Elecraft

Re: K3 Curious behavio

Classic

List

Threaded

34 messages Options

Doug Faunt N6TQS +1-510-655-8604

Re: Memory sticks

I recall this discussion lately, but in looking around, I find I don't
locate the information necessary to actually separate the two functions.
Perhaps if the procedure were more visible, there'd be less confusion.

I can't locate the sizes of the firmware updates, either.

73, doug

Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 11:16:42 -0800
From: Vic K2VCO <[hidden email]>

Geoffrey Mackenzie-Kennedy wrote:
> The lack of a computer could be resolved, it's getting the internet
> connection in the remote area that's the problem. The memory sticks used
> by our daughter are about a couple of inches long, USB connector, can
> store a lot of music, photos and other data and are not expensive.

As long as you have a computer at the remote location on which to run
the K3 Utility, the firmware files can be downloaded to the memory stick
at a location which does have internet service. Then you could take it
to your remote location, and plug it into the computer which could
transfer the firmware to the K3.

The utility has the option of downloading the files from Elecraft's
server, or of using files stored on the local computer (including on a
memory stick, CD, etc.).
--
_______________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Post to: [hidden email]
You must be a subscriber to post to the list.
Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.):
http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft

Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm
Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com

Bob Cunnings NW8L

Re: K3 Curious behavio

In reply to this post by Van W1WCG

2-way bus, yes, but symmetrical, no. The USB flash card and the
Serial<->USB adaptor are both USB peripheral devices, so they can't
talk to each other directly - they both expect to be connected to a
USB host port, as found on a laptop for instance. The host port
masters the bus, something the peripherals can't do.

Bob NW8L

On Nov 29, 2007 11:58 AM, Van W1WCG <[hidden email]> wrote:

> I wonder if the Serial-to-USB adapter sold by Elecraft could be used
> to access a USB flash memory card plugged into the USB end of
> the adapter -- it's basically a 2-way bus anyway. Of course it would
> mean yet more code and memory usage in the K3......
>
> Van, W1WCG
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Don Wilhelm" <[hidden email]>
> To: "Geoffrey Mackenzie-Kennedy" <[hidden email]
>
>
> > Geoff,
> >
> > A USB port is not necessary - but yes it would require some sort of
> > memory slot to be added to the K3. I am thinking of something similar
> > to the Compact Flash card used in Nikon (and other) cameras. Just
> > memory - without all the other protocol stuff associated with a 'port'.
> > The only 'computational' need is for the K3 to address the memory.
> >
> > 73,
> > Don W3FPR
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Post to: [hidden email]
> You must be a subscriber to post to the list.
> Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.):
> http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm
> Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
>

David Fleming-2

Re: Memory sticks

In reply to this post by Doug Faunt N6TQS +1-510-655-8604

You can access the firmware files using your web
browser.

ftp://ftp.elecraft.com/K3/firmware/

David, W4SMT

--- Doug Faunt N6TQS +1-510-655-8604 <[hidden email]>
wrote:

> I recall this discussion lately, but in looking
> around, I find I don't
> locate the information necessary to actually
> separate the two functions.
> Perhaps if the procedure were more visible, there'd
> be less confusion.
>
> I can't locate the sizes of the firmware updates,
> either.
>
> 73, doug
>
> Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 11:16:42 -0800
> From: Vic K2VCO <[hidden email]>
>
> Geoffrey Mackenzie-Kennedy wrote:
> > The lack of a computer could be resolved, it's
> getting the internet
> > connection in the remote area that's the
> problem. The memory sticks used
> > by our daughter are about a couple of inches
> long, USB connector, can
> > store a lot of music, photos and other data and
> are not expensive.
>
> As long as you have a computer at the remote
> location on which to run
> the K3 Utility, the firmware files can be
> downloaded to the memory stick
> at a location which does have internet service.
> Then you could take it
> to your remote location, and plug it into the
> computer which could
> transfer the firmware to the K3.
>
> The utility has the option of downloading the
> files from Elecraft's
> server, or of using files stored on the local
> computer (including on a
> memory stick, CD, etc.).
> --
> _______________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Post to: [hidden email]
> You must be a subscriber to post to the list.
> Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.):
> http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>
>
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm
> Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
>

N5GE

Re: Memory sticks (was: K3 Curious behavior)

In reply to this post by M0XDF

On Thu, 29 Nov 2007 17:12:38 +0000, you wrote:

>Er, isn't that device called a PC?
>
>A Pocket PC might be able to do this - no I don't have that skillset.
>
>
>On 29/11/07 17:08, "Vic K2VCO" <[hidden email]> sent:
>
>> Maybe someone could build a device that would accept a memory card and
>> plug into the RS232 port? It would have to know the protocol for loading
>> the MCU and DSP. It could also be used to save configurations.

I would assume that most contesters will have a lap top with them for logging,
etc.

One could save the operator prefs on memory sticks and load them via a laptop
USB port. After all the Laptop recognizes a memory stick as another drive.
Uploading user prefs would be easy this way.

As for not having a computer connected to my main rig; That will never be the
case in my shack. I've got too much stuff for prop forecasting, logging, etc.
to not have a computer connected. If I ever do any mobile HF work I plan to use
the K3 I have ordered for that, and it will be connected to a laptop.

Having said that I want you all to know that I have very fond memories of slowly
tuning the bands looking for other hams calling CQ back in the days before
clusters, and computer logging, but, that was then and this is now ;o)

Tom, N5GE - SWOT 3537

"They that can give up essential liberty
to obtain a little temporary safety deserve
neither liberty nor safety."

--Benjamin Franklin 1775

http://www.n5ge.com
http://www.eQSL.cc/Member.cfm?N5GE

_______________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Post to: [hidden email]
You must be a subscriber to post to the list.
Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.):
http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft

Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm
Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com

Amateur Radio Operator N5GE

Chris G3SJJ

Re: Memory sticks

I have to say I am totally puzzled by this thread. You buy the K3 in
full knowledge that new versions of firmware will be available from time
to time and how they are accessed. You see the connectors in the rear
panel so you understand what is required. Fullstop/Period. No other
dicsussion required..

End.

Chrid G3SJJ

Tom Childers, N5GE wrote:

> On Thu, 29 Nov 2007 17:12:38 +0000, you wrote:
>
>
>> Er, isn't that device called a PC?
>>
>> A Pocket PC might be able to do this - no I don't have that skillset.
>>
>>
>> On 29/11/07 17:08, "Vic K2VCO" <[hidden email]> sent:
>>
>>
>>> Maybe someone could build a device that would accept a memory card and
>>> plug into the RS232 port? It would have to know the protocol for loading
>>> the MCU and DSP. It could also be used to save configurations.
>>>
>
> I would assume that most contesters will have a lap top with them for logging,
> etc.
>
> One could save the operator prefs on memory sticks and load them via a laptop
> USB port. After all the Laptop recognizes a memory stick as another drive.
> Uploading user prefs would be easy this way.
>
> As for not having a computer connected to my main rig; That will never be the
> case in my shack. I've got too much stuff for prop forecasting, logging, etc.
> to not have a computer connected. If I ever do any mobile HF work I plan to use
> the K3 I have ordered for that, and it will be connected to a laptop.
>
> Having said that I want you all to know that I have very fond memories of slowly
> tuning the bands looking for other hams calling CQ back in the days before
> clusters, and computer logging, but, that was then and this is now ;o)
>
> Tom, N5GE - SWOT 3537
>
> "They that can give up essential liberty
> to obtain a little temporary safety deserve
> neither liberty nor safety."
>
> --Benjamin Franklin 1775
>
> http://www.n5ge.com
> http://www.eQSL.cc/Member.cfm?N5GE
>
> _______________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Post to: [hidden email]
> You must be a subscriber to post to the list.
> Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.):
> http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm
> Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
>
>

Greg - AB7R

Re: Memory sticks (was: K3 Curious behavior)

In reply to this post by Vic K2VCO

Exactly, but with the laptop or other computer connected you don't need the thumb drive.
Just setup the configs and save them using the K3FW Utility. If a user has a K3 at home also
they should be able to copy the configuration from the K3FW directory to the thumb drive and
then restore it as necessary at the contest/DX site.

-------------------------
73,
Greg - AB7R
Whidbey Island WA
NA-065
K3#0009

On Thu Nov 29 17:14 , "Tom Childers, N5GE" sent:

>On Thu, 29 Nov 2007 17:12:38 +0000, you wrote:
>
>>Er, isn't that device called a PC?
>>
>>A Pocket PC might be able to do this - no I don't have that skillset.
>>
>>
>>On 29/11/07 17:08, "Vic K2VCO" [hidden email]> sent:
>>
>>> Maybe someone could build a device that would accept a memory card and
>>> plug into the RS232 port? It would have to know the protocol for loading
>>> the MCU and DSP. It could also be used to save configurations.
>
>I would assume that most contesters will have a lap top with them for logging,
>etc.
>
>One could save the operator prefs on memory sticks and load them via a laptop
>USB port. After all the Laptop recognizes a memory stick as another drive.
>Uploading user prefs would be easy this way.
>
>As for not having a computer connected to my main rig; That will never be the
>case in my shack. I've got too much stuff for prop forecasting, logging, etc.
>to not have a computer connected. If I ever do any mobile HF work I plan to use
>the K3 I have ordered for that, and it will be connected to a laptop.
>
>Having said that I want you all to know that I have very fond memories of slowly
>tuning the bands looking for other hams calling CQ back in the days before
>clusters, and computer logging, but, that was then and this is now ;o)
>
>Tom, N5GE - SWOT 3537
>
>"They that can give up essential liberty
>to obtain a little temporary safety deserve
>neither liberty nor safety."
>
>--Benjamin Franklin 1775
>
>http://www.n5ge.com
>http://www.eQSL.cc/Member.cfm\?N5GE
>
>_______________________________________________
>Elecraft mailing list
>Post to: [hidden email]
>You must be a subscriber to post to the list.
>Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.):
> http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>
>Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm
>Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com

Leigh L. Klotz Jr WA5ZNU

Re: Memory sticks

Administrator

In reply to this post by Chris G3SJJ

If the goal is to have a contester's dongle that you drop into a rig when
you set down and then remove it afterwards, just restoring the personal
settings (not the rig calibration settings) over the CAT protocol should
be fairly easy, given that the KIO3 protocol for reading values is
documented.

Simon HB9DRV has already said he's doing this for Ham Radio Deluxe, but
for a dongle, a PIC or Atmel ought to be able to do this easily.

But I remembered seeing ads for this $25 device in Nuts and Volts, and
always wanted a reason to buy one. It's a 386-compatible system with
flash memory that's built into a DB9 dongle, and it gets its power from
the RS232 port.

http://www.star.net/people/~mvs/
http://www.star.net/people/~mvs/tpcspec.txt

Leigh/WA5ZNU

_______________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Post to: [hidden email]
You must be a subscriber to post to the list.
Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.):
http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft

Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm
Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com

Leigh L. Klotz Jr WA5ZNU

Re: Memory sticks

Administrator

In reply to this post by Chris G3SJJ

If the goal is to have a contester's dongle that you drop into a rig when
you sit down and then remove it afterwards, just restoring the personal
settings (not the rig calibration settings) over the CAT protocol should
be fairly easy, given that the KIO3 protocol for reading values is
documented.

Simon HB9DRV has already said he's doing this for Ham Radio Deluxe, but
for a dongle, a PIC or Atmel ought to be able to do this easily.

But I remembered seeing ads for this $25 device in Nuts and Volts, and
always wanted a reason to buy one. It's a 386-compatible system with
flash memory that's built into a DB9 dongle, and it gets its power from
the RS232 port.

http://www.star.net/people/~mvs/
http://www.star.net/people/~mvs/tpcspec.txt

Leigh/WA5ZNU

_______________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Post to: [hidden email]
You must be a subscriber to post to the list.
Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.):
http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft

Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm
Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com

Dick Dievendorff

RE: Memory sticks

In reply to this post by David Fleming-2

It's described in the K3 Utility Help file, look for "Manual File Transfer".

73 de Dick, K6KR

-----Original Message-----
From: [hidden email]
[mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of David Fleming
Sent: Thursday, November 29, 2007 11:40 AM
To: Doug Faunt N6TQS +1-510-655-8604; [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Memory sticks

You can access the firmware files using your web
browser.

ftp://ftp.elecraft.com/K3/firmware/

David, W4SMT

--- Doug Faunt N6TQS +1-510-655-8604 <[hidden email]>
wrote:

_______________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Post to: [hidden email]
You must be a subscriber to post to the list.
Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.):
http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft

Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm
Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com

_______________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Post to: [hidden email]
You must be a subscriber to post to the list.
Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.):
http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft

Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm
Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com

Ed K1EP

Re: Memory sticks (was: K3 Curious behavior)

In reply to this post by Greg - AB7R

The problem I see with that is that the configuration save and
restore takes a (relatively) long time. In a contest situation, it
would be nice to have that in a second or two. A limited subset of
config parameters would speed it up. Also, it would be nice to have
the ability to restore a setup after someone has "played" with the
radio. For example, in a multioperator contest situation, if a
person sits down at the radio and inadvertently changes some
parameters in the CONFIG menu, how are you to know? It is quite easy
to bump VFO A while searching for an item and not even know it.

At 11/29/2007 05:50 PM, Greg - AB7R wrote:

>Exactly, but with the laptop or other computer connected you don't
>need the thumb drive.
>
>Just setup the configs and save them using the K3FW Utility. If a
>user has a K3 at home also
>
>they should be able to copy the configuration from the K3FW
>directory to the thumb drive and
>
>then restore it as necessary at the contest/DX site.

Dick Dievendorff

RE: Memory sticks

In reply to this post by Doug Faunt N6TQS +1-510-655-8604

To see the sizes of the firmware files, open a command window (Start menu,
accessories, command prompt) and you'll have the familiar DOS prompt. CD to
the firmware folder (probably c:\documents and settings\doug\application
data\Elecraft\K3 Firmware). Then type "DIR" the files will be listed,
along with their sizes.

73 de Dick, K6KR

-----Original Message-----
From: [hidden email]
[mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Doug Faunt N6TQS
+1-510-655-8604
Sent: Thursday, November 29, 2007 11:25 AM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Memory sticks

I recall this discussion lately, but in looking around, I find I don't
locate the information necessary to actually separate the two functions.
Perhaps if the procedure were more visible, there'd be less confusion.

I can't locate the sizes of the firmware updates, either.

73, doug

Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 11:16:42 -0800
From: Vic K2VCO <[hidden email]>

Geoffrey Mackenzie-Kennedy wrote:
> The lack of a computer could be resolved, it's getting the internet
> connection in the remote area that's the problem. The memory sticks
used
> by our daughter are about a couple of inches long, USB connector, can
> store a lot of music, photos and other data and are not expensive.

As long as you have a computer at the remote location on which to run
the K3 Utility, the firmware files can be downloaded to the memory stick
at a location which does have internet service. Then you could take it
to your remote location, and plug it into the computer which could
transfer the firmware to the K3.

The utility has the option of downloading the files from Elecraft's
server, or of using files stored on the local computer (including on a
memory stick, CD, etc.).
--
_______________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Post to: [hidden email]
You must be a subscriber to post to the list.
Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.):
http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft

Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm
Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com

_______________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Post to: [hidden email]
You must be a subscriber to post to the list.
Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.):
http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft

Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm
Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com

Dick Dievendorff

RE: Memory sticks (was: K3 Curious behavior)

In reply to this post by Ed K1EP

Give me a list of the menu items you'd like saved and restored for this
situation. The existing save/restore config is relatively large, and uses a
byte at a time protocol. I agree that it's slow, and speeding it up is "on
the list". It requires MCU changes.

I'll have to come up with some other sort of name other than "configuration"
to distinguish the full save from this relatively few parameters sort of
save/restore. I fear that having both will be confusing. The intent of the
existing save/restore is to save you the work of reentering all the filter
settings in the event of EEINIT.

73 de Dick, K6KR

-----Original Message-----
From: [hidden email]
[mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Ed K1EP
Sent: Thursday, November 29, 2007 3:24 PM
To: [hidden email]; Elecraft reflector; '[hidden email];
[hidden email]; N5GE'
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Memory sticks (was: K3 Curious behavior)

The problem I see with that is that the configuration save and
restore takes a (relatively) long time. In a contest situation, it
would be nice to have that in a second or two. A limited subset of
config parameters would speed it up. Also, it would be nice to have
the ability to restore a setup after someone has "played" with the
radio. For example, in a multioperator contest situation, if a
person sits down at the radio and inadvertently changes some
parameters in the CONFIG menu, how are you to know? It is quite easy
to bump VFO A while searching for an item and not even know it.

At 11/29/2007 05:50 PM, Greg - AB7R wrote:

Doug Faunt N6TQS +1-510-655-8604

Re: Memory sticks

In reply to this post by Dick Dievendorff

That's one way.
It's probably easier for most people to do it with Windows Explorer.
My Computer>C:>Documents And Settings>{user name}>Application Data>Elecraft>K3 Firmware
...If you remember where Windows keeps such things.

And it'd be a useful reminder to have a pointer to
ftp://ftp.elecraft.com/K3/firmware/
on the Elecraft web site, if you're at a location where you can't
install the K3 downloader, but can plug in a USB drive or write a
CDROM.

Having this information in the help file of a program you need to
install isn't keeping it a secret, but it's also not making it
available in all situations where it might be needed, either.

73, doug

From: "Dick Dievendorff" <[hidden email]>
Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 15:22:05 -0800

It's described in the K3 Utility Help file, look for "Manual File Transfer".

73 de Dick, K6KR

-----Original Message-----
From: [hidden email]
[mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of David Fleming
Sent: Thursday, November 29, 2007 11:40 AM
To: Doug Faunt N6TQS +1-510-655-8604; [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Memory sticks

You can access the firmware files using your web
browser.

ftp://ftp.elecraft.com/K3/firmware/

David, W4SMT

--- Doug Faunt N6TQS +1-510-655-8604 <[hidden email]>
wrote:

> I recall this discussion lately, but in looking
> around, I find I don't
> locate the information necessary to actually
> separate the two functions.
> Perhaps if the procedure were more visible, there'd
> be less confusion.
>
> I can't locate the sizes of the firmware updates,
> either.
>
> 73, doug
>
> Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 11:16:42 -0800
> From: Vic K2VCO <[hidden email]>
>
> Geoffrey Mackenzie-Kennedy wrote:
> > The lack of a computer could be resolved, it's
> getting the internet
> > connection in the remote area that's the
> problem. The memory sticks used
> > by our daughter are about a couple of inches
> long, USB connector, can
> > store a lot of music, photos and other data and
> are not expensive.
>
> As long as you have a computer at the remote
> location on which to run
> the K3 Utility, the firmware files can be
> downloaded to the memory stick
> at a location which does have internet service.
> Then you could take it
> to your remote location, and plug it into the
> computer which could
> transfer the firmware to the K3.
>
> The utility has the option of downloading the
> files from Elecraft's
> server, or of using files stored on the local
> computer (including on a
> memory stick, CD, etc.).
> --
> _______________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Post to: [hidden email]
> You must be a subscriber to post to the list.
> Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.):
> http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>
>
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm
> Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
>

_______________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Post to: [hidden email]
You must be a subscriber to post to the list.
Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.):
http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft

Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm
Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com

_______________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Post to: [hidden email]
You must be a subscriber to post to the list.
Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.):
http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft

Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm
Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com

AJSOENKE

Re: K3 Curious behavio

In reply to this post by Carl Clawson

Just to add another slant to the slippery hill, I have a perfectly good IPaq
5400 that is a very small computer and has huge storage capacity. It is
hardly used because it lacks a lot of common interfacing. It does Blue tooth,
WiFi and IR but no USB or RS232 (as if having a laptop weren't difficult to
interface). There is a young fellow in Arizona who has interfaces for these
pocket PCs - so that's the direction I am taking for portability. The Ipaq has a
plug in keyboard and a large enough screen to run decent text. So as far as I
can see all it needs is an RS232 interface.

Comments?

Al WA6VNN

**************************************Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest
products.
(http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001)
_______________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Post to: [hidden email]
You must be a subscriber to post to the list.
Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.):
http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft

Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm
Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com