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SDR software for KX3?

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tomb18

SDR software for KX3?

Hi
Has anyone tried to hook up their kx3 via the IQ output to SDR software?
I have so far tried three different programs, hdsdr, sdr-radio, and SDR sharp, and they are all the same. I get images that run in different directions as I tune. I tried everything to get get rid of them to no avail.
I also tried three different sound boards and different cables. No difference at all. Anybody have ideas?
Thanks, Tom va2fsq

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Jerry Flanders

Re: SDR software for KX3?

I saw the same thing with several of the programs I tried, but
finally one worked OK without those images.

It is: PowerSDR/IF Stage V1.19.3.5

SETUP IF:

RIG CONNECTION - rig type K3 (NOTE - K3, NOT KX3)( also get your com
port and baud rate from the kx3 utility)

IF FREQUENCIES global offset -5700 lo center (don't know what this
is) 8215000 LSB 650 USB -800

This should get you started.

GL de Jerry W4UK

At 04:35 PM 10/12/2013, Tom wrote:
>Hi
>Has anyone tried to hook up their kx3 via the IQ output to SDR software?
>I have so far tried three different programs, hdsdr, sdr-radio, and
>SDR sharp, and they are all the same. I get images that run in
>different directions as I tune. I tried everything to get get rid of
>them to no avail.
>I also tried three different sound boards and different cables. No
>difference at all. Anybody have ideas?
>Thanks, Tom va2fsq

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Barry K3NDM

Re: SDR software for KX3?

In reply to this post by tomb18

Guys,
The one that really works well is NaP3. It was originally set up
for the K3, but the latest iteration does a great job on the KX3. I've
been running with the software for about a year or so, and I now don't
know how function without it.

73,
Barry
K3NDM

On 10/12/2013 5:04 PM, Jerry Flanders wrote:

> I saw the same thing with several of the programs I tried, but finally
> one worked OK without those images.
>
> It is: PowerSDR/IF Stage V1.19.3.5
>
> SETUP IF:
>
> RIG CONNECTION - rig type K3 (NOTE - K3, NOT KX3)( also get your com
> port and baud rate from the kx3 utility)
>
> IF FREQUENCIES global offset -5700 lo center (don't know what this
> is) 8215000 LSB 650 USB -800
>
> This should get you started.
>
> GL de Jerry W4UK
>
> At 04:35 PM 10/12/2013, Tom wrote:
>> Hi
>> Has anyone tried to hook up their kx3 via the IQ output to SDR software?
>> I have so far tried three different programs, hdsdr, sdr-radio, and
>> SDR sharp, and they are all the same. I get images that run in
>> different directions as I tune. I tried everything to get get rid of
>> them to no avail.
>> I also tried three different sound boards and different cables. No
>> difference at all. Anybody have ideas?
>> Thanks, Tom va2fsq
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
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> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>

tomb18

Re: SDR software for KX3?

In reply to this post by tomb18

Well I just tried nap3 and while I can get a spectrum there are so many artifacts it hardly seems worth it.
In order to rule out the soundcard I bought a emu0202 and by adjusting the two inputs I can lower the images but not entirely eliminate them.
I can run the optimization for images and it doesn't do much. So far the best I have obtained is with HDSdr but it really a far cry from something like the p3.
How is this posdible ? I thought SDR was the next best thing!
Tom

-------- Original message --------
From: Monty S <[hidden email]>
Date: 12/10/2013 16:40 (GMT-05:00)
To: Tom <[hidden email]>
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] SDR software for KX3?

Tom,
I use NaP3 and it works fine. Sounds like you need to tell your SDR program to invert the I and Q inputs

Monty K2DLJ

Sent from my iPhone

> On Oct 12, 2013, at 1:35 PM, Tom <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> Hi
> Has anyone tried to hook up their kx3 via the IQ output to SDR software?
> I have so far tried three different programs, hdsdr, sdr-radio, and SDR sharp, and they are all the same. I get images that run in different directions as I tune. I tried everything to get get rid of them to no avail.
> I also tried three different sound boards and different cables. No difference at all. Anybody have ideas?
> Thanks, Tom va2fsq
>
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

tomb18

Re: SDR software for KX3?

In reply to this post by tomb18

Hi
Well I just bought a new outboard sound card and removed all previous cards. I'm now running an emu2020 and I can adjust the levels between the channels. I can minimize the images but as soon as you move up or down a while the images are back. I also have lots of spurious peaks making it impossible to distinguish between cw and spurs. There is no adjustment in software for the inputs but I can adjust the levels on the outside. The images look nowhere like what you see on YouTube.
Getting pretty frustrated here
Tom

-------- Original message --------
From: Barry LaZar <[hidden email]>
Date: 12/10/2013 17:28 (GMT-05:00)
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] SDR software for KX3?

Guys,
The one that really works well is NaP3. It was originally set up
for the K3, but the latest iteration does a great job on the KX3. I've
been running with the software for about a year or so, and I now don't
know how function without it.

73,
Barry
K3NDM

On 10/12/2013 5:04 PM, Jerry Flanders wrote:

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wb4jfi

Re: SDR software for KX3?

Hello Tom.

I have had success with using several SDR software programs (and sound cards) with my KX3. It shouldn't be that hard. I've used Rocky, hDSDR, a few variants of PowersDR, SDRsharp, and a few others, on various Windows and Apple (iPad, iPhone) computers.

Most programs have internal adjustments for phase and gain differences, so you don't need to adjust those with External mixer controls. Try Rocky first, it's probably the easiest to set up and use. It can also automatically adjust for your sound card and rig differences.

If you are having so many problems, be sure to check your cables. I have had a couple of commercially made cables that were defective, with partial shorts between the various connections. I had trouble with I/Q balancing until I found they were bad.

Good luck. 73, Terry, WB4JFI
Sent from tfox iPad

> On Oct 12, 2013, at 7:27 PM, Tom <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> Hi
> Well I just bought a new outboard sound card and removed all previous cards. I'm now running an emu2020 and I can adjust the levels between the channels. I can minimize the images but as soon as you move up or down a while the images are back. I also have lots of spurious peaks making it impossible to distinguish between cw and spurs. There is no adjustment in software for the inputs but I can adjust the levels on the outside. The images look nowhere like what you see on YouTube.
> Getting pretty frustrated here
> Tom
>
>
>
>
>
> -------- Original message --------
> From: Barry LaZar <[hidden email]>
> Date: 12/10/2013 17:28 (GMT-05:00)
> To: [hidden email]
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] SDR software for KX3?
>
> Guys,
> The one that really works well is NaP3. It was originally set up
> for the K3, but the latest iteration does a great job on the KX3. I've
> been running with the software for about a year or so, and I now don't
> know how function without it.
>
>
> 73,
> Barry
> K3NDM
>
>> On 10/12/2013 5:04 PM, Jerry Flanders wrote:
>> I saw the same thing with several of the programs I tried, but finally
>> one worked OK without those images.
>>
>> It is: PowerSDR/IF Stage V1.19.3.5
>>
>> SETUP IF:
>>
>> RIG CONNECTION - rig type K3 (NOTE - K3, NOT KX3)( also get your com
>> port and baud rate from the kx3 utility)
>>
>> IF FREQUENCIES global offset -5700 lo center (don't know what this
>> is) 8215000 LSB 650 USB -800
>>
>> This should get you started.
>>
>> GL de Jerry W4UK
>>
>> At 04:35 PM 10/12/2013, Tom wrote:
>>> Hi
>>> Has anyone tried to hook up their kx3 via the IQ output to SDR software?
>>> I have so far tried three different programs, hdsdr, sdr-radio, and
>>> SDR sharp, and they are all the same. I get images that run in
>>> different directions as I tune. I tried everything to get get rid of
>>> them to no avail.
>>> I also tried three different sound boards and different cables. No
>>> difference at all. Anybody have ideas?
>>> Thanks, Tom va2fsq
>>
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> Elecraft mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

tomb18

Re: SDR software for KX3?

In reply to this post by tomb18

I think I'll be looking at the cables, I seem to be picking up some 60 hz on the kx3, fairly low level but this is on the battery so it must be coming from a connection somewhere. ThTs probably why there's always a log spur at the center frequently .
I seem to have hdsdr working acceptably except for the spur. I'll also try rockey.
Thanks for the suggestions
Tom

-------- Original message --------
From: WB4JFI <[hidden email]>
Date: 12/10/2013 20:49 (GMT-05:00)
To: Tom <[hidden email]>
Cc: Barry LaZar <[hidden email]>,[hidden email]
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] SDR software for KX3?

Hello Tom.

I have had success with using several SDR software programs (and sound cards) with my KX3. It shouldn't be that hard. I've used Rocky, hDSDR, a few variants of PowersDR, SDRsharp, and a few others, on various Windows and Apple (iPad, iPhone) computers.

Most programs have internal adjustments for phase and gain differences, so you don't need to adjust those with External mixer controls. Try Rocky first, it's probably the easiest to set up and use. It can also automatically adjust for your sound card and rig differences.

If you are having so many problems, be sure to check your cables. I have had a couple of commercially made cables that were defective, with partial shorts between the various connections. I had trouble with I/Q balancing until I found they were bad.

Good luck. 73, Terry, WB4JFI
Sent from tfox iPad

Barry K3NDM

Re: SDR software for KX3?

In reply to this post by tomb18

Tom,
I, too, am running the EMU0202. first thing you need to do is shft the receiver 8KHz. That makes the appearance a bit better. I also notice extraneous garbage on the display. It doesn't seem to interfere with the overall operation, so I live with it.

Let me suggest that you not exceed 96 KHz sample bandwidth and then use the zoom feature to look at less than the sample rate. I haven't thought it through, but I was taught that you need to sample 2X the bandwidth. How we are able to use a bandwidth equal to the sample rate is something I really need to think about. But, I suspect that is contributing to some of the garbage on the screen. And, Elecraft suggests that you should stay at 48 KHz due to internal flatness of the radio's response, anyway.

73,
Barry
K3NDM

----- Original Message -----

From: "Tom" <[hidden email]>
To: "Barry LaZar" <[hidden email]>, [hidden email]
Sent: Saturday, October 12, 2013 7:27:48 PM
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] SDR software for KX3?

Hi
Well I just bought a new outboard sound card and removed all previous cards. I'm now running an emu2020 and I can adjust the levels between the channels. I can minimize the images but as soon as you move up or down a while the images are back. I also have lots of spurious peaks making it impossible to distinguish between cw and spurs. There is no adjustment in software for the inputs but I can adjust the levels on the outside. The images look nowhere like what you see on YouTube.
Getting pretty frustrated here
Tom

-------- Original message --------
From: Barry LaZar <[hidden email]>
Date: 12/10/2013 17:28 (GMT-05:00)
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] SDR software for KX3?

Guys,
The one that really works well is NaP3. It was originally set up
for the K3, but the latest iteration does a great job on the KX3. I've
been running with the software for about a year or so, and I now don't
know how function without it.

73,
Barry
K3NDM

On 10/12/2013 5:04 PM, Jerry Flanders wrote:

______________________________________________________________
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______________________________________________________________
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Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

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Nicklas Johnson

Re: SDR software for KX3?

In reply to this post by tomb18

I had a lot of trouble until I put a ground-loop isolator between the KX3
and the PC. The grounding at my QTH is a bit less-than-perfect, and I was
getting a 60Hz+harmonics buzz by connecting the PC to the KX3. Not saying
it is the case with you, but it's just another one of those things.

You might try disconnecting the KX3 from your ground and running it off
batteries to see if it matters as far as the SDR is concerned... it's easy
to rule out a ground loop that way.

On 12 October 2013 18:20, Tom <[hidden email]> wrote:

> I think I'll be looking at the cables, I seem to be picking up some 60 hz
> on the kx3, fairly low level but this is on the battery so it must be
> coming from a connection somewhere. ThTs probably why there's always a log
> spur at the center frequently .
> I seem to have hdsdr working acceptably except for the spur. I'll also try
> rockey.
> Thanks for the suggestions
> Tom
>
>
>
>
> -------- Original message --------
> From: WB4JFI <[hidden email]>
> Date: 12/10/2013 20:49 (GMT-05:00)
> To: Tom <[hidden email]>
> Cc: Barry LaZar <[hidden email]>,[hidden email]
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] SDR software for KX3?
>
> Hello Tom.
>
> I have had success with using several SDR software programs (and sound
> cards) with my KX3. It shouldn't be that hard. I've used Rocky, hDSDR, a
> few variants of PowersDR, SDRsharp, and a few others, on various Windows
> and Apple (iPad, iPhone) computers.
>
> Most programs have internal adjustments for phase and gain differences, so
> you don't need to adjust those with External mixer controls. Try Rocky
> first, it's probably the easiest to set up and use. It can also
> automatically adjust for your sound card and rig differences.
>
> If you are having so many problems, be sure to check your cables. I have
> had a couple of commercially made cables that were defective, with partial
> shorts between the various connections. I had trouble with I/Q balancing
> until I found they were bad.
>
> Good luck. 73, Terry, WB4JFI
> Sent from tfox iPad
>
> > On Oct 12, 2013, at 7:27 PM, Tom <[hidden email]> wrote:
> >
> > Hi
> > Well I just bought a new outboard sound card and removed all previous
> cards. I'm now running an emu2020 and I can adjust the levels between the
> channels. I can minimize the images but as soon as you move up or down a
> while the images are back. I also have lots of spurious peaks making it
> impossible to distinguish between cw and spurs. There is no adjustment in
> software for the inputs but I can adjust the levels on the outside. The
> images look nowhere like what you see on YouTube.
> > Getting pretty frustrated here
> > Tom
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > -------- Original message --------
> > From: Barry LaZar <[hidden email]>
> > Date: 12/10/2013 17:28 (GMT-05:00)
> > To: [hidden email]
> > Subject: Re: [Elecraft] SDR software for KX3?
> >
> > Guys,
> > The one that really works well is NaP3. It was originally set up
> > for the K3, but the latest iteration does a great job on the KX3. I've
> > been running with the software for about a year or so, and I now don't
> > know how function without it.
> >
> >
> > 73,
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>

--
*N6OL*
Saying something doesn't make it true. Belief in something doesn't make it
real. And if you have to lie to support a position, that position is not
worth supporting.
______________________________________________________________
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Post: mailto:[hidden email]

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Pete Smith N4ZR

Re: SDR software for KX3?

When I first started with SDRs, I had a Softrock that had substantial
hum(p) around the center frequency. I added a pair of Triad sub-mini
isolation transformers, ones with good high-frequency response, and
found that instead of the hum(p) I now had a very narrow hole at the
center freq.

73, Pete N4ZR
Check out the Reverse Beacon Network at
http://reversebeacon.net,
blog at reversebeacon.blogspot.com.
For spots, please go to your favorite
ARC V6 or VE7CC DX cluster node.

On 10/12/2013 9:40 PM, Nicklas Johnson wrote:

> I had a lot of trouble until I put a ground-loop isolator between the KX3
> and the PC. The grounding at my QTH is a bit less-than-perfect, and I was
> getting a 60Hz+harmonics buzz by connecting the PC to the KX3. Not saying
> it is the case with you, but it's just another one of those things.
>
> You might try disconnecting the KX3 from your ground and running it off
> batteries to see if it matters as far as the SDR is concerned... it's easy
> to rule out a ground loop that way.
>
>
> On 12 October 2013 18:20, Tom <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> I think I'll be looking at the cables, I seem to be picking up some 60 hz
>> on the kx3, fairly low level but this is on the battery so it must be
>> coming from a connection somewhere. ThTs probably why there's always a log
>> spur at the center frequently .
>> I seem to have hdsdr working acceptably except for the spur. I'll also try
>> rockey.
>> Thanks for the suggestions
>> Tom
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> -------- Original message --------
>> From: WB4JFI <[hidden email]>
>> Date: 12/10/2013 20:49 (GMT-05:00)
>> To: Tom <[hidden email]>
>> Cc: Barry LaZar <[hidden email]>,[hidden email]
>> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] SDR software for KX3?
>>
>> Hello Tom.
>>
>> I have had success with using several SDR software programs (and sound
>> cards) with my KX3. It shouldn't be that hard. I've used Rocky, hDSDR, a
>> few variants of PowersDR, SDRsharp, and a few others, on various Windows
>> and Apple (iPad, iPhone) computers.
>>
>> Most programs have internal adjustments for phase and gain differences, so
>> you don't need to adjust those with External mixer controls. Try Rocky
>> first, it's probably the easiest to set up and use. It can also
>> automatically adjust for your sound card and rig differences.
>>
>> If you are having so many problems, be sure to check your cables. I have
>> had a couple of commercially made cables that were defective, with partial
>> shorts between the various connections. I had trouble with I/Q balancing
>> until I found they were bad.
>>
>> Good luck. 73, Terry, WB4JFI
>> Sent from tfox iPad
>>
>>> On Oct 12, 2013, at 7:27 PM, Tom <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>
>>> Hi
>>> Well I just bought a new outboard sound card and removed all previous
>> cards. I'm now running an emu2020 and I can adjust the levels between the
>> channels. I can minimize the images but as soon as you move up or down a
>> while the images are back. I also have lots of spurious peaks making it
>> impossible to distinguish between cw and spurs. There is no adjustment in
>> software for the inputs but I can adjust the levels on the outside. The
>> images look nowhere like what you see on YouTube.
>>> Getting pretty frustrated here
>>> Tom
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> -------- Original message --------
>>> From: Barry LaZar <[hidden email]>
>>> Date: 12/10/2013 17:28 (GMT-05:00)
>>> To: [hidden email]
>>> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] SDR software for KX3?
>>>
>>> Guys,
>>> The one that really works well is NaP3. It was originally set up
>>> for the K3, but the latest iteration does a great job on the KX3. I've
>>> been running with the software for about a year or so, and I now don't
>>> know how function without it.
>>>
>>>
>>> 73,
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> Elecraft mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>>
>
>

Tony Estep

Re: SDR software for KX3?

In reply to this post by tomb18

On Sat, Oct 12, 2013 at 6:05 PM, Tom <[hidden email]> wrote:

> ..I just tried nap3 and while I can get a spectrum there are so many
> artifacts...

========
NaP3 has an automatic routine that can balance out images. It is supposed
to work with any strong carrier, but it seems that it takes a super-strong
signal to make it work correctly.

To use it, inject a strong (>S9+30) carrier into the receiver antenna port.
Tune so that it is off to one side of the pan picture. After a few seconds,
all will be well.

I have my XG3 connected to the aux ant jack on my K3 so that I can switch
it in to do this little fix when necessary. It doesn't happen often, but
sometimes NaP3 loses its mind and needs this treatment. Fiddling with the
volume knobs on the Emu is fruitless, but this trick works perfectly in my
shack. Once you get NaP3 working, you'll be happy.

Tony KT0NY
______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
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wb4jfi

Re: SDR software for KX3?

In reply to this post by Barry K3NDM

Barry:
I don't have the EMU0202, so I can't say about the 8kHz shift. I do not need to add the 8kHz shift on any of my SDR operations, however.

Regarding the sample rate versus bandwidth, when using 48ks/s, you are actually getting TWO samples at that rate, one of I and one of Q. They each count, so you can end up with a total of 48kHz bandwidth being displayed (plus and minus 24kHz from center frequency). That is, if you have both I and Q working properly. That's how you get 48kHz displayed with a 48ks/s sample rate.

From what I recall (I'm out of town right now), the KX3 I/Q bandwidth is not much more than 48k or so anyway, so sampling at 96k or higher probably won't buy you much. But you certainly could try it. Remember that not only do you have to deal with the KX3 I/Q output bandwidth, but some sound cards roll off much beyond 48kHz, even if they sample at 96k or 192k. YMMV

73, Terry, WB4JFI
Sent from tfox iPad

> On Oct 12, 2013, at 9:32 PM, [hidden email] wrote:
>
> Tom,
> I, too, am running the EMU0202. first thing you need to do is shft the receiver 8KHz. That makes the appearance a bit better. I also notice extraneous garbage on the display. It doesn't seem to interfere with the overall operation, so I live with it.
>
> Let me suggest that you not exceed 96 KHz sample bandwidth and then use the zoom feature to look at less than the sample rate. I haven't thought it through, but I was taught that you need to sample 2X the bandwidth. How we are able to use a bandwidth equal to the sample rate is something I really need to think about. But, I suspect that is contributing to some of the garbage on the screen. And, Elecraft suggests that you should stay at 48 KHz due to internal flatness of the radio's response, anyway.
>
> 73,
> Barry
> K3NDM
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
>
> From: "Tom" <[hidden email]>
> To: "Barry LaZar" <[hidden email]>, [hidden email]
> Sent: Saturday, October 12, 2013 7:27:48 PM
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] SDR software for KX3?
>
> Hi
> Well I just bought a new outboard sound card and removed all previous cards. I'm now running an emu2020 and I can adjust the levels between the channels. I can minimize the images but as soon as you move up or down a while the images are back. I also have lots of spurious peaks making it impossible to distinguish between cw and spurs. There is no adjustment in software for the inputs but I can adjust the levels on the outside. The images look nowhere like what you see on YouTube.
> Getting pretty frustrated here
> Tom
>
>
>
>
>
>
> -------- Original message --------
> From: Barry LaZar <[hidden email]>
> Date: 12/10/2013 17:28 (GMT-05:00)
> To: [hidden email]
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] SDR software for KX3?
>
>
> Guys,
> The one that really works well is NaP3. It was originally set up
> for the K3, but the latest iteration does a great job on the KX3. I've
> been running with the software for about a year or so, and I now don't
> know how function without it.
>

'DGB'

Re: FS W2 Wattmeter Sold!

SOLD !!!!

Excellent condition, about 1-1/2 yr. old, no longer needed, non-smoking
environment, original owner. It was a kit that I assembled, looks and
works as new. With manual, coupler (2KW, 1.8 - 54mhz), rs-232-3.5mm
connecting cable and power cable.

Will ship in original packing and insure Priority Mail for $195.00 in
the US ... Paypal or USPS money order. Tnx ... Dwight NS9I
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Barry K3NDM

Re: SDR software for KX3?

In reply to this post by wb4jfi

Terry,
Whether you use an EMU0202 or any of the other choice for a sound
card, the issue gets down to where the 0 is. If you don't use the 8 KHz
offset, the center of your sample and the point where you are tuned
become the same. By using the offset you move the two apart by telling
the SDR software that you are using an 8 KHz. IF. This way things get a
little cleaner on the screen. However, by doing a shift, you do lose a
feature or two of the radio.

The issue of sample rate is driven by Nyquist theory for sampling.
He said you need to sample at 2X the intended bandwidth. That means to
me BOTH the I and Q data, and some DSP designers "over sample" at 3X or
or more. However to be honest, I really haven't researched this issue of
sample rate and displayed bandwidth, yet I do use it. I have only run
across this when using SDR receiver display software, so I'm not sure
what the designers are really doing. In a past incarnation, when I was
playing with early SDR's, we never went below 2X and for some dynamic
range issues we went to 4X.

The issue about using 48 KHz. is based solely on the fact that the
radio itself does not have a flat response beyond about 48 KHz. I think
there is a reference to that in the manual. And, I believe they say you
can go to 96 KHZ, but it won't be flat. This is a separate problem/issue
not associated with sampling theory.

You are quite correct. What rate you can or should sample at is
dependent on the card you go with. I went the '0202 because it was
cheaper than some of the others at the time and yet had good specs. But,
I suspect that opening this discussion up to sound card choices would be
like a discussion on what is the best antenna.:-)

73,
Barry
K3NDM

On 10/14/2013 5:39 PM, WB4JFI wrote:

> Barry:
> I don't have the EMU0202, so I can't say about the 8kHz shift. I do not need to add the 8kHz shift on any of my SDR operations, however.
>
> Regarding the sample rate versus bandwidth, when using 48ks/s, you are actually getting TWO samples at that rate, one of I and one of Q. They each count, so you can end up with a total of 48kHz bandwidth being displayed (plus and minus 24kHz from center frequency). That is, if you have both I and Q working properly. That's how you get 48kHz displayed with a 48ks/s sample rate.
>
> From what I recall (I'm out of town right now), the KX3 I/Q bandwidth is not much more than 48k or so anyway, so sampling at 96k or higher probably won't buy you much. But you certainly could try it. Remember that not only do you have to deal with the KX3 I/Q output bandwidth, but some sound cards roll off much beyond 48kHz, even if they sample at 96k or 192k. YMMV
>
> 73, Terry, WB4JFI
> Sent from tfox iPad
>
>> On Oct 12, 2013, at 9:32 PM, [hidden email] wrote:
>>
>> Tom,
>> I, too, am running the EMU0202. first thing you need to do is shft the receiver 8KHz. That makes the appearance a bit better. I also notice extraneous garbage on the display. It doesn't seem to interfere with the overall operation, so I live with it.
>>
>> Let me suggest that you not exceed 96 KHz sample bandwidth and then use the zoom feature to look at less than the sample rate. I haven't thought it through, but I was taught that you need to sample 2X the bandwidth. How we are able to use a bandwidth equal to the sample rate is something I really need to think about. But, I suspect that is contributing to some of the garbage on the screen. And, Elecraft suggests that you should stay at 48 KHz due to internal flatness of the radio's response, anyway.
>>
>> 73,
>> Barry
>> K3NDM
>>
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>>
>> From: "Tom" <[hidden email]>
>> To: "Barry LaZar" <[hidden email]>, [hidden email]
>> Sent: Saturday, October 12, 2013 7:27:48 PM
>> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] SDR software for KX3?
>>
>> Hi
>> Well I just bought a new outboard sound card and removed all previous cards. I'm now running an emu2020 and I can adjust the levels between the channels. I can minimize the images but as soon as you move up or down a while the images are back. I also have lots of spurious peaks making it impossible to distinguish between cw and spurs. There is no adjustment in software for the inputs but I can adjust the levels on the outside. The images look nowhere like what you see on YouTube.
>> Getting pretty frustrated here
>> Tom
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> -------- Original message --------
>> From: Barry LaZar <[hidden email]>
>> Date: 12/10/2013 17:28 (GMT-05:00)
>> To: [hidden email]
>> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] SDR software for KX3?
>>
>>
>> Guys,
>> The one that really works well is NaP3. It was originally set up
>> for the K3, but the latest iteration does a great job on the KX3. I've
>> been running with the software for about a year or so, and I now don't
>> know how function without it.
>>