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KPA-1500 Fan Noise

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Jeff Griffin

Re: KPA500 and K3 SWR meters disagree

FIXED ! This morning I went through the RF jumper cables. I didn't find any
issues after taking each one out and inspecting. So I went through all the
other Elecraft supplied cables and also found no issues. So just to be sure
I make a new set of RF jumper cables out of LMR-240. Hooked everything up
and the problem is now fixed. I then tried the jumper cables I replaced one
at a time and the problem didn't return. Go figure. So I put the new LMR-240
jumpers back on and life is once again good in kb2mland...

73 Jeff kb2m

-----Original Message-----
From: [hidden email]
[mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of jeff griffin
Sent: Saturday, June 2, 2018 11:49 AM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: [Elecraft] KPA500 and K3 SWR meters disagree

I recently brought my KPA/KAT500 north for the summer and hooked up to my
trapped multiband fan dipole that I use here in NJ. I leave my K3 here for
remote use and use the amp at my winter home in Florida to use with my Flex
6500 with a Steppir Vertical antenna without the KAT500 tuner. When I got up
here I installed the KIO3B option. The install went well with no issues, all
looked good so I connected the K3, P3, KAT500, and KPA500 with the Elecraft
provided cable set like I do every year.

The issue I'm having is an SWR difference between the KAT500 and the K3.
For example if I use the K3's internal tuner I can on a chosen frequency
achieve an SWR of 1/1. I the put the internal K3 tuner in bypass mode and
take the KAT500 out of bypass and set to auto. I then use the xmit button on
the K3 to create a tune signal to be sent to the KAT500. The K3 then shows a
1/1, the KAT500 about the same but the KPA500 which is in STBY mode shows
around 3/1. What this causes to happen is the Amp will fault out if I try to
use any power output. If I check the antenna with a trusted SWR meter I see
1.3/1 at the frequency of use. I upgraded the firmware in all the devices in
use, I also did a reset of the KAT's stored frequencies memory, and checked
both the amp and tuner with the utility programs. I'm going to call Elecraft
on Monday, anyone have any ideas in the meantime I can try?

73 Jeff kb2m

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Bob McGraw - K4TAX

Re: KPA500 and K3 SWR meters disagree

Loose or poor quality PL-259. There are many which "look good" but are not. Always snug PL-259 connectors on the SO-239 such they are a bit more than finger tight. I use/have a pair of 4" Channel lock pliers on the desk.

Bob, K4TAX

Sent from my iPhone

> On Jun 3, 2018, at 9:58 AM, jeff griffin <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> FIXED ! This morning I went through the RF jumper cables. I didn't find any
> issues after taking each one out and inspecting. So I went through all the
> other Elecraft supplied cables and also found no issues. So just to be sure
> I make a new set of RF jumper cables out of LMR-240. Hooked everything up
> and the problem is now fixed. I then tried the jumper cables I replaced one
> at a time and the problem didn't return. Go figure. So I put the new LMR-240
> jumpers back on and life is once again good in kb2mland...
>
> 73 Jeff kb2m
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [hidden email]
> [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of jeff griffin
> Sent: Saturday, June 2, 2018 11:49 AM
> To: [hidden email]
> Subject: [Elecraft] KPA500 and K3 SWR meters disagree
>
> I recently brought my KPA/KAT500 north for the summer and hooked up to my
> trapped multiband fan dipole that I use here in NJ. I leave my K3 here for
> remote use and use the amp at my winter home in Florida to use with my Flex
> 6500 with a Steppir Vertical antenna without the KAT500 tuner. When I got up
> here I installed the KIO3B option. The install went well with no issues, all
> looked good so I connected the K3, P3, KAT500, and KPA500 with the Elecraft
> provided cable set like I do every year.
>
> The issue I'm having is an SWR difference between the KAT500 and the K3.
> For example if I use the K3's internal tuner I can on a chosen frequency
> achieve an SWR of 1/1. I the put the internal K3 tuner in bypass mode and
> take the KAT500 out of bypass and set to auto. I then use the xmit button on
> the K3 to create a tune signal to be sent to the KAT500. The K3 then shows a
> 1/1, the KAT500 about the same but the KPA500 which is in STBY mode shows
> around 3/1. What this causes to happen is the Amp will fault out if I try to
> use any power output. If I check the antenna with a trusted SWR meter I see
> 1.3/1 at the frequency of use. I upgraded the firmware in all the devices in
> use, I also did a reset of the KAT's stored frequencies memory, and checked
> both the amp and tuner with the utility programs. I'm going to call Elecraft
> on Monday, anyone have any ideas in the meantime I can try?
>
> 73 Jeff kb2m
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>

Jeff Griffin

Re: KPA500 and K3 SWR meters disagree

The jumpers connectors were good quality, but are very old I think I built
them maybe 20 years ago. Anyway now I use better coax, and quality crimp on
connectors I use either Amphenol or the DX Engineering brand which seem to
me to be equal to the Amphenol brand. I'm not the type to pursue this
farther, I'm not going to dissect the connectors on the old jumpers, I'm
just going to throw them out. I have better things to do with my time :-)

73 Jeff kb2m

-----Original Message-----
From: Bob McGraw K4TAX [mailto:[hidden email]]
Sent: Sunday, June 3, 2018 1:52 PM
To: jeff griffin
Cc: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] KPA500 and K3 SWR meters disagree

Loose or poor quality PL-259. There are many which "look good" but are not.
Always snug PL-259 connectors on the SO-239 such they are a bit more than
finger tight. I use/have a pair of 4" Channel lock pliers on the desk.

Bob, K4TAX

Sent from my iPhone

> On Jun 3, 2018, at 9:58 AM, jeff griffin <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> FIXED ! This morning I went through the RF jumper cables. I didn't find
any
> issues after taking each one out and inspecting. So I went through all the
> other Elecraft supplied cables and also found no issues. So just to be
sure
> I make a new set of RF jumper cables out of LMR-240. Hooked everything up
> and the problem is now fixed. I then tried the jumper cables I replaced
one
> at a time and the problem didn't return. Go figure. So I put the new
LMR-240

> jumpers back on and life is once again good in kb2mland...
>
> 73 Jeff kb2m
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [hidden email]
> [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of jeff griffin
> Sent: Saturday, June 2, 2018 11:49 AM
> To: [hidden email]
> Subject: [Elecraft] KPA500 and K3 SWR meters disagree
>
> I recently brought my KPA/KAT500 north for the summer and hooked up to my
> trapped multiband fan dipole that I use here in NJ. I leave my K3 here for
> remote use and use the amp at my winter home in Florida to use with my

Flex
> 6500 with a Steppir Vertical antenna without the KAT500 tuner. When I got
up
> here I installed the KIO3B option. The install went well with no issues,
all
> looked good so I connected the K3, P3, KAT500, and KPA500 with the
Elecraft
> provided cable set like I do every year.
>
> The issue I'm having is an SWR difference between the KAT500 and the K3.
> For example if I use the K3's internal tuner I can on a chosen frequency
> achieve an SWR of 1/1. I the put the internal K3 tuner in bypass mode and
> take the KAT500 out of bypass and set to auto. I then use the xmit button
on
> the K3 to create a tune signal to be sent to the KAT500. The K3 then shows
a
> 1/1, the KAT500 about the same but the KPA500 which is in STBY mode shows
> around 3/1. What this causes to happen is the Amp will fault out if I try
to
> use any power output. If I check the antenna with a trusted SWR meter I
see
> 1.3/1 at the frequency of use. I upgraded the firmware in all the devices
in
> use, I also did a reset of the KAT's stored frequencies memory, and
checked
> both the amp and tuner with the utility programs. I'm going to call
Elecraft

> on Monday, anyone have any ideas in the meantime I can try?
>
> 73 Jeff kb2m
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>

Elecraft mailing list

Re: KPA-1500 Fan Noise - measured (sort of)

In reply to this post by Chris Codella, W2PA

My measurements were taken with a microphone about 2 feet from the front panels of the components. I wondered if W2PA’s alpha 89 was as quiet as he reported, so I thought I’d report on what I found -

Ham shack in a finished (insulated drywall) room in a metal shed with equipment and HVAC off - 24 dBa

Above with Mitsubishi HVAC on - 29 dBa

HVAC was then turned off for the remainder of these measurements

KPA1500 PS fans on, RF deck fans off (step 0) - 36 dBa

KPA1500 PS fans on, RF deck fans at step 1 - 40 dBa

KPA1500 PS fans on, RF deck fans at step 2 - 44 dBa

KPA1500 PS fans on, RF deck fans at step 3 - 50 dBa

KPA1500 PS fans on, RF deck fans at step 4 - 57 dBa

KPA1500 PS fans on, RF deck fans at step 5 - 59 dBa

alpha 87a (everything else off) - 50 dBa - the fans run at a fixed speed when mains power is applied

My experience for S&P CW during WPX is that the KPA1500 PA temp rose to about 64C so that the deck fans were at Step 2. During a recent RTTY contest, the deck rose above 70C and the fans were running at Step 3 pushing a lot of warm air out of the vent holes above the heat sink.

73 & YMMV,

Bob Rennard = N7WY
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Clay Autery-2

Re: KPA500 and K3 SWR meters disagree

In reply to this post by Jeff Griffin

Make and break syndrome! <smile>

Either there was a connector that was not fully mated even though you
thought it was (something fouling a thread making it appear snug) or
some oxidation/schmutz on one of the mating surfaces.

I've experienced BOTH... it is maddening for sure. That's why I now put
covers on ALL unused connector ends for cables/jumpers not actually in
use. There's a reason the military "dummy cords" a connector cover to
virtually everything. <wink>

73,

______________________
Clay Autery, KY5G
(318) 518-1389

On 06/03/18 09:58, jeff griffin wrote:

> FIXED ! This morning I went through the RF jumper cables. I didn't find any
> issues after taking each one out and inspecting. So I went through all the
> other Elecraft supplied cables and also found no issues. So just to be sure
> I make a new set of RF jumper cables out of LMR-240. Hooked everything up
> and the problem is now fixed. I then tried the jumper cables I replaced one
> at a time and the problem didn't return. Go figure. So I put the new LMR-240
> jumpers back on and life is once again good in kb2mland...
>
> 73 Jeff kb2m
>

Jeff Griffin

Re: KPA500 and K3 SWR meters disagree

That's true. Especially when you let stuff sit for 6 months between uses. I need to get more of those covers....

73 Jeff kb2m

-----Original Message-----
From: [hidden email] [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Clay Autery
Sent: Sunday, June 3, 2018 2:34 PM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] KPA500 and K3 SWR meters disagree

Make and break syndrome! <smile>

Either there was a connector that was not fully mated even though you
thought it was (something fouling a thread making it appear snug) or
some oxidation/schmutz on one of the mating surfaces.

I've experienced BOTH... it is maddening for sure. That's why I now put
covers on ALL unused connector ends for cables/jumpers not actually in
use. There's a reason the military "dummy cords" a connector cover to
virtually everything. <wink>

73,

______________________
Clay Autery, KY5G
(318) 518-1389

On 06/03/18 09:58, jeff griffin wrote:

______________________________________________________________
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Message delivered to [hidden email]

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Bill K9YEQ

Re: KPA-1500 Fan Noise

In reply to this post by Eric Swartz - WA6HHQ

Eric, based on the comments about fan speed, I was confident you and Wayne and team would address the issue with a good solution. I have one on order and scheduled to be received in July.

72 & 73,
Bill
K9YEQ
FT'er for K2, KX1, KX3, KXPA100, KAT500, W2, etc.

-----Original Message-----
From: [hidden email] <[hidden email]> On Behalf Of Eric Swartz - WA6HHQ, Elecraft
Sent: Saturday, June 2, 2018 11:14 PM
To: Les Peters <[hidden email]>
Cc: [hidden email]; [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] KPA-1500 Fan Noise

One quick note: We have shifted up the fan turn on temperatures by about 7 degrees for Fan speed 2 and above in our next KPA1500 s/w release and on newly shipping amps. The release should be available in the next week or two.

As noted by others, setting the minimum RF deck fan speed to 1 (or 2 if desired) also further delays going to higher fan speeds in TX.

Also, since the RF deck is instant on, its OK to turn it off from the front panel when you are mostly listening and tuning the band. (The amp can also be set to power up in operate mode in its menu..)

There are no limitations to turning it on and off frequently. (Of course we recommend letting it cool first before turning it off temporarily when running higher duty TX cycles.)

73,
Eric
elecraft.com
_..._
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Stefan von Baltz, DL1IAO

Re: KPA-1500 Fan Noise - measured (sort of)

In reply to this post by Chris Codella, W2PA

Hello Bob,

Thanks for the measurements! Was this with the Alpha’s auxiliary fan on or off? You will find this fan and its belonging switch on the amplifiers back on the right side where the power supply transformer sits.

73,

Stefan DL1IAO, SA3CWW/SM9A

--
Stefan v. Baltz
[hidden email]
http://www.dl1iao.com

> Am 03.06.2018 um 20:33 schrieb Bob Rennard via Elecraft <[hidden email]>:
>
> My measurements were taken with a microphone about 2 feet from the front panels of the components. I wondered if W2PA’s alpha 89 was as quiet as he reported, so I thought I’d report on what I found -
>
>
>
> Ham shack in a finished (insulated drywall) room in a metal shed with equipment and HVAC off - 24 dBa
>
> Above with Mitsubishi HVAC on - 29 dBa
>
> HVAC was then turned off for the remainder of these measurements
>
> KPA1500 PS fans on, RF deck fans off (step 0) - 36 dBa
>
> KPA1500 PS fans on, RF deck fans at step 1 - 40 dBa
>
> KPA1500 PS fans on, RF deck fans at step 2 - 44 dBa
>
> KPA1500 PS fans on, RF deck fans at step 3 - 50 dBa
>
> KPA1500 PS fans on, RF deck fans at step 4 - 57 dBa
>
> KPA1500 PS fans on, RF deck fans at step 5 - 59 dBa
>
>
> alpha 87a (everything else off) - 50 dBa - the fans run at a fixed speed when mains power is applied
>
>
> My experience for S&P CW during WPX is that the KPA1500 PA temp rose to about 64C so that the deck fans were at Step 2. During a recent RTTY contest, the deck rose above 70C and the fans were running at Step 3 pushing a lot of warm air out of the vent holes above the heat sink.
>
>
> 73 & YMMV,
>
>
> Bob Rennard = N7WY
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to [hidden email]

Chris Codella, W2PA

Re: KPA-1500 Fan Noise - measured (sort of)

FWIW - My test using the Alpha 89, was with only the built-in fan on,
not the add-on one in back (which I've never really had to use).

73,
Chris, W2PA

On 6/4/2018 4:43 AM, Stefan von Baltz, DL1IAO wrote:

> Hello Bob,
>
> Thanks for the measurements! Was this with the Alpha’s auxiliary fan on or off? You will find this fan and its belonging switch on the amplifiers back on the right side where the power supply transformer sits.
>
>
> 73,
>
> Stefan DL1IAO, SA3CWW/SM9A
>
>
> --
> Stefan v. Baltz
> [hidden email]
> http://www.dl1iao.com
>
>
>
>
>
>> Am 03.06.2018 um 20:33 schrieb Bob Rennard via Elecraft <[hidden email]>:
>>
>> My measurements were taken with a microphone about 2 feet from the front panels of the components. I wondered if W2PA’s alpha 89 was as quiet as he reported, so I thought I’d report on what I found -
>>
>>
>>
>> Ham shack in a finished (insulated drywall) room in a metal shed with equipment and HVAC off - 24 dBa
>>
>> Above with Mitsubishi HVAC on - 29 dBa
>>
>> HVAC was then turned off for the remainder of these measurements
>>
>> KPA1500 PS fans on, RF deck fans off (step 0) - 36 dBa
>>
>> KPA1500 PS fans on, RF deck fans at step 1 - 40 dBa
>>
>> KPA1500 PS fans on, RF deck fans at step 2 - 44 dBa
>>
>> KPA1500 PS fans on, RF deck fans at step 3 - 50 dBa
>>
>> KPA1500 PS fans on, RF deck fans at step 4 - 57 dBa
>>
>> KPA1500 PS fans on, RF deck fans at step 5 - 59 dBa
>>
>>
>> alpha 87a (everything else off) - 50 dBa - the fans run at a fixed speed when mains power is applied
>>
>>
>> My experience for S&P CW during WPX is that the KPA1500 PA temp rose to about 64C so that the deck fans were at Step 2. During a recent RTTY contest, the deck rose above 70C and the fans were running at Step 3 pushing a lot of warm air out of the vent holes above the heat sink.
>>
>>
>> 73 & YMMV,
>>
>>
>> Bob Rennard = N7WY
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> Elecraft mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>> Message delivered to [hidden email]
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to [hidden email]

Elecraft mailing list

Re: KPA-1500 Fan Noise - measured (sort of)

In reply to this post by Stefan von Baltz, DL1IAO

Bob please give us the model number of your acoustic level meter, Thanks.
Mel, K6KBE

From: "Stefan von Baltz, DL1IAO" <[hidden email]>
To: "[hidden email]" <[hidden email]>
Sent: Monday, June 4, 2018 1:44 AM
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] KPA-1500 Fan Noise - measured (sort of)

Hello Bob,

Thanks for the measurements! Was this with the Alpha’s auxiliary fan on or off? You will find this fan and its belonging switch on the amplifiers back on the right side where the power supply transformer sits.

73,

Stefan DL1IAO, SA3CWW/SM9A

--
Stefan v. Baltz
[hidden email]
http://www.dl1iao.com