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P3 Broad Birdie

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Phil K3TUF

P3 Broad Birdie

Does anyone else get the wide birdie that floats around the P3 screen?
This does not affect the operation of the K3, but does interfere with
the display.
Must be on the IF because it is never heard even when it is in the
apparent bandwidth window.
Phil K3TUF
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Rick Tavan N6XI

Re: P3 Broad Birdie

I've been seeing several of these but only on 6M.

/Rick N6XI

On Sat, Jun 11, 2011 at 5:45 PM, Phil Theis <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Does anyone else get the wide birdie that floats around the P3 screen?
> This does not affect the operation of the K3, but does interfere with
> the display.
> Must be on the IF because it is never heard even when it is in the
> apparent bandwidth window.
> Phil K3TUF
> ______________________________________________________________
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--
Rick Tavan N6XI
Truckee, CA
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Jim Brown-10

Re: P3 Broad Birdie

On 6/11/2011 8:47 PM, Rick Tavan N6XI wrote:
> I've been seeing several of these but only on 6M.

Yes, the birdies on 6M are a real PITA. Also the frying noise as you
tune. That needs work.

73, Jim K9YC

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Dave Perry N4QS

Re: P3 Broad Birdie

In reply to this post by Phil K3TUF

Yes, I get the wide birdie all the time on the P3, but I also hear it on the
K3. I always figured it was something in the house.

Dave, N4QS

----- Original Message -----
From: "Phil Theis" <[hidden email]>
To: <[hidden email]>
Sent: Saturday, June 11, 2011 7:45 PM
Subject: [Elecraft] P3 Broad Birdie

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Phil K3TUF

Re: P3 Broad Birdie

I wonder how we can find out what it is and get it isolated, or
eliminated.
Phil K3TUF

On 6/12/2011 2:40 PM, Dave Perry wrote:

> Yes, I get the wide birdie all the time on the P3, but I also hear it
> on the K3. I always figured it was something in the house.
>
> Dave, N4QS
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Phil Theis" <[hidden email]>
> To: <[hidden email]>
> Sent: Saturday, June 11, 2011 7:45 PM
> Subject: [Elecraft] P3 Broad Birdie
>
>
>> Does anyone else get the wide birdie that floats around the P3 screen?
>> This does not affect the operation of the K3, but does interfere with
>> the display.
>> Must be on the IF because it is never heard even when it is in the
>> apparent bandwidth window.
>> Phil K3TUF
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> Elecraft mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
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>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>
>
>
> -----
> No virus found in this message.
> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
> Version: 10.0.1382 / Virus Database: 1513/3698 - Release Date: 06/12/11
>
>

John Ragle

Re: P3 Broad Birdie

In reply to this post by Dave Perry N4QS

I see it on both the K3 and the P3 but it does not interfere with
operation, as I am mostly narrow band, with the P3 span stopped down as
well. It is ~10 dB tall on the P3. A component of it meanders around the
PSK regions on 20, 15, and on 6 and much less on 2. It is something in
the house or the neighborhood, perhaps a plasma TV. It is present all
the time that I am awake.

=====

On 6/12/2011 2:40 PM, Dave Perry wrote:

> Yes, I get the wide birdie all the time on the P3, but I also hear it on the
> K3. I always figured it was something in the house.
>
> Dave, N4QS
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Phil Theis"<[hidden email]>
> To:<[hidden email]>
> Sent: Saturday, June 11, 2011 7:45 PM
> Subject: [Elecraft] P3 Broad Birdie
>> Does anyone else get the wide birdie that floats around the P3 screen?

Jim Brown-10

Re: P3 Broad Birdie

We're talking about two different things. There are birdies generated
within the K3 that show up in the P3 as signals, and that move around as
you tune. This is a problem within the K3.

Noise and unstable birdies that drift in frequency (usually, but not
always, very slowly) is RF trash produced by all forms of electronic
equipment, but mostly switching power supplies (including those for
battery chargers, etc.). This stuff is radiated by the wiring connected
to the noisy equipment, and is picked up by our antennas, just like any
other radio signal.

The P3 can be a VERY useful tool for chasing the sources of this trash,
because it lets us see it more clearly. Some of these noise sources
have a carrier frequency, but most of them are frequency modulated by
random noise so that you don't hear a carrier. This modulation is called
"dither", and serves to skirt FCC regulations which limit the field
strength at a single frequency. So instead of seeing (and hearing) a
strong carrier, you see (and hear) a broad hump of noise. The result is
that the noise level is raised within the width of that hump, typically
several kHz (or tens of kHz on VHF).

73, Jim Brown K9YC

On 6/12/2011 12:14 PM, John Ragle wrote:

> I see it on both the K3 and the P3 but it does not interfere with
> operation, as I am mostly narrow band, with the P3 span stopped down as
> well. It is ~10 dB tall on the P3. A component of it meanders around the
> PSK regions on 20, 15, and on 6 and much less on 2. It is something in
> the house or the neighborhood, perhaps a plasma TV. It is present all
> the time that I am awake.
>
> =====
>
> On 6/12/2011 2:40 PM, Dave Perry wrote:
>> Yes, I get the wide birdie all the time on the P3, but I also hear it on the
>> K3. I always figured it was something in the house.
>>
>> Dave, N4QS
>>
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Phil Theis"<[hidden email]>
>> To:<[hidden email]>
>> Sent: Saturday, June 11, 2011 7:45 PM
>> Subject: [Elecraft] P3 Broad Birdie
>>> Does anyone else get the wide birdie that floats around the P3 screen?
> ______________________________________________________________
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>

Jim Brown-10

Re: P3 Broad Birdie & straw men...

I understand exactly what you are talking about -- my case #2, but I
also realized that what K3TUF and N6XI are talking about was my case
#1. Your birdies and noise are from OUTSIDE the radio. Their's are
only INSIDE the radio. I experience both.

Notice that Phil says "Must be on the IF because it is never heard even
when it is in the
apparent bandwidth window."

These INTERIOR birdies also get MUCH stronger when you have the SUB RX
turned on. During the VHF contest, I split my time between CW and SSB,
with the SUB RX listening to whichever one I wasn't transmitting on.
The thing that's a PITA about this is that you think that these are
signals that you can work, so you switch from SSB to CW to work them,
but they aren't really there. There are also some fairly weak
birdies/noise peaks that look like weak CW signals, but are not. And I
worked nearly a dozen weak CW signals that looked like those
birdies/noise peaks, and as you tune to work them, they also disappear.

73, Jim K9YC

On 6/12/2011 6:34 PM, John Ragle wrote:
> second paragraph, and I believe the other posts are talking about
> exactly the same thing. If you will take the time to read what they
> wrote, you might recognize as much. Perhaps your objection is to the
> use of the word "birdie" in this context?

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Johnny Siu

P3 Broad Birdie & straw men...

Hello Jim,

I fully appreciate the PITA and am annoyed about it.

The elimination of internal birdies require substantial amount of DSP power. In the circumstances, by taking advantage of the module design of K3, a new more powerful DSP board to replace the existing one may be the ultimate solution in the future. Of course, this will take Elecraft some time to implement

At the current moment, I still feel that K3 is the smallest portable high performance radio with true dual receivers. It will not be practical for me to take my IC7800 easily to other QTH to operate.

I am going to do some IOTA operation this week end and will bring my K3 with me.

TNX & 73,

Johnny VR2XMC

從︰ Jim Brown <[hidden email]>
收件人︰ Reflector Elecraft <[hidden email]>
傳送日期︰ 2011年06月13日 (週一) 1:25 PM
主題︰ Re: [Elecraft] P3 Broad Birdie & straw men...

I understand exactly what you are talking about -- my case #2, but I
also realized that what K3TUF and N6XI are talking about was my case
#1. Your birdies and noise are from OUTSIDE the radio. Their's are
only INSIDE the radio. I experience both.

Notice that Phil says "Must be on the IF because it is never heard even
when it is in the
apparent bandwidth window."

These INTERIOR birdies also get MUCH stronger when you have the SUB RX
turned on. During the VHF contest, I split my time between CW and SSB,
with the SUB RX listening to whichever one I wasn't transmitting on.
The thing that's a PITA about this is that you think that these are
signals that you can work, so you switch from SSB to CW to work them,
but they aren't really there. There are also some fairly weak
birdies/noise peaks that look like weak CW signals, but are not. And I
worked nearly a dozen weak CW signals that looked like those
birdies/noise peaks, and as you tune to work them, they also disappear.

73, Jim K9YC

On 6/12/2011 6:34 PM, John Ragle wrote:
> second paragraph, and I believe the other posts are talking about
> exactly the same thing. If you will take the time to read what they
> wrote, you might recognize as much. Perhaps your objection is to the
> use of the word "birdie" in this context?

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juergen piezo

Re: P3 Broad Birdie & straw men...

Hi Johnny

The OMNI6 had the same birdie problems. The birdie elimination routine is not all that effective and leaves holes in the band. I dont see how a more powerful DSP is going to help birdie removal.

The best solution is a redesign of the boards with more shielding. The K3 is a very "open" design with regards to the internal shielding. When I added the second receiver I used some space blanket material that was grounded to the chasis, it did help a small amount.

Ten Tec did improve the shielding for the 10 meter birdie problem, however that was not very effective also. Most operators used homebrew shielding solutions using 3rd party shielding material. I used space blanket material which helped.

No Birdies will happen In the K4, I suppose. Birdie problems are too hard to fix after the design has been released. The K3 is what it is, I will just wait for the K4 or wait for some other brand of miracle radio. The openHPSDR Hermes is starting to look good!

This sunspot cycle looks like its going to be a poor one. I can ignore the birdies on the higher bands by not using the radio, I wont be missing much. The K3 unfortunately needs the preamp to be left on, on the higher bands which makes the birdies worst, especially with the P3. You cant win!

73

Juergen

--- On Sun, 6/12/11, Johnny Siu <[hidden email]> wrote:

> From: Johnny Siu <[hidden email]>
> Subject: [Elecraft] P3 Broad Birdie & straw men...
> To: "[hidden email]" <[hidden email]>, "Reflector Elecraft" <[hidden email]>
> Date: Sunday, June 12, 2011, 11:44 PM
> Hello Jim,
>
> I fully appreciate the PITA and am annoyed about it.
>
> The elimination of internal birdies require substantial
> amount of DSP power. In the circumstances, by taking
> advantage of the module design of K3, a new more
> powerful DSP board to replace the existing one may be the
> ultimate solution in the future. Of course, this will take
> Elecraft some time to implement
>
> At the current moment, I still feel that K3 is the
> smallest portable high performance radio with true dual
> receivers. It will not be practical for me to take my
> IC7800 easily to other QTH to operate.
>
> I am going to do some IOTA operation this week end and
> will bring my K3 with me.
>
> TNX & 73,
>
>
> Johnny VR2XMC
>
> 從︰ Jim Brown <[hidden email]>
> 收件人︰ Reflector Elecraft <[hidden email]>
> 傳送日期︰ 2011年06月13日 (週一) 1:25 PM
> 主題︰ Re: [Elecraft] P3 Broad Birdie & straw
> men...
>
> I understand exactly what you are talking about -- my case
> #2, but I
> also realized that what K3TUF and N6XI are talking about
> was my case
> #1. Your birdies and noise are from OUTSIDE the radio.
> Their's are
> only INSIDE the radio. I experience both.
>
> Notice that Phil says "Must be on the IF because it is
> never heard even
> when it is in the
> apparent bandwidth window."
>
> These INTERIOR birdies also get MUCH stronger when you have
> the SUB RX
> turned on. During the VHF contest, I split my time
> between CW and SSB,
> with the SUB RX listening to whichever one I wasn't
> transmitting on.
> The thing that's a PITA about this is that you think that
> these are
> signals that you can work, so you switch from SSB to CW to
> work them,
> but they aren't really there. There are also some fairly
> weak
> birdies/noise peaks that look like weak CW signals, but are
> not. And I
> worked nearly a dozen weak CW signals that looked like
> those
> birdies/noise peaks, and as you tune to work them, they
> also disappear.
>
> 73, Jim K9YC
>
> On 6/12/2011 6:34 PM, John Ragle wrote:
> > second paragraph, and I believe the other posts are
> talking about
> > exactly the same thing. If you will take the time to
> read what they
> > wrote, you might recognize as much. Perhaps your
> objection is to the
> > use of the word "birdie" in this context?
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

Stephen G4SJP

Re: P3 Broad Birdie & straw men...

I can only assume that either the majority of the birdies arise as a result
of the second RX (which I do not have) or I'm just plain lucky, as I haven't
recognised any spurious signals at all in my 3 years of ownership of the K3.

Stephen G4SJP
K3 #980
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Johnny Siu

Re: P3 Broad Birdie & straw men...

In reply to this post by juergen piezo

Hello Om,

Although K3 comes with excellent specifications, the construction materials are fairly primitive . From my observation of other radios, there are not too many shielded metal boxes inside K3. Perhaps K3's small size gives some restrictions in design. I prefer di-cast cases but the radio will be heavier.

Sent from my iPhone 4

juergen <[hidden email]> 於 2011年6月13日下午3:32 寫道：

> Hi Johnny
>
> The OMNI6 had the same birdie problems. The birdie elimination routine is not all that effective and leaves holes in the band. I dont see how a more powerful DSP is going to help birdie removal.
>
> The best solution is a redesign of the boards with more shielding. The K3 is a very "open" design with regards to the internal shielding. When I added the second receiver I used some space blanket material that was grounded to the chasis, it did help a small amount.
>
> Ten Tec did improve the shielding for the 10 meter birdie problem, however that was not very effective also. Most operators used homebrew shielding solutions using 3rd party shielding material. I used space blanket material which helped.
>
> No Birdies will happen In the K4, I suppose. Birdie problems are too hard to fix after the design has been released. The K3 is what it is, I will just wait for the K4 or wait for some other brand of miracle radio. The openHPSDR Hermes is starting to look good!
>
> This sunspot cycle looks like its going to be a poor one. I can ignore the birdies on the higher bands by not using the radio, I wont be missing much. The K3 unfortunately needs the preamp to be left on, on the higher bands which makes the birdies worst, especially with the P3. You cant win!
>
> 73
>
> Juergen
>
>
>
> --- On Sun, 6/12/11, Johnny Siu <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> From: Johnny Siu <[hidden email]>
>> Subject: [Elecraft] P3 Broad Birdie & straw men...
>> To: "[hidden email]" <[hidden email]>, "Reflector Elecraft" <[hidden email]>
>> Date: Sunday, June 12, 2011, 11:44 PM
>> Hello Jim,
>>
>> I fully appreciate the PITA and am annoyed about it.
>>
>> The elimination of internal birdies require substantial
>> amount of DSP power. In the circumstances, by taking
>> advantage of the module design of K3, a new more
>> powerful DSP board to replace the existing one may be the
>> ultimate solution in the future. Of course, this will take
>> Elecraft some time to implement
>>
>> At the current moment, I still feel that K3 is the
>> smallest portable high performance radio with true dual
>> receivers. It will not be practical for me to take my
>> IC7800 easily to other QTH to operate.
>>
>> I am going to do some IOTA operation this week end and
>> will bring my K3 with me.
>>
>> TNX & 73,
>>
>>
>> Johnny VR2XMC
>>
>> 從︰ Jim Brown <[hidden email]>
>> 收件人︰ Reflector Elecraft <[hidden email]>
>> 傳送日期︰ 2011年06月13日 (週一) 1:25 PM
>> 主題︰ Re: [Elecraft] P3 Broad Birdie & straw
>> men...
>>
>> I understand exactly what you are talking about -- my case
>> #2, but I
>> also realized that what K3TUF and N6XI are talking about
>> was my case
>> #1. Your birdies and noise are from OUTSIDE the radio.
>> Their's are
>> only INSIDE the radio. I experience both.
>>
>> Notice that Phil says "Must be on the IF because it is
>> never heard even
>> when it is in the
>> apparent bandwidth window."
>>
>> These INTERIOR birdies also get MUCH stronger when you have
>> the SUB RX
>> turned on. During the VHF contest, I split my time
>> between CW and SSB,
>> with the SUB RX listening to whichever one I wasn't
>> transmitting on.
>> The thing that's a PITA about this is that you think that
>> these are
>> signals that you can work, so you switch from SSB to CW to
>> work them,
>> but they aren't really there. There are also some fairly
>> weak
>> birdies/noise peaks that look like weak CW signals, but are
>> not. And I
>> worked nearly a dozen weak CW signals that looked like
>> those
>> birdies/noise peaks, and as you tune to work them, they
>> also disappear.
>>
>> 73, Jim K9YC
>>
>> On 6/12/2011 6:34 PM, John Ragle wrote:
>>> second paragraph, and I believe the other posts are
>> talking about
>>> exactly the same thing. If you will take the time to
>> read what they
>>> wrote, you might recognize as much. Perhaps your
>> objection is to the
>>> use of the word "birdie" in this context?
>>
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> Elecraft mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> Elecraft mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
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>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

Johnny Siu

P3 Broad Birdie & straw men...

In reply to this post by Stephen G4SJP

There are quite a number of birdies. DSP power has been used to eliminate most of them so that you do not hear them. Anyway, K3 is still the smallest radio equipped with true dual receivers. It is one of the reasons that I am still keeping my K3.

TNX & 73,

Johnny VR2XMC

從︰ Stephen Prior <[hidden email]>
收件人︰ [hidden email]
傳送日期︰ 2011年06月13日 (週一) 4:09 PM
主題︰ Re: [Elecraft] P3 Broad Birdie & straw men...

I can only assume that either the majority of the birdies arise as a result
of the second RX (which I do not have) or I'm just plain lucky, as I haven't
recognised any spurious signals at all in my 3 years of ownership of the K3.

Stephen G4SJP
K3 #980
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David Gilbert

Re: P3 Broad Birdie & straw men...

In reply to this post by Stephen G4SJP

I don't have a P3 so can't comment there, but I do own a K3 and spent a
lot of time trying to eliminate birdies when I first got it (before the
arrival of the excellent SIG RMV software feature). The second receiver
is MUCH better shielded than the first receiver and has virtually zero
birdies of its own, but in my opinion the second receiver contributes
greatly to the birdies that occur in the first receiver. In general
(but not always), I found it important to keep cables away from the
shield of the second receiver to minimize the birdies in the first
receiver.

Several other K3 owners who only have the first receiver have made the
same comment that you just did, so I'm not surprised to hear it again.
And of course, if you listen for the birdies while having an antenna
connected to the antenna port, band noise will mask many of them.

73,
Dave AB7E

On 6/13/2011 1:09 AM, Stephen Prior wrote:
> I can only assume that either the majority of the birdies arise as a result
> of the second RX (which I do not have) or I'm just plain lucky, as I haven't
> recognised any spurious signals at all in my 3 years of ownership of the K3.
>
> Stephen G4SJP
> K3 #980
______________________________________________________________
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Joe Subich, W4TV-4

Re: P3 Broad Birdie & straw men...

> The second receiver is MUCH better shielded than the first receiver
> and has virtually zero birdies of its own, but in my opinion the
> second receiver contributes greatly to the birdies that occur in the
> first receiver.

I don't agree ... based on my two K3s - both have subreceivers.

I have very few birdies that I can't track to specific Ethernet devices
somewhere in the house. Perhaps I've been lucky in the way I installed
the subreceivers but I did not take any undue care in routing cables.

One of these days I will go on a search and destroy mission for all of
the offending devices. I will remove/disable all of the unused network
cards and shield/choke/replace switches and wireless access devices as
necessary. I hope that that improving the antenna system and getting
away from the 30' high Windom that hangs directly over the shack will
help with the Ethernet birdies <G>.

73,

... Joe, W4TV

On 6/13/2011 4:34 PM, David Gilbert wrote:

>
> I don't have a P3 so can't comment there, but I do own a K3 and spent a
> lot of time trying to eliminate birdies when I first got it (before the
> arrival of the excellent SIG RMV software feature). The second receiver
> is MUCH better shielded than the first receiver and has virtually zero
> birdies of its own, but in my opinion the second receiver contributes
> greatly to the birdies that occur in the first receiver. In general
> (but not always), I found it important to keep cables away from the
> shield of the second receiver to minimize the birdies in the first
> receiver.
>
> Several other K3 owners who only have the first receiver have made the
> same comment that you just did, so I'm not surprised to hear it again.
> And of course, if you listen for the birdies while having an antenna
> connected to the antenna port, band noise will mask many of them.
>
> 73,
> Dave AB7E
>
>
>
> On 6/13/2011 1:09 AM, Stephen Prior wrote:
>> I can only assume that either the majority of the birdies arise as a result
>> of the second RX (which I do not have) or I'm just plain lucky, as I haven't
>> recognised any spurious signals at all in my 3 years of ownership of the K3.
>>
>> Stephen G4SJP
>> K3 #980
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David Gilbert

Re: P3 Broad Birdie & straw men...

In reply to this post by juergen piezo

Juergen, how exactly does the SIG RMV feature in the K3 "leave holes in
the band"?? I have zapped several dozen birdies that way and don't have
any holes at all. Yes ... there is a sort of "whooshing" sounds as you
tune across some of them (the ones that required greater shift), but I
do a lot of contesting and have never experienced any signal drop out
... and per my understanding of how SIG RMV works there should not be
any anyway.

Dave AB7E

On 6/13/2011 12:32 AM, juergen wrote:
> The birdie elimination routine is not all that effective and leaves holes in the band. I dont see how a more powerful DSP is going to help birdie removal.
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juergen piezo

Re: P3 Broad Birdie & straw men...

Hi David

Thats what I am referring too, its the tuning by product effect. Now if there is weak signal on that spot, it makes it very difficult to copy or tune in a station. It is as if the signal "drops into a hole" or that the synthesizer skips or jumps that spot. Thats the best description I can give. Anyway you have to tune carefully.

On bands where there are a lot of birdies that have been removed, if you spin the VFO fast you can notice the "holes" 12 Meters is a case in point, there are several birdies there, and the band slice is small. You notice the tuning weirdness more on a narrow band like 12 meters. You also have the pre-amp engaged and the noise floor is low, any quirks on receive become very obvious.

Holes or artifacts same difference!

Anyway its a quirk of the radio and thats it, I can live with it!

73
Juergen

--- On Mon, 6/13/11, David Gilbert <[hidden email]> wrote:

> From: David Gilbert <[hidden email]>
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] P3 Broad Birdie & straw men...
> To: [hidden email]
> Date: Monday, June 13, 2011, 2:29 PM
>
> Juergen, how exactly does the SIG RMV feature in the K3
> "leave holes in
> the band"?? I have zapped several dozen birdies that
> way and don't have
> any holes at all. Yes ... there is a sort of
> "whooshing" sounds as you
> tune across some of them (the ones that required greater
> shift), but I
> do a lot of contesting and have never experienced any
> signal drop out
> ... and per my understanding of how SIG RMV works there
> should not be
> any anyway.
>
> Dave AB7E
>
>
> On 6/13/2011 12:32 AM, juergen wrote:
> > The birdie elimination routine is not
> all that effective and leaves holes in the band. I dont see
> how a more powerful DSP is going to help birdie
> removal.
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>

Eric Swartz - WA6HHQ

Re: P3 Broad Birdie & straw men...

Administrator

In reply to this post by David Gilbert

There should be no 'holes' with the K3 SIGRMV birdie removal method.

At the specified tuning point we simply shift the VFO and DSP internal
oscillators a small amount in opposite directions to move the weak
birdie and still recieve on exactly the same frequency. (Birdies are
typically the result of mixing of higher harmonics of the internal radio
oscillators and hence move in multiples of the amount any oscillator is
moved, pushing them well outside of the receive filter pass-band.)

73, Eric WA6HHQ

---
www.elecraft.com

On 6/13/2011 2:29 PM, David Gilbert wrote:

> Juergen, how exactly does the SIG RMV feature in the K3 "leave holes in
> the band"?? I have zapped several dozen birdies that way and don't have
> any holes at all. Yes ... there is a sort of "whooshing" sounds as you
> tune across some of them (the ones that required greater shift), but I
> do a lot of contesting and have never experienced any signal drop out
> ... and per my understanding of how SIG RMV works there should not be
> any anyway.
>
> Dave AB7E
>
>
> On 6/13/2011 12:32 AM, juergen wrote:
>> The birdie elimination routine is not all that effective and leaves holes in the band. I dont see how a more powerful DSP is going to help birdie removal.

KD7PY

Re: P3 Broad Birdie

In reply to this post by Phil K3TUF

I ran the whole VHF June contest with my K3/10K + Mirage A1015g brick + 8877 at 1500w out on 6 meters and have no trouble with the P3. in fact it helped me spot some very weak sig I would have missed with normal searching.
although I found that the noise blanker in my Orion ll does a better job on the noise crud that I have living in the city..

BUT...when I go to CW with the K3 its a different ball game, the K3 blows the doors off the Orion.
when I went to wk some really weak cw sigs I turned on the APF and did the sig stand out,
The K3 is a real CW dream machine..

Well done Elecraft... This rig is a keeper......

Ed K7WIA