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KX3: How much space inside?

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Oliver Dröse

KX3: How much space inside?

As it's currently Q & A with Wayne ... ;-))

Wayne, how much space is left inside the radio? Any real chance to fit an
internal 2 m option? THAT would make it a real seller overhere in Europe
where 2 m is extremely popular due to population density (and one of the
reasons the FT-817 is still selling so extremely well overhere). Any place
left for that? Could e.g. go in the same place as the internal tuner, so an
either or option if it can not be fitted in parallel. ;-))

TIA ... 73, Olli - DH8BQA (still dreaming)
Happy owner of the Elecraft K3 #4546 ;-))

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wayne burdick

Re: KX3: How much space inside?

Administrator

Our first priority is the KXAT3 ATU, but we've included the "hooks"
for a possible internal transverter. And that's all I can say about it
at present.

73,
Wayne
N6KR

On May 23, 2011, at 3:34 PM, Oliver Dröse wrote:

> As it's currently Q & A with Wayne ... ;-))
>
> Wayne, how much space is left inside the radio? Any real chance to
> fit an
> internal 2 m option? THAT would make it a real seller overhere in
> Europe
> where 2 m is extremely popular due to population density (and one of
> the
> reasons the FT-817 is still selling so extremely well overhere). Any
> place
> left for that? Could e.g. go in the same place as the internal
> tuner, so an
> either or option if it can not be fitted in parallel. ;-))
>
> TIA ... 73, Olli - DH8BQA (still dreaming)
> Happy owner of the Elecraft K3 #4546 ;-))
>

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Oliver Dröse

Re: KX3: How much space inside?

That's already one step forward! ;-))

Thanks alot for considering it, Wayne,
and good luck with all the work still to do.

73, Olli - DH8BQA

----- Original Message -----
From: "Wayne Burdick" <[hidden email]>
To: "Oliver Dröse" <[hidden email]>
Cc: <[hidden email]>
Sent: Tuesday, May 24, 2011 1:22 AM
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] KX3: How much space inside?

Our first priority is the KXAT3 ATU, but we've included the "hooks"
for a possible internal transverter. And that's all I can say about it
at present.

73,
Wayne
N6KR

On May 23, 2011, at 3:34 PM, Oliver Dröse wrote:

> As it's currently Q & A with Wayne ... ;-))
>
> Wayne, how much space is left inside the radio? Any real chance to fit an
> internal 2 m option? THAT would make it a real seller overhere in Europe
> where 2 m is extremely popular due to population density (and one of the
> reasons the FT-817 is still selling so extremely well overhere). Any
> place
> left for that? Could e.g. go in the same place as the internal tuner, so
> an
> either or option if it can not be fitted in parallel. ;-))
>
> TIA ... 73, Olli - DH8BQA (still dreaming)
> Happy owner of the Elecraft K3 #4546 ;-))
>

-----
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M0XDF

Re: KX3: How much space inside?

Yes, a good step - I really want this to be an FT-817 killer.
I can live without 70cm, but 2m SSB is quite important to me for UKAC contests, FM would just be more icing on the cake.
73 de M0XDF, K3 #174, P3 #108, KX3 #???

Thank everyone who calls out your faults, your anger, your impatience, your egotism; do this consciously, voluntarily.
-Jean Toomer, poet and novelist (1894-1967)

On 24 May 2011, at 20:24, Oliver Dröse wrote:

> That's already one step forward! ;-))
>
> Thanks alot for considering it, Wayne,
> and good luck with all the work still to do.
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Wayne Burdick" <[hidden email]>
> Our first priority is the KXAT3 ATU, but we've included the "hooks"
> for a possible internal transverter. And that's all I can say about it
> at present.

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Tim Tucker

Re: KX3: How much space inside?

If it had both 2m and 440, it WOULD be an 817D killer. The satellite crowd
also really likes the 817D because it gets you a basic QRP radio and a
portable satellite station to work both the FM and SSB birds.

Remember, Icom had a HF only QRP rig - the 703. It was a flop. The KX3
won't suffer the same fate because it's so much more, but it would
absolutely crush the competition (Yaesu FT-817D) if both 2m and 440 were
incorporated.

On Tue, May 24, 2011 at 1:26 PM, David Ferrington, M0XDF <
[hidden email]> wrote:

> Yes, a good step - I really want this to be an FT-817 killer.
> I can live without 70cm, but 2m SSB is quite important to me for UKAC
> contests, FM would just be more icing on the cake.
> 73 de M0XDF, K3 #174, P3 #108, KX3 #???
>
> Thank everyone who calls out your faults, your anger, your impatience, your
> egotism; do this consciously, voluntarily.
> -Jean Toomer, poet and novelist (1894-1967)
>
> On 24 May 2011, at 20:24, Oliver Dröse wrote:
>
> > That's already one step forward! ;-))
> >
> > Thanks alot for considering it, Wayne,
> > and good luck with all the work still to do.
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Wayne Burdick" <[hidden email]>
> > Our first priority is the KXAT3 ATU, but we've included the "hooks"
> > for a possible internal transverter. And that's all I can say about it
> > at present.
>
> ______________________________________________________________
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k5wmg

Re: KX3: How much space inside?

While I am seriously looking at the KX3 to become the main station
here,and I completely agree about the bird guys, they certainly aren't
the majority of us who operate at low power.

I've used both the 817 and the 703, and in 37 years as a qrper, I've
never had any interest in vhf. To say that the 703 was "a flop"
because it was hf only is a pretty bold statement and I think there
are several thousand qrpers who would disagree with you there -
including those posting on a number of lists that are still looking
for a radio that has been discontinued.

mike, k5wmg

On Tue, May 24, 2011 at 4:08 PM, Tim Tucker <[hidden email]> wrote:

> If it had both 2m and 440, it WOULD be an 817D killer. The satellite crowd
> also really likes the 817D because it gets you a basic QRP radio and a
> portable satellite station to work both the FM and SSB birds.
>
> Remember, Icom had a HF only QRP rig - the 703. It was a flop. The KX3
> won't suffer the same fate because it's so much more, but it would
> absolutely crush the competition (Yaesu FT-817D) if both 2m and 440 were
> incorporated.
>
> On Tue, May 24, 2011 at 1:26 PM, David Ferrington, M0XDF <
> [hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> Yes, a good step - I really want this to be an FT-817 killer.
>> I can live without 70cm, but 2m SSB is quite important to me for UKAC
>> contests, FM would just be more icing on the cake.
>> 73 de M0XDF, K3 #174, P3 #108, KX3 #???
>>
>> Thank everyone who calls out your faults, your anger, your impatience, your
>> egotism; do this consciously, voluntarily.
>> -Jean Toomer, poet and novelist (1894-1967)
>>
>> On 24 May 2011, at 20:24, Oliver Dröse wrote:
>>
>> > That's already one step forward! ;-))
>> >
>> > Thanks alot for considering it, Wayne,
>> > and good luck with all the work still to do.
>> > ----- Original Message -----
>> > From: "Wayne Burdick" <[hidden email]>
>> > Our first priority is the KXAT3 ATU, but we've included the "hooks"
>> > for a possible internal transverter. And that's all I can say about it
>> > at present.
>>
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> Elecraft mailing list
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Julian, G4ILO

Re: KX3: How much space inside?

In reply to this post by M0XDF

M0XDF wrote

Yes, a good step - I really want this to be an FT-817 killer.
I can live without 70cm, but 2m SSB is quite important to me for UKAC contests, FM would just be more icing on the cake.

Yes, 2m is one of the most popular bands for SOTA activations which I guess the KX3 would be popular for. It would also take maximum advantage of the all mode capability. Whilst 70cm would be nice, I guess it would be expecting too much for there to be space for two internal transverter modules.

The other thing that would be a huge selling point in Europe if it could be designed in is support for the 4m band. There is no radio that covers 4m apart from a couple of cheap Chinese FM handies. A lot of countries have 4m now and again it is a popular band for SOTA activations. I don't know whether it is feasible to push the upper frequency limit from 50MHz to 70MHz but I am sure there are people who would buy one for that reason alone, if it were possible.

Julian, G4ILO. K2 #392 K3 #222 KX3 #110
* G4ILO's Shack - http://www.g4ilo.com
* KComm - http://www.g4ilo.com/kcomm.html
* KTune - http://www.g4ilo.com/ktune.html

Raymond Sills

Re: KX3: How much space inside?

HI Julian:

And now that US TV broadcasting has almost all but vacated the 54-88
MHz band (Channels 2-6 here), the case can be made that a 70 MHz
band would be good to have on this side of the pond.

73 de Ray
K2ULR
On May 24, 2011, at 5:24 PM, Julian, G4ILO wrote:

>
> M0XDF wrote:
>>
>> Yes, a good step - I really want this to be an FT-817 killer.
>> I can live without 70cm, but 2m SSB is quite important to me for UKAC
>> contests, FM would just be more icing on the cake.
>>
>>
>
> Yes, 2m is one of the most popular bands for SOTA activations which
> I guess
> the KX3 would be popular for. It would also take maximum advantage
> of the
> all mode capability. Whilst 70cm would be nice, I guess it would be
> expecting too much for there to be space for two internal transverter
> modules.
>
> The other thing that would be a huge selling point in Europe if it
> could be
> designed in is support for the 4m band. There is no radio that
> covers 4m
> apart from a couple of cheap Chinese FM handies. A lot of countries
> have 4m
> now and again it is a popular band for SOTA activations. I don't know
> whether it is feasible to push the upper frequency limit from 50MHz
> to 70MHz
> but I am sure there are people who would buy one for that reason
> alone, if
> it were possible.
>
> -----
> Julian, G4ILO. K2 #392 K3 #222.
> * G4ILO's Shack - http://www.g4ilo.com
> * KComm - http://www.g4ilo.com/kcomm.html
> * KTune - http://www.g4ilo.com/ktune.html
>
> --
> View this message in context: http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/
> KX3-How-much-space-inside-tp6396543p6400528.html
> Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
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Jens Petersen-2

Re: KX3: How much space inside?

In reply to this post by Julian, G4ILO

On Tue, 24 May 2011 14:24:00 -0700 (PDT), you wrote:

>The other thing that would be a huge selling point in Europe if it could be
>designed in is support for the 4m band. There is no radio that covers 4m
>apart from a couple of cheap Chinese FM handies.

Oh yes - Hilberling does:
http://www.hilberling.de/bo/bo_pdf/pt-8k-2010_folder_a4a3.pdf

--
OV1A Jens

Sent from my desktop PC with a nice big screen and a real keyboard.
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w7aqk

Re: KX3: How much space inside?

In reply to this post by Oliver Dröse

Tim and All,

The Icom 703 was not a flop--far from it. No, it wasn't as popular as the
FT-817, and in large part due to the reasons you state. However, the 703
was/is a very nice radio. For what it did do, it was superior to the
FT-817. It had a better RX (even better than the 706, which is it's higher
power look-alike), an internal ATU, a bit more power, and was ergonomically
a lot easier to use. I don't know if you ever got to use a 703, but if you
did, then you would see what I mean.

There is still a lot of interest in the 703, although that may wane a bit
with the KX3 now in the works. Icom ceased production of the 703 just a few
months ago, and their timing was impeccable! It's as if they knew the KX3
was coming!

Right now it looks like the KX3 is a "slam dunk" replacement for the 703,
and maybe even the 817 (except for the VHF/UHF capability there, but which
Wayne has alluded might be a later option), provided the price is right. I
have both rigs, so I'm fairly familiar with each one's capabilities, and how
they compare.

But don't sell the 703 short. It's a very competent little radio, and
fairly widely available on the used market. This will still be an
"alternative", particularly for the dollar conscious hams out there--we all
know hams are among the most tight fisted people on the planet! Although
not advertised as such, the 703 was actually an improved version of the 706,
albeit at a lower power output capability.

I'm also hearing very strong rumors that some other manufacturers are also
planning some new QRP type radios. So, the KX3 may actually have some
stiffer competition than what's out there at the moment.

Dave W7AQK

------------------------------------------
Tim Tucker, AE6LX said:

Remember, Icom had a HF only QRP rig - the 703. It was a flop. The KX3
won't suffer the same fate because it's so much more, but it would
absolutely crush the competition (Yaesu FT-817D) if both 2m and 440 were
incorporated

=======
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wayne burdick

Re: KX3: How much space inside?

Administrator

In reply to this post by Jens Petersen-2

We're leaving "hooks" in place for either a 2 m or 4 m transverter (or
possibly both) in the KX3. It would be in the ~5W range, and would
substitute for the optional ATU. If you needed both the transverter
and an ATU, you'd need to use an external ATU such as the Elecraft T1,
which can be band-switched and remotely tuned directly from the KX3.

73,
Wayne
N6KR

On May 25, 2011, at 8:36 AM, Jens Petersen wrote:

> On Tue, 24 May 2011 14:24:00 -0700 (PDT), you wrote:
>
>
>> The other thing that would be a huge selling point in Europe if it
>> could be
>> designed in is support for the 4m band. There is no radio that
>> covers 4m
>> apart from a couple of cheap Chinese FM handies.
>
> Oh yes - Hilberling does:
> http://www.hilberling.de/bo/bo_pdf/pt-8k-2010_folder_a4a3.pdf
>
> --
> OV1A Jens
>
> Sent from my desktop PC with a nice big screen and a real keyboard.
> ______________________________________________________________
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P.B. Christensen

Re: KX3: How much space inside?

In reply to this post by w7aqk

> But don't sell the 703 short.

Dave, my experience with the 703+ was a bit less enjoyable than yours.
Here's why: QSK performance was not only poor, it was down-right
objectionable on the air. The 703+ suffers from extreme "dit-shortening"
and chirp from T/R synthesizer transitions when in QSK mode. In semi mode,
CW is fine. But, the 703+ cannot handle fast T/R transitions.

One cannot hear this effect while listening to the CW sidetone. The keying
artifacts require listening on a separate receiver, ensuring that the
external receiver is not being overloaded, NB turned off, etc. For me,
owning the 703+ was one of the worst QRP experiences I've had. That, added
to the relatively high Rx current consumption and high case temperature
caused me to sell it shortly after purchase.

The ability to produce fast T/R without artifacts is now at the top of my
list when considering any new rig whether it's QRP or QRO. It tops all
other performance parameters. It's *the* reason why I have not gravitated to
most other SDR rigs.

Paul, W9AC

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M0XDF

Re: KX3: How much space inside?

In reply to this post by wayne burdick

Hmmm - shame - since I'd like both - ok so the FT-817 doesn't have the ATU and so the KX3 with a 2m option and external ATU is about the same, but with obviously better HF than the 817.

But I was hoping for a killer rig with an ATU and now the 70cm on the 817 might just swing it away from the KX3.

I assume we could drive an XV144 from the KX3, and I'd guess the XV144 would be a better transverter?
73 de M0XDF, K3 #174, P3 #108, KX3 #???
--
A child, like your stomach, doesn't need all you can afford to give it.
-Frank A. Clark, writer (1911- )

On 25 May 2011, at 17:29, Wayne Burdick wrote:

Phil Salas

Re: KX3: How much space inside?

In reply to this post by w7aqk

"...The Icom 703 was not a flop--far from it. ...'

I totally agree. After I bought an IC-703, I sold my FT-817 and SG-2020.
The IC-703 internal tuner was great, and 10 watts was a good output level.
And, of course, included DSP and speech processing. The only thing was that
it didn't have good QSK operation (like most rigs don't have, including the
FT-817 and SG-2020).

Anyway, I'll be signing up for the KX3 as soon as I can!!

Phil - AD5X

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wayne burdick

Re: KX3: How much space inside?

Administrator

In reply to this post by M0XDF

> I assume we could drive an XV144 from the KX3, and I'd guess the
> XV144 would be a better transverter?

A good bet. The KX3's will be 2x3 inches. We have some invention to
do :)

Wayne

> 73 de M0XDF, K3 #174, P3 #108, KX3 #???
> --
> A child, like your stomach, doesn't need all you can afford to give
> it.
> -Frank A. Clark, writer (1911- )
>
> On 25 May 2011, at 17:29, Wayne Burdick wrote:
>
>> We're leaving "hooks" in place for either a 2 m or 4 m transverter
>> (or
>> possibly both) in the KX3. It would be in the ~5W range, and would
>> substitute for the optional ATU. If you needed both the transverter
>> and an ATU, you'd need to use an external ATU such as the Elecraft
>> T1,
>> which can be band-switched and remotely tuned directly from the KX3.
>>
>> 73,
>> Wayne
>> N6KR
>>
>> On May 25, 2011, at 8:36 AM, Jens Petersen wrote:
>>
>>> On Tue, 24 May 2011 14:24:00 -0700 (PDT), you wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>> The other thing that would be a huge selling point in Europe if it
>>>> could be
>>>> designed in is support for the 4m band. There is no radio that
>>>> covers 4m
>>>> apart from a couple of cheap Chinese FM handies.
>>>
>>> Oh yes - Hilberling does:
>>> http://www.hilberling.de/bo/bo_pdf/pt-8k-2010_folder_a4a3.pdf

wayne burdick

Re: KX3: How much space inside?

Administrator

In reply to this post by P.B. Christensen

The KX3 will have outstanding QSK with very clean, DSP-shaped keying,
and no ALC or synthesizer artifacts.

73,
Wayne
N6KR

On May 25, 2011, at 9:42 AM, Paul Christensen wrote:

>
> The ability to produce fast T/R without artifacts is now at the top
> of my
> list when considering any new rig whether it's QRP or QRO. It tops
> all
> other performance parameters. It's *the* reason why I have not
> gravitated to
> most other SDR rigs.
>
> Paul, W9AC

K6LMP

Re: KX3: How much space inside?

In reply to this post by wayne burdick

Here's another member of the group offering unsolicited product design ideas to Elecraft...which they surely don't need, but I know they welcome.

My "big wish" product for Elecraft would be an adaptation of the K3 with multiple slots for small-ish transverters to make a pure VHF/UHF rig.

I'm thinking of an up-to-date version of the Yaesu FT-936R, which was and still is very popular with the weak signal VHF/UHF crowd. It has four slots for band-specific modules. The rig came standard with modules for 6 meters and 2 meters installed, and two open slots that you could fill with 220, 440, and/or 1296 mHz modules. One could also remove the 6 meter module and use all four slots for vhf/uhf bands. Hams could buy the bare rig and as many or as few of the band modules as they wished (sort of a precursor of the K3 modularity, but more limited than Elecraft's offerings). Even today, with all the whiskers the 736 has grown over the years (and its mediocre sensitivity), the "scarce" 222 mHz and 1296 mHz modules fetch $400 to $800 on eBay.

That, I think, indicates how much demand there is for a rig tailored specifically for the VHF/UHF contesting crowd, EME and satellite work.

The 736 modules put out 25 watts except for 6 meters. Each band had its own antenna jack, facilitating attachment of amplifiers as desired with less band-switching complexity.

I can envision a "K-4" line based on the K3, but with the inside reconfigured to accept transverter boards plugged into a mother board. If they could be engineered to output 16 watts, you could get 500 watts out from a dedicated one-band amp with 15 dB gain. With 25 watts out, you could reach 800 with an amp. The band-specific amps could go into a separate box or boxes, "plug and play" with the K-4. That would create a great weak signal VHF/UHF setup! The K3 is a marvelous IF strip as it stands. This would make a more compact and purpose-specific rig than the K3 plus separate transverters, since you need a K3 plus a transverter plus a separate amp for each band to output 500 watts on any UHF band.

To achieve this, you'd have to take over the space inside the existing K3 that's used by the internal HF amp and ATU, and maybe the space allocated for a second receiver (although a second receiver would be quite valuable for contesting purposes).I don't know how much re-engineering it would take to reduce the current line of transverters to a form factor that would fit inside the "K4". You could also pick up space by making the "motherboard" a single-band 28 mHz IF strip, plus capability for 6 meters and maybe 2 meters, depending on available space.

The circuit board for the current Elecraft transverters has about 65 square inches. One could fit a "daughter board" into the K3 that would have about 25 or 30 square inches, so I think the existing transverter circuit design could be laid out on two "back to back" circuit boards that would comprise a one-band module that would be about 2 inches thick; you could install at least four of such modules in the K3 form factor.

That's my 2 cents worth on the "next big idea" coming out of Watsonville.

73

Lew K6LMP

On May 25, 2011, at 9:29 AM, Wayne Burdick wrote:

> We're leaving "hooks" in place for either a 2 m or 4 m transverter (or
> possibly both) in the KX3. It would be in the ~5W range, and would
> substitute for the optional ATU. If you needed both the transverter
> and an ATU, you'd need to use an external ATU such as the Elecraft T1,
> which can be band-switched and remotely tuned directly from the KX3.
>
> 73,
> Wayne
> N6KR
>
> On May 25, 2011, at 8:36 AM, Jens Petersen wrote:
>
>> On Tue, 24 May 2011 14:24:00 -0700 (PDT), you wrote:
>>
>>
>>> The other thing that would be a huge selling point in Europe if it
>>> could be
>>> designed in is support for the 4m band. There is no radio that
>>> covers 4m
>>> apart from a couple of cheap Chinese FM handies.
>>
>> Oh yes - Hilberling does:
>> http://www.hilberling.de/bo/bo_pdf/pt-8k-2010_folder_a4a3.pdf
>>
>> --
>> OV1A Jens
>>
>> Sent from my desktop PC with a nice big screen and a real keyboard.
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> Elecraft mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>
> ______________________________________________________________
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> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
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> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

Alan Bloom

Re: KX3: How much space inside?

> I'm thinking of an up-to-date version of the Yaesu FT-936R

736, right?

One feature the FT736 has is full duplex cross-band, to support
satellite operation. Is that something the VHF/UHF K3 should have also?

Al N1AL

On Wed, 2011-05-25 at 11:05 -0700, Lew Phelps K6LMP wrote:

> Here's another member of the group offering unsolicited product design
> ideas to Elecraft...which they surely don't need, but I know they
> welcome.
>
> My "big wish" product for Elecraft would be an adaptation of the K3
> with multiple slots for small-ish transverters to make a pure VHF/UHF
> rig.
>
> I'm thinking of an up-to-date version of the Yaesu FT-936R, which was
> and still is very popular with the weak signal VHF/UHF crowd. It has
> four slots for band-specific modules. The rig came standard with
> modules for 6 meters and 2 meters installed, and two open slots that
> you could fill with 220, 440, and/or 1296 mHz modules. One could also
> remove the 6 meter module and use all four slots for vhf/uhf bands.
> Hams could buy the bare rig and as many or as few of the band modules
> as they wished (sort of a precursor of the K3 modularity, but more
> limited than Elecraft's offerings). Even today, with all the whiskers
> the 736 has grown over the years (and its mediocre sensitivity), the
> "scarce" 222 mHz and 1296 mHz modules fetch $400 to $800 on eBay.
>
> That, I think, indicates how much demand there is for a rig tailored
> specifically for the VHF/UHF contesting crowd, EME and satellite
> work.
>
> The 736 modules put out 25 watts except for 6 meters. Each band had
> its own antenna jack, facilitating attachment of amplifiers as desired
> with less band-switching complexity.
>
> I can envision a "K-4" line based on the K3, but with the inside
> reconfigured to accept transverter boards plugged into a mother board.
> If they could be engineered to output 16 watts, you could get 500
> watts out from a dedicated one-band amp with 15 dB gain. With 25 watts
> out, you could reach 800 with an amp. The band-specific amps could go
> into a separate box or boxes, "plug and play" with the K-4. That
> would create a great weak signal VHF/UHF setup! The K3 is a marvelous
> IF strip as it stands. This would make a more compact and
> purpose-specific rig than the K3 plus separate transverters, since you
> need a K3 plus a transverter plus a separate amp for each band to
> output 500 watts on any UHF band.
>
> To achieve this, you'd have to take over the space inside the existing
> K3 that's used by the internal HF amp and ATU, and maybe the space
> allocated for a second receiver (although a second receiver would be
> quite valuable for contesting purposes).I don't know how much
> re-engineering it would take to reduce the current line of
> transverters to a form factor that would fit inside the "K4". You
> could also pick up space by making the "motherboard" a single-band 28
> mHz IF strip, plus capability for 6 meters and maybe 2 meters,
> depending on available space.
>
> The circuit board for the current Elecraft transverters has about 65
> square inches. One could fit a "daughter board" into the K3 that
> would have about 25 or 30 square inches, so I think the existing
> transverter circuit design could be laid out on two "back to back"
> circuit boards that would comprise a one-band module that would be
> about 2 inches thick; you could install at least four of such modules
> in the K3 form factor.
>
> That's my 2 cents worth on the "next big idea" coming out of
> Watsonville.
>
> 73
>
> Lew K6LMP
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On May 25, 2011, at 9:29 AM, Wayne Burdick wrote:
>
> > We're leaving "hooks" in place for either a 2 m or 4 m transverter (or
> > possibly both) in the KX3. It would be in the ~5W range, and would
> > substitute for the optional ATU. If you needed both the transverter
> > and an ATU, you'd need to use an external ATU such as the Elecraft T1,
> > which can be band-switched and remotely tuned directly from the KX3.
> >
> > 73,
> > Wayne
> > N6KR
> >
> > On May 25, 2011, at 8:36 AM, Jens Petersen wrote:
> >
> >> On Tue, 24 May 2011 14:24:00 -0700 (PDT), you wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >>> The other thing that would be a huge selling point in Europe if it
> >>> could be
> >>> designed in is support for the 4m band. There is no radio that
> >>> covers 4m
> >>> apart from a couple of cheap Chinese FM handies.
> >>
> >> Oh yes - Hilberling does:
> >> http://www.hilberling.de/bo/bo_pdf/pt-8k-2010_folder_a4a3.pdf
> >>
> >> --
> >> OV1A Jens
> >>
> >> Sent from my desktop PC with a nice big screen and a real keyboard.
> >> ______________________________________________________________
> >> Elecraft mailing list
> >> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> >> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> >> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
> >>
> >> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> >> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> >
> > ______________________________________________________________
> > Elecraft mailing list
> > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> > Post: mailto:[hidden email]
> >
> > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>

Julian, G4ILO

Re: KX3: How much space inside?

In reply to this post by M0XDF

Ideally I would too. On the other hand, I already have a T1. So I use something I've already got and save myself the cost of the internal ATU to put towards the transverter, which might even cover 4m as well as 2! Every cloud has a silver lining!

M0XDF wrote

Hmmm - shame - since I'd like both - ok so the FT-817 doesn't have the ATU and so the KX3 with a 2m option and external ATU is about the same, but with obviously better HF than the 817.

On 25 May 2011, at 17:29, Wayne Burdick wrote:

> We're leaving "hooks" in place for either a 2 m or 4 m transverter (or
> possibly both) in the KX3. It would be in the ~5W range, and would
> substitute for the optional ATU. If you needed both the transverter
> and an ATU, you'd need to use an external ATU such as the Elecraft T1,
> which can be band-switched and remotely tuned directly from the KX3.
>

Julian, G4ILO. K2 #392 K3 #222 KX3 #110
* G4ILO's Shack - http://www.g4ilo.com
* KComm - http://www.g4ilo.com/kcomm.html
* KTune - http://www.g4ilo.com/ktune.html

K6LMP

Re: KX3: How much space inside?

In reply to this post by Alan Bloom

yes, the FT-736R, not the number I originally typed. Thanks for catching that.

and yes, full duplex cross band would be essential for satellite work.

Lew

On May 25, 2011, at 11:36 AM, Alan Bloom wrote:

>> I'm thinking of an up-to-date version of the Yaesu FT-936R
>
> 736, right?
>
> One feature the FT736 has is full duplex cross-band, to support
> satellite operation. Is that something the VHF/UHF K3 should have also?
>
> Al N1AL
>
>
> On Wed, 2011-05-25 at 11:05 -0700, Lew Phelps K6LMP wrote:
>> Here's another member of the group offering unsolicited product design
>> ideas to Elecraft...which they surely don't need, but I know they
>> welcome.
>>
>> My "big wish" product for Elecraft would be an adaptation of the K3
>> with multiple slots for small-ish transverters to make a pure VHF/UHF
>> rig.
>>
>> I'm thinking of an up-to-date version of the Yaesu FT-936R, which was
>> and still is very popular with the weak signal VHF/UHF crowd. It has
>> four slots for band-specific modules. The rig came standard with
>> modules for 6 meters and 2 meters installed, and two open slots that
>> you could fill with 220, 440, and/or 1296 mHz modules. One could also
>> remove the 6 meter module and use all four slots for vhf/uhf bands.
>> Hams could buy the bare rig and as many or as few of the band modules
>> as they wished (sort of a precursor of the K3 modularity, but more
>> limited than Elecraft's offerings). Even today, with all the whiskers
>> the 736 has grown over the years (and its mediocre sensitivity), the
>> "scarce" 222 mHz and 1296 mHz modules fetch $400 to $800 on eBay.
>>
>> That, I think, indicates how much demand there is for a rig tailored
>> specifically for the VHF/UHF contesting crowd, EME and satellite
>> work.
>>
>> The 736 modules put out 25 watts except for 6 meters. Each band had
>> its own antenna jack, facilitating attachment of amplifiers as desired
>> with less band-switching complexity.
>>
>> I can envision a "K-4" line based on the K3, but with the inside
>> reconfigured to accept transverter boards plugged into a mother board.
>> If they could be engineered to output 16 watts, you could get 500
>> watts out from a dedicated one-band amp with 15 dB gain. With 25 watts
>> out, you could reach 800 with an amp. The band-specific amps could go
>> into a separate box or boxes, "plug and play" with the K-4. That
>> would create a great weak signal VHF/UHF setup! The K3 is a marvelous
>> IF strip as it stands. This would make a more compact and
>> purpose-specific rig than the K3 plus separate transverters, since you
>> need a K3 plus a transverter plus a separate amp for each band to
>> output 500 watts on any UHF band.
>>
>> To achieve this, you'd have to take over the space inside the existing
>> K3 that's used by the internal HF amp and ATU, and maybe the space
>> allocated for a second receiver (although a second receiver would be
>> quite valuable for contesting purposes).I don't know how much
>> re-engineering it would take to reduce the current line of
>> transverters to a form factor that would fit inside the "K4". You
>> could also pick up space by making the "motherboard" a single-band 28
>> mHz IF strip, plus capability for 6 meters and maybe 2 meters,
>> depending on available space.
>>
>> The circuit board for the current Elecraft transverters has about 65
>> square inches. One could fit a "daughter board" into the K3 that
>> would have about 25 or 30 square inches, so I think the existing
>> transverter circuit design could be laid out on two "back to back"
>> circuit boards that would comprise a one-band module that would be
>> about 2 inches thick; you could install at least four of such modules
>> in the K3 form factor.
>>
>> That's my 2 cents worth on the "next big idea" coming out of
>> Watsonville.
>>
>> 73
>>
>> Lew K6LMP
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On May 25, 2011, at 9:29 AM, Wayne Burdick wrote:
>>
>>> We're leaving "hooks" in place for either a 2 m or 4 m transverter (or
>>> possibly both) in the KX3. It would be in the ~5W range, and would
>>> substitute for the optional ATU. If you needed both the transverter
>>> and an ATU, you'd need to use an external ATU such as the Elecraft T1,
>>> which can be band-switched and remotely tuned directly from the KX3.
>>>
>>> 73,
>>> Wayne
>>> N6KR
>>>
>>> On May 25, 2011, at 8:36 AM, Jens Petersen wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Tue, 24 May 2011 14:24:00 -0700 (PDT), you wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> The other thing that would be a huge selling point in Europe if it
>>>>> could be
>>>>> designed in is support for the 4m band. There is no radio that
>>>>> covers 4m
>>>>> apart from a couple of cheap Chinese FM handies.
>>>>
>>>> Oh yes - Hilberling does:
>>>> http://www.hilberling.de/bo/bo_pdf/pt-8k-2010_folder_a4a3.pdf
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> OV1A Jens
>>>>
>>>> Sent from my desktop PC with a nice big screen and a real keyboard.
>>>> ______________________________________________________________
>>>> Elecraft mailing list
>>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>>>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>>>
>>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>>>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>>>
>>> ______________________________________________________________
>>> Elecraft mailing list
>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>>
>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>>
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> Elecraft mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>>
>
>