The K3 and "homebrew": view from the E-lab

[wayne burdick]

First, let me say that I like Jim's sliding scale of what constitutes
"homebrew" (reproduced at the end of this email from his recent QRP-L
posting). Translating that into contest multipliers and
building-contest rules is another story.

I've been engaged in "building" at every level of the N2EY Scale. I've
designed a lot from scratch (including--with a lot of help from my
friends--the K3/K2/K1/KX1/Sierra/SST/NC40A). I've built PCs from
modules, built Heathkits, borrowed circuits from Hayward and DeMaw, and
tried everything in between, sometimes with comical results. I had *no*
clue what I was doing -- at first. The important thing is this: Every
level of building is rewarding in its own way, because you have to
learn something to do it well.

I have no qualms at all when I see the K3 at #6 on the scale. Skill is
still involved: using tools, aligning hardware and panels by eye,
calibrating trim-caps, reading instructions. A modular K3 is, clearly,
not what you'd think of as homebrew, but it certainly is a kit, and
will still take considerable time to complete. I'm content to have the
subject debated by the many enthusiastic builders on this list, and
will accept your judgment.

But I'll leave you with an interesting story. Once, at a wireless
seminar, I had the opportunity to show one of my little projects
(NorCal Sierra prototype) to Wes Hayward, W7ZOI. Wes is the famous
co-author of Solid State Design, EMRFD, and other books, and was a
mentor of mine, though he didn't realize it. At first he tossed a few
compliments my way. But then he firmly chided me for having
single-handedly stunted the intellectual growth of a generation of
potential engineers -- by offering PC boards pre-made!

I countered that I might just have *helped* some future engineers by
giving them something cool to start on. Something to stimulate their
imagination. And over the years this has proven to be true: I've been
contacted by many hams who hadn't built a thing until they'd
encountered a kit (one of Doug's, or mine and Eric's, or Bob Dyer's, or
Dave Benson's), and had then moved successively higher up the rungs on
N2EY's hierarchy.

So when I think about the K3 and its pre-tested, no-soldering modules,
I don't see a swath of destruction in the ranks of the technically
inclined. I don't see a impending precipitous drop in IQ. Instead, I
see hundreds of ordinary folks -- who might never have touched a
soldering iron or even a screwdriver -- take their first tentative
steps towards learning the skill of building.

With our help (and yours), some of them will make that same leap of
faith that we did. They'll modify something. Or fix something. And
before you know it, they'll be slapping 0402's on hand-etched
microstrips   ;)

73,
Wayne
N6KR


* * *

N2EY's homebrew/kit scale:

1) Homebrew (scratch built): Original unit, designed and built by the
ham,
including circuit design, mechanical layout, coil winding, etc.

2) Homebrew (article project): More-or-less copy of a project designed
and
documented by others, such as an HBR receiver.

3) Surplus conversion: Adaptation of an electronic unit meant for one
purpose
to a new purpose, but not a completely new design. Usually applied to
WW2
military surplus but really applies to almost anything, such as
land-mobile VHF
FM rigs converted to ham use.

4) Semi-kit: Construction of a kit that requires more than electronic
assembly, such as a QRP rig that consists of a PCB and most parts but
leaves the
chassis and some other details up to the builder. Limited instructions
are part of
the semi-kit class.

5) Heath-kit: Construction of a kit that requires only electronic
assembly
(and possibly coil winding) from components. Extensive instructions, as
in most
Heathkit and Elecraft products.

6) PC-kit: Construction of a kit from modules rather than components.
Similar
to building a computer from a pile of goodies, hence the name. Elecraft
K3.


---

http://www.elecraft.com

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[Dr. Dan Swartling]

Well, now that the K3 is modular in design, it seems like a
fore-runner of what I would still like to see: the K4, a modular FM
radio with plug-in band modules for 2 meters and up.

I know it can be done. I just might have to do it myself.

Dan
--
To make a difference, one must first be different.
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[John GM4SLV]

On Mon, 30 Apr 2007 21:47:08 -0700
wayne burdick <[hidden email]> wrote:

> A modular K3 is, clearly, not what you'd think of as homebrew, but
> it certainly is a kit, and will still take considerable time to
> complete.

One small question, since Wayne has given the first indication the the
self-build K3 is a little more complex than I might have first thought.

What is the estimate of how long a K3 _would_ take to put together?
Are we talking over the course of an evening or something a bit more
involving?

I'm not planning one for myself (my K2 is enough radio for me), but I
can see others wanting to join the party, and to save money by going the
self build route, and I would love to be able to give them the answers
that might just push them into it!

For some it might be "oh - it'll only take a couple of hours, go on
you'll enjoy it and get a great rig in the process" and for others it
may be "oh - it's still quite a bit of work, you'll enjoy the build
process and learn a lot in the process, _and_ get a great rig at the
end"



Cheers,

John GM4SLV
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[Gary D Krause]

Good point, Wayne.  I would also like to add that a lot of us build our
own computers which are also modular and we still get a sense of
achievement and pride as well as learning how they work.   The world is
dynamic and things change.

Gary, N7HTS

wayne burdick wrote:

> First, let me say that I like Jim's sliding scale of what constitutes
> "homebrew" (reproduced at the end of this email from his recent QRP-L
> posting). Translating that into contest multipliers and
> building-contest rules is another story.
>
> I've been engaged in "building" at every level of the N2EY Scale. I've
> designed a lot from scratch (including--with a lot of help from my
> friends--the K3/K2/K1/KX1/Sierra/SST/NC40A). I've built PCs from
> modules, built Heathkits, borrowed circuits from Hayward and DeMaw,
> and tried everything in between, sometimes with comical results. I had
> *no* clue what I was doing -- at first. The important thing is this:
> Every level of building is rewarding in its own way, because you have
> to learn something to do it well.
>
> I have no qualms at all when I see the K3 at #6 on the scale. Skill is
> still involved: using tools, aligning hardware and panels by eye,
> calibrating trim-caps, reading instructions. A modular K3 is, clearly,
> not what you'd think of as homebrew, but it certainly is a kit, and
> will still take considerable time to complete. I'm content to have the
> subject debated by the many enthusiastic builders on this list, and
> will accept your judgment.
>
> But I'll leave you with an interesting story. Once, at a wireless
> seminar, I had the opportunity to show one of my little projects
> (NorCal Sierra prototype) to Wes Hayward, W7ZOI. Wes is the famous
> co-author of Solid State Design, EMRFD, and other books, and was a
> mentor of mine, though he didn't realize it. At first he tossed a few
> compliments my way. But then he firmly chided me for having
> single-handedly stunted the intellectual growth of a generation of
> potential engineers -- by offering PC boards pre-made!
>
> I countered that I might just have *helped* some future engineers by
> giving them something cool to start on. Something to stimulate their
> imagination. And over the years this has proven to be true: I've been
> contacted by many hams who hadn't built a thing until they'd
> encountered a kit (one of Doug's, or mine and Eric's, or Bob Dyer's,
> or Dave Benson's), and had then moved successively higher up the rungs
> on N2EY's hierarchy.
>
> So when I think about the K3 and its pre-tested, no-soldering modules,
> I don't see a swath of destruction in the ranks of the technically
> inclined. I don't see a impending precipitous drop in IQ. Instead, I
> see hundreds of ordinary folks -- who might never have touched a
> soldering iron or even a screwdriver -- take their first tentative
> steps towards learning the skill of building.
>
> With our help (and yours), some of them will make that same leap of
> faith that we did. They'll modify something. Or fix something. And
> before you know it, they'll be slapping 0402's on hand-etched
> microstrips   ;)
>
> 73,
> Wayne
> N6KR
>
>
> * * *
>
> N2EY's homebrew/kit scale:
>
> 1) Homebrew (scratch built): Original unit, designed and built by the
> ham,
> including circuit design, mechanical layout, coil winding, etc.
>
> 2) Homebrew (article project): More-or-less copy of a project designed
> and
> documented by others, such as an HBR receiver.
>
> 3) Surplus conversion: Adaptation of an electronic unit meant for one
> purpose
> to a new purpose, but not a completely new design. Usually applied to WW2
> military surplus but really applies to almost anything, such as
> land-mobile VHF
> FM rigs converted to ham use.
>
> 4) Semi-kit: Construction of a kit that requires more than electronic
> assembly, such as a QRP rig that consists of a PCB and most parts but
> leaves the
> chassis and some other details up to the builder. Limited instructions
> are part of
> the semi-kit class.
>
> 5) Heath-kit: Construction of a kit that requires only electronic
> assembly
> (and possibly coil winding) from components. Extensive instructions,
> as in most
> Heathkit and Elecraft products.
>
> 6) PC-kit: Construction of a kit from modules rather than components.
> Similar
> to building a computer from a pile of goodies, hence the name.
> Elecraft K3.
>
>
> ---
>
> http://www.elecraft.com
>
> _______________________________________________
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> You must be a subscriber to post to the list.
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> Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
>

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[Doug Faunt N6TQS [phone]]

No one authorative so I'll answer the question about build time, since
I asked Eric this at the Visalia vendors forum.

7-9 hours estimated build time for a K3.  Not an evening, but a
weekend.

73, doug

   Date: Tue, 1 May 2007 08:44:29 +0100
   From: John GM4SLV <[hidden email]>
   Z-Spam-Score: -2.4 (--)
   Z-Spam-Report: No, hits=-2.4 required=5.5 test=BAYES_00,DNS_FROM_RFC_ABUSE autolearn=no version=3.1.8
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   On Mon, 30 Apr 2007 21:47:08 -0700
   wayne burdick <[hidden email]> wrote:

   > A modular K3 is, clearly, not what you'd think of as homebrew, but
   > it certainly is a kit, and will still take considerable time to
   > complete.

   One small question, since Wayne has given the first indication the the
   self-build K3 is a little more complex than I might have first thought.

   What is the estimate of how long a K3 _would_ take to put together?
   Are we talking over the course of an evening or something a bit more
   involving?

   I'm not planning one for myself (my K2 is enough radio for me), but I
   can see others wanting to join the party, and to save money by going the
   self build route, and I would love to be able to give them the answers
   that might just push them into it!

   For some it might be "oh - it'll only take a couple of hours, go on
   you'll enjoy it and get a great rig in the process" and for others it
   may be "oh - it's still quite a bit of work, you'll enjoy the build
   process and learn a lot in the process, _and_ get a great rig at the
   end"



   Cheers,

   John GM4SLV
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[Brett gazdzinski-2]

I have done 1 to 6, homebrew receivers and transmitters without any
starting design, superhets and kilowatt transmitters,
old push pull tube stuff, pi net continuous coverage, etc,
plus the old heathkit stuff (lots of it), regens out of
encyclopedias, home made circuit board things out
of the ARRL handbook, home built computers, etc, and its
all fun. The design/prototype/test part seems to be the most
fun and educational for me, finding a good simple local
oscillator design using junk box parts was very fun.

I think the K2 was a little over to the parts stuffing side
of kit building, but with so many parts, it has its own
flavor of kit building, and I rate it higher then the old
heathkit stuff.
And nothing heathkit ever designed worked so well, they
always seemed to compromise performance severely over cost.

It sure sounds like the K3 is case building and then you stuff
the modules into slots, do some calibration, and operate.
No way they could offer something as complex in any
other format.


I personally have no reason to upgrade to a K3 other than
the AM receiver part. It sure would be nice if the K3
ends up having a good hi fidelity AM receiver in it.
(20 to 5000 Hz, low distortion and noise)

Many AMers are using old R390's and such, a truckload
of tubes and gears, and it still needs work and
an outboard amp to sound good.

Most swl stuff is not setup to be a communications receiver,
and most is poor for anything other than swl stuff.

Modern ham gear seems to limit things to 300 to maybe 3000
Hz at 1.5 watts and 10% distortion, out of a 2 inch speaker...
add in plenty of IC chip hash from the 4 conversions and
they sound horrible on AM.

I hear flex radio is doing amazing things on AM with
their stuff, you can set the fidelity, modulation, compression,
etc on both rx and tx, and they can sound better than broadcast
stations, but I don't want a computer in the shack.
I sure hope the K3 includes some of that type of stuff
on the AM mode.
I don't think I could sell the K2, but the 756 pro will
be gone in a flash if the K3 has nice AM receive!

Although I think the crew at elecraft are really amazing, maybe
they shot themselves in the foot with the premature release
of some k3 info, everyone is all lathered up now!

I suppose its time to list the 756 pro on ebay....



Brett
N2DTS



   

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[J S-17]

Wayne wrote, in part, last night:

"I countered that I might just have *helped* some future engineers by
giving them something cool to start on. Something to stimulate their
imagination. And over the years this has proven to be true: I've been
contacted by many hams who hadn't built a thing until they'd
encountered a kit (one of Doug's, or mine and Eric's, or Bob Dyer's,
or Dave Benson's), and had then moved successively higher up the rungs
on N2EY's hierarchy."

Wayne,

I have saved your post to my computer, because more than anything I've
seen, it says so much about you and about Elecraft.  It really means a
lot to me.

A little bit about me.  As a teen many years ago, I wanted to get into
ham radio, but it all looked so technical.  And I didn't know anyone
who was a ham who could help me.  I bought "How to Become a Radio
Amateur", and was fascinated, but didn't carry it any farther.
Finally, years later,  in 1999, I passed the written exam and code
exam and got my first license!  A dream had come true for me at last.

Shortly thereafter, I decided to try my hand at kit building with a
Ramsey 20 meter receiver from the local ham radio store here in town.
I'd never soldered anything, so it turned out poorly and it didn't
work. I was pretty discouraged about that, and wondered if I'd ever
build an electonic project (with soldering) that would work.  I found
eham.net on the web, and started to read reviews about QRP radios.
The reviews I found led me to your website, and the wealth of
information and help about soldering and kit building, not to mention
all the kits offered there.

So here I was, a guy with no technical training or background, who
never successfully built anything electronic, and you, your superb
website, and the other folks at Elecraft are the sole reasons I
successfully built a K1 three years ago.  It was certainly a challenge
for me, but I finished it, and I've made many contacts with that
radio.  And it's a high-quality rig as well.  I was amazed at the
success of that project.

Thank you, Wayne, is all I can say.  I think the real test of all you
are doing, now with the K3 as well, is:  can a high quality radio that
does what it does very, very well be made available not only to the
technically skilled, but also to those like me who don't have a
technical background?  If you achieve these goals, you will done a
great service for the hobby and community of ham radio.

Thank you again for your post. There is so much that you say there.
It's more than all the kits you have devised and built, Wayne.  It's
your perspective: the desire to mentor and encourage others in
building their own radios and projects.  More than that, when so many
will say that ham radio is a dying hobby, what you are really trying
to do is remind us how much there is that is fun in this hobby.  You
and Elecraft really bring us back again to the "Magic of Marconi" -
the discovery of the wonder of radio transmission and communication.
It's how that invisible signal through the air can miraculously allow
me to communicate with someone across town, across the country, or
across the ocean.   Isn't that what Elecraft is really about, after
all?

Your post is real hall-of-fame material, in this ham's opinion.  Thank
you, Wayne, for this great reminder of the magic of radio... for all
to enjoy.

Jeff Simpson
K6ATT
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[Brett gazdzinski-2]

There is actually a step below 1 on the scale.
Remember way back, like when the ARRL started, everyone
made their own parts!
Caps, coils, batteries, resistors were all home made
in many cases.
I do my own coils and was thinking about ways I might
make some big air variable caps for a big antenna tuner,
but draw the line at blowing glass for tubes and making
resistors out of carbon....

Brett
N2DTS

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[Brian Lloyd-6]

WRT the levels of homebuilding: sometimes you have to change your  
view on what constitutes the component level. If you look at amateur  
radio historically, early hams had to construct their own coils,  
capacitors, and resistors. Later these things were sold ready-made.  
With the advent of monolithic circuits whole subassemblies were  
subsumed into a single part. Now we consider entire functional blocks  
to be "components".

18 years ago I went to work for Telebit. They made modems (really  
good modems by the way). My idea was a device to allow people to dial  
up and connect to the Internet. We built it and called it the  
Netblazer. It was built around a generic PC motherboard.

I ran into a problem with engineering and manufacturing when they  
wanted a complete parts breakdown on the motherboard we had selected.  
I tried to explain that the motherboard itself was the 'component'  
and not all the devices attached to the motherboard. I didn't care  
about the individual parts, only the high-level function of the board  
itself. Even the processor didn't matter so long as it executed a  
certain set of instructions.

Today we accept that as reasonable. Back then it was a revolutionary  
concept.

I guess it all depends on which end of the telescope you are looking  
through.

73 de Brian, WB6RQN

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