Elecraft › [K3]

Low headphone audio level

Classic

List

Threaded

37 messages Options

W8JI

Re: Low headphone audio level

>> We sort of got sidetracked from the original posters remarks. It's about
>> low
>> headphone level on the K3. If the level were a bit higher there would be
>> no
>> need to plug the headphones into the speaker jack. Similarly each pair of
>> headphones you grab seems to have a different level. I have 3 different
>> headphones and don't intend to buy a forth. Naturally the one that is the
>> most comfortable is also the one with the lowest level. And I understand
>> that most people don't seem to have this problem. It might be better
>> hearing
>> or better headphones.

A good audio line with lots of volume headroom is everything. I can't
imagine spending so much time on everything else in the station and then not
spending any time on something used and changed all the time like the audio
output lines.

I have never liked nor used the headphone jacks in anything from my
boatanchors up through my FT1000's of all flavors and the K3. I've never
found them suitable or flexible enough for my tastes.

I always run the speaker line out to a switching system, and I terminate
that line in a load safe for the radio. Then I bridge off that line with
either a good big speaker and audio amp, or headphones.

I have virtually no problems at all with any headphone bridging across the
speaker output lines of any radio, and I can bridge multiple headsets at
once.

The toughest thing for me is to get guest ops to stop using the headphone
jacks on receivers and transceivers, and to use the desk mounted jacks.

http://www.w8ji.com/cables_and_wiring.htm

I have to finish that page some day. :-)

73 Tom

______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

Joe Subich, W4TV-4

Re: K3 with Expert 1K-FA, RS232 connections question?

In reply to this post by gd0tep

Andy,

If you are using computer control of the K3, you will probably
have better results if you use the DB15HD connection (BCD Band
Data) to control the Expert 1K-FA than trying to parallel the
RS-232 (CAT) connections. With the "Band Data" connection the
1K-FA operates as if it were connected to a Yaesu transceiver.

I will send you separately an old drawing by the former Expert
distributor showing both (Band Data and CAT) connections.

73,

... Joe, W4TV

On 6/27/2010 8:22 AM, GD0TEP wrote:

> Hello to the group again,
>
> I want to connect my K3 to my 1K-FA amplifier, the amplifier manual
> isn't to clear (to me anyway) on the connections that need to be
> used.
>
> On the amplifier 15pin plug, I use pins 1, 9& 14, yes it's that
> simple.
>
> On the K3 RS232 I connect the amplifier pin 1 to K3 pin 3 (I think, I
> may have these two crossed) On the K3 RS232 I connect the amplifier
> pin 9 to K3 pin 2 (I think, I may have these two crossed)
>
> And
>
> On the K3 RS232 I connect the amplifier pin 9 to K3 pin 5 as ground
>
> Within the K3 RS232 I need to link the RST and CTS together, well RTS
> is pin 7 on the K3, but what pin is the CTS????
>
> Advice would be greatly appreciated.
>
> 73, Andy http://gd0tep.com
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list Home:
> http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help:
> http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post:
> mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this
> email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>

Igor Sokolov-2

Re: K3 with Expert 1K-FA, RS232 connections question?

I use CAT data from my K3 to control 1k-FA. I think CAT control has a
distinct advantage in case of 1K-FA because the internal antenna tuner in
Expert usually has several settings per band. That is especially important
on wide bands like 160 or 80 meters. With CAT control these tuner settings
are correctly chosen in RX mode. That improves receiving as well as avoids
tuner relays switching at the beginning of the transmission.

73, Igor UA9CDC

>
> Andy,
>
> If you are using computer control of the K3, you will probably
> have better results if you use the DB15HD connection (BCD Band
> Data) to control the Expert 1K-FA than trying to parallel the
> RS-232 (CAT) connections. With the "Band Data" connection the
> 1K-FA operates as if it were connected to a Yaesu transceiver.
>
> I will send you separately an old drawing by the former Expert
> distributor showing both (Band Data and CAT) connections.
>
> 73,
>
> ... Joe, W4TV
>
> On 6/27/2010 8:22 AM, GD0TEP wrote:
>> Hello to the group again,
>>
>> I want to connect my K3 to my 1K-FA amplifier, the amplifier manual
>> isn't to clear (to me anyway) on the connections that need to be
>> used.
>>
>> On the amplifier 15pin plug, I use pins 1, 9& 14, yes it's that
>> simple.
>>
>> On the K3 RS232 I connect the amplifier pin 1 to K3 pin 3 (I think, I
>> may have these two crossed) On the K3 RS232 I connect the amplifier
>> pin 9 to K3 pin 2 (I think, I may have these two crossed)
>>
>> And
>>
>> On the K3 RS232 I connect the amplifier pin 9 to K3 pin 5 as ground
>>
>> Within the K3 RS232 I need to link the RST and CTS together, well RTS
>> is pin 7 on the K3, but what pin is the CTS????
>>
>> Advice would be greatly appreciated.
>>
>> 73, Andy http://gd0tep.com
>>
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> Elecraft mailing list Home:
>> http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help:
>> http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post:
>> mailto:[hidden email]
>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this
>> email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

Steve Ellington

Re: Low headphone audio level

In reply to this post by W8JI

As far as I'm concerned, all the audio is weak on the K3. Using the same
speaker, the little IC7000 blows the K3 off the desk. Maybe it's got
something to do with current drain. The Icom does use considerable more
power in receive mode and runs pretty hot. The K3's audio is quiet adequate
but just not very loud.

Steve
N4LQ
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tom W8JI" <[hidden email]>
To: <[hidden email]>; <[hidden email]>
Sent: Sunday, June 27, 2010 9:16 AM
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Low headphone audio level

>>> We sort of got sidetracked from the original posters remarks. It's about
>>> low
>>> headphone level on the K3. If the level were a bit higher there would be
>>> no
>>> need to plug the headphones into the speaker jack. Similarly each pair
>>> of
>>> headphones you grab seems to have a different level. I have 3 different
>>> headphones and don't intend to buy a forth. Naturally the one that is
>>> the
>>> most comfortable is also the one with the lowest level. And I understand
>>> that most people don't seem to have this problem. It might be better
>>> hearing
>>> or better headphones.
>
> A good audio line with lots of volume headroom is everything. I can't
> imagine spending so much time on everything else in the station and then
> not
> spending any time on something used and changed all the time like the
> audio
> output lines.
>
> I have never liked nor used the headphone jacks in anything from my
> boatanchors up through my FT1000's of all flavors and the K3. I've never
> found them suitable or flexible enough for my tastes.
>
> I always run the speaker line out to a switching system, and I terminate
> that line in a load safe for the radio. Then I bridge off that line with
> either a good big speaker and audio amp, or headphones.
>
> I have virtually no problems at all with any headphone bridging across the
> speaker output lines of any radio, and I can bridge multiple headsets at
> once.
>
> The toughest thing for me is to get guest ops to stop using the headphone
> jacks on receivers and transceivers, and to use the desk mounted jacks.
>
> http://www.w8ji.com/cables_and_wiring.htm
>
> I have to finish that page some day. :-)
>
> 73 Tom
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

Grant Youngman

Re: Low headphone audio level

My way around it is reasonably straightforward. I have a GAP (BHI Anem) In-Line module on the speaker output. Besides having an excellent audio DSP capability that I use routinely on SSB, it has a 5W audio amp and plenty of gain to drive an external speaker to room filling volume levels.

Grant/NQ5T

On Jun 27, 2010, at 10:32 AM, Steve Ellington wrote:

> The K3's audio is quiet adequate
> but just not very loud.
>

______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

rfenabled

Re: Low headphone audio level

In reply to this post by Steve Ellington

Steve,

I have never found a radio with an internal speaker that I liked. The FTdx9000D came close. (But what a price tag)

I have always used external speakers as well as put up with degraded hearing.

The K3 driving various speakers (non amplified) provides good audio levels for me to the point whereby I can clearly hear voices at 10 plus metres from the radio.

This was not always the case. I sent mine to Aptos for upgrades to the current spec earlier this year and the audio has been improved dramatically since it's return.

I wonder if you have the problem I had?

Mine (#679) is now superb to my ears. I run the AF at 10 o'clock or less with or without the CM-500 headphones.

73's
Gary
VK4FD
Sent via BlackBerry® from Telstra

-----Original Message-----
From: "Steve Ellington" <[hidden email]>
Sender: [hidden email]
Date: Sun, 27 Jun 2010 11:32:56
To: Tom W8JI<[hidden email]>; <[hidden email]>; <[hidden email]>
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Low headphone audio level

As far as I'm concerned, all the audio is weak on the K3. Using the same
speaker, the little IC7000 blows the K3 off the desk. Maybe it's got
something to do with current drain. The Icom does use considerable more
power in receive mode and runs pretty hot. The K3's audio is quiet adequate
but just not very loud.

Steve
N4LQ
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tom W8JI" <[hidden email]>
To: <[hidden email]>; <[hidden email]>
Sent: Sunday, June 27, 2010 9:16 AM
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Low headphone audio level

______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

Steve Ellington

Re: Low headphone audio level

Ok guys...now calm down!
I shouldn't have said anything.
The K3's audio is just fine and there's plenty of it.
I was just comparing it to the IC-7000.
I never use internal speakers.
Yes I know about the hi/low setting in the menu and yes I'm using an
efficient speaker and no I'm not deaf. I'm just saying that some other rigs
have more AF power and perhaps there is a reason.
Looking at the K3's specifications, I don't see what the AF power rating is
so it's hard to compare.
So YES....The K3 has plenty of audio....at 8:00 o'clock or whatever....Of
course at 11:00 o'clock I do turn it down!

Steve
N4LQ
----- Original Message -----
From: <[hidden email]>
To: "Steve Ellington" <[hidden email]>;
<[hidden email]>; "Tom W8JI" <[hidden email]>;
<[hidden email]>; "Elecraft" <[hidden email]>
Sent: Sunday, June 27, 2010 12:19 PM
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Low headphone audio level

> Steve,
>
> I have never found a radio with an internal speaker that I liked. The
> FTdx9000D came close. (But what a price tag)
>
> I have always used external speakers as well as put up with degraded
> hearing.
>
> The K3 driving various speakers (non amplified) provides good audio levels
> for me to the point whereby I can clearly hear voices at 10 plus metres
> from the radio.
>
> This was not always the case. I sent mine to Aptos for upgrades to the
> current spec earlier this year and the audio has been improved
> dramatically since it's return.
>
> I wonder if you have the problem I had?
>
> Mine (#679) is now superb to my ears. I run the AF at 10 o'clock or less
> with or without the CM-500 headphones.
>
> 73's
> Gary
> VK4FD
> Sent via BlackBerry® from Telstra
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: "Steve Ellington" <[hidden email]>
> Sender: [hidden email]
> Date: Sun, 27 Jun 2010 11:32:56
> To: Tom W8JI<[hidden email]>; <[hidden email]>; <[hidden email]>
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Low headphone audio level
>
> As far as I'm concerned, all the audio is weak on the K3. Using the same
> speaker, the little IC7000 blows the K3 off the desk. Maybe it's got
> something to do with current drain. The Icom does use considerable more
> power in receive mode and runs pretty hot. The K3's audio is quiet
> adequate
> but just not very loud.
>
> Steve
> N4LQ
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Tom W8JI" <[hidden email]>
> To: <[hidden email]>; <[hidden email]>
> Sent: Sunday, June 27, 2010 9:16 AM
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Low headphone audio level
>
>
>>>> We sort of got sidetracked from the original posters remarks. It's
>>>> about
>>>> low
>>>> headphone level on the K3. If the level were a bit higher there would
>>>> be
>>>> no
>>>> need to plug the headphones into the speaker jack. Similarly each pair
>>>> of
>>>> headphones you grab seems to have a different level. I have 3 different
>>>> headphones and don't intend to buy a forth. Naturally the one that is
>>>> the
>>>> most comfortable is also the one with the lowest level. And I
>>>> understand
>>>> that most people don't seem to have this problem. It might be better
>>>> hearing
>>>> or better headphones.
>>
>> A good audio line with lots of volume headroom is everything. I can't
>> imagine spending so much time on everything else in the station and then
>> not
>> spending any time on something used and changed all the time like the
>> audio
>> output lines.
>>
>> I have never liked nor used the headphone jacks in anything from my
>> boatanchors up through my FT1000's of all flavors and the K3. I've never
>> found them suitable or flexible enough for my tastes.
>>
>> I always run the speaker line out to a switching system, and I terminate
>> that line in a load safe for the radio. Then I bridge off that line with
>> either a good big speaker and audio amp, or headphones.
>>
>> I have virtually no problems at all with any headphone bridging across
>> the
>> speaker output lines of any radio, and I can bridge multiple headsets at
>> once.
>>
>> The toughest thing for me is to get guest ops to stop using the headphone
>> jacks on receivers and transceivers, and to use the desk mounted jacks.
>>
>> http://www.w8ji.com/cables_and_wiring.htm
>>
>> I have to finish that page some day. :-)
>>
>> 73 Tom
>>
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> Elecraft mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>

Gary Gregory

Re: Low headphone audio level

Hmmmm

Guess I missed the point completely.

Apologies to all

Gary

On Mon, Jun 28, 2010 at 2:52 AM, Steve Ellington <[hidden email]>wrote:

> Ok guys...now calm down!
> I shouldn't have said anything.
> The K3's audio is just fine and there's plenty of it.
> I was just comparing it to the IC-7000.
> I never use internal speakers.
> Yes I know about the hi/low setting in the menu and yes I'm using an
> efficient speaker and no I'm not deaf. I'm just saying that some other rigs
> have more AF power and perhaps there is a reason.
> Looking at the K3's specifications, I don't see what the AF power rating is
> so it's hard to compare.
> So YES....The K3 has plenty of audio....at 8:00 o'clock or whatever....Of
> course at 11:00 o'clock I do turn it down!
>
> Steve
> N4LQ
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <[hidden email]>
> To: "Steve Ellington" <[hidden email]>;
> <[hidden email]>; "Tom W8JI" <[hidden email]>;
> <[hidden email]>; "Elecraft" <[hidden email]>
> Sent: Sunday, June 27, 2010 12:19 PM
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Low headphone audio level
>
>
> > Steve,
> >
> > I have never found a radio with an internal speaker that I liked. The
> > FTdx9000D came close. (But what a price tag)
> >
> > I have always used external speakers as well as put up with degraded
> > hearing.
> >
> > The K3 driving various speakers (non amplified) provides good audio
> levels
> > for me to the point whereby I can clearly hear voices at 10 plus metres
> > from the radio.
> >
> > This was not always the case. I sent mine to Aptos for upgrades to the
> > current spec earlier this year and the audio has been improved
> > dramatically since it's return.
> >
> > I wonder if you have the problem I had?
> >
> > Mine (#679) is now superb to my ears. I run the AF at 10 o'clock or less
> > with or without the CM-500 headphones.
> >
> > 73's
> > Gary
> > VK4FD
> > Sent via BlackBerry® from Telstra
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: "Steve Ellington" <[hidden email]>
> > Sender: [hidden email]
> > Date: Sun, 27 Jun 2010 11:32:56
> > To: Tom W8JI<[hidden email]>; <[hidden email]>; <[hidden email]>
> > Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Low headphone audio level
> >
> > As far as I'm concerned, all the audio is weak on the K3. Using the same
> > speaker, the little IC7000 blows the K3 off the desk. Maybe it's got
> > something to do with current drain. The Icom does use considerable more
> > power in receive mode and runs pretty hot. The K3's audio is quiet
> > adequate
> > but just not very loud.
> >
> > Steve
> > N4LQ
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Tom W8JI" <[hidden email]>
> > To: <[hidden email]>; <[hidden email]>
> > Sent: Sunday, June 27, 2010 9:16 AM
> > Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Low headphone audio level
> >
> >
> >>>> We sort of got sidetracked from the original posters remarks. It's
> >>>> about
> >>>> low
> >>>> headphone level on the K3. If the level were a bit higher there would
> >>>> be
> >>>> no
> >>>> need to plug the headphones into the speaker jack. Similarly each pair
> >>>> of
> >>>> headphones you grab seems to have a different level. I have 3
> different
> >>>> headphones and don't intend to buy a forth. Naturally the one that is
> >>>> the
> >>>> most comfortable is also the one with the lowest level. And I
> >>>> understand
> >>>> that most people don't seem to have this problem. It might be better
> >>>> hearing
> >>>> or better headphones.
> >>
> >> A good audio line with lots of volume headroom is everything. I can't
> >> imagine spending so much time on everything else in the station and then
> >> not
> >> spending any time on something used and changed all the time like the
> >> audio
> >> output lines.
> >>
> >> I have never liked nor used the headphone jacks in anything from my
> >> boatanchors up through my FT1000's of all flavors and the K3. I've never
> >> found them suitable or flexible enough for my tastes.
> >>
> >> I always run the speaker line out to a switching system, and I terminate
> >> that line in a load safe for the radio. Then I bridge off that line with
> >> either a good big speaker and audio amp, or headphones.
> >>
> >> I have virtually no problems at all with any headphone bridging across
> >> the
> >> speaker output lines of any radio, and I can bridge multiple headsets at
> >> once.
> >>
> >> The toughest thing for me is to get guest ops to stop using the
> headphone
> >> jacks on receivers and transceivers, and to use the desk mounted jacks.
> >>
> >> http://www.w8ji.com/cables_and_wiring.htm
> >>
> >> I have to finish that page some day. :-)
> >>
> >> 73 Tom
> >>
> >> ______________________________________________________________
> >> Elecraft mailing list
> >> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> >> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> >> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
> >>
> >> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> >> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> >
> > ______________________________________________________________
> > Elecraft mailing list
> > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> > Post: mailto:[hidden email]
> >
> > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> >
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>

--
Gary
VK4FD - Motorhome Mobile
http://www.qsl.net/vk4fd/
K3 #679
For everything else there's Mastercard!!!
______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

P.B. Christensen

Re: Low headphone audio level

In reply to this post by Steve Ellington

> "I always run the speaker line out to a switching system, and I terminate
that line in a load safe for the radio. Then I bridge off that line with
either a good big speaker and audio amp, or headphones."

A while back, I found a used broadcast-quality 8 x 8 audio matrix switcher,
with built-in high-quality speaker amp and digital telco hybrid. Its a
Gentner/ClearOne XAP-400 and typical cost is USD $60 through the big auction
site. The older model is the Gentner AP400 but is essentially the same unit
and can be purchased for even less. New, these units sold for nearly USD
$4K just a couple years ago.

Switching across the matrix is accomplished with free PC software available
from the ClearOne web site. A block diagram appears on the PC screen and
one clicks on each functional block to make switching changes. It's a very
intuitive and graphical switching diagram. Routing, compression, EQ, and
multipe switching patterns between balanced and unbalanced audio is
accomplished with a couple mouse clicks.

These units also contain high-quality mic preamps (software switchable for
either mic or line) with selectable phantom power for condenser mics. Each
input contains a true, 3-stage instrumentation op-amp. This makes
connection to either balanced or unbalanced sources very easy with
predictable results and minimum common-mode issues.

For roughly USD $60 each, these units are an incredible deal for folks who
have been considering an audio matrix witching switching system. The
speaker power amp and a digital telco hybrid are a bonus. HF phone patches
aren't too common these days, but the Gentner digital hybrids are fully
automatic and dynamically adapt to each phone line for maximum trans-hybrid
loss. I've configured my Gentner unit with a desktop DTMF control pad sold
by JK Audio. A picture of the Gentner and JK Audio devices can be seen on
my QRZ.com page.

Multiple Gentner units can be linked together and I imagine for a large
contest station, nearly any audio combination one could think of can be
switched. My plan is to integrate a pair of XAP-400 units (16 x 16) with
W8ZR's new StationPo II device. If you've not yet seen Jim's amazing
station router, have a look at the link below. A complete write-up will
also be available in the upcoming August issue of QST.

http://www.w8zr.net/stationpro/index.htm

Paul, W9AC

______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

Jim Brown-10

Re: Low headphone audio level

In reply to this post by Steve Ellington

On Sun, 27 Jun 2010 12:52:47 -0400, Steve Ellington wrote:

>The K3's audio is just fine and there's plenty of it.

I agree. There are at least seven problems. First, Elecraft has a
design philosophy of minimizing current drain so that a rig works well
from batteries. That is a good thing, but it places limits on how loud
the audio outputs can get. Second, hams, and those who design ham
products, generally don't understand the concept of impedance, nor do
they understand audio. Third, hams as a general population are a bunch
of old farts (like me), and we have hearing loss for a variety of
reasons. As an audio professional, I must be aware of that. I had my
hearing tested several years ago, and I had at least 15dB of loss then.
Fourth, some hams seem to confuse their ham rig with their high
futility sound system. Fifth, hams seem to confuse the setting of the
front panel controls with how much audio the rig can put out. Sixth,
there are several places within both the K2 and the K3 where audio
gains can be adjusted for various conditions like filtering and
bandwidth. Seventh, because the K3 has much less IMD than other rigs,
it is much quieter under crowded band conditions than other rigs, so it
gives the illusion of not being loud.

Even with my hearing loss, I've never felt that ANY ham rig I owned was
weak on RX audio, and the Elecraft radios I've owned (K2, K3) are no
exception. They are quite sufficient for communications purposes for
anyone without serious hearing loss (that is, enough to need a hearing
aid). My K2s and K3s happily drive Sony MDR7506s, the Yamaha CM500,
Etymotic Research ER4s, Shure in-ear headphones whose model numbers
I've lost, and a variety of miscellaneous elcheapo headphones I've got
laying around. Now, a stock K2 IS weak on TX audio, and there are
several well documented mods to improve that considerably.

As to those gain adjustments -- there are the RXEQ settings that Fred
mentioned, and there is gain adjustment to compensate for the loss in
each of the roofing filters. One must be careful with pushing either of
these too far -- depending on the internal design of the K3 RX audio
path, that could result in clipping within the signal chain. My guess
is that you could safely add a total of 10dB if you wanted. If I were
Elecraft, and if I hadn't already done so, I would be looking at RX
audio gains and trying to figure out if there might be another 6-10 dB
available. That won't increase the maximum audio level without
clipping, but it will mean that you won't have to turn the front panel
gain up so high, and I suspect that dumb reason (which doesn't matter)
is who most folks are complaining. :)

73, Jim Brown K9YC

______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

John_N1JM

Re: Low headphone audio level

I see there is a new review on eham where he had low headphone audio.

John N1JM

Bill Steffey NY9H

Re: Low headphone audio level

In reply to this post by Jim Brown-10

>Jim said:
> Fifth, hams seem to confuse the setting of the
>front panel controls with how much audio the rig can put out.

Do you mean to tell me that I might be getting full audio output at 9
o clock ?????
wow ..... ; )
I suppose that goes for my gutbuster car stereo as well......

(ps to jim : I worked k9or during field day did you ??? )

bill/3

______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

Glen, W6GJB

Re: K3 with Expert 1K-FA, RS232 connections question?

In reply to this post by Igor Sokolov-2

I use an Expert with my K3 and made up a cable with both serial and band
data connections. I ended up using only the band data, with the Expert set
to expect a Yaesu connection. When you switch bands, the amp selects the
appropriate antenna(s). The first time you key the amp sees the freq and
sets the tuner without any delay at all.

Otherwise the amp takes up the only serial port available from the K3 and it
is limited to 9600 baud.

I am totally happy with this setup.

73,
Glen W6GJB

On Sun, Jun 27, 2010 at 6:46 AM, Igor Sokolov <[hidden email]> wrote:

> I use CAT data from my K3 to control 1k-FA. I think CAT control has a
> distinct advantage in case of 1K-FA because the internal antenna tuner in
> Expert usually has several settings per band. That is especially important
> on wide bands like 160 or 80 meters. With CAT control these tuner settings
> are correctly chosen in RX mode. That improves receiving as well as avoids
> tuner relays switching at the beginning of the transmission.
>
> 73, Igor UA9CDC
>
>
>
> >
> > Andy,
> >
> > If you are using computer control of the K3, you will probably
> > have better results if you use the DB15HD connection (BCD Band
> > Data) to control the Expert 1K-FA than trying to parallel the
> > RS-232 (CAT) connections. With the "Band Data" connection the
> > 1K-FA operates as if it were connected to a Yaesu transceiver.
> >
> > I will send you separately an old drawing by the former Expert
> > distributor showing both (Band Data and CAT) connections.
> >
> > 73,
> >
> > ... Joe, W4TV
> >
> > On 6/27/2010 8:22 AM, GD0TEP wrote:
> >> Hello to the group again,
> >>
> >> I want to connect my K3 to my 1K-FA amplifier, the amplifier manual
> >> isn't to clear (to me anyway) on the connections that need to be
> >> used.
> >>
> >> On the amplifier 15pin plug, I use pins 1, 9& 14, yes it's that
> >> simple.
> >>
> >> On the K3 RS232 I connect the amplifier pin 1 to K3 pin 3 (I think, I
> >> may have these two crossed) On the K3 RS232 I connect the amplifier
> >> pin 9 to K3 pin 2 (I think, I may have these two crossed)
> >>
> >> And
> >>
> >> On the K3 RS232 I connect the amplifier pin 9 to K3 pin 5 as ground
> >>
> >> Within the K3 RS232 I need to link the RST and CTS together, well RTS
> >> is pin 7 on the K3, but what pin is the CTS????
> >>
> >> Advice would be greatly appreciated.
> >>
> >> 73, Andy http://gd0tep.com
> >>
> >> ______________________________________________________________
> >> Elecraft mailing list Home:
> >> http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help:
> >> http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post:
> >> mailto:[hidden email]
> >>
> >> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this
> >> email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> >>
> > ______________________________________________________________
> > Elecraft mailing list
> > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> > Post: mailto:[hidden email]
> >
> > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>

Igor Sokolov-2

Re: K3 with Expert 1K-FA, RS232 connections question?

Glen, since your tuner is only set correctly when you TX, that means that you loose in RX at times. When you jump on a new frequensy (band map spot) your tuner is set incorrectly. Another point is that when you start transmit on the frequency where tuner is set incorrectly, the relays in the tuner are somewhat hot switching which does not make them better at all.
Expert does not need to occupy the only RS232 port on K3. Expert only eavesdrop what is going on between the K3 and logging program.
Besides you can always use devices like Microham Microkeyer if you want to isolate Expert from K3 RS232. Microkeyer can translate K3 -logging program "conversation" into CI-V and one can use that CI-V to control Expert.
Just MHO....

73, Igor UA9CDC

----- Original Message -----
From: GLEN BROWN
To: Igor Sokolov
Cc: Elecraft Reflector
Sent: Tuesday, June 29, 2010 2:42 AM
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3 with Expert 1K-FA, RS232 connections question?

I use an Expert with my K3 and made up a cable with both serial and band data connections. I ended up using only the band data, with the Expert set to expect a Yaesu connection. When you switch bands, the amp selects the appropriate antenna(s). The first time you key the amp sees the freq and sets the tuner without any delay at all.

Otherwise the amp takes up the only serial port available from the K3 and it is limited to 9600 baud.

I am totally happy with this setup.

73,
Glen W6GJB

On Sun, Jun 27, 2010 at 6:46 AM, Igor Sokolov <[hidden email]> wrote:

I use CAT data from my K3 to control 1k-FA. I think CAT control has a
distinct advantage in case of 1K-FA because the internal antenna tuner in
Expert usually has several settings per band. That is especially important
on wide bands like 160 or 80 meters. With CAT control these tuner settings
are correctly chosen in RX mode. That improves receiving as well as avoids
tuner relays switching at the beginning of the transmission.

73, Igor UA9CDC

>
> Andy,
>
> If you are using computer control of the K3, you will probably
> have better results if you use the DB15HD connection (BCD Band
> Data) to control the Expert 1K-FA than trying to parallel the
> RS-232 (CAT) connections. With the "Band Data" connection the
> 1K-FA operates as if it were connected to a Yaesu transceiver.
>
> I will send you separately an old drawing by the former Expert
> distributor showing both (Band Data and CAT) connections.
>
> 73,
>
> ... Joe, W4TV
>
> On 6/27/2010 8:22 AM, GD0TEP wrote:
>> Hello to the group again,
>>
>> I want to connect my K3 to my 1K-FA amplifier, the amplifier manual
>> isn't to clear (to me anyway) on the connections that need to be
>> used.
>>
>> On the amplifier 15pin plug, I use pins 1, 9& 14, yes it's that
>> simple.
>>
>> On the K3 RS232 I connect the amplifier pin 1 to K3 pin 3 (I think, I
>> may have these two crossed) On the K3 RS232 I connect the amplifier
>> pin 9 to K3 pin 2 (I think, I may have these two crossed)
>>
>> And
>>
>> On the K3 RS232 I connect the amplifier pin 9 to K3 pin 5 as ground
>>
>> Within the K3 RS232 I need to link the RST and CTS together, well RTS
>> is pin 7 on the K3, but what pin is the CTS????
>>
>> Advice would be greatly appreciated.
>>
>> 73, Andy http://gd0tep.com
>>
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> Elecraft mailing list Home:
>> http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help:
>> http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post:
>> mailto:[hidden email]
>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this
>> email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

Joe Subich, W4TV-4

Re: K3 with Expert 1K-FA, RS232 connections question?

> Expert does not need to occupy the only RS232 port on K3. Expert
> only eavesdrop what is going on between the K3 and logging program.

Unfortunately, Expert will only eavesdrop at up to 9600 bps. For
those who use higher speeds, particularly 38.400 to avoid issues
with autobaud routines, Expert is a problem.

> Besides you can always use devices like Microham Microkeyer if you
> want to isolate Expert from K3 RS232. Microkeyer can translate
> K3 -logging program "conversation" into CI-V and one can use that
> CI-V to control Expert.

CI-V output is only available from microKEYER II, MK2R/MK2R+ or
Station Master (and now DigiKeyer II). All of those devices have
their uses but they are probably not justified just as a translator
for band switching an amplifier.

73,

... Joe Subich, W4TV
microHAM America, LLC.
http://www.microHAM-USA.com
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/microHAM

On 6/29/2010 12:49 AM, Igor Sokolov wrote:

> Glen, since your tuner is only set correctly when you TX, that means
> that you loose in RX at times. When you jump on a new frequensy (band
> map spot) your tuner is set incorrectly. Another point is that when
> you start transmit on the frequency where tuner is set incorrectly,
> the relays in the tuner are somewhat hot switching which does not
> make them better at all. Expert does not need to occupy the only
> RS232 port on K3. Expert only eavesdrop what is going on between the
> K3 and logging program. Besides you can always use devices like
> Microham Microkeyer if you want to isolate Expert from K3 RS232.
> Microkeyer can translate K3 -logging program "conversation" into CI-V
> and one can use that CI-V to control Expert. Just MHO....
>
> 73, Igor UA9CDC
>
> ----- Original Message ----- From: GLEN BROWN To: Igor Sokolov Cc:
> Elecraft Reflector Sent: Tuesday, June 29, 2010 2:42 AM Subject: Re:
> [Elecraft] K3 with Expert 1K-FA, RS232 connections question?
>
>
> I use an Expert with my K3 and made up a cable with both serial and
> band data connections. I ended up using only the band data, with the
> Expert set to expect a Yaesu connection. When you switch bands, the
> amp selects the appropriate antenna(s). The first time you key the
> amp sees the freq and sets the tuner without any delay at all.
>
>
> Otherwise the amp takes up the only serial port available from the K3
> and it is limited to 9600 baud.
>
>
> I am totally happy with this setup.
>
>
> 73, Glen W6GJB
>
>
>
>
>
> On Sun, Jun 27, 2010 at 6:46 AM, Igor Sokolov<[hidden email]>
> wrote:
>
> I use CAT data from my K3 to control 1k-FA. I think CAT control has
> a distinct advantage in case of 1K-FA because the internal antenna
> tuner in Expert usually has several settings per band. That is
> especially important on wide bands like 160 or 80 meters. With CAT
> control these tuner settings are correctly chosen in RX mode. That
> improves receiving as well as avoids tuner relays switching at the
> beginning of the transmission.
>
> 73, Igor UA9CDC
>
>
>
>
>>
>> Andy,
>>
>> If you are using computer control of the K3, you will probably have
>> better results if you use the DB15HD connection (BCD Band Data) to
>> control the Expert 1K-FA than trying to parallel the RS-232 (CAT)
>> connections. With the "Band Data" connection the 1K-FA operates as
>> if it were connected to a Yaesu transceiver.
>>
>> I will send you separately an old drawing by the former Expert
>> distributor showing both (Band Data and CAT) connections.
>>
>> 73,
>>
>> ... Joe, W4TV
>>
>> On 6/27/2010 8:22 AM, GD0TEP wrote:
>>> Hello to the group again,
>>>
>>> I want to connect my K3 to my 1K-FA amplifier, the amplifier
>>> manual isn't to clear (to me anyway) on the connections that need
>>> to be used.
>>>
>>> On the amplifier 15pin plug, I use pins 1, 9& 14, yes it's
>>> that simple.
>>>
>>> On the K3 RS232 I connect the amplifier pin 1 to K3 pin 3 (I
>>> think, I may have these two crossed) On the K3 RS232 I connect
>>> the amplifier pin 9 to K3 pin 2 (I think, I may have these two
>>> crossed)
>>>
>>> And
>>>
>>> On the K3 RS232 I connect the amplifier pin 9 to K3 pin 5 as
>>> ground
>>>
>>> Within the K3 RS232 I need to link the RST and CTS together, well
>>> RTS is pin 7 on the K3, but what pin is the CTS????
>>>
>>> Advice would be greatly appreciated.
>>>
>>> 73, Andy http://gd0tep.com
>>>

--

______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

Igor Sokolov-2

Re: K3 with Expert 1K-FA, RS232 connections question?

> > Expert does not need to occupy the only RS232 port on K3. Expert
> > only eavesdrop what is going on between the K3 and logging program.
>
> Unfortunately, Expert will only eavesdrop at up to 9600 bps. For
> those who use higher speeds, particularly 38.400 to avoid issues
> with autobaud routines, Expert is a problem.

Joe, can you enlighten me on why one would need more then 9600 bps for radio
control? I use to use 1200 (which is a default baud rate) on Icom and I use
4800 on my K3. I never felt the need to speed up baud rate even in the
fastest contests. It usually takes me 20 seconds to move the station to
another band and work him there. And I am usually the first to get back and
forth ;)

>
> > Besides you can always use devices like Microham Microkeyer if you
> > want to isolate Expert from K3 RS232. Microkeyer can translate
> > K3 -logging program "conversation" into CI-V and one can use that
> > CI-V to control Expert.
>
> CI-V output is only available from microKEYER II, MK2R/MK2R+ or
> Station Master (and now DigiKeyer II). All of those devices have
> their uses but they are probably not justified just as a translator
> for band switching an amplifier.

I use my microkeyerII as winkey, sound card and sequencer. CI-V is redundant
in my installation. Anyway it is very nice feature and could be additional
reason for someone to purchase MKII

73, Igor UA9CDC

> 73,
>
> ... Joe Subich, W4TV
> microHAM America, LLC.
> http://www.microHAM-USA.com
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/microHAM
>
>
> On 6/29/2010 12:49 AM, Igor Sokolov wrote:
>> Glen, since your tuner is only set correctly when you TX, that means
>> that you loose in RX at times. When you jump on a new frequensy (band
>> map spot) your tuner is set incorrectly. Another point is that when
>> you start transmit on the frequency where tuner is set incorrectly,
>> the relays in the tuner are somewhat hot switching which does not
>> make them better at all. Expert does not need to occupy the only
>> RS232 port on K3. Expert only eavesdrop what is going on between the
>> K3 and logging program. Besides you can always use devices like
>> Microham Microkeyer if you want to isolate Expert from K3 RS232.
>> Microkeyer can translate K3 -logging program "conversation" into CI-V
>> and one can use that CI-V to control Expert. Just MHO....
>>
>> 73, Igor UA9CDC
>>
>> ----- Original Message ----- From: GLEN BROWN To: Igor Sokolov Cc:
>> Elecraft Reflector Sent: Tuesday, June 29, 2010 2:42 AM Subject: Re:
>> [Elecraft] K3 with Expert 1K-FA, RS232 connections question?
>>
>>
>> I use an Expert with my K3 and made up a cable with both serial and
>> band data connections. I ended up using only the band data, with the
>> Expert set to expect a Yaesu connection. When you switch bands, the
>> amp selects the appropriate antenna(s). The first time you key the
>> amp sees the freq and sets the tuner without any delay at all.
>>
>>
>> Otherwise the amp takes up the only serial port available from the K3
>> and it is limited to 9600 baud.
>>
>>
>> I am totally happy with this setup.
>>
>>
>> 73, Glen W6GJB
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Sun, Jun 27, 2010 at 6:46 AM, Igor Sokolov<[hidden email]>
>> wrote:
>>
>> I use CAT data from my K3 to control 1k-FA. I think CAT control has
>> a distinct advantage in case of 1K-FA because the internal antenna
>> tuner in Expert usually has several settings per band. That is
>> especially important on wide bands like 160 or 80 meters. With CAT
>> control these tuner settings are correctly chosen in RX mode. That
>> improves receiving as well as avoids tuner relays switching at the
>> beginning of the transmission.
>>
>> 73, Igor UA9CDC
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>>
>>> Andy,
>>>
>>> If you are using computer control of the K3, you will probably have
>>> better results if you use the DB15HD connection (BCD Band Data) to
>>> control the Expert 1K-FA than trying to parallel the RS-232 (CAT)
>>> connections. With the "Band Data" connection the 1K-FA operates as
>>> if it were connected to a Yaesu transceiver.
>>>
>>> I will send you separately an old drawing by the former Expert
>>> distributor showing both (Band Data and CAT) connections.
>>>
>>> 73,
>>>
>>> ... Joe, W4TV
>>>
>>> On 6/27/2010 8:22 AM, GD0TEP wrote:
>>>> Hello to the group again,
>>>>
>>>> I want to connect my K3 to my 1K-FA amplifier, the amplifier
>>>> manual isn't to clear (to me anyway) on the connections that need
>>>> to be used.
>>>>
>>>> On the amplifier 15pin plug, I use pins 1, 9& 14, yes it's
>>>> that simple.
>>>>
>>>> On the K3 RS232 I connect the amplifier pin 1 to K3 pin 3 (I
>>>> think, I may have these two crossed) On the K3 RS232 I connect
>>>> the amplifier pin 9 to K3 pin 2 (I think, I may have these two
>>>> crossed)
>>>>
>>>> And
>>>>
>>>> On the K3 RS232 I connect the amplifier pin 9 to K3 pin 5 as
>>>> ground
>>>>
>>>> Within the K3 RS232 I need to link the RST and CTS together, well
>>>> RTS is pin 7 on the K3, but what pin is the CTS????
>>>>
>>>> Advice would be greatly appreciated.
>>>>
>>>> 73, Andy http://gd0tep.com
>>>>
>
> --
>
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

gd0tep

Re: K3 with Expert 1K-FA, RS232 connections question?

As I instigated this thread...

I received the relative information from W4TV. And, although it wasn't what
I was originally looking for, it works just fine.

I now have the USB2 interface linked to the K3 and the 1K-FA.

Thanks again to those who replied to my original email.

73,
Andy
http://gd0tep.com

______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html