release is really very rare.
Your particular issue has two sides to it as I have seen on the reflector,
and maybe a dozen or two or three out of 6000+ owners going back to 4.48.
That is not at all to diminish the complaints, but one needs to consider
the vast majority when putting up possibilities in the main utility
program. Mostly the utility has to be designed for new builders and newbie
owners.

I note that via the reflector copies of 4.48 were very quickly available.
You guys figured it out and fixed it quite quickly. You did not appear to
really need anything else to get squared to your satisfaction. Try that
with other brands.

Keep the utility safe for newbies and non-technical types.

73, Guy.

On Tue, Aug 21, 2012 at 9:01 PM, vk4tux <[hidden email]> wrote:

> I would assume the default K3Util firmware lookup would point to;
>
> ftp://ftp.elecraft.com/K3/firmware/
>
> Could an option in K3Util provide old and beta defaults with a menu select,
> such that to revert firmware the k3Util would look at;
>
> ftp://ftp.elecraft.com/K3/firmware/old/
>
> or to try beta;
>
> ftp://ftp.elecraft.com/K3/firmware/beta/
>
> Like a user repository select function in K3Util, giving the user quick
> easy
> selection of older, current or beta firmware. The programming change should
> be simple to enable deault ftp url links to menu description.
>
> Is this a good idea for simplicity?
>
> Some op's find the download , unzip then manual browsing for other than
> current versions, etc a bit brainswelling.
>
> Adrian ... vk4tux
>
>
>
> --
> View this message in context:
> http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/K3Util-version-history-tp5946045p7561442.html
> Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
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> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>

vk4tux

Re: K3Util Firmware version

In reply to this post by vk4tux

Answered Inline;

Beta firmware should not be installable by accident. Should have to go
somewhere else on purpose, get it on purpose and install it quite on
purpose. Same thing for retrograde firmware.

~The current firmware would remain the startup default and beta or old would need to be user selected from K3Util advanced submenu, by the user.

Needing to go backward on an Elecraft firmware release is really very rare.

~Not lately

Your particular issue has two sides to it as I have seen on the reflector,
and maybe a dozen or two or three out of 6000+ owners going back to 4.48.
That is not at all to diminish the complaints, but one needs to consider
the vast majority when putting up possibilities in the main utility
program. Mostly the utility has to be designed for new builders and newbie
owners.

~The k3Utility should be designed for any K3 owner. The user selects could be a submenu of the advanced menu. Anytime new firmware does not meet expectations, the user should be able to easily revert back.

I note that via the reflector copies of 4.48 were very quickly available.
You guys figured it out and fixed it quite quickly. You did not appear to
really need anything else to get squared to your satisfaction. Try that
with other brands.

Keep the utility safe for newbies and non-technical types.

~If there is nothing in the ftp beta folder then it can not be selected. Elecraft obviously decide when a beta is ready for general release beyond a test group and control what is their server.

~#Reverting to older software without downloading, unzipping and browse located to load etc is a nice convenience.

~I have done it like # many times, and is of no issue to me however I would be surprised if the general K3 user would not appreciate the feature (which needs to be selected) of reverting back or trying beta software that is available for download otherwise at Elecrafts discretion & decision to have it available.

~If you keep "non-technical types" wrapped up in cotton wool, then how will they ever become technical or real hams?

~Adrian ... vk4tux

Dick Dievendorff

Re: K3Util Firmware version

In reply to this post by vk4tux

Dick

On Aug 21, 2012, at 6:01 PM, vk4tux <[hidden email]> wrote:

> I would assume the default K3Util firmware lookup would point to;
>
> ftp://ftp.elecraft.com/K3/firmware/
>
> Could an option in K3Util provide old and beta defaults with a menu select,
> such that to revert firmware the k3Util would look at;
>
> ftp://ftp.elecraft.com/K3/firmware/old/
>
> or to try beta;
>
> ftp://ftp.elecraft.com/K3/firmware/beta/
>
> Like a user repository select function in K3Util, giving the user quick easy
> selection of older, current or beta firmware. The programming change should
> be simple to enable deault ftp url links to menu description.
>
> Is this a good idea for simplicity?
>
> Some op's find the download , unzip then manual browsing for other than
> current versions, etc a bit brainswelling.
>
> Adrian ... vk4tux
>
>
>
> --
> View this message in context: http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/K3Util-version-history-tp5946045p7561442.html
> Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

Dick Dievendorff

Re: K3Util Firmware version

In reply to this post by vk4tux

I'm reluctant to go this way. We can't do this without making the choices more daunting for those customers that choose not to be early adopters. The unzip process for beta firmware is written up on our web site.

Dick, K6KR

On Aug 21, 2012, at 7:27 PM, vk4tux <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Answered Inline;
>
> Beta firmware should not be installable by accident. Should have to go
> somewhere else on purpose, get it on purpose and install it quite on
> purpose. Same thing for retrograde firmware.
>
> ~The current firmware would remain the startup default and beta or old would
> need to be user selected from K3Util advanced submenu, by the user.
>
> Needing to go backward on an Elecraft firmware release is really very rare.
>
> ~Not lately
>
> Your particular issue has two sides to it as I have seen on the reflector,
> and maybe a dozen or two or three out of 6000+ owners going back to 4.48.
> That is not at all to diminish the complaints, but one needs to consider
> the vast majority when putting up possibilities in the main utility
> program. Mostly the utility has to be designed for new builders and newbie
> owners.
>
> ~The k3Utility should be designed for any K3 owner. The user selects could
> be a submenu of the advanced menu. Anytime new firmware does not meet
> expectations, the user should be able to easily revert back.
>
> I note that via the reflector copies of 4.48 were very quickly available.
> You guys figured it out and fixed it quite quickly. You did not appear to
> really need anything else to get squared to your satisfaction. Try that
> with other brands.
>
> Keep the utility safe for newbies and non-technical types.
>
> ~If there is nothing in the ftp beta folder then it can not be selected.
> Elecraft obviously decide when a beta is ready for general release beyond a
> test group and control what is their server.
>
> ~#Reverting to older software without downloading, unzipping and browse
> located to load etc is a nice convenience.
>
> ~I have done it like # many times, and is of no issue to me however I would
> be surprised if the general K3 user would not appreciate the feature (which
> needs to be selected) of reverting back or trying beta software that is
> available for download otherwise at Elecrafts discretion & decision to have
> it available.
>
> ~If you keep "non-technical types" wrapped up in cotton wool, then how will
> they ever become technical or real hams?
>
> ~Adrian ... vk4tux
>
>
>
> --
> View this message in context: http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/K3Util-version-history-tp5946045p7561448.html
> Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
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> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

N0AZZ

Re: K3Util Firmware version

In reply to this post by Guy, K2AV

Thank You Guy I could not agree more with your statement, right on the
point.

73,
Fred/N0AZZ

-----Original Message-----
From: [hidden email]
[mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Guy Olinger K2AV
Sent: Tuesday, August 21, 2012 8:57 PM
To: vk4tux
Cc: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3Util Firmware version

Beta firmware should not be installable by accident. Should have to go
somewhere else on purpose, get it on purpose and install it quite on
purpose. Same thing for retrograde firmware.

Needing to go backward on an Elecraft firmware release is really very rare.
Your particular issue has two sides to it as I have seen on the reflector,
and maybe a dozen or two or three out of 6000+ owners going back to 4.48.
That is not at all to diminish the complaints, but one needs to consider
the vast majority when putting up possibilities in the main utility program.
Mostly the utility has to be designed for new builders and newbie owners.

I note that via the reflector copies of 4.48 were very quickly available.
You guys figured it out and fixed it quite quickly. You did not appear to
really need anything else to get squared to your satisfaction. Try that
with other brands.

Keep the utility safe for newbies and non-technical types.

73, Guy.

On Tue, Aug 21, 2012 at 9:01 PM, vk4tux <[hidden email]> wrote:

> I would assume the default K3Util firmware lookup would point to;
>
> ftp://ftp.elecraft.com/K3/firmware/
>
> Could an option in K3Util provide old and beta defaults with a menu
> select, such that to revert firmware the k3Util would look at;
>
> ftp://ftp.elecraft.com/K3/firmware/old/
>
> or to try beta;
>
> ftp://ftp.elecraft.com/K3/firmware/beta/
>
> Like a user repository select function in K3Util, giving the user
> quick easy selection of older, current or beta firmware. The
> programming change should be simple to enable deault ftp url links to
> menu description.
>
> Is this a good idea for simplicity?
>
> Some op's find the download , unzip then manual browsing for other
> than current versions, etc a bit brainswelling.
>
> Adrian ... vk4tux
>
>
>
> --
> View this message in context:
> http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/K3Util-version-history-tp5946045p
> 7561442.html Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at
> Nabble.com.
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email
> list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>

______________________________________________________________
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Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

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vk4tux

Re: K3Util Firmware version

I guess it seems to be a generally bad idea with no support, but it won't be
hard for me to make up
a selectable redirect gui script to work with it either in Linux or
windows, so I will just do that.

EOT

Adrian ... vk4tux

-----Original Message-----
From: Fred Smith [mailto:[hidden email]]
Sent: Wednesday, 22 August 2012 4:46 PM
To: 'Guy Olinger K2AV'; 'vk4tux'
Cc: [hidden email]
Subject: RE: [Elecraft] K3Util Firmware version

Thank You Guy I could not agree more with your statement, right on the
point.

73,
Fred/N0AZZ

-----Original Message-----
From: [hidden email]
[mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Guy Olinger K2AV
Sent: Tuesday, August 21, 2012 8:57 PM
To: vk4tux
Cc: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3Util Firmware version

Beta firmware should not be installable by accident. Should have to go
somewhere else on purpose, get it on purpose and install it quite on
purpose. Same thing for retrograde firmware.

Needing to go backward on an Elecraft firmware release is really very rare.
Your particular issue has two sides to it as I have seen on the reflector,
and maybe a dozen or two or three out of 6000+ owners going back to 4.48.
That is not at all to diminish the complaints, but one needs to consider
the vast majority when putting up possibilities in the main utility program.
Mostly the utility has to be designed for new builders and newbie owners.

I note that via the reflector copies of 4.48 were very quickly available.
You guys figured it out and fixed it quite quickly. You did not appear to
really need anything else to get squared to your satisfaction. Try that
with other brands.

Keep the utility safe for newbies and non-technical types.

73, Guy.

On Tue, Aug 21, 2012 at 9:01 PM, vk4tux <[hidden email]> wrote:

> I would assume the default K3Util firmware lookup would point to;
>
> ftp://ftp.elecraft.com/K3/firmware/
>
> Could an option in K3Util provide old and beta defaults with a menu
> select, such that to revert firmware the k3Util would look at;
>
> ftp://ftp.elecraft.com/K3/firmware/old/
>
> or to try beta;
>
> ftp://ftp.elecraft.com/K3/firmware/beta/
>
> Like a user repository select function in K3Util, giving the user
> quick easy selection of older, current or beta firmware. The
> programming change should be simple to enable deault ftp url links to
> menu description.
>
> Is this a good idea for simplicity?
>
> Some op's find the download , unzip then manual browsing for other
> than current versions, etc a bit brainswelling.
>
> Adrian ... vk4tux
>
>
>
> --
> View this message in context:
> http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/K3Util-version-history-tp5946045p
> 7561442.html Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at
> Nabble.com.
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email
> list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>

Gary Gregory

Re: K3Util Firmware version

*I have watched the thread since it appeared and I do concur with Adrian's
thinking that if an "Advanced" menu was to be added then I see no issue for
the newer owners whether they be new to Elecraft or the hobby.

Protecting the 'innocent' should not mean standing in the way of
progress....:-)

Mine is an opinion only, and it IS mine alone perhaps, but nonetheless, I
think Adrian's idea has merit.

73's and goodnight all...
*
On 22 August 2012 17:10, Adrian <[hidden email]> wrote:

> I guess it seems to be a generally bad idea with no support, but it won't
> be
> hard for me to make up
> a selectable redirect gui script to work with it either in Linux or
> windows, so I will just do that.
>
> EOT
>
> Adrian ... vk4tux
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Fred Smith [mailto:[hidden email]]
> Sent: Wednesday, 22 August 2012 4:46 PM
> To: 'Guy Olinger K2AV'; 'vk4tux'
> Cc: [hidden email]
> Subject: RE: [Elecraft] K3Util Firmware version
>
> Thank You Guy I could not agree more with your statement, right on the
> point.
>
> 73,
> Fred/N0AZZ
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [hidden email]
> [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Guy Olinger K2AV
> Sent: Tuesday, August 21, 2012 8:57 PM
> To: vk4tux
> Cc: [hidden email]
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3Util Firmware version
>
> Beta firmware should not be installable by accident. Should have to go
> somewhere else on purpose, get it on purpose and install it quite on
> purpose. Same thing for retrograde firmware.
>
> Needing to go backward on an Elecraft firmware release is really very rare.
> Your particular issue has two sides to it as I have seen on the reflector,
> and maybe a dozen or two or three out of 6000+ owners going back to 4.48.
> That is not at all to diminish the complaints, but one needs to consider
> the vast majority when putting up possibilities in the main utility
> program.
> Mostly the utility has to be designed for new builders and newbie owners.
>
> I note that via the reflector copies of 4.48 were very quickly available.
> You guys figured it out and fixed it quite quickly. You did not appear to
> really need anything else to get squared to your satisfaction. Try that
> with other brands.
>
> Keep the utility safe for newbies and non-technical types.
>
> 73, Guy.
>
> On Tue, Aug 21, 2012 at 9:01 PM, vk4tux <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> > I would assume the default K3Util firmware lookup would point to;
> >
> > ftp://ftp.elecraft.com/K3/firmware/
> >
> > Could an option in K3Util provide old and beta defaults with a menu
> > select, such that to revert firmware the k3Util would look at;
> >
> > ftp://ftp.elecraft.com/K3/firmware/old/
> >
> > or to try beta;
> >
> > ftp://ftp.elecraft.com/K3/firmware/beta/
> >
> > Like a user repository select function in K3Util, giving the user
> > quick easy selection of older, current or beta firmware. The
> > programming change should be simple to enable deault ftp url links to
> > menu description.
> >
> > Is this a good idea for simplicity?
> >
> > Some op's find the download , unzip then manual browsing for other
> > than current versions, etc a bit brainswelling.
> >
> > Adrian ... vk4tux
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > View this message in context:
> > http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/K3Util-version-history-tp5946045p
> > 7561442.html Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at
> > Nabble.com.
> > ______________________________________________________________
> > Elecraft mailing list
> > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> > Post: mailto:[hidden email]
> >
> > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email
> > list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> >
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
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> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>

--
*Gary*
*Start the day off slow, then taper off.........*
______________________________________________________________
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Bruce Beford-2

Re: K3Util Firmware version

In reply to this post by vk4tux

I agree with Dick on this one as well. Guy put it well in his reply-
Installing beta firmware should be a very deliberate process, taken on by
the user who knows he is trying something that is perhaps "not ready for
prime time". The process for loading beta firmware, including downloading
files, unpacking and installing is all spelled out. Perhaps this procedure
could be re-written to make it clearer for some, but it has always been fine
for me. As for this comment:

> ~If you keep "non-technical types" wrapped up in cotton wool, then how
will
> they ever become technical or real hams?

My answer would be, by encouraging them to learn how things work, such as
the downloading and installing of trial firmware to their radio, instead of
spoon-feeding the process behind an automated menu.

I think the current system of firmware distribution works well. Those who
are interested in becoming early adopters, with all the potential risks and
benefits, would be better served by having them learn how to do it properly.
I do not believe the current process is excessively burdensome. The skills
required are basic computer skills. Of course, it's only my opinion.
FWIW es 73,
Bruce, N1RX

______________________________________________________________
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Eric Swartz - WA6HHQ

Re: K3Util Firmware version

Administrator

Lets end this thread at this time.

We purposely zip the beta releases to prevent the code from being super easy to download or mistakenly downloaded. This is also to prevent people loading it thinking it is a normal release.

Thanks for the suggestions, but we will be leaving it as is for now. (We're really busy on other projects too :-)

73,

Eric

www.elecraft.com
_..._

On Aug 22, 2012, at 7:45 AM, "Bruce Beford" <[hidden email]> wrote:

> I agree with Dick on this one as well. Guy put it well in his reply-
> Installing beta firmware should be a very deliberate process, taken on by
> the user who knows he is trying something that is perhaps "not ready for
> prime time". The process for loading beta firmware, including downloading
> files, unpacking and installing is all spelled out. Perhaps this procedure
> could be re-written to make it clearer for some, but it has always been fine
> for me. As for this comment:
>
>> ~If you keep "non-technical types" wrapped up in cotton wool, then how
> will
>> they ever become technical or real hams?
>
> My answer would be, by encouraging them to learn how things work, such as
> the downloading and installing of trial firmware to their radio, instead of
> spoon-feeding the process behind an automated menu.
>
> I think the current system of firmware distribution works well. Those who
> are interested in becoming early adopters, with all the potential risks and
> benefits, would be better served by having them learn how to do it properly.
> I do not believe the current process is excessively burdensome. The skills
> required are basic computer skills. Of course, it's only my opinion.
> FWIW es 73,
> Bruce, N1RX
>
>
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html