RE: Translation - 2nd RX

[Dave Agsten]

> Dave, N1LQ wrote : The delay of the second receiver
option is to me both highly
 regrettable
and somewhat deceptive.

I, for one, based my purchase decision greatly on this
option being
ready for prime time which is obviously was not and
apparently will not
 
be any time soon.  Production delays are forgivable
and understandable
but discovering that this option which is touted as a
big-time feature
but is really no where near ready is confidence
deflating.

I have been personally patient waiting for my K3 (as
are many others)
and occasionally publicly supportive on this list of
the delays that
Elecraft has been experiencing. Now we discover that a
MAJOR K3 feature
 
is no where near production ready, if even designed at
this time. Come
on.... <

I have to agree with Dave here. It's the same
situation here. The delays are understandable. Even a
SHORT, further delay with the KRX3, was accepable. Now
it's listed merely as "DELAYED". What does that really
mean? If I recall correctly, the KRX3 2nd receiver
option has been on the Elecraft info/order sheet, with
no mention of being available "in the future", at any
time since its annoucement. All of the info sheets I
have from Dayton show the KRX3 as being like any other
option...such as filters. This option was certainly a
deciding factor in ordering a K3. It wasn't until
quite a few orders were taken that it was suddenly
listed with a later shipping date that continues, even
now, to slip. ( A big slip apparently, since now there
isn't even a projected date ) I was never informed
when placing my order on May 25th that the KRX3 would
not be available with the rest of my order. Was anyone
else who ordered before the KRX3 delay was posted
notified that the it would not be immediately
available? My 50% deposit was calculated with the KRX3
option included. It would be nice to know exactly
what's going on here. If it is, as Wayne said, that
they are redesigning for a valid reason, then there is
no way the KRX3 should have been listed as an
available option from Day 1.

I was thinking about having my deposit applied to a K2
and waiting until "who knows when" for the 2nd
production run to be shipped. Now, with the KRX3 news,
I'm not sure what direction to go. It has made me
decide to scrap the K2 idea. Perhaps an Orion II or an
Omni VII for now and continue to wait and see on the
K3. I could probably have either Ten-Tec within a week
or so. Then, when the K3 comes along, I can do my own
side-by-side.

And, in reading a few of the latest list postings,
there appears to be some issues with using the K3
being used in a certain manner before the KRX3 is
available. ie. VFO A/B things. To me, having one band
on VFO A and another on VFO B is perfectly normal and
should not be an issue.

It does seem that the K3 was actually announced and
released a bit before it was ready for Prime Time.
That was probably driven by the Visalia and Dayton
dates which, obviously, would not be slipped.

73,
Dave N8AG


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[Stewart Baker]

And while were are at it, how about the KDVR3 (Digital Voice
Recorder Option). This also seems to have slipped into the DELAYED
category. For me, in addition to the 2nd receiver this modules
availability was a decision maker. Total lack of transparency....

Stewart G3RXQ
On Fri, 18 Jan 2008 09:33:05 -0800 (PST), Dave Agsten wrote:

>> Dave, N1LQ wrote : The delay of the second receiver
> option is to me both highly
> regrettable
> and somewhat deceptive.
>
> I, for one, based my purchase decision greatly on this
> option being
> ready for prime time which is obviously was not and
> apparently will not
>
> be any time soon.  Production delays are forgivable
> and understandable
> but discovering that this option which is touted as a
> big-time feature
> but is really no where near ready is confidence
> deflating.
>
> I have been personally patient waiting for my K3 (as
> are many others)
> and occasionally publicly supportive on this list of
> the delays that
> Elecraft has been experiencing. Now we discover that a
> MAJOR K3 feature
>
> is no where near production ready, if even designed at
> this time. Come
> on.... <
>
> I have to agree with Dave here. It's the same
> situation here. The delays are understandable. Even a
> SHORT, further delay with the KRX3, was accepable. Now
> it's listed merely as "DELAYED". What does that really
> mean? If I recall correctly, the KRX3 2nd receiver
> option has been on the Elecraft info/order sheet, with
> no mention of being available "in the future", at any
> time since its annoucement. All of the info sheets I
> have from Dayton show the KRX3 as being like any other
> option...such as filters. This option was certainly a
> deciding factor in ordering a K3. It wasn't until
> quite a few orders were taken that it was suddenly
> listed with a later shipping date that continues, even
> now, to slip. ( A big slip apparently, since now there
> isn't even a projected date ) I was never informed
> when placing my order on May 25th that the KRX3 would
> not be available with the rest of my order. Was anyone
> else who ordered before the KRX3 delay was posted
> notified that the it would not be immediately
> available? My 50% deposit was calculated with the KRX3
> option included. It would be nice to know exactly
> what's going on here. If it is, as Wayne said, that
> they are redesigning for a valid reason, then there is
> no way the KRX3 should have been listed as an
> available option from Day 1.
>
> I was thinking about having my deposit applied to a K2
> and waiting until "who knows when" for the 2nd
> production run to be shipped. Now, with the KRX3 news,
> I'm not sure what direction to go. It has made me
> decide to scrap the K2 idea. Perhaps an Orion II or an
> Omni VII for now and continue to wait and see on the
> K3. I could probably have either Ten-Tec within a week
> or so. Then, when the K3 comes along, I can do my own
> side-by-side.
>
> And, in reading a few of the latest list postings,
> there appears to be some issues with using the K3
> being used in a certain manner before the KRX3 is
> available. ie. VFO A/B things. To me, having one band
> on VFO A and another on VFO B is perfectly normal and
> should not be an issue.
>
> It does seem that the K3 was actually announced and
> released a bit before it was ready for Prime Time.
> That was probably driven by the Visalia and Dayton
> dates which, obviously, would not be slipped.
>
> 73,
> Dave N8AG
>
>
> ________________________________________________________________

________________

> ____
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[N4GW]

These delays are dissapointing to me as well, but I would rather have it right, than to go out with issues.  I look at the Yaesu FT-2000 (and the 9000 for that fact) was released with a lot of issues which still have not been resolved.  I would have Elecraft resolve these things before releasing them, no matter how dissapointing it may seem

Mike, N4GW

-------------- Original message from Stewart Baker <[hidden email]>: --------------

> And while were are at it, how about the KDVR3 (Digital Voice
> Recorder Option). This also seems to have slipped into the DELAYED
> category. For me, in addition to the 2nd receiver this modules
> availability was a decision maker. Total lack of transparency....
>
> Stewart G3RXQ
> On Fri, 18 Jan 2008 09:33:05 -0800 (PST), Dave Agsten wrote:
> >> Dave, N1LQ wrote : The delay of the second receiver
> > option is to me both highly
> > regrettable
> > and somewhat deceptive.
> >
> > I, for one, based my purchase decision greatly on this
> > option being
> > ready for prime time which is obviously was not and
> > apparently will not
> >
> > be any time soon. Production delays are forgivable
> > and understandable
> > but discovering that this option which is touted as a
> > big-time feature
> > but is really no where near ready is confidence
> > deflating.
> >
> > I have been personally patient waiting for my K3 (as
> > are many others)
> > and occasionally publicly supportive on this list of
> > the delays that
> > Elecraft has been experiencing. Now we discover that a
> > MAJOR K3 feature
> >
> > is no where near production ready, if even designed at
> > this time. Come
> > on.... <
> >
> > I have to agree with Dave here. It's the same
> > situation here. The delays are understandable. Even a
> > SHORT, further delay with the KRX3, was accepable. Now
> > it's listed merely as "DELAYED". What does that really
> > mean? If I recall correctly, the KRX3 2nd receiver
> > option has been on the Elecraft info/order sheet, with
> > no mention of being available "in the future", at any
> > time since its annoucement. All of the info sheets I
> > have from Dayton show the KRX3 as being like any other
> > option...such as filters. This option was certainly a
> > deciding factor in ordering a K3. It wasn't until
> > quite a few orders were taken that it was suddenly
> > listed with a later shipping date that continues, even
> > now, to slip. ( A big slip apparently, since now there
> > isn't even a projected date ) I was never informed
> > when placing my order on May 25th that the KRX3 would
> > not be available with the rest of my order. Was anyone
> > else who ordered before the KRX3 delay was posted
> > notified that the it would not be immediately
> > available? My 50% deposit was calculated with the KRX3
> > option included. It would be nice to know exactly
> > what's going on here. If it is, as Wayne said, that
> > they are redesigning for a valid reason, then there is
> > no way the KRX3 should have been listed as an
> > available option from Day 1.
> >
> > I was thinking about having my deposit applied to a K2
> > and waiting until "who knows when" for the 2nd
> > production run to be shipped. Now, with the KRX3 news,
> > I'm not sure what direction to go. It has made me
> > decide to scrap the K2 idea. Perhaps an Orion II or an
> > Omni VII for now and continue to wait and see on the
> > K3. I could probably have either Ten-Tec within a week
> > or so. Then, when the K3 comes along, I can do my own
> > side-by-side.
> >
> > And, in reading a few of the latest list postings,
> > there appears to be some issues with using the K3
> > being used in a certain manner before the KRX3 is
> > available. ie. VFO A/B things. To me, having one band
> > on VFO A and another on VFO B is perfectly normal and
> > should not be an issue.
> >
> > It does seem that the K3 was actually announced and
> > released a bit before it was ready for Prime Time.
> > That was probably driven by the Visalia and Dayton
> > dates which, obviously, would not be slipped.
> >
> > 73,
> > Dave N8AG
> >
> >
> > ________________________________________________________________
> ________________
> > ____
> > Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your home page.
> > http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs 
> > _______________________________________________
> > Elecraft mailing list
> > Post to: [hidden email]
> > You must be a subscriber to post to the list.
> > Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.):
> > http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft 
> >
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> > Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com 
>
>
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[Dave Larson-2]

2 days ago I received the invoice for my K3.  Lisa, without my asking,
applied my full payment for the 2nd rx to the K3.  I now have the 2nd rx on
backorder with none of my money tied up in it.
 I feel Elecraft handled this case properly.  I am as disappointed as anyone
that the 2nd rx may be a long way off. Elecraft could have shipped a lower
quality 2nd rx and everything would have been just fine until we started to
use it and found that it was inferior to the main rx. Doing so would have
damaged Elecraft's reputation long term.
I am sure it was a very hard and disappointing decision to have to return to
the drawing board. Elecraft did the right thing in my opinion and when it is
all over, their fine reputation that they have had in the past will be
maintained.

Dave, K8AA

----- Original Message -----
From: "Dave Agsten" <[hidden email]>
To: <[hidden email]>
Sent: Friday, January 18, 2008 12:33 PM
Subject: [Elecraft] RE: Translation - 2nd RX

>> Dave, N1LQ wrote : The delay of the second receiver
> option is to me both highly
> regrettable
> and somewhat deceptive.
>
> I, for one, based my purchase decision greatly on this
> option being
> ready for prime time which is obviously was not and
> apparently will not
>
> be any time soon.  Production delays are forgivable
> and understandable
> but discovering that this option which is touted as a
> big-time feature
> but is really no where near ready is confidence
> deflating.
>
> I have been personally patient waiting for my K3 (as
> are many others)
> and occasionally publicly supportive on this list of
> the delays that
> Elecraft has been experiencing. Now we discover that a
> MAJOR K3 feature
>
> is no where near production ready, if even designed at
> this time. Come
> on.... <
>
> I have to agree with Dave here. It's the same
> situation here. The delays are understandable. Even a
> SHORT, further delay with the KRX3, was accepable. Now
> it's listed merely as "DELAYED". What does that really
> mean? If I recall correctly, the KRX3 2nd receiver
> option has been on the Elecraft info/order sheet, with
> no mention of being available "in the future", at any
> time since its annoucement. All of the info sheets I
> have from Dayton show the KRX3 as being like any other
> option...such as filters. This option was certainly a
> deciding factor in ordering a K3. It wasn't until
> quite a few orders were taken that it was suddenly
> listed with a later shipping date that continues, even
> now, to slip. ( A big slip apparently, since now there
> isn't even a projected date ) I was never informed
> when placing my order on May 25th that the KRX3 would
> not be available with the rest of my order. Was anyone
> else who ordered before the KRX3 delay was posted
> notified that the it would not be immediately
> available? My 50% deposit was calculated with the KRX3
> option included. It would be nice to know exactly
> what's going on here. If it is, as Wayne said, that
> they are redesigning for a valid reason, then there is
> no way the KRX3 should have been listed as an
> available option from Day 1.
>
> I was thinking about having my deposit applied to a K2
> and waiting until "who knows when" for the 2nd
> production run to be shipped. Now, with the KRX3 news,
> I'm not sure what direction to go. It has made me
> decide to scrap the K2 idea. Perhaps an Orion II or an
> Omni VII for now and continue to wait and see on the
> K3. I could probably have either Ten-Tec within a week
> or so. Then, when the K3 comes along, I can do my own
> side-by-side.
>
> And, in reading a few of the latest list postings,
> there appears to be some issues with using the K3
> being used in a certain manner before the KRX3 is
> available. ie. VFO A/B things. To me, having one band
> on VFO A and another on VFO B is perfectly normal and
> should not be an issue.
>
> It does seem that the K3 was actually announced and
> released a bit before it was ready for Prime Time.
> That was probably driven by the Visalia and Dayton
> dates which, obviously, would not be slipped.
>
> 73,
> Dave N8AG
>
>
>
> ____________________________________________________________________________________
> Never miss a thing.  Make Yahoo your home page.
> http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs
> _______________________________________________
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> Post to: [hidden email]
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>
>
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[Julian, G4ILO]

Dave Larson-2 wrote

I am sure it was a very hard and disappointing decision to have to return to
the drawing board. Elecraft did the right thing in my opinion and when it is
all over, their fine reputation that they have had in the past will be
maintained.

Whilst I tend to agree with you, it's easier for some who already have well equipped shacks to live with that decision than others. I still feel sorry for the guy a few months ago who sold his only radio so as to put down a deposit on a K3, never realizing how long he would have to wait. Vendors do have a responsibility to make accurate advertising and at the time I placed my deposit I never realized how much of the K3 was just an idea rather than an actual working prototype. Since I now have my albeit incomplete K3 it's hard to still feel annoyed about it, but I'm going to remember this episode when the K4 is announced in another 8 years time and I may well decide to wait that one out as a result.