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SP-3 frequency range question

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Bill Clarke

SP-3 frequency range question

This is another repeat - the first two attempts did not appear. Makes me
wonder if I am blocked for some reason???

In the real world, does the SP-3 exhibit well rounded frequency
response? Or, is the response more directed for "communications use"?
How is it for listening to AM broadcast? How does it do with the famous
K3 hiss? How does it do with a less capable receiver (one without an EQ)?

I am considering some station simplification, hence the SP-3. Currently,
I am using the Behringer MS40 pair. Super sound, but quite large and do
have an internal amp (I have experienced no RF problems).

Bill W2BLC K-Line

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wayne burdick

Re: SP-3 frequency range question

Administrator

Hi Bill,

The SP3 is relatively flat from 100-20,000 Hz, and is very sensitive (90 dB SPL), meaning no need for amplification. A K3 or K3S will drive one or two of them easily. The K3/K3S also have RX EQ to tailor the response to your operating position.

I'll let others comment subjectively on the sound.

73,
Wayne
N6KR

> On Feb 4, 2018, at 12:36 PM, Bill <[hidden email]> wrote:
>

> I am considering some station simplification, hence the SP-3. Currently, I am using the Behringer MS40 pair. Super sound, but quite large and do have an internal amp (I have experienced no RF problems).
>
> Bill W2BLC K-Line

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David Bunte

Re: SP-3 frequency range question

In reply to this post by Bill Clarke

Bill -

I saw your earlier request. Don’t know if I saw more than one. I did not
respond then because I thought the first post said something about how
great the SP3’s sounded on music, but I could be remembering wrong. The
other reason I did not respond is because I assumed someone with an SP3, or
someone who recalled the earlier post would answer (that seems to be the
norm here).

Hope you get a more helpful response soon.

Dave - K9FN

On Sun, Feb 4, 2018 at 3:39 PM Bill <[hidden email]> wrote:

> This is another repeat - the first two attempts did not appear. Makes me
> wonder if I am blocked for some reason???
>
>
> In the real world, does the SP-3 exhibit well rounded frequency
> response? Or, is the response more directed for "communications use"?
> How is it for listening to AM broadcast? How does it do with the famous
> K3 hiss? How does it do with a less capable receiver (one without an EQ)?
>
> I am considering some station simplification, hence the SP-3. Currently,
> I am using the Behringer MS40 pair. Super sound, but quite large and do
> have an internal amp (I have experienced no RF problems).
>
> Bill W2BLC K-Line
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
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> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>

Bill Clarke

Re: SP-3 frequency range question

In reply to this post by wayne burdick

Wayne - the receive EQ on my K3 is pure gold! It allows me to work
around age-diminished hearing and enjoy - what is to me - full range
hearing. Similar to how high quality hearing aids work.

I just want to hear how well they do (or don't do) in the real world -
on various desks, etc. And, maybe with other rigs lacking EQ
capabilities. It is all about performance - and not specification.

SP-3s will be a part of my station desk redesign project - if I choose
them. Price is not a factor - after all, how much are they costing after
ten or more years daily use.

Bill W2BLC K-Line

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Bill Clarke

Re: SP-3 frequency range question

In reply to this post by Bill Clarke

Well, between list failures and a lack of the "real world" experience
replies I was seeking, I have decided to continue using the Behringer
MS40 pair. Just wasn't meant to be.

I did receive a couple of direct replies indicating I might well be
disappointed in the low end department - which I need for AM and SWL. I
also dabble in ESSB.

Actually, when it comes to receiving - I personally think it is more
about the Receive EQ in the K3 than about the quality/specs of the
speaker. Similar to how a cheap mic can be made to sound like an RCA
ribbon mic. Of course, this is not true for a lesser rig - in which
case, speaker choice can be very important.

I was considering the SP3 due to its size and K3 style match. However,
as the new desk is still in the paper/pencil stage, I can accommodate
the Behringers.

Bill W2BLC K-Line

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Bill Clarke

Re: SP-3 frequency range question

I posted this message - and checked that it appeared. It did. But, it was skipped over on the reflector. Hmmm???

Well, between list failures and a lack of the "real world" experience
replies I was seeking, I have decided to continue using the Behringer
MS40 pair. Just wasn't meant to be.

I did receive a couple of direct replies indicating I might well be
disappointed in the low end department - which I need for AM and SWL. I
also dabble in ESSB.

Actually, when it comes to receiving - I personally think it is more
about the Receive EQ in the K3 than about the quality/specs of the
speaker. Similar to how a cheap mic can be made to sound like an RCA
ribbon mic. Of course, this is not true for a lesser rig - in which
case, speaker choice can be very important.

I was considering the SP3 due to its size and K3 style match. However,
as the new desk is still in the paper/pencil stage, I can accommodate
the Behringers.

Bill W2BLC K-Line

------------------------------------------------------------------------
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Alan Bloom

Re: SP-3 frequency range question

On 02/05/2018 07:58 AM, Bill wrote:

> I did receive a couple of direct replies indicating I might well be
> disappointed in the low end department - which I need for AM and SWL. I
> also dabble in ESSB.

I'm not an expert in speaker design but I have dabbled a little. I
think that to get good bass response in a small enclosure you have to
give up efficiency - it takes a lot more power to drive the speaker.

Basically it's a tradeoff between small size, good bass response and
good efficiency - pick any two.

Alan N1AL
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Jim Wilson

Re: SP-3 frequency range question

In reply to this post by Bill Clarke

Bill,

Personally, I like the SP-3 speaker. I have two of them and,
compared with my Koss headphones, they both sound like
the headphones. Great for the K3 on SSB or CW. Not Hi-Fi
for music but entirely adequate. PLUS, they look good
in the K-Line.

Jim - W4RKS
----------------------------------------

>In the real world, does the SP-3 exhibit well rounded frequency
>response? Or, is the response more directed for "communications use"?
>How is it for listening to AM broadcast? How does it do with the famous
>K3 hiss? How does it do with a less capable receiver (one without an EQ)?

>I am considering some station simplification, hence the SP-3. Currently,
>I am using the Behringer MS40 pair. Super sound, but quite large and do
>have an internal amp (I have experienced no RF problems).

>Bill W2BLC K-Line
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Joe Subich, W4TV-4

Re: SP-3 frequency range question

On 2/5/2018 1:43 PM, James Wilson wrote:
> Great for the K3 on SSB or CW. Not Hi-Fi for music but entirely
> adequate.

I've been using the Pyle PCB3 series "cube" speakers since well
before the SP3 was introduced. The Pyle speakers are spec'd at
90 - 20 KHz (about the same as the SP3) and are easy to drive
as well.

I notice no difference in response between the speakers and my
headphones (typically Yamaha CM500 but occasionally smaller,
ear bud or "professional" Sony headphones) *HOWEVER* I have the
K3 RX EQ set to roll off (-16 dB) the 50 and 100 Hz bands with
a -6 dB roll off in the 200 Hz band for SSB/AM and with -16 dB
at 50 Hz and -3 dB at 200 Hz for CW.

There is no issue for me with the roll off if/when I listen to
AM or shortwave broadcast but I can certainly "flatten out" the
response by changing the RX EQ to flat or even add a bit of low
end boost if band conditions are quiet/no QRM.

73,

... Joe, W4TV

On 2/5/2018 1:43 PM, James Wilson wrote:

> Bill,
>
> Personally, I like the SP-3 speaker. I have two of them and,
> compared with my Koss headphones, they both sound like
> the headphones. Great for the K3 on SSB or CW. Not Hi-Fi
> for music but entirely adequate. PLUS, they look good
> in the K-Line.
>
> Jim - W4RKS
> ----------------------------------------
>
>> In the real world, does the SP-3 exhibit well rounded frequency
>> response? Or, is the response more directed for "communications use"?
>> How is it for listening to AM broadcast? How does it do with the famous
>> K3 hiss? How does it do with a less capable receiver (one without an EQ)?
>
>> I am considering some station simplification, hence the SP-3. Currently,
>> I am using the Behringer MS40 pair. Super sound, but quite large and do
>> have an internal amp (I have experienced no RF problems).
>
>> Bill W2BLC K-Line
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
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>
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Jim Brown-10

Re: SP-3 frequency range question

In reply to this post by Alan Bloom

On 2/5/2018 10:13 AM, Alan wrote:

> On 02/05/2018 07:58 AM, Bill wrote:
>
>> I did receive a couple of direct replies indicating I might well be
>> disappointed in the low end department - which I need for AM and SWL. I
>> also dabble in ESSB.
>
> I'm not an expert in speaker design but I have dabbled a little. I
> think that to get good bass response in a small enclosure you have to
> give up efficiency - it takes a lot more power to drive the speaker.
>
> Basically it's a tradeoff between small size, good bass response and
> good efficiency - pick any two.

Elecraft mailing list

Re: SP-3 frequency range question

>>> which I need for AM and SWL. I
>> also dabble in ESSB. <<<
Bill, according to the Scripture of HAM Radio, AM, SWL, and even more so, ESSB, is not Ham Radio. Please do not listen below 200Hz, and above 2400Hz. Should you persist, you'll get cavities, and eventually go deaf. This is in accordance to the GOSPEL of Jim K9YC.
Milverton / W9MMS.

On Tuesday, February 6, 2018, 7:40:49 AM CST, Jim Brown <[hidden email]> wrote:

On 2/5/2018 10:13 AM, Alan wrote:

This is a good description of the tradeoffs. BUT -- there is NO useful
energy in human speech below about 200 Hz, and a cone doesn't have to be
very big to reproduce that with reasonable efficiency. We're not
reproducing music here. Riley Hollingsworth, our hero who cleaned up ham
radio in his gig at the FCC before he retired a decade or so ago, said
it quite well; "if you want to transmit hi-fi, buy a radio station."

73, Jim K9YC

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wayne burdick

The SP3 is not just for SSB speech reproduction

Administrator

In reply to this post by Jim Brown-10

The SP3 is reasonably flat from 100-20,000 Hz. It can reproduce somewhat lower pitches, too. It’s not a brick-wall function. A bit of EQ can be applied if the source provides it.

The SP3 is thus suitable for a wide range of material, including high-quality broadcast voice, ESSB, and even music, but not counting subsonic Earthquake mode, etc.

We did not design it to be used exclusively for narrowband voice.

73,
Wayne
N6KR

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Dennis Moore

Re: SP-3 frequency range question

In reply to this post by Bill Clarke

I sometimes listen to a ball game on the K3 with two SP3s, sounds great
even when I forget to switch from LSB to AM. I set a wide rcv filter and
haven't set RX equalization to take advantage of them. I just plugged
them in and started listening. I'm not an audiophile.

73, Dennis NJ6G

On 2/4/2018 12:36, Bill wrote:

> This is another repeat - the first two attempts did not appear. Makes
> me wonder if I am blocked for some reason???
>
>
> In the real world, does the SP-3 exhibit well rounded frequency
> response? Or, is the response more directed for "communications use"?
> How is it for listening to AM broadcast? How does it do with the
> famous K3 hiss? How does it do with a less capable receiver (one
> without an EQ)?
>
> I am considering some station simplification, hence the SP-3.
> Currently, I am using the Behringer MS40 pair. Super sound, but quite
> large and do have an internal amp (I have experienced no RF problems).
>
> Bill W2BLC K-Line

ke9uw

Re: SP-3 frequency range question

In reply to this post by Joe Subich, W4TV-4

Will the KX3 drive the SP3 adequately?

Chuck Hawley
[hidden email]

Amateur Radio, KE9UW
aka Jack, BMW Motorcycles
________________________________________
From: [hidden email] [[hidden email]] on behalf of Walter Underwood [[hidden email]]
Sent: Tuesday, February 13, 2018 10:40 PM
To: Elecraft Reflector
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] SP-3 frequency range question

I use the same Pyle speakers, mostly because they were cheap, but they sound OK. My RX EQ is flat.

With my KX3, I drive them with a $10 12V audio amp, because the phones output is 100 mW.

Details here:

https://observer.wunderwood.org/2017/03/04/speakers-for-my-elecraft-kx3/

wunder
Walter Underwood
[hidden email]
http://observer.wunderwood.org/ (my blog)

> On Feb 5, 2018, at 12:23 PM, Joe Subich, W4TV <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> On 2/5/2018 1:43 PM, James Wilson wrote:
>> Great for the K3 on SSB or CW. Not Hi-Fi for music but entirely
>> adequate.
>
> I've been using the Pyle PCB3 series "cube" speakers since well
> before the SP3 was introduced. The Pyle speakers are spec'd at
> 90 - 20 KHz (about the same as the SP3) and are easy to drive
> as well.
>
> I notice no difference in response between the speakers and my
> headphones (typically Yamaha CM500 but occasionally smaller,
> ear bud or "professional" Sony headphones) *HOWEVER* I have the
> K3 RX EQ set to roll off (-16 dB) the 50 and 100 Hz bands with
> a -6 dB roll off in the 200 Hz band for SSB/AM and with -16 dB
> at 50 Hz and -3 dB at 200 Hz for CW.
>
> There is no issue for me with the roll off if/when I listen to
> AM or shortwave broadcast but I can certainly "flatten out" the
> response by changing the RX EQ to flat or even add a bit of low
> end boost if band conditions are quiet/no QRM.
>
> 73,
>
> ... Joe, W4TV
>
>
> On 2/5/2018 1:43 PM, James Wilson wrote:
>> Bill,
>> Personally, I like the SP-3 speaker. I have two of them and,
>> compared with my Koss headphones, they both sound like
>> the headphones. Great for the K3 on SSB or CW. Not Hi-Fi
>> for music but entirely adequate. PLUS, they look good
>> in the K-Line.
>> Jim - W4RKS
>> ----------------------------------------
>>> In the real world, does the SP-3 exhibit well rounded frequency
>>> response? Or, is the response more directed for "communications use"?
>>> How is it for listening to AM broadcast? How does it do with the famous
>>> K3 hiss? How does it do with a less capable receiver (one without an EQ)?
>>> I am considering some station simplification, hence the SP-3. Currently,
>>> I am using the Behringer MS40 pair. Super sound, but quite large and do
>>> have an internal amp (I have experienced no RF problems).
>>> Bill W2BLC K-Line
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> Elecraft mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>> Message delivered to [hidden email]
> ______________________________________________________________
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> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
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> Message delivered to [hidden email]

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Chuck, KE9UW

Don Wilhelm

Re: SP-3 frequency range question

Chuck,

With only 100mW of audio from the KX3 phones jack, I doubt the KX3 will
drive any speaker directly. Use amplified speakers.
The SP3 will work fine if you add an amplifier.

I use the West Mountain Radio ComSpeakers with my KX3. They are not
only amplified, but are shielded for RF immunity. No problems here with
output at 100 watts (I don't run more than that here, never have).

73,
Don W3FPR

On 2/14/2018 9:26 AM, hawley, charles j jr wrote:

> Will the KX3 drive the SP3 adequately?
>
> Chuck Hawley
> [hidden email]
>
> Amateur Radio, KE9UW
> aka Jack, BMW Motorcycles
> ________________________________________
> From: [hidden email] [[hidden email]] on behalf of Walter Underwood [[hidden email]]
> Sent: Tuesday, February 13, 2018 10:40 PM
> To: Elecraft Reflector
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] SP-3 frequency range question
>
> I use the same Pyle speakers, mostly because they were cheap, but they sound OK. My RX EQ is flat.
>
> With my KX3, I drive them with a $10 12V audio amp, because the phones output is 100 mW.
>
> Details here:
>
> https://observer.wunderwood.org/2017/03/04/speakers-for-my-elecraft-kx3/
>
> wunder
> Walter Underwood
> [hidden email]
> http://observer.wunderwood.org/ (my blog)
>
>> On Feb 5, 2018, at 12:23 PM, Joe Subich, W4TV <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>> On 2/5/2018 1:43 PM, James Wilson wrote:
>>> Great for the K3 on SSB or CW. Not Hi-Fi for music but entirely
>>> adequate.
>>
>> I've been using the Pyle PCB3 series "cube" speakers since well
>> before the SP3 was introduced. The Pyle speakers are spec'd at
>> 90 - 20 KHz (about the same as the SP3) and are easy to drive
>> as well.
>>
>> I notice no difference in response between the speakers and my
>> headphones (typically Yamaha CM500 but occasionally smaller,
>> ear bud or "professional" Sony headphones) *HOWEVER* I have the
>> K3 RX EQ set to roll off (-16 dB) the 50 and 100 Hz bands with
>> a -6 dB roll off in the 200 Hz band for SSB/AM and with -16 dB
>> at 50 Hz and -3 dB at 200 Hz for CW.
>>
>> There is no issue for me with the roll off if/when I listen to
>> AM or shortwave broadcast but I can certainly "flatten out" the
>> response by changing the RX EQ to flat or even add a bit of low
>> end boost if band conditions are quiet/no QRM.
>>
>> 73,
>>
>> ... Joe, W4TV
>>
>>
>> On 2/5/2018 1:43 PM, James Wilson wrote:
>>> Bill,
>>> Personally, I like the SP-3 speaker. I have two of them and,
>>> compared with my Koss headphones, they both sound like
>>> the headphones. Great for the K3 on SSB or CW. Not Hi-Fi
>>> for music but entirely adequate. PLUS, they look good
>>> in the K-Line.
>>> Jim - W4RKS
>>> ----------------------------------------
>>>> In the real world, does the SP-3 exhibit well rounded frequency
>>>> response? Or, is the response more directed for "communications use"?
>>>> How is it for listening to AM broadcast? How does it do with the famous
>>>> K3 hiss? How does it do with a less capable receiver (one without an EQ)?
>>>> I am considering some station simplification, hence the SP-3. Currently,
>>>> I am using the Behringer MS40 pair. Super sound, but quite large and do
>>>> have an internal amp (I have experienced no RF problems).
>>>> Bill W2BLC K-Line
>>> ______________________________________________________________
>>> Elecraft mailing list
>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>>> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> Elecraft mailing list
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>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>
> ______________________________________________________________
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>
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SP-3 frequency range question

SP-3 frequency range question

Re: SP-3 frequency range question

Re: SP-3 frequency range question

Re: SP-3 frequency range question

Re: SP-3 frequency range question

Re: SP-3 frequency range question

Re: SP-3 frequency range question

Re: SP-3 frequency range question

Re: SP-3 frequency range question

Re: SP-3 frequency range question

Re: SP-3 frequency range question

The SP3 is *not* just for SSB speech reproduction

Re: SP-3 frequency range question

Re: SP-3 frequency range question

Re: SP-3 frequency range question

The SP3 is not just for SSB speech reproduction