News from Visalia! (:-))

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News from Visalia! (:-))

dhhdeh
Thanks Wes,

You are entitled to your opinion which is sound and me, mine which is
also sound. Yours seems based on long-established theory and mine based
on 32 years of DX'ing practice.

Maybe there should be no need for an ATU option for the K3-100? And..I
would not have 342 DXCC with 100W and all with non-resonant wire. I have
no physical capability for multiple resonant antennas here at my QTH.  
Do I /need/ an amp?...no...It's a /want /only.  Plenty of folks like the
SPE 1K and have said so on many forums.

I'm patient and not ready to jump to conclusions here as I 'm sure its
still a ways off... but If there isn't an ATU on board as I recall there
was with the earlier prototypes of the bigger Elecraft amps, I wish that
there were one with the KPA 500 and I'm disappointed if not, that's all.

The folks at Elecraft are savvy, proficient and clever, more so than
most others but they are not perfect. There is plenty of room for
discussion and disagreement on points. (I'd still like to have had
dedicated bandswitches on the K3.)

YMMV,

Offered  in the form of good spirited debate.

Come on guys at Visalia, we need some GOOD jpegs.

73 de N1LQ-Dave

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Re: News from Visalia! (:-))

Craig Smith
Only room for so much stuff in a K3 sized box.  I like the built-in Power
Supply and the 500 W design point.  And, I'm even thankful that there isn't
a built-in tuner, as it holds out the possibility of an external 500W
Elecraft tuner!  Make it remotable, capable of driving a balanced or
unbalanced load and weatherproof, please  ;>)

      73    Craig   AC0DS



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Re: News from Visalia! (:-))

Phil Salas
In reply to this post by dhhdeh
"... but If there isn't an ATU on board as I recall there
was with the earlier prototypes of the bigger Elecraft amps, I wish that
there were one with the KPA 500 and I'm disappointed..."

The SPE internal tuner (and even the THP external tuner) can only handle
about a 3:1 SWR.  A wide-range autotuner needs a much greater range in
component values, as well as higher voltage-rated and higher current-rated
components than does a limited range tuner.  Look inside a LDG-1000 or
MFJ-998 and you'll see what I mean.  Adding a wide-range tuner capability
inside the KPA500 would add considerably to the size, cost and complexity of
the KPA500.

When it comes to an amplifier, I prefer an external wide-range tuner.  Just
my opinion.

Phil - AD5X

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Re: News from Visalia! (:-))

Claude Du Berger
In reply to this post by Craig Smith
Yes, Yes, Yes...
73, Claude VE2FK

  ----- Original Message -----
  From: Craig D. Smith
  To: [hidden email]
  Sent: Saturday, April 17, 2010 3:13 PM
  Subject: Re: [Elecraft] News from Visalia! (:-))


  Only room for so much stuff in a K3 sized box.  I like the built-in Power
  Supply and the 500 W design point.  And, I'm even thankful that there isn't
  a built-in tuner, as it holds out the possibility of an external 500W
  Elecraft tuner!  Make it remotable, capable of driving a balanced or
  unbalanced load and weatherproof, please  ;>)

        73    Craig   AC0DS

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Re: News from Visalia! (:-))

Dunc Carter - W5DC
In reply to this post by Craig Smith
According to Doug Faunt N6TQS, "There is a button on front that says
"ATU".  Of course, Doug could be pulling our legs or perhaps Wayne could
be doing the same with a fake ATU button - Oops, someone put the wrong
button on the show demo!".  Considering how the the subscribers to this
board like to take a bit of wild speculation and run with it, this seems
possible.   I like Craig's comment as it seems to make sense and what
I've seen from Elecraft so far also makes sense.

;-)), Dunc, W5DC

Craig D. Smith wrote:

> Only room for so much stuff in a K3 sized box.  I like the built-in Power
> Supply and the 500 W design point.  And, I'm even thankful that there isn't
> a built-in tuner, as it holds out the possibility of an external 500W
> Elecraft tuner!  Make it remotable, capable of driving a balanced or
> unbalanced load and weatherproof, please  ;>)
>
>       73    Craig   AC0DS
>
>
>
> ______________________________________________________________
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>  

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Re: News from Visalia! (:-))

ab2tc
In reply to this post by Claude Du Berger
Hi,

Yes please, a remotable, weatherproofed 500W tuner with balanced capability would create an instant order here. Until then, I will continue to rely on my modified MFJ tuner (remote the "tune" function with a wire and weatherproofed in a plastic feed container). It's starting to show signs of corrosion and decay after 4 CNY winters but it's still working fine. I have a spare on hand to install when it gives out. It's cheap enough to be a throwaway item. Hint: Use Ethernet for the remote connection, please. It's easy nowadays.

AB2TC - Knut

Claude Du Berger wrote
Yes, Yes, Yes...
73, Claude VE2FK

  ----- Original Message -----
  From: Craig D. Smith
  To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
  Sent: Saturday, April 17, 2010 3:13 PM
  Subject: Re: [Elecraft] News from Visalia! (:-))


  Only room for so much stuff in a K3 sized box.  I like the built-in Power
  Supply and the 500 W design point.  And, I'm even thankful that there isn't
  a built-in tuner, as it holds out the possibility of an external 500W
  Elecraft tuner!  Make it remotable, capable of driving a balanced or
  unbalanced load and weatherproof, please  ;>)

        73    Craig   AC0DS

<snip>
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Re: News from Visalia! (:-))

Doug Faunt N6TQS +1-510-655-8604
In reply to this post by Craig Smith
Rumor level now-
The modular jack on the back is currently undefined, but is NOT just
an extension of the K3 ACC connection.  An ATU connnected there was
mentioned.  And, as I said, there's a button with an ATU label.

The most knowledgeable person is no longer here, but the active devices are
apparently a pair of 750W devices running at 60VDC.

And it MAY deliver power without a ATU as well as some units that
have an ATU.

Delivery- "end of this year".
that's all for now.

73, doug

   From: "Craig D. Smith" <[hidden email]>
   Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2010 13:13:23 -0600

   Only room for so much stuff in a K3 sized box.  I like the built-in Power
   Supply and the 500 W design point.  And, I'm even thankful that there isn't
   a built-in tuner, as it holds out the possibility of an external 500W
   Elecraft tuner!  Make it remotable, capable of driving a balanced or
   unbalanced load and weatherproof, please  ;>)
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Re: News from Visalia! (:-))

Doug Faunt N6TQS +1-510-655-8604
In reply to this post by Dunc Carter - W5DC
   Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2010 13:36:36 -0600
   From: Duncan Carter <[hidden email]>

   According to Doug Faunt N6TQS, "There is a button on front that says
   "ATU".  Of course, Doug could be pulling our legs or perhaps Wayne could

You can read it on one of the photos I posted.  But this is just a
prototype- the K3 labels changed in beta testing.

73, doug

   be doing the same with a fake ATU button - Oops, someone put the wrong
   button on the show demo!".  Considering how the the subscribers to this
   board like to take a bit of wild speculation and run with it, this seems
   possible.   I like Craig's comment as it seems to make sense and what
   I've seen from Elecraft so far also makes sense.
   ;-)), Dunc, W5DC

   Craig D. Smith wrote:
   > Only room for so much stuff in a K3 sized box.  I like the built-in Power
   > Supply and the 500 W design point.  And, I'm even thankful that there isn't
   > a built-in tuner, as it holds out the possibility of an external 500W
   > Elecraft tuner!  Make it remotable, capable of driving a balanced or
   > unbalanced load and weatherproof, please  ;>)
   >
   >       73    Craig   AC0DS
   >
   >
   >
   > ______________________________________________________________
   > Elecraft mailing list
   > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
   > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
   > Post: mailto:[hidden email]
   >
   > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
   > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
   >
   >  

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Re: News from Visalia! (:-))

Bill K9YEQ
We must remember, Wayne and Eric are quite crafty.  They may come up with a
through the coax powered remote tuner to handle most types of antennas at
the antenna base to cooperate with those of us that are attempting to do
this at ridiculous cost.  And yes I would love to be a field tester for this
once again.

Bill
K9YEQ
K2 and KX1 field tester, K3 and modules
-----Original Message-----
From: [hidden email]
[mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Doug Faunt N6TQS
+1-510-655-8604
Sent: Saturday, April 17, 2010 4:52 PM
To: [hidden email]
Cc: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] News from Visalia! (:-))

   Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2010 13:36:36 -0600
   From: Duncan Carter <[hidden email]>

   According to Doug Faunt N6TQS, "There is a button on front that says
   "ATU".  Of course, Doug could be pulling our legs or perhaps Wayne could

You can read it on one of the photos I posted.  But this is just a
prototype- the K3 label..........

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Re: News from Visalia! (:-))

Johnny Siu
In reply to this post by Doug Faunt N6TQS +1-510-655-8604
Hello Doug,

Any idea about the likely pricing.  I am really looking for a linear that I can service it myself.

Can I suppose KPA500 will work with both K2 and K3?

73

Johnny VR2XMC



----- 郵件原件 ----
寄件人﹕ Doug Faunt N6TQS +1-510-655-8604 <[hidden email]>
收件人﹕ [hidden email]
副本(CC) [hidden email]
傳送日期﹕ 2010/4/18 (日) 5:49:44 AM
主題: Re: [Elecraft] News from Visalia! (:-))

Rumor level now-
The modular jack on the back is currently undefined, but is NOT just
an extension of the K3 ACC connection.  An ATU connnected there was
mentioned.  And, as I said, there's a button with an ATU label.

The most knowledgeable person is no longer here, but the active devices are
apparently a pair of 750W devices running at 60VDC.

And it MAY deliver power without a ATU as well as some units that
have an ATU.

Delivery- "end of this year".
that's all for now.

73, doug

  From: "Craig D. Smith" <[hidden email]>
  Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2010 13:13:23 -0600

  Only room for so much stuff in a K3 sized box.  I like the built-in Power
  Supply and the 500 W design point.  And, I'm even thankful that there isn't
  a built-in tuner, as it holds out the possibility of an external 500W
  Elecraft tuner!  Make it remotable, capable of driving a balanced or
  unbalanced load and weatherproof, please  ;>)



     

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Re: Re: News from Visalia! (:-))

Doug Faunt N6TQS +1-510-655-8604
A number I heard was $2000.,  but I have to admit, I don't recall who
said it.

I didn't ask about K2 interfacing, but since it's got the serial port
interface, I suspect it'll work fine.

Apparently it can follow the transceiver by either reading the serial
port or by watching the drive frequency (frequency counter).
Note that all of this is preliminary, and anything can change to some
degree.

Oh, and it's got front panel band buttons, one for each band, and
using them changes the band on the K3, also.  So now, band buttons for
your K3.

And it's possible that Elecraft won't actually produce a tuner
themselves, but will make interfacing informattion available for
others to do something that will work cleanly.

73, doug

   Date: Sun, 18 Apr 2010 09:08:58 +0800 (HKT)
   From: Johnny Siu <[hidden email]>

   Hello Doug,

   Any idea about the likely pricing.  I am really looking for a linear that I can service it myself.

   Can I suppose KPA500 will work with both K2 and K3?

   73

   Johnny VR2XMC



   ----- 郵件原件 ----
   å¯„件人œóðõ Doug Faunt N6TQS +1-510-655-8604 <[hidden email]>
   æ”¶ä»¶äººœóðõ [hidden email]
   å‰¯æœ¬(CC) [hidden email]
   å‚³é€æ—¥æœŸœóðõ 2010/4/18 (日) 5:49:44 AM
   ä¸»é¡Œœóòú Re: [Elecraft] News from Visalia! (:-))

   Rumor level now-
   The modular jack on the back is currently undefined, but is NOT just
   an extension of the K3 ACC connection.  An ATU connnected there was
   mentioned.  And, as I said, there's a button with an ATU label.

   The most knowledgeable person is no longer here, but the active devices are
   apparently a pair of 750W devices running at 60VDC.

   And it MAY deliver power without a ATU as well as some units that
   have an ATU.

   Delivery- "end of this year".
   that's all for now.

   73, doug

       From: "Craig D. Smith" <[hidden email]>
       Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2010 13:13:23 -0600

       Only room for so much stuff in a K3 sized box.  I like the built-in Power
       Supply and the 500 W design point.  And, I'm even thankful that there isn't
       a built-in tuner, as it holds out the possibility of an external 500W
       Elecraft tuner!  Make it remotable, capable of driving a balanced or
       unbalanced load and weatherproof, please  ;>)






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Re: News from Visalia! (:-))

John Harper AE5X
In reply to this post by dhhdeh
Too rich for my blood for 500w.....


>A number I heard was $2000.,  but I have to admit, I don't recall who
>said it.

John Harper AE5X
http://www.ae5x.com/blog




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Re: News from Visalia! (:-))

Lu Romero - W4LT
In reply to this post by dhhdeh
I agree:

I can get an ACOM 1010 (admittedly, with a tube) around (below) that that
price with the handy TRI tuning and 800w to do the same thing, with
paperclip reliability to boot.  

Also, an ALS600 with the Linear Power supply, AD5X Full Break In mod and an
external bandswitching accessory plus an MFJ998 would come in considerably
under the $2,000 price.  I should know. I own this configuration and it
works wonderfully at a total cost of just under $1,800 :)

Matching boxes are nice, but they are not worth that kind of money for that
power level.  500 watts in kit form with a under $1,100 price point makes
much more sense in today's economic environment, with the added advantage of
me being able to build and service it (although the Ameritron is very simple
inside, easy to service and I don't have to build it, for two hundred
dollars more!).

Sorry, but the Kool Aid seems to be starting to taste a little bitter.

-lu-w4lt-



Date: Sun, 18 Apr 2010 09:50:25 -0500
From: "John Harper" <[hidden email]>
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] News from Visalia! (:-))
To: "Elecraft" <[hidden email]>
Message-ID: <000501cadf06$7b260ed0$0301a8c0@JOHN>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
        reply-type=original

Too rich for my blood for 500w.....


>A number I heard was $2000.,  but I have to admit, I don't recall who
>said it.

John Harper AE5X
http://www.ae5x.com/blog

No virus found in this outgoing message
Checked by PC Tools AntiVirus (6.1.0.25 - 6.14780).
http://www.pctools.com/free-antivirus/





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Re: News from Visalia! (:-))

Terry Posey
lu w4lt wrote:

I can get an ACOM 1010 (admittedly, with a tube) around (below) that that
price with the handy TRI tuning and 800w to do the same thing, with
paperclip reliability to boot.  

Also, an ALS600 with the Linear Power supply, AD5X Full Break In mod and an
external bandswitching accessory plus an MFJ998 would come in considerably
under the $2,000 price.  I should know. I own this configuration and it
works wonderfully at a total cost of just under $1,800 :)

Matching boxes are nice, but they are not worth that kind of money for that
power level.  500 watts in kit form with a under $1,100 price point makes
much more sense in today's economic environment, with the added advantage of
me being able to build and service it (although the Ameritron is very simple
inside, easy to service and I don't have to build it, for two hundred
dollars more!).

Sorry, but the Kool Aid seems to be starting to taste a little bitter.

-lu-w4lt-

************

lu, I understand how you conclude your personal equipment druthers - and
there can be no criticisms for those choices.

Let me suggest; however, that there is an "iron triangle" that most people
consider as trade-offs for purchases, either consciously or subconsciously :
1) Performance, 2) Style, and 3) Cost.  In general we all seek to maximize
performance in whatever we wish to acquire or purchase, whether it be power
level, duty cycle, weight, distortion, and HF and 6-meter band coverage. I
will argue that Style is also an issue for everyone on some level - do we
really need to have any of our cabinets painted? What about knobs?  Must
they be black? Knurled? Plastic? Metal?  Ultimately, Performance and Style
are phase-locked to COST.  The more you demand of Performance and Style, the
higher the Cost must be.  Considerations of 1) Performance, 2) Style, and 3)
Cost, send our personal choices in the directions that suit us as we
individuals deem best.  Those choices have nothing to do with the taste of
anyone's Kool Aid.

I have already acquired a high duty cycle, low distortion, 1.5KW amplifier
years ago. Now I would like a small, light, and portable HF+6-meter
amplifier for DXpedition duty.  I personally will not consider ANY amplifier
that cannot Perform on 6-meters in a small stylish, compact, light, and low
distortion package.  Your mileage does vary.

73,
Terry K4RX




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Re: News from Visalia! (:-))

Grant Youngman
We don't know the price, we don't know the specs.  All anyone has seen is a box with a few hints based on the buttons, and exhaustive posts on silicon devices.   Why not let it roll out in its own time -- before (1) the list has completely redesigned it, or (2) decided it isn't worth it, or (3) put it in the same category as some "Dave-Made" piece of garbage -- which, based on a few  comments, would appear to be a staple in some parts of the ham(?) community.  I'm not sure which part???  :-)

Oh, well -- at least it has given us something else to opine about, and gratefully reduced the number of posts continuing to bloviate on the benefits of the P3 vs. whatever.

Grant/NQ5T



>
> Sorry, but the Kool Aid seems to be starting to taste a little bitter.

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Re: News from Visalia! (:-))

Doug Faunt N6TQS +1-510-655-8604
In reply to this post by Terry Posey
   From: "Terry Posey" <[hidden email]>
   Date: Sun, 18 Apr 2010 16:16:58 -0400
   I have already acquired a high duty cycle, low distortion, 1.5KW amplifier
   years ago. Now I would like a small, light, and portable HF+6-meter
   amplifier for DXpedition duty.  I personally will not consider ANY amplifier
   that cannot Perform on 6-meters in a small stylish, compact, light, and low
   distortion package.  Your mileage does vary.

Interestingly M-Squared was showing a VERY small high-power 6M amp.  I
didn't pay a lot of attention and can't locate the sheet I picked up
about it, but 6M folks might want to check it out.

Given the size and direction of the KPA-500, I think it'll be in demand.
500W on RTTY with DXpedition/contesting duty cycles make me happy.

My IC-2KL with a commercial switching supply weighs 25 pounds (I'm
home now), and I thought that was pretty good.  It's also larger (both
pieces together).

73, doug
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Re: News from Visalia! (:-))

Greg - AB7R
In reply to this post by Terry Posey
Lets not forget... "Service".


On 4/18/2010 1:16 PM, Terry Posey wrote:

> lu w4lt wrote:
>
> I can get an ACOM 1010 (admittedly, with a tube) around (below) that that
> price with the handy TRI tuning and 800w to do the same thing, with
> paperclip reliability to boot.
>
> Also, an ALS600 with the Linear Power supply, AD5X Full Break In mod and an
> external bandswitching accessory plus an MFJ998 would come in considerably
> under the $2,000 price.  I should know. I own this configuration and it
> works wonderfully at a total cost of just under $1,800 :)
>
> Matching boxes are nice, but they are not worth that kind of money for that
> power level.  500 watts in kit form with a under $1,100 price point makes
> much more sense in today's economic environment, with the added advantage of
> me being able to build and service it (although the Ameritron is very simple
> inside, easy to service and I don't have to build it, for two hundred
> dollars more!).
>
> Sorry, but the Kool Aid seems to be starting to taste a little bitter.
>
> -lu-w4lt-
>
> ************
>
> lu, I understand how you conclude your personal equipment druthers - and
> there can be no criticisms for those choices.
>
> Let me suggest; however, that there is an "iron triangle" that most people
> consider as trade-offs for purchases, either consciously or subconsciously :
> 1) Performance, 2) Style, and 3) Cost.  In general we all seek to maximize
> performance in whatever we wish to acquire or purchase, whether it be power
> level, duty cycle, weight, distortion, and HF and 6-meter band coverage. I
> will argue that Style is also an issue for everyone on some level - do we
> really need to have any of our cabinets painted? What about knobs?  Must
> they be black? Knurled? Plastic? Metal?  Ultimately, Performance and Style
> are phase-locked to COST.  The more you demand of Performance and Style, the
> higher the Cost must be.  Considerations of 1) Performance, 2) Style, and 3)
> Cost, send our personal choices in the directions that suit us as we
> individuals deem best.  Those choices have nothing to do with the taste of
> anyone's Kool Aid.
>
> I have already acquired a high duty cycle, low distortion, 1.5KW amplifier
> years ago. Now I would like a small, light, and portable HF+6-meter
> amplifier for DXpedition duty.  I personally will not consider ANY amplifier
> that cannot Perform on 6-meters in a small stylish, compact, light, and low
> distortion package.  Your mileage does vary.
>
> 73,
> Terry K4RX
>
>
>
>
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Re: News from Visalia! (:-))

Jim Brown-10
In reply to this post by Terry Posey
On Sun, 18 Apr 2010 16:16:58 -0400, Terry Posey wrote:

>ALS600 with the Linear Power supply, AD5X Full Break In mod and an
>external bandswitching accessory plus an MFJ998 would come in considerably
>under the $2,000 price.

Do I understand that you are equating MFJ with Elecraft?  That's quite a
stretch! While I have great respect for W8JI's engineering, that does not
extend to MFJ's manufacturing, and Ameritron has common ownership with MFJ.
:)

I can also buy at least twenty different models of 100 watt HF transceiver
for much less than the cost of a K3. Yet I OWN two K3s.

I just returned from Visalia. The exhibit hall included large booths
showing Icom and Yaesu rigs. The Elecraft booth was JAMMED from the minute
the doors opened until they closed. The Yaesu and Icom booths had only
modest traffic, and were oftn next to deserted.

73,

Jim K9YC


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Re: News from Visalia! (:-))

Gary Gregory
Jim Brown wrote

I just returned from Visalia. The exhibit hall included large booths
showing Icom and Yaesu rigs. The Elecraft booth was JAMMED from the minute
the doors opened until they closed. The Yaesu and Icom booths had only
modest traffic, and were oftn next to deserted.

Now THAT is interesting..brought on a chuckle Jim.

Wonder if Eric noticed

73's
Gary

On Tue, Apr 20, 2010 at 2:59 AM, Jim Brown <[hidden email]>wrote:

> On Sun, 18 Apr 2010 16:16:58 -0400, Terry Posey wrote:
>
> >ALS600 with the Linear Power supply, AD5X Full Break In mod and an
> >external bandswitching accessory plus an MFJ998 would come in considerably
> >under the $2,000 price.
>
> Do I understand that you are equating MFJ with Elecraft?  That's quite a
> stretch! While I have great respect for W8JI's engineering, that does not
> extend to MFJ's manufacturing, and Ameritron has common ownership with MFJ.
> :)
>
> I can also buy at least twenty different models of 100 watt HF transceiver
> for much less than the cost of a K3. Yet I OWN two K3s.
>
> I just returned from Visalia. The exhibit hall included large booths
> showing Icom and Yaesu rigs. The Elecraft booth was JAMMED from the minute
> the doors opened until they closed. The Yaesu and Icom booths had only
> modest traffic, and were oftn next to deserted.
>
> 73,
>
> Jim K9YC
>
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
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> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>



--
Gary
VK4FD - Motorhome Mobile
http://www.qsl.net/vk4fd/
K3 #679
For everything else there's Mastercard!!!
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