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Re: Prosign "IM" to end K3 RTTY idle not working: Solved

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John Stasiw

Re: Prosign "IM" to end K3 RTTY idle not working: Solved

Many thanks for suggestions.
Solution is to send IM in cadence of question mark,ie, dididahdah.That works.

--- On Sat, 3/12/11, John Stasiw <[hidden email]> wrote:

From: John Stasiw <[hidden email]>
Subject: [Elecraft] Prosign "IM" to end K3 RTTY idle not working
To: Date: Saturday, 3 December, 2011, 9:50

In using a paddle for CW-to-DATA operation I have found the prosign "IM" does not halt idle after one second but just enables the idle to continue to runout for an additional 4 seconds.
Any thoughts on the problem would be appreciated.
73
John Stasiw
VE6GJ
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Don Wilhelm-4

Re: Prosign "IM" to end K3 RTTY idle not working: Solved

John,

That is how most all prosigns should be sent. Not as individual
letters, but with no spaces between.
If you look at properly typeset prosigns, you will see them represented
with a bar over the top - that means what is represented by the letters
shown is only a representation - send the elements all run together
rather than as separate letters. You send the "AS" prosign as
didahdididit, "KN" as dahdidahdahdit, etc. In emails and other text
formats, it is difficult to represent the bar over the characters unless
graphics are used.

The space between each element should be only a dit time rather than a
dah time as you would see between different letters.

73,
Don W3FPR

On 12/2/2011 9:26 PM, John Stasiw wrote:

>
>
>
> Many thanks for suggestions.
> Solution is to send IM in cadence of question mark,ie, dididahdah.That works.
>
> --- On Sat, 3/12/11, John Stasiw<[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>
> From: John Stasiw<[hidden email]>
> Subject: [Elecraft] Prosign "IM" to end K3 RTTY idle not working
> To: Date: Saturday, 3 December, 2011, 9:50
>
>
> In using a paddle for CW-to-DATA operation I have found the prosign "IM" does not halt idle after one second but just enables the idle to continue to runout for an additional 4 seconds.
> Any thoughts on the problem would be appreciated.
> 73
> John Stasiw
> VE6GJ
> ______________________________________________________________
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David Pratt

Re: Prosign "IM" to end K3 RTTY idle not working: Solved

In a recent message, Don Wilhelm <[hidden email]> writes
>You send the "AS" prosign as
>didahdididit, "KN" as dahdidahdahdit, etc.

Forgive me for making a slight correction to that, Don, but KN is not a
prosign but is defined as a left-hand bracket in the latest
recommendations of the ITU. The latest definitions were prepared
primarily to include the Morse code sequence for @ (prosign AC).

http://www.itu.int/dms_pubrec/itu-r/rec/m/R-REC-M.1677-1-200910-I!!PDF-E.pdf

Consequently, K N should really be separated by a space.

73 de David G4DMP

--
+ - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - +
| David M Pratt, Kippax, Leeds. |
| Website: http://www.g4dmp.co.uk |
+ - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - +

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Don Wilhelm-4

Re: Prosign "IM" to end K3 RTTY idle not working: Solved

All I can say in my defense is that the 1977 ARRL Handbook put a bar
over "AR", "AS", "KN", and "SK". I guess things have changed since that
time.

73,
Don W3FPR

On 12/3/2011 2:44 AM, David Pratt wrote:

>
> Forgive me for making a slight correction to that, Don, but KN is not a
> prosign but is defined as a left-hand bracket in the latest
> recommendations of the ITU. The latest definitions were prepared
> primarily to include the Morse code sequence for @ (prosign AC).
>
> http://www.itu.int/dms_pubrec/itu-r/rec/m/R-REC-M.1677-1-200910-I!!PDF-E.pdf
>
> Consequently, K N should really be separated by a space.
>
> 73 de David G4DMP
>

Don Wilhelm-4

Re: Prosign "IM" to end K3 RTTY idle not working: Solved

Well, we have a slight conflict Houston! I found the ARRL Operating
Manual - 9th Edition, and it has the same list as my 1977 Handbook, So
if we want to invite only the named station to transmit, we should send
a left-hand parenthesis symbol - Yes, the same operating manual lists
that too! Interesting.

73,
Don W3FPR

On 12/3/2011 6:37 AM, Don Wilhelm wrote:

> All I can say in my defense is that the 1977 ARRL Handbook put a bar
> over "AR", "AS", "KN", and "SK". I guess things have changed since that
> time.
>
> 73,
> Don W3FPR
>
> On 12/3/2011 2:44 AM, David Pratt wrote:
>> Forgive me for making a slight correction to that, Don, but KN is not a
>> prosign but is defined as a left-hand bracket in the latest
>> recommendations of the ITU. The latest definitions were prepared
>> primarily to include the Morse code sequence for @ (prosign AC).
>>
>> http://www.itu.int/dms_pubrec/itu-r/rec/m/R-REC-M.1677-1-200910-I!!PDF-E.pdf
>>
>> Consequently, K N should really be separated by a space.
>>
>> 73 de David G4DMP
>>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
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>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
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>

k6dgw

Re: Prosign "IM" to end K3 RTTY idle not working: Solved

In reply to this post by David Pratt

Hmmm ... I had punctuation on my 2nd Telegraph exam in 1956 and got
credit for the code when I sat for the Extra that afternoon at the Los
Angeles FCC office. I didn't know the Extra code did not include
punctuation.

All the mills at the coastal marine station I worked at had a slashed
zero, and a "1" key [not present on regular typewriters, you used a
lower-case "L"]. They also had a couple of prosigns on them, I remember
BT and AR. We had five mills, four of which were open-frame Underwoods.
The prosigns had no bar. I can't remember the make of the fifth one,
never really used it, but the prosigns on it had a bar.

I have a 1990 ARRL Handbook, and on pg 38-2, Table 2 lists four prosigns
and a couple of other signals. AR, KN, AS, and SK all have a bar. K,
R, and CL do not, not that this means anything.

The operating description for AR is interesting: "Used after a call to
a specific station before the contact has been established." I wonder
where they got that?

73,

Fred K6DGW
- Northern California Contest Club
- CU in the 2012 Cal QSO Party 6-7 Oct 2012
- www.cqp.org

On 12/3/2011 8:05 AM, Ron D'Eau Claire wrote:
> I believe -.--. has always been a left-hand parenthesis.

That's what I learned.
>
> Since Hams didn't use parenthesis in CW communications, it didn't produce a
> conflict. (For me, the toughest part of passing the commercial RadioTelegaph
> license test back in the 1950's was learning to copy all the punctuation
> marks Hams never use mixed into 5-letter groups at 20 WPM.)
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