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New KPA100 Rev.

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Ron ZL1TW

New KPA100 Rev.

Hi
I have just finished making a K2/100 for a friend here, and I notice
that the KPA100 is now up to REV D-1 ( Sept 28 2006) and has a quite few
changes in it.
Amongst them is the addition of two new toroidal RF chokes that are filled
with #26 wire and because they are so full, the mounting holes on the (Rev
B) board are a bit far apart to be able to pull them down tight. I was a
bit alarmed at having a choke this size dangling upside down on flimsy
wires ( when in the K2) that I have broken the Elecraft Golden Rule and
used a small amount of non-acidic RTV under each choke to hold it in place.
( I guess the Warranty just expired after admitting that!)
I wonder if any other recent constructors have had the same concern for the
mechanical stability of these components?
Among the changes I see the pesky RFC10 on the antenna socket has disappeared!
Cheers.....Ron ZL1TW

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Marshall Jose

Re: New KPA100 Rev.

I'll come out of the closet and admit that I, too, used the expensive
non-corrosive RTV to hold down the cores in my new K2. I did it because

- I'm willing to accept the (warranty-breaking) consequences of doing so,
- It's standard practice with spacecraft assemblies, which are held to a
higher standard than ham radio kits, and
- I had access to some :)

PLEASE note that I have no intention of starting a religious war about
construction practices. Elecraft's warranty policy is concrete and
perfectly understandable, and I have no quarrel with it. My comment here
is made only to reassure the nonconformists among us. :)

Marshall, WA3VPZ

Ron Willcocks wrote:

> Hi
> I have just finished making a K2/100 for a friend here....
> ....I was a
> bit alarmed at having a choke this size dangling upside down on flimsy
> wires ( when in the K2) that I have broken the Elecraft Golden Rule and
> used a small amount of non-acidic RTV under each choke to hold it in
> place.
> ( I guess the Warranty just expired after admitting that!)
> I wonder if any other recent constructors have had the same concern
> for the
> mechanical stability of these components?
> Cheers.....Ron ZL1TW
>

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Don Wilhelm-3

RE: New KPA100 Rev.

In reply to this post by Ron ZL1TW

Ron,

I built up one of the first new KPA100 kits and had no problem with loose RF
chokes as you describe - I just checked it and the cores are tight. Yes,
the mounting holes are wide-spaced, but the leads can still be snugged down
so the cores do not move - a gentle tug with the pliers while soldering is
sufficient.

If one is a 'real purist' and insists that the toroids line up squarely with
the silkscreening on the board, then yes, the leads will have to be a bit
loose, but there is no real need to 'square-up' the toroids, and for the
sake of longevity, it is better just to snug the leads and let the cores
twist where they may.

73,
Don W3FPR

> -----Original Message-----

> Hi
> I have just finished making a K2/100 for a friend here, and I notice
> that the KPA100 is now up to REV D-1 ( Sept 28 2006) and has a quite few
> changes in it.
> Amongst them is the addition of two new toroidal RF chokes that
> are filled
> with #26 wire and because they are so full, the mounting holes on
> the (Rev
> B) board are a bit far apart to be able to pull them down tight. I was a
> bit alarmed at having a choke this size dangling upside down on flimsy
> wires ( when in the K2) that I have broken the Elecraft Golden Rule and
> used a small amount of non-acidic RTV under each choke to hold it
> in place.
> ( I guess the Warranty just expired after admitting that!)
> I wonder if any other recent constructors have had the same
> concern for the
> mechanical stability of these components?
> Among the changes I see the pesky RFC10 on the antenna socket has
> disappeared!
> Cheers.....Ron ZL1TW
>

David Cutter

Re: Re: New KPA100 Rev.

In reply to this post by Ron ZL1TW

I think too much is made of so-called corrosive RTV (it's the vinegar). The level of corrosion to bare metal is very small and in free air stops fairly quickly. For other components bathroom sealant is perfectly adequate. Enamelled copper wire and toroids should be immune anyway.

David
G3UNA

>
> From: Marshall Jose <[hidden email]>
> Date: 2006/10/18 Wed PM 02:05:53 BST
> To: [hidden email]
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] New KPA100 Rev.
>
> I'll come out of the closet and admit that I, too, used the expensive
> non-corrosive RTV to hold down the cores in my new K2. I did it because
>
> - I'm willing to accept the (warranty-breaking) consequences of doing so,
> - It's standard practice with spacecraft assemblies, which are held to a
> higher standard than ham radio kits, and
> - I had access to some :)
>
> PLEASE note that I have no intention of starting a religious war about
> construction practices. Elecraft's warranty policy is concrete and
> perfectly understandable, and I have no quarrel with it. My comment here
> is made only to reassure the nonconformists among us. :)
>
> Marshall, WA3VPZ
>

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Ben Hofmann K1NT

Re: New KPA100 Rev.

In reply to this post by Ron ZL1TW

Hmmm...

Where can I find more information about the specifics of the changes in the new KPA100 revision? Looked real quick on the elecraft web site, but didn't find anything. I have an unbuilt KPA100 that is the previous version, and I'm wondering if I should try to order parts and incorporate some of the new revision changes as I build it.

-Ben K1NT
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Don Wilhelm-3

RE: Re: New KPA100 Rev.

In reply to this post by David Cutter

David,

I beg to disagree, some time ago I used some of the 'vinegar' stuff on a
splice with insulated copper wire (#14 THHN) - and I can say that the bad
stuff keeps creeping for a long way. After a couple years, I had occasion
to examine it and found the stuff had crept up under the insulation and
caused corrosion as much as 6 inches from the point where it was applied -
It did make a good weather seal, but at the cost of electrical properties
loss. Fortunately, this was not in any critical application.

No longer will I use commonly available RTV direcly in electronics
applications - even the consumer grade 'non-corrosive' RTV commonly
available that I bought recently had a vinegar smell to it.

73,
Don W3FPR

> -----Original Message-----
>
> I think too much is made of so-called corrosive RTV (it's the
> vinegar). The level of corrosion to bare metal is very small
> and in free air stops fairly quickly. For other components
> bathroom sealant is perfectly adequate. Enamelled copper wire
> and toroids should be immune anyway.
>
> David
> G3UNA
>
>

Don Brown-4

Re: Re: New KPA100 Rev.

Hi

My company manufactures a small controller used on aerobic sewage treatment
plants. I have over 50,000 of them installed. One of the requirements is to
seal all of the electrical wiring where it enters the controller box using
silicone rubber. This is to keep chlorine, HS2 and water vapor out of the
box. We provide a 4 Oz tube of GE Silicone II so our installers will not use
the wrong type of silicone. The Silicone II is alcohol based rather than
Acetic acid based (vinegar). I have received several circuit boards returned
with green corrosion on the resistor leads and circuit traces due to the
wrong type of silicone used. We found this because the silicone we provide
is clear and the installer had used white bathroom calk bought at the local
hardware store. I guess he lost the tube we provided in the parts kit.

I would not recommend any adhesive be used on any Elecraft kit just as it
states in the manual. The wire leads are strong enough to hold the toroids.
If you must use something I would suggest a small strip of double stick foam
tape.

Don Brown
KD5NDB

----- Original Message -----
From: "Don Wilhelm" <[hidden email]>
To: <[hidden email]>
Sent: Wednesday, October 18, 2006 9:35 AM
Subject: RE: Re: [Elecraft] New KPA100 Rev.

> David,
>
> I beg to disagree, some time ago I used some of the 'vinegar' stuff on a
> splice with insulated copper wire (#14 THHN) - and I can say that the bad
> stuff keeps creeping for a long way. After a couple years, I had occasion
> to examine it and found the stuff had crept up under the insulation and
> caused corrosion as much as 6 inches from the point where it was applied -
> It did make a good weather seal, but at the cost of electrical properties
> loss. Fortunately, this was not in any critical application.
>
> No longer will I use commonly available RTV direcly in electronics
> applications - even the consumer grade 'non-corrosive' RTV commonly
> available that I bought recently had a vinegar smell to it.
>
> 73,
> Don W3FPR
>
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> >
> > I think too much is made of so-called corrosive RTV (it's the
> > vinegar). The level of corrosion to bare metal is very small
> > and in free air stops fairly quickly. For other components
> > bathroom sealant is perfectly adequate. Enamelled copper wire
> > and toroids should be immune anyway.
> >
> > David
> > G3UNA
> >
> >
>
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Karl Larsen

Re: New KPA100 Rev.

In reply to this post by David Cutter

I hold all my toroid coils firm to the board AFTER all tuning is
complete with my Hot Glue system. It tacks down everything but not so
tight you can't get it loose. I do not find the hot glue to be corrosive.

I buy my hot-glue tubes and the gun at any good Hardware store.

73 Karl K5DI

[hidden email] wrote:

> I think too much is made of so-called corrosive RTV (it's the vinegar). The level of corrosion to bare metal is very small and in free air stops fairly quickly. For other components bathroom sealant is perfectly adequate. Enamelled copper wire and toroids should be immune anyway.
>
> David
> G3UNA
>
>
>> From: Marshall Jose <[hidden email]>
>> Date: 2006/10/18 Wed PM 02:05:53 BST
>> To: [hidden email]
>> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] New KPA100 Rev.
>>
>> I'll come out of the closet and admit that I, too, used the expensive
>> non-corrosive RTV to hold down the cores in my new K2. I did it because
>>
>> - I'm willing to accept the (warranty-breaking) consequences of doing so,
>> - It's standard practice with spacecraft assemblies, which are held to a
>> higher standard than ham radio kits, and
>> - I had access to some :)
>>
>> PLEASE note that I have no intention of starting a religious war about
>> construction practices. Elecraft's warranty policy is concrete and
>> perfectly understandable, and I have no quarrel with it. My comment here
>> is made only to reassure the nonconformists among us. :)
>>
>> Marshall, WA3VPZ
>>
>>
>
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>
>

Geoffrey Mackenzie-Kennedy-2

Re: Re: New KPA100 Rev.

In reply to this post by Don Wilhelm-3

Don, W3FPR wrote

> No longer will I use commonly available RTV direcly in electronics
> applications - even the consumer grade 'non-corrosive' RTV commonly
> available that I bought recently had a vinegar smell to it.

--------------------------------------------------------------

Very wise!

73,
Geoff
GM4ESD

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Mike S-8

Re: New KPA100 Rev.

In reply to this post by Karl Larsen

At 11:03 AM 10/18/2006, Karl Larsen wrote...

> I hold all my toroid coils firm to the board AFTER all tuning is complete with my Hot Glue system. It tacks down everything but not so tight you can't get it loose. I do not find the hot glue to be corrosive.

Beeswax is the traditional "tried and true." It does not affect the Q or impedance (if I recall correctly, silicone rubber does have an effect, I suspect hot glue would, too). It holds fast, but is still easy to soften/remove if a component needs to be replaced.

There have been previous discussions on this list regarding this, which a search of the archives should turn up.
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David Cutter

Re: Re: New KPA100 Rev.

In reply to this post by Ron ZL1TW

I'm going to have to clarify what I said: I would not use the vinegar variety for caulking, ie in large quantities where there are electrical parts "in an enclosed space." I was talking about in free air. I have used Dow Corning 3140 for that.

Sorry for misleading anyone, but, as always, glad to raise the issue for others to learn from the group experience.

David
G3UNA

>
> From: "Don Brown" <[hidden email]>
> Date: 2006/10/18 Wed PM 04:00:46 BST
> To: <[hidden email]>, <[hidden email]>
> Subject: Re: Re: [Elecraft] New KPA100 Rev.
>
> Hi
>
> My company manufactures a small controller used on aerobic sewage treatment
> plants. I have over 50,000 of them installed. One of the requirements is to
> seal all of the electrical wiring where it enters the controller box using
> silicone rubber. This is to keep chlorine, HS2 and water vapor out of the
> box. We provide a 4 Oz tube of GE Silicone II so our installers will not use
> the wrong type of silicone. The Silicone II is alcohol based rather than
> Acetic acid based (vinegar). I have received several circuit boards returned
> with green corrosion on the resistor leads and circuit traces due to the
> wrong type of silicone used. We found this because the silicone we provide
> is clear and the installer had used white bathroom calk bought at the local
> hardware store. I guess he lost the tube we provided in the parts kit.
>
> I would not recommend any adhesive be used on any Elecraft kit just as it
> states in the manual. The wire leads are strong enough to hold the toroids.
> If you must use something I would suggest a small strip of double stick foam
> tape.
>
> Don Brown
> KD5NDB
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Don Wilhelm" <[hidden email]>
> To: <[hidden email]>
> Sent: Wednesday, October 18, 2006 9:35 AM
> Subject: RE: Re: [Elecraft] New KPA100 Rev.
>
>
> > David,
> >
> > I beg to disagree, some time ago I used some of the 'vinegar' stuff on a
> > splice with insulated copper wire (#14 THHN) - and I can say that the bad
> > stuff keeps creeping for a long way. After a couple years, I had occasion
> > to examine it and found the stuff had crept up under the insulation and
> > caused corrosion as much as 6 inches from the point where it was applied -
> > It did make a good weather seal, but at the cost of electrical properties
> > loss. Fortunately, this was not in any critical application.
> >
> > No longer will I use commonly available RTV direcly in electronics
> > applications - even the consumer grade 'non-corrosive' RTV commonly
> > available that I bought recently had a vinegar smell to it.
> >
> > 73,
> > Don W3FPR
> >
> >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > >
> > > I think too much is made of so-called corrosive RTV (it's the
> > > vinegar). The level of corrosion to bare metal is very small
> > > and in free air stops fairly quickly. For other components
> > > bathroom sealant is perfectly adequate. Enamelled copper wire
> > > and toroids should be immune anyway.
> > >
> > > David
> > > G3UNA
> > >
> > >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Elecraft mailing list
> > Post to: [hidden email]
> > You must be a subscriber to post to the list.
> > Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.):
> > http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> >
> > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm
> > Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
> >
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Ron Hahn (EI2JP)

New KPA100 Rev. D vs. older Rev. C

Ok Lads,

I too have scoured the Elecraft web site for the changes from Rev C
(which I'm building now after a long delay after purchasing) and Rev
D (the alleged current version) and I cannot find any reference to
the changes.

Perhaps someone at Elecraft could educate us as to the changes
required to go from Rev C to Rev D???

Thanks,

Ron
-
Ron Hahn - EI2JP
Grid: IO52GA CQ: 14 ITU: 27 IOTA: EU-115
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Keeper, EI7KYR
Mob. +353-86-600-5499

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