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Trying to connect K3s to Win 10 and Expert 2K amp. Db9/serial port problem

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bobf@feldtman.com

Trying to connect K3s to Win 10 and Expert 2K amp. Db9/serial port problem

I have read the Elecraft K3s manual, K3 manual, Expert 2K manual.. realize that I need to try to use db9..(RJ45) and have been told to use a Y connector (using the y connector I purchased from Elecraft for P3 display but I don’t use it).. and connect only two wires to Expert (ground and RXD- but NOT tXD)-and the the other Y I fed through a USB convertor. That goes to a Dell Win 10 computer which doesn’t even allow one to see comm ports in device manager. Yes I tried “hidden devices” but never saw Comm port or LPT anywhere.

Guess I might have to go back to a “legacy computer -windows 7, or make my linux mint do it.. I do have WSJTX running fine on IC-7600, and CiV com talks to Expert 2K fine.

Doesn’t work.

Maybe the RJ45, to two serial Db9 connectors isn’t really a split serial port.??

Any quick and easy guide to make the RJ45 work…??

Bobf

> On Jun 10, 2021, at 3:03 PM, [hidden email] wrote:
>
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>
> Today's Topics:
>
> 1. Gurus (Andy Durbin)
> 2. Gurus, Giving Up & Group Therapy (Joseph Shuman)
> 3. Gurus (Bob McGraw)
> 4. setting up KPA 1500 remote app (Howard Sherer)
> 5. Re: Help with KIO3b RJ45 to Windows 10 (Bob KD7YZ)
> 6. Re: Gurus (Bill Frantz)
> 7. Re: Gurus (Dean L)
> 8. Re: Gurus, Giving Up & Group Therapy (Julia Tuttle)
> 9. Re: Gurus (Dave)
> 10. Re: Gurus (Julia Tuttle)
> 11. Re: Gurus (Dave)
> 12. Re: Gurus (Dave)
> 13. Re: Gurus (Wes)
> 14. Re: Gurus (Josh Fiden)
> 15. Re: Gurus (Dean L)
> 16. Re: Gurus (Jim Brown)
> 17. Re: Gurus (Eric Swartz)
> 18. Re: Gurus, Giving Up & Group Therapy (Jim Brown)
> 19. Sub RX on 40m random deafness (G2NF Tony)
> 20. Re: Gurus (Gwen Patton)
> 21. Re: Gurus (Jim Brown)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2021 17:06:26 +0000
> From: Andy Durbin <[hidden email]>
> To: "[hidden email]" <[hidden email]>
> Subject: [Elecraft] Gurus
> Message-ID:
> <[hidden email]>
>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> "Harmonics should only be heard on the harmonic frequency, not splatter across the entire band."
>
> That depends on whether you are talking about RF frequency harmonics or harmonics of the modulating audio frequency. There is a plague of stations producing FT8 audio harmonics. The problem is not helped by people insisting that the cure is proper ALC adjustment. While there may be rigs that cause audio harmonics because of incorrect ALC adjustment it's far more likely that the clipping that causes these harmonics happens in the audio stages long before ALC is applied.
>
> Transmitting a clean signal is the responsibility of the operator not that of the rig manufacturer or software application provider.
>
> Andy, k3wyc
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2021 13:24:04 -0400
> From: Joseph Shuman <[hidden email]>
> To: [hidden email]
> Subject: [Elecraft] Gurus, Giving Up & Group Therapy
> Message-ID: <[hidden email]>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
>
> Humor on this Board is sometimes misunderstood. Oh well?
>
> My 3 rules:
>
> 1. If my $100.00 built from scratch and spare parts radio successfully communicates with your state of the art shack, my hobby has succeeded.
>
> 2. Everybody has an opinion and all of them are correct, but mine is more correct for me than yours.
>
> 3. There is very little on this board about the KX2 so it must be the closest to perfect radio out there Elecraft has designed. That is why I own one.
>
> Is the true spirit of the ?Elmer? part of your hobby?
>
> Keeping Watch-
> shu
> Joe Shuman, NZ8P
>
> Unless someone like you
> cares a whole awful lot,
> nothing is going to get better.
> It?s not. -Dr. Seuss
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2021 12:29:51 -0500
> From: Bob McGraw <[hidden email]>
> To: [hidden email]
> Subject: [Elecraft] Gurus
> Message-ID: <[hidden email]>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed
>
> Lets get a few facts straight.
>
> An amateur operator designated by the licensee of a?station is to
> be?responsible?for the operation of that station. Refer to ?2.201 of the
> FCC Rules,?Emission, modulation and transmission?. It is the ham that
> holds the station license and the designated operator of that station
> that is responsible for all emissions from that station.? This is
> regardless of the brand or model of equipment being used.
>
> Reading the manual and operating the equipment as specified by the
> manufacture is absolutely mandatory for any good operator. Using
> excessive levels or power is not a good candidate for a good operator
> and thus leads to signal degradation.
>
> The FCC no longer evaluates or test ham radio equipment.?? Each
> manufacturer submits the required documentation to the FCC for
> approval.? In doing so they are attesting that the brand / model does
> meet the FCC requirements. ? {I have observed an instance where approval
> was granted but independent measurements confirm the particular brand /
> model did not meet the requirements.?? In a different occasion, the
> company / person performing the tests said "oh, that's good enough" when
> indeed the equipment did not make the required measurement values.}
>
> Splatter is just that, splatter.? It is not a harmonic. "A?harmonic?is a
> wave with a frequency that is a positive integer multiple of the
> frequency of the original wave, known as the fundamental frequency. The
> original wave is also called the 1st?harmonic, the
> following?harmonics?are known as higher?harmonics."?? Thus if one
> transmits a CW signal then the 2nd harmonic is 2x the fundamental
> frequency.? Thus 3.562 MHz has a 2nd harmonic at 7.124 MHz.??? Or if one
> transmits an FT-8 signal at 735 Hz then the 2nd harmonic is 1470 Hz.
>
> Hams do make mistakes and can often mis-adjust their radios,
> deliberately, unintentionally, or unknowingly.? Advising one in a
> friendly and informative means is just good practice.?? I don't care how
> expensive or how advanced ones station might be, operated incorrectly it
> can and will cause spectral issues.?? Unfortunately many new hams aren't
> really technical and may not understand how and why certain things
> occur.? They have to be educated in proper station set-up and
> operation.?? It is up to the more experienced and more knowledgeable
> hams to provide this service.
>
> Don't be mislead by what I describe as "old ham lore".?? Just because
> someone said bla bla bla doesn't make it correct.? One must always check
> and verify to their own level of satisfaction or seek the advice of
> others.?? Or perhaps, just read the manual. The acronym for that is RTFM.
>
> 73
>
> Bob, K4TAX
>
>
> On 6/10/2021 11:22 AM, [hidden email] wrote:
>> Message: 1
>> Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2021 04:22:25 +0000
>> From: Bill Johnson<[hidden email]>
>> To: Dave<[hidden email]>,"[hidden email]"
>> <[hidden email]>
>> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Gurus
>> Message-ID:
>> <[hidden email]>
>>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>>
>> I would add, the radio operator with a license is supposed to know the requirements and operate accordingly. This includes staying with the passband of the FCC regulations. Just because a radio is FCC accepted, doesn't mean the operator doesn?t have responsibility to stay within the regulations. Thus if I note you are splattering because of too much mic gain, or whatever, doesn't excuse the person from adjusting the signal or correcting the situation, regardless of the manufacturer. It is the HAM's station creating the issue that is legally needing to correct it. Don't be offended, fix it. I have had issues with my own Elecraft radio with a circuit failure... what did I do? I fixed it.
>>
>> Bill
>> K9YEQ
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 4
> Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2021 13:33:41 -0400
> From: Howard Sherer <[hidden email]>
> To: elecraft <[hidden email]>
> Subject: [Elecraft] setting up KPA 1500 remote app
> Message-ID:
> <CAFmQ1msOjBDt7nbmyW8YVGWbExkDwJT-AWFT=[hidden email]>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
>
> I will be moving my KPA 1500 to a remote site in a few weeks and would like
> to use the remote program to control the amp without the need for a local
> pc at the amp location. I can use the local PC at the amp if it is
> absolutely necessary.
>
> Can someone please walk me through the steps to set up the remote program
> including the need to run host on my remote PC along with the settings for
> the connect remote at the home pc.
>
> Thanks
> Howard
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 5
> Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2021 13:50:05 -0400
> From: Bob KD7YZ <[hidden email]>
> To: Elecraft List <[hidden email]>
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Help with KIO3b RJ45 to Windows 10
> Message-ID: <[hidden email]>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>
> Thanks for the direct-email help
>
> I found my Elecraft cable for RJ45 to RS232
>
> the next issue was correct settings in the K3 the with baud rate on the COM1 port
>
> all is well now.
>
>
> --
> Best regards,
> Bob KD7YZ
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 6
> Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2021 13:58:02 -0400
> From: Bill Frantz <[hidden email]>
> To: [hidden email]
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Gurus
> Message-ID:
> <[hidden email]>
>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
>
> On 6/10/21 at 1:29 PM, [hidden email] (Bob McGraw) wrote:
>
>> The acronym for that is RTFM.
>
> Which a tech writer I worked with insisted expanded to Read The Fine Manual.
>
> 73 Bill AE6JV
>
> -----------------------------------------------------------------------
> Bill Frantz | When all else fails: | Periwinkle
> (408)348-7900 | Voice and CW. | 150 Rivermead Rd #235
> www.pwpconsult.com | | Peterborough, NH 03458
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 7
> Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2021 13:58:55 -0400
> From: Dean L <[hidden email]>
> To: "Dave Cole (NK7Z)" <[hidden email]>
> Cc: Elecraft Mail List <[hidden email]>
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Gurus
> Message-ID:
> <CAHh=[hidden email]>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
>
> After watching the video of the TinySA next to the HP8921, I can't see how
> you could EVER trust the results of the toy.
> I watched as OM in the video was scratching his head wondering where the
> artifacts on the display of the TinySA came from.
> Did I watch the wrong video? If I didn't see the image captured by the HP,
> I would have comd to different conclusions.
>
>
>
>
> I was not impressed:
> Same author different video,
>
> https://youtu.be/uwXUZSdxNq4
>
> As he changed the amplitude the harmonics generated by the TinySA changed
> accordingly making the signal look "dirty"
> Great tool if you have a $10k Service monitor sitting right next to it...
>
> I understand it's $100 gizmo, but might confuse an unsuspecting operator.
>
>
> I would not fault my kilobuck HF rig with this unit
> YMMV
>
> 73
> Dean K2WW
>
> On Thu, Jun 10, 2021, 10:23 Dave <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> Interestingly enough I don't see that issue here with my K3, and tinySA.
>> I also don't use the built in antenna. I use a tap and attenuator
>> combination.
>>
>> I am also using a non clone device, as opposed to a clone device. Some
>> clones don't have the internal shielding.
>>
>> Here is a compare to a clone vs a non clone:
>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I5IzLAGgKg0
>>
>> Here is an interesting video showing both the strengths, and weaknesses
>> of the tinySA. A compare of the tinySA to an HP 8921A SA:
>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xFtF2AYT0iQ
>>
>> For the price, and if one is careful, and aware of how to use the
>> tinySA, you can gain a lot of knowledge for around 100 bucks.
>>
>> I am half tempted to buy one, and add a tap to my output coax, add
>> power, bring it to a very low input level, and just keep the tinySA on
>> all the time I operate, as an alarm that I might have an issue.
>>
>> 73, and thanks,
>> Dave (NK7Z)
>> https://www.nk7z.net
>> ARRL Volunteer Examiner
>> ARRL Technical Specialist, RFI
>> ARRL Asst. Director, NW Division, Technical Resources
>>
>> On 6/10/21 6:45 AM, N4ST - Jim wrote:
>>> FWIW, be careful with your measurement process.
>>> I got very depressed when I saw that my K3S had harmonics only 20db down
>> on most bands when measured by Tiny SA and its telescoping antenna.
>>> It was not being overloaded and in fact I measured similar results when
>> feeding a dummy load.
>>> Then I went outside the shack at a distance from the antennas and found
>> that the harmonics were 40dB down or better.
>>> Evidently when measuring inside the shack I was getting RF leakage
>> directly through the front panel of the rig. (?).
>>>
>>> _______________
>>> 73,
>>> Jim - N4ST
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: [hidden email] <[hidden email]>
>> On Behalf Of Dave
>>> Sent: Wednesday, June 9, 2021 23:01
>>> To: [hidden email]
>>> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Gurus
>>>
>>> Actually for this use they are... Someone did a compare of the tinySA
>>> to an HP, and it was within a few dB as long as it was overdriven. We
>>> are looking for splatter or harmonics, not doing a proof of performance.
>>>
>>> 73, and thanks,
>>> Dave (NK7Z)
>>> https://www.nk7z.net
>>> ARRL Volunteer Examiner
>>> ARRL Technical Specialist, RFI
>>> ARRL Asst. Director, NW Division, Technical Resources
>>>
>>> On 6/9/21 7:10 PM, Wes wrote:
>>>> I'm not sure those toys are up to the task.
>>>>
>>>> On 6/9/2021 5:30 PM, Dave wrote:
>>>>> Buy an attenuator, and a tinySA, or get an SDRPlay, and run the
>>>>> Spectrum Analyzer software. Take a few SA shots, that will tell you
>>>>> if it is him, or you.
>>>>>
>>>>> 73, and thanks,
>>>>> Dave (NK7Z)
>>>>> https://www.nk7z.net
>>>>> ARRL Volunteer Examiner
>>>>> ARRL Technical Specialist, RFI
>>>>> ARRL Asst. Director, NW Division, Technical Resources
>>>> ______________________________________________________________
>>>> Elecraft mailing list
>>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>>>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>>>
>>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>>>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>>>> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>>> ______________________________________________________________
>>> Elecraft mailing list
>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>>
>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>>> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>>>
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> Elecraft mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 8
> Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2021 14:03:59 -0400
> From: Julia Tuttle <[hidden email]>
> To: Joseph Shuman <[hidden email]>
> Cc: Elecraft <[hidden email]>
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Gurus, Giving Up & Group Therapy
> Message-ID:
> <[hidden email]>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
>
> Sadly, humor is really easy to miss on the Internet, mostly due to Poe's
> law (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poe%27s_law).
>
> 1. Yes!
> 2. Yes!
> 3. Yes! My *only* nit is that it can't charge batteries without removing
> them.
>
> And I wanna second the Elmer bit. Helping each other get up and running,
> kindly letting folks know when things are broken, and collaboratively
> debugging problems is such a big part of what makes this hobby enjoyable.
>
> Cheers,
>
> Julie
>
> On Thu, Jun 10, 2021 at 1:24 PM Joseph Shuman via Elecraft <
> [hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> Humor on this Board is sometimes misunderstood. Oh well?
>>
>> My 3 rules:
>>
>> 1. If my $100.00 built from scratch and spare parts radio successfully
>> communicates with your state of the art shack, my hobby has succeeded.
>>
>> 2. Everybody has an opinion and all of them are correct, but mine is more
>> correct for me than yours.
>>
>> 3. There is very little on this board about the KX2 so it must be the
>> closest to perfect radio out there Elecraft has designed. That is why I
>> own one.
>>
>> Is the true spirit of the ?Elmer? part of your hobby?
>>
>> Keeping Watch-
>> shu
>> Joe Shuman, NZ8P
>>
>> Unless someone like you
>> cares a whole awful lot,
>> nothing is going to get better.
>> It?s not. -Dr. Seuss
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> Elecraft mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 9
> Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2021 11:25:22 -0700
> From: Dave <[hidden email]>
> To: [hidden email]
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Gurus
> Message-ID: <[hidden email]>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed
>
> My response was regarding the post talking about operators, see quoted
> text quote in my response.
>
> 73, and thanks,
> Dave (NK7Z)
> https://www.nk7z.net
> ARRL Volunteer Examiner
> ARRL Technical Specialist, RFI
> ARRL Asst. Director, NW Division, Technical Resources
>
> On 6/9/21 6:03 PM, Gwen Patton wrote:
>> It wasn't about the operator, it was about the hardware. I talked to the
>> ham involved, and he's a nice enough bloke. I have no beef with him.
>>
>> My antennas are, unfortunately, not designed with a useful null. I have an
>> end feed W3EDP style that works very well, and a Comet CHA-250B vertical.
>> Neither can reasonably be pointed to attenuate the signal.
>>
>> Gwen, NG3P
>>
>>
>> On Wed, Jun 9, 2021, 8:51 PM Dave <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>>> I must respectfully disagree sir...
>>>
>>> The ordinary ham should be able to tell when his/her rig is out of spec.
>>> The ordinary ham should be able to operate his/her rig correctly.
>>> That is just no longer the case. There are a lot of folks out there
>>> that don't even know how a repeater works at the most basic of levels.
>>> They are operating HF rigs with no understanding of how they work, and
>>> no understanding of what limits they need to maintain.
>>>
>>> They create a mess on the air, and should be told about it. Nicely, but
>>> told non the less. It is far better to have a fellow ham tell you you
>>> have an issue, than have the FCC tell you...
>>>
>>> Speaking of the FCC, I don't remember the FCC turning over
>>> responsibility for signal quality to the manufactures of radios,
>>> absolving the operator of all responsibility... It is the operators job
>>> to make sure he/she is operating their radio correctly, and within
>>> tolerance, period, end of discussion, the operator is responsible.
>>>
>>> If he/she can not tell there is a problem, than that ham should not be
>>> allowed to transmit...
>>>
>>> There are dirty transmitters all over, and they meet FCC specs... How
>>> can that be you might ask yourself?
>>>
>>> In a lot of cases, the operator is not knowledgeable in how to drive the
>>> transmitter properly, or that low voltages feeding the transmitter can
>>> cause issues, or that triggering ALC in FT8 causes issues, there are any
>>> number of settings the Amateur can screw up, and the rig meets FCC
>>> specs...
>>>
>>> So no, it is not "out of line" to let someone know their transmitter is
>>> spraying crap.
>>>
>>> On 6/9/21 5:02 PM, Richards wrote:
>>>> Anyone condemning other hams for using "dirty transmitters" is simply
>>>> out of line.
>>>>
>>>> The ordinary ham is NOT an Electrical Engineer and he buys his rig in
>>>> good faith, believing it passed FCC and other engineering standards. He
>>>> uses it in good faith, assuming it is OK and not causing problems. But
>>>> then, a few self-appointed Frequency Cops condemn the poor operator as a
>>>> bad citizen for using a "dirty transmitter" as if the operator is
>>>> somehow to blame. I have worked a lot of contests with crowded
>>>> conditions in a large metropolitan area, and nobody has ever whined
>>>> about any of this, notwithstanding a couple of self-appointed experts
>>>> living in the mountains of CA and CO claim it is a horrible epidemic.
>>>> Besides, if this was such big problem why is it such a new, current
>>>> topic? Supposedly, all those old rigs have been noisy all the time. I
>>>> suspect it is topical only because they have nothing else to talk about.
>>>>
>>>> Well, even if it is a problem, there is no place for this sort of
>>>> personal attack in ham radio, AND IT IS SIMPLY WRONG TO BLAME THE
>>>> OPERATOR for how his rig works. For most ops, ham radio is just a
>>>> hobby and they are entitled to expect their radios will work right.
>>>> Blaming the operator is simply out of line. K8JHR
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ______________________________________________________________
>>>> Elecraft mailing list
>>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>>>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>>>
>>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>>>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>>>> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>>> Dave
>>> https://www.nk7z.net
>>>
>>> ______________________________________________________________
>>> Elecraft mailing list
>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>>
>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>>> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> Elecraft mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 10
> Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2021 14:30:30 -0400
> From: Julia Tuttle <[hidden email]>
> To: Dave <[hidden email]>
> Cc: Elecraft <[hidden email]>
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Gurus
> Message-ID:
> <[hidden email]>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
>
> I'm confused, I don't see any quoted text, unless you meant just "dirty
> transmitter". Whose post were you responding to?
>
> On Thu, Jun 10, 2021, 14:26 Dave <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> My response was regarding the post talking about operators, see quoted
>> text quote in my response.
>>
>> 73, and thanks,
>> Dave (NK7Z)
>> https://www.nk7z.net
>> ARRL Volunteer Examiner
>> ARRL Technical Specialist, RFI
>> ARRL Asst. Director, NW Division, Technical Resources
>>
>> On 6/9/21 6:03 PM, Gwen Patton wrote:
>>> It wasn't about the operator, it was about the hardware. I talked to the
>>> ham involved, and he's a nice enough bloke. I have no beef with him.
>>>
>>> My antennas are, unfortunately, not designed with a useful null. I have
>> an
>>> end feed W3EDP style that works very well, and a Comet CHA-250B vertical.
>>> Neither can reasonably be pointed to attenuate the signal.
>>>
>>> Gwen, NG3P
>>>
>>>
>>> On Wed, Jun 9, 2021, 8:51 PM Dave <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>
>>>> I must respectfully disagree sir...
>>>>
>>>> The ordinary ham should be able to tell when his/her rig is out of spec.
>>>> The ordinary ham should be able to operate his/her rig correctly.
>>>> That is just no longer the case. There are a lot of folks out there
>>>> that don't even know how a repeater works at the most basic of levels.
>>>> They are operating HF rigs with no understanding of how they work, and
>>>> no understanding of what limits they need to maintain.
>>>>
>>>> They create a mess on the air, and should be told about it. Nicely, but
>>>> told non the less. It is far better to have a fellow ham tell you you
>>>> have an issue, than have the FCC tell you...
>>>>
>>>> Speaking of the FCC, I don't remember the FCC turning over
>>>> responsibility for signal quality to the manufactures of radios,
>>>> absolving the operator of all responsibility... It is the operators job
>>>> to make sure he/she is operating their radio correctly, and within
>>>> tolerance, period, end of discussion, the operator is responsible.
>>>>
>>>> If he/she can not tell there is a problem, than that ham should not be
>>>> allowed to transmit...
>>>>
>>>> There are dirty transmitters all over, and they meet FCC specs... How
>>>> can that be you might ask yourself?
>>>>
>>>> In a lot of cases, the operator is not knowledgeable in how to drive the
>>>> transmitter properly, or that low voltages feeding the transmitter can
>>>> cause issues, or that triggering ALC in FT8 causes issues, there are any
>>>> number of settings the Amateur can screw up, and the rig meets FCC
>>>> specs...
>>>>
>>>> So no, it is not "out of line" to let someone know their transmitter is
>>>> spraying crap.
>>>>
>>>> On 6/9/21 5:02 PM, Richards wrote:
>>>>> Anyone condemning other hams for using "dirty transmitters" is simply
>>>>> out of line.
>>>>>
>>>>> The ordinary ham is NOT an Electrical Engineer and he buys his rig in
>>>>> good faith, believing it passed FCC and other engineering standards. He
>>>>> uses it in good faith, assuming it is OK and not causing problems. But
>>>>> then, a few self-appointed Frequency Cops condemn the poor operator as
>> a
>>>>> bad citizen for using a "dirty transmitter" as if the operator is
>>>>> somehow to blame. I have worked a lot of contests with crowded
>>>>> conditions in a large metropolitan area, and nobody has ever whined
>>>>> about any of this, notwithstanding a couple of self-appointed experts
>>>>> living in the mountains of CA and CO claim it is a horrible epidemic.
>>>>> Besides, if this was such big problem why is it such a new, current
>>>>> topic? Supposedly, all those old rigs have been noisy all the time. I
>>>>> suspect it is topical only because they have nothing else to talk
>> about.
>>>>>
>>>>> Well, even if it is a problem, there is no place for this sort of
>>>>> personal attack in ham radio, AND IT IS SIMPLY WRONG TO BLAME THE
>>>>> OPERATOR for how his rig works. For most ops, ham radio is just a
>>>>> hobby and they are entitled to expect their radios will work right.
>>>>> Blaming the operator is simply out of line. K8JHR
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> ______________________________________________________________
>>>>> Elecraft mailing list
>>>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>>>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>>>>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>>>>
>>>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>>>>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>>>>> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>>>> Dave
>>>> https://www.nk7z.net
>>>>
>>>> ______________________________________________________________
>>>> Elecraft mailing list
>>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>>>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>>>
>>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>>>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>>>> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>>> ______________________________________________________________
>>> Elecraft mailing list
>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>>
>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>>> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>>>
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> Elecraft mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 11
> Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2021 11:37:45 -0700
> From: Dave <[hidden email]>
> To: [hidden email]
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Gurus
> Message-ID: <[hidden email]>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed
>
> Who said it was a trustworthy device? I did not indicate you should
> trust it, I indicated it has use as an indicator of possible problems...
> You are responding to perhaps someone else?
>
> Here is the quote from my post:
>> Here is an interesting video showing both the strengths, and
> weaknesses >of the tinySA. A compare of the tinySA to an HP 8921A SA:
>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xFtF2AYT0iQ
>>
>> For the price, and if one is careful, and aware of how to use the
> <tinySA, you can gain a lot of knowledge for around 100 bucks.
>>
>> I am half tempted to buy one, and add a tap to my output coax, add
>> power, bring it to a very low input level, and just keep the tinySA on
>> all the time I operate, as an alarm that I might have an issue.
>
>
> 73, and thanks,
> Dave (NK7Z)
> https://www.nk7z.net
> ARRL Volunteer Examiner
> ARRL Technical Specialist, RFI
> ARRL Asst. Director, NW Division, Technical Resources
>
> On 6/10/21 10:58 AM, Dean L wrote:
>> After watching the video of the TinySA next to the HP8921, I can't see
>> how you could EVER trust the results of the toy.
>> I watched as OM in the video was scratching his head wondering where the
>> artifacts on the display of the TinySA came from.
>> Did I watch the wrong video? If I didn't see the image captured by the
>> HP, I would have comd to different conclusions.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> I was not impressed:
>> Same author different video,
>>
>> https://youtu.be/uwXUZSdxNq4 <https://youtu.be/uwXUZSdxNq4>
>>
>> ?As he changed the amplitude the harmonics generated by the TinySA
>> changed accordingly making the signal look "dirty"
>> Great tool if you have a $10k Service monitor sitting right next to it...
>>
>> I understand it's $100?gizmo, but might confuse an unsuspecting operator.
>>
>>
>> I would not fault my kilobuck HF rig with this unit
>> YMMV
>>
>> 73
>> Dean K2WW
>>
>> On Thu, Jun 10, 2021, 10:23 Dave <[hidden email] <mailto:[hidden email]>>
>> wrote:
>>
>> Interestingly enough I don't see that issue here with my K3, and
>> tinySA.
>> ? I also don't use the built in antenna.? I use a tap and attenuator
>> combination.
>>
>> I am also using a non clone device, as opposed to a clone device.? Some
>> clones don't have the internal shielding.
>>
>> Here is a compare to a clone vs a non clone:
>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I5IzLAGgKg0
>> <https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I5IzLAGgKg0>
>>
>> Here is an interesting video showing both the strengths, and weaknesses
>> of the tinySA.? A compare of the tinySA to an HP 8921A SA:
>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xFtF2AYT0iQ
>> <https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xFtF2AYT0iQ>
>>
>> For the price, and if one is careful, and aware of how to use the
>> tinySA, you can gain a lot of knowledge for around 100 bucks.
>>
>> I am half tempted to buy one, and add a tap to my output coax, add
>> power, bring it to a very low input level, and just keep the tinySA on
>> all the time I operate, as an alarm that I might have an issue.
>>
>> 73, and thanks,
>> Dave (NK7Z)
>> https://www.nk7z.net <https://www.nk7z.net>
>> ARRL Volunteer Examiner
>> ARRL Technical Specialist, RFI
>> ARRL Asst. Director, NW Division, Technical Resources
>>
>> On 6/10/21 6:45 AM, N4ST - Jim wrote:
>>> FWIW, be careful with your measurement process.
>>> I got very depressed when I saw that my K3S had harmonics only
>> 20db down on most bands when measured by Tiny SA and its telescoping
>> antenna.
>>> It was not being overloaded and in fact I measured similar
>> results when feeding a dummy load.
>>> Then I went outside the shack at a distance from the antennas and
>> found that the harmonics were 40dB down or better.
>>> Evidently when measuring inside the shack I was getting RF
>> leakage directly through the front panel of the rig. (?).
>>>
>>> _______________
>>> 73,
>>> Jim - N4ST
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: [hidden email]
>> <mailto:[hidden email]>
>> <[hidden email]
>> <mailto:[hidden email]>> On Behalf Of Dave
>>> Sent: Wednesday, June 9, 2021 23:01
>>> To: [hidden email] <mailto:[hidden email]>
>>> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Gurus
>>>
>>> Actually for this use they are...? Someone did a compare of the
>> tinySA
>>> to an HP, and it was within a few dB as long as it was
>> overdriven.? We
>>> are looking for splatter or harmonics, not doing a proof of
>> performance.
>>>
>>> 73, and thanks,
>>> Dave (NK7Z)
>>> https://www.nk7z.net <https://www.nk7z.net>
>>> ARRL Volunteer Examiner
>>> ARRL Technical Specialist, RFI
>>> ARRL Asst. Director, NW Division, Technical Resources
>>>
>>> On 6/9/21 7:10 PM, Wes wrote:
>>>> I'm not sure those toys are up to the task.
>>>>
>>>> On 6/9/2021 5:30 PM, Dave wrote:
>>>>> Buy an attenuator, and a tinySA, or get an SDRPlay, and run the
>>>>> Spectrum Analyzer software.? Take a few SA shots, that will
>> tell you
>>>>> if it is him, or you.
>>>>>
>>>>> 73, and thanks,
>>>>> Dave (NK7Z)
>>>>> https://www.nk7z.net <https://www.nk7z.net>
>>>>> ARRL Volunteer Examiner
>>>>> ARRL Technical Specialist, RFI
>>>>> ARRL Asst. Director, NW Division, Technical Resources
>>>> ______________________________________________________________
>>>> Elecraft mailing list
>>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>> <http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft>
>>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> <http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm>
>>>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>> <mailto:[hidden email]>
>>>>
>>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net <http://www.qsl.net>
>>>> Please help support this email list:
>> http://www.qsl.net/donate.html <http://www.qsl.net/donate.html>
>>>> Message delivered to [hidden email] <mailto:[hidden email]>
>>> ______________________________________________________________
>>> Elecraft mailing list
>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>> <http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft>
>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> <http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm>
>>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>> <mailto:[hidden email]>
>>>
>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net <http://www.qsl.net>
>>> Please help support this email list:
>> http://www.qsl.net/donate.html <http://www.qsl.net/donate.html>
>>> Message delivered to [hidden email] <mailto:[hidden email]>
>>>
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> Elecraft mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>> <http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft>
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> <http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm>
>> Post: mailto:[hidden email] <mailto:[hidden email]>
>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net <http://www.qsl.net>
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>> <http://www.qsl.net/donate.html>
>> Message delivered to [hidden email] <mailto:[hidden email]>
>>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 12
> Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2021 11:50:33 -0700
> From: Dave <[hidden email]>
> To: [hidden email]
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Gurus
> Message-ID: <[hidden email]>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed
>
> Hi Julia,
>
> Now I am confused... I quoted the text I was responding to, then
> referenced that quote... Your reply included the quoted text and my
> reference to it.
>
> In any case I was replying to Gwen's response at 6:03 PM, quoted here,
> in my initial response, and in your response...
>
> Here it is broken out from the quot mess:
> On 6/9/21 6:03 PM, Gwen Patton wrote:
> It wasn't about the operator, it was about the hardware.
>
>
> 73, and thanks,
> Dave (NK7Z)
> https://www.nk7z.net
> ARRL Volunteer Examiner
> ARRL Technical Specialist, RFI
> ARRL Asst. Director, NW Division, Technical Resources
>
> On 6/10/21 11:30 AM, Julia Tuttle wrote:
>> I'm confused, I don't see any quoted text, unless you meant just "dirty
>> transmitter". Whose post were you responding to?
>>
>> On Thu, Jun 10, 2021, 14:26 Dave <[hidden email] <mailto:[hidden email]>>
>> wrote:
>>
>> My response was regarding the post talking about operators, see quoted
>> text quote in my response.
>>
>> 73, and thanks,
>> Dave (NK7Z)
>> https://www.nk7z.net <https://www.nk7z.net>
>> ARRL Volunteer Examiner
>> ARRL Technical Specialist, RFI
>> ARRL Asst. Director, NW Division, Technical Resources
>>
>> On 6/9/21 6:03 PM, Gwen Patton wrote:
>>> It wasn't about the operator, it was about the hardware. I talked
>> to the
>>> ham involved, and he's a nice enough bloke. I have no beef with him.
>>>
>>> My antennas are, unfortunately, not designed with a useful null.
>> I have an
>>> end feed W3EDP style that works very well, and a Comet CHA-250B
>> vertical.
>>> Neither can reasonably be pointed to attenuate the signal.
>>>
>>> Gwen, NG3P
>>>
>>>
>>> On Wed, Jun 9, 2021, 8:51 PM Dave <[hidden email]
>> <mailto:[hidden email]>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> I must respectfully disagree sir...
>>>>
>>>> The ordinary ham should be able to tell when his/her rig is out
>> of spec.
>>>> ? ? The ordinary ham should be able to operate his/her rig correctly.
>>>> That is just no longer the case.? There are a lot of folks out there
>>>> that don't even know how a repeater works at the most basic of
>> levels.
>>>> They are operating HF rigs with no understanding of how they
>> work, and
>>>> no understanding of what limits they need to maintain.
>>>>
>>>> They create a mess on the air, and should be told about it.
>> Nicely, but
>>>> told non the less.? It is far better to have a fellow ham tell
>> you you
>>>> have an issue, than have the FCC tell you...
>>>>
>>>> Speaking of the FCC, I don't remember the FCC turning over
>>>> responsibility for signal quality to the manufactures of radios,
>>>> absolving the operator of all responsibility...? It is the
>> operators job
>>>> to make sure he/she is operating their radio correctly, and within
>>>> tolerance, period, end of discussion, the operator is responsible.
>>>>
>>>> If he/she can not tell there is a problem, than that ham should
>> not be
>>>> allowed to transmit...
>>>>
>>>> There are dirty transmitters all over, and they meet FCC
>> specs...? How
>>>> can that be you might ask yourself?
>>>>
>>>> In a lot of cases, the operator is not knowledgeable in how to
>> drive the
>>>> transmitter properly, or that low voltages feeding the
>> transmitter can
>>>> cause issues, or that triggering ALC in FT8 causes issues, there
>> are any
>>>> number of settings the Amateur can screw up, and the rig meets FCC
>>>> specs...
>>>>
>>>> So no, it is not "out of line" to let someone know their
>> transmitter is
>>>> spraying crap.
>>>>
>>>> On 6/9/21 5:02 PM, Richards wrote:
>>>>> Anyone condemning other hams for using "dirty transmitters"? is
>> simply
>>>>> out of line.
>>>>>
>>>>> The ordinary ham is NOT an Electrical Engineer and he buys his
>> rig in
>>>>> good faith, believing it passed FCC and other engineering
>> standards. He
>>>>> uses it in good faith, assuming it is OK and not causing
>> problems. But
>>>>> then, a few self-appointed Frequency Cops condemn the poor
>> operator as a
>>>>> bad citizen for using a "dirty transmitter"? as if the operator is
>>>>> somehow to blame.? ?I have worked a lot of contests with crowded
>>>>> conditions in a large metropolitan area, and nobody has ever whined
>>>>> about any of this, notwithstanding a couple of self-appointed
>> experts
>>>>> living in the mountains of CA and CO claim it is a horrible
>> epidemic.
>>>>> Besides, if this was such big problem why is it such a new, current
>>>>> topic? Supposedly, all those old rigs have been noisy all the
>> time.? ?I
>>>>> suspect it is topical only because they have nothing else to
>> talk about.
>>>>>
>>>>> Well, even if it is a problem, there is no place for this sort of
>>>>> personal attack in ham radio, AND IT IS SIMPLY WRONG TO BLAME THE
>>>>> OPERATOR for how his rig works.? ?For most ops, ham radio is just a
>>>>> hobby and they are entitled to expect their radios will work right.
>>>>> Blaming the operator is simply out of line.? ?K8JHR
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> ______________________________________________________________
>>>>> Elecraft mailing list
>>>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>> <http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft>
>>>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> <http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm>
>>>>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>> <mailto:[hidden email]>
>>>>>
>>>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net <http://www.qsl.net>
>>>>> Please help support this email list:
>> http://www.qsl.net/donate.html <http://www.qsl.net/donate.html>
>>>>> Message delivered to [hidden email] <mailto:[hidden email]>
>>>> Dave
>>>> https://www.nk7z.net <https://www.nk7z.net>
>>>>
>>>> ______________________________________________________________
>>>> Elecraft mailing list
>>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>> <http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft>
>>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> <http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm>
>>>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>> <mailto:[hidden email]>
>>>>
>>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net <http://www.qsl.net>
>>>> Please help support this email list:
>> http://www.qsl.net/donate.html <http://www.qsl.net/donate.html>
>>>> Message delivered to [hidden email] <mailto:[hidden email]>
>>> ______________________________________________________________
>>> Elecraft mailing list
>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>> <http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft>
>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> <http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm>
>>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>> <mailto:[hidden email]>
>>>
>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net <http://www.qsl.net>
>>> Please help support this email list:
>> http://www.qsl.net/donate.html <http://www.qsl.net/donate.html>
>>> Message delivered to [hidden email] <mailto:[hidden email]>
>>>
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> Elecraft mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>> <http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft>
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> <http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm>
>> Post: mailto:[hidden email] <mailto:[hidden email]>
>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net <http://www.qsl.net>
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>> <http://www.qsl.net/donate.html>
>> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>> <mailto:[hidden email]>
>>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 13
> Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2021 12:24:53 -0700
> From: Wes <[hidden email]>
> To: [hidden email]
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Gurus
> Message-ID: <[hidden email]>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed
>
> Dean's making the case I thought to make.? Couldn't agree more.
>
> Dave said: "Here is an interesting video showing both the strengths, and
> weaknesses of the tinySA.
>
> I looked at the videos and said, "Okay, where are the strengths?"
>
> I spent a lot of years sitting in front of spectrum analyzers. One of the first
> things you want to do after
> displaying signals of interest is to adjust the input attenuator up or down. If
> you add or remove10 dB of attenuation
> and ALL of the signals do not change by exactly 10 dB, you have a linearity
> problem at that setting.? Don't use it, or
> if you do, understand that you are getting bogus answers.
>
> Likewise, if you have a really clean, stable source like a quality OCXO with
> published phase noise specs and you
> measure it with your SA and it looks other than that, you're measuring your SA's
> shortcomings.? That's okay as
> long as you understand them.
>
> Wes? N7WS
>
>
>
> On 6/10/2021 10:58 AM, Dean L wrote:
>> After watching the video of the TinySA next to the HP8921, I can't see how
>> you could EVER trust the results of the toy.
>> I watched as OM in the video was scratching his head wondering where the
>> artifacts on the display of the TinySA came from.
>> Did I watch the wrong video? If I didn't see the image captured by the HP,
>> I would have comd to different conclusions.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> I was not impressed:
>> Same author different video,
>>
>> https://youtu.be/uwXUZSdxNq4
>>
>> As he changed the amplitude the harmonics generated by the TinySA changed
>> accordingly making the signal look "dirty"
>> Great tool if you have a $10k Service monitor sitting right next to it...
>>
>> I understand it's $100 gizmo, but might confuse an unsuspecting operator.
>>
>>
>> I would not fault my kilobuck HF rig with this unit
>> YMMV
>>
>> 73
>> Dean K2WW
>>
>> On Thu, Jun 10, 2021, 10:23 Dave <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>>> Interestingly enough I don't see that issue here with my K3, and tinySA.
>>> I also don't use the built in antenna. I use a tap and attenuator
>>> combination.
>>>
>>> I am also using a non clone device, as opposed to a clone device. Some
>>> clones don't have the internal shielding.
>>>
>>> Here is a compare to a clone vs a non clone:
>>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I5IzLAGgKg0
>>>
>>> Here is an interesting video showing both the strengths, and weaknesses
>>> of the tinySA. A compare of the tinySA to an HP 8921A SA:
>>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xFtF2AYT0iQ
>>>
>>> For the price, and if one is careful, and aware of how to use the
>>> tinySA, you can gain a lot of knowledge for around 100 bucks.
>>>
>>> I am half tempted to buy one, and add a tap to my output coax, add
>>> power, bring it to a very low input level, and just keep the tinySA on
>>> all the time I operate, as an alarm that I might have an issue.
>>>
>>> 73, and thanks,
>>> Dave (NK7Z)
>>> https://www.nk7z.net
>>> ARRL Volunteer Examiner
>>> ARRL Technical Specialist, RFI
>>> ARRL Asst. Director, NW Division, Technical Resources
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 14
> Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2021 12:33:26 -0700
> From: Josh Fiden <[hidden email]>
> To: [hidden email]
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Gurus
> Message-ID: <[hidden email]>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
>
> This discussion reminds me quite a few years back I was running a 756Pro and PW-1. Steve K6UM, a neighbor at the time, contacted me and said I had bad key clicks. I was glad he did. We got on the phone, made adjustments and resolved it. Prior to that I didn?t know the default CW rise time was way too fast and that letting ALC control exciter power was a terrible idea. I LEARNED something and it was FUN. When I stop learning things and having fun, I will leave this hobby. Not likely!
>
> From the Amateur?s Code. Seems as valid today as ever.
>
> The Radio Amateur is
>
> CONSIDERATE...He/[She] never knowingly operates in such a way as to lessen the pleasure of others.
>
> PROGRESSIVE...He/[She] keeps his/[her] station up to date. It is well-built and efficient. His/[Her] operating practice is above reproach.
>
> FRIENDLY...He/[She] operates slowly and patiently when requested; offers friendly advice and counsel to beginners; kind assistance, cooperation and consideration for the interests of others. These are the marks of the amateur spirit.
>
> 73
> Josh W6XU
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 15
> Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2021 15:36:41 -0400
> From: Dean L <[hidden email]>
> To: Wes Stewart <[hidden email]>, Elecraft Mail List
> <[hidden email]>
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Gurus
> Message-ID:
> <CAHh=7i=y8Zc59cGS=[hidden email]>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
>
> looked at the videos and said, "Okay, where are the strengths?"
>
> the fact that it's $100
> Not looking to wage war just stating facts
> The first rules of using test equipment you got to trust it...
>
> 73 all
> Dean
>
> On Thu, Jun 10, 2021, 15:26 Wes <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> Dean's making the case I thought to make. Couldn't agree more.
>>
>> Dave said: "Here is an interesting video showing both
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 16
> Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2021 12:43:37 -0700
> From: Jim Brown <[hidden email]>
> To: [hidden email]
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Gurus
> Message-ID:
> <[hidden email]>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed
>
> On 6/10/2021 7:17 AM, [hidden email] wrote:
>> Contest stations operate on multiple bands from the same property
>> without issue. Harmonics should only be heard on the harmonic frequency,
>> not splatter across the entire band. You should not have a problem with
>> a station over a mile away. What is your antenna and how it is fed?
>
> YES. Here are slides from a talk I gave at Visalia two years ago on what
> it takes for multiple stations to operate in close proximity on the same
> band.
> http://k9yc.com/Multi-Station.pdf
>
> 73, Jim K9YC
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 17
> Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2021 12:44:26 -0700
> From: Eric Swartz <[hidden email]>
> To: Al Lorona <[hidden email]>
> Cc: Elecraft Reflector <[hidden email]>
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Gurus
> Message-ID:
> <CAGe0YDa=[hidden email]>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
>
> *Thread Closed*
>
> Folks - let's close this thread now as its -waaay- past the single topic
> posting limit for the list.
>
> I apologize for not stepping in earlier. I've been off the list for several
> days running the business etc :-)
>
> 73,
> Eric
> List moderator etc.
> *elecraft.com <http://elecraft.com>*
>
>
> On Tue, Jun 8, 2021 at 6:58 PM Al Lorona <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> When this subject appeared last week I had composed a reply but then slept
>> on it and canceled it the next morning, as I probably do 80% of the time.
>>
>> In this my second attempt, let me say that I've always been amazed at the
>> power wielded by Rob Sherwood. Thousands of hams hang on his latest tests.
>> If he deems a new radio exceptional in some way, that can mean many
>> millions of dollars for a manufacturer.
>>
>> And yet, if there were no such thing as gurus on the web and at places
>> like Dayton expounding about how Brand A is better than Brand B, how would
>> you answer the questions, "Do I like this transceiver?," and, "Is it any
>> good?"
>>
>> You'd probably get on the air and use it, and decide that way.
>>
>> But we constantly have gurus telling us that Brand A is the 'best' which
>> horrifies us if up until now we liked Brand B better. Against our personal
>> experience we flip-flop and say, "Gee, I used to like Brand B, but Brand A
>> must be better because the gurus say so."
>>
>> Yet, there will always be guys who'll be tortured owning a transceiver
>> that has the 2nd highest dynamic range, or the 3rd best distortion. Never
>> mind if they can't actually hear the differences.
>>
>> It's how a rig *sounds and feels* during actual operating that's most
>> important. Not the numbers. For instance, Wes made a comment about his
>> tuning knob, and although some of you might have laughed at that... it's
>> darned important! That's the kind of thing I'm talking about.
>>
>> Here's my opinion on ranking receivers by 2 kHz 3rd order dynamic range:
>> almost any modern receiver has enough dynamic range to make this ranking
>> more and more meaningless as time goes on. Sherwood himself has said that
>> 90 dB or above is plenty enough. To understand why, see this post from 2016
>> by one of the old guys on this reflector:
>> http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/K3-The-Way-We-Rank-Receivers-long-td7623639.html
>>
>>
>> Lastly, if you've been enjoying your rig for years and then hear someone
>> else complain about a flaw you weren't even aware of, don't panic. There
>> are a million reasons why his concerns might not involve you in the least.
>>
>> Above all, have fun.
>>
>> Al W6LX/4
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> Elecraft mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 18
> Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2021 12:50:45 -0700
> From: Jim Brown <[hidden email]>
> To: [hidden email]
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Gurus, Giving Up & Group Therapy
> Message-ID:
> <[hidden email]>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed
>
> On 6/10/2021 10:24 AM, Joseph Shuman via Elecraft wrote:
>> Everybody has an opinion and all of them are correct, but mine is more correct for me than yours.
>
> Nope. The SCIENCE of almost everything about radio is long established.
> Some things we, as a society, are still learning about, like
> propagation, and new viruses.
>
> Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but NOT to their own facts.
>
> 73, Jim K9YC
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 19
> Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2021 12:51:00 -0700 (MST)
> From: G2NF Tony <[hidden email]>
> To: [hidden email]
> Subject: [Elecraft] Sub RX on 40m random deafness
> Message-ID: <[hidden email]>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>
> Hi, Some times in contests the K3 sub RX goes deaf on 40m with just a lot of
> noise, but this only occurs when the A VFO makes a freq jump (grabing a
> mult) from below to above (or close) to the VFO B freq I think?
> Most often this happens at 7025 but also seen at 7035.
> The P5 show signals and the main RX is OK but the SUB RX is just noise and
> no sig.
> Some times just a very slight nuge of the B VFO in the HF direction is
> sufficent to restore sigs, but bring the B VFO down again and sub RX becomes
> deaf with a lot of noise again.
>
> When you tune across this edge 7025 or 7035 you can turn "ON" and "OFF" this
> sub RX noise.
> I have seen this very same effect at both M6T and when elsewhere on
> different SN radios.
>
> I can hear the shouts of B/Set already and antenna switching, but it's not
> this as in all ocasions we either had an ext antenna or loop back with
> filters etc. connected.
>
> I know this radio is getting on a bit old but it's got a few years left
> surley, hence any help re this would be much appreciated.
>
> Could this be a calibration issue?
> I doubt it as it is defetnaly related to the VFO(A) QSY issue.
>
> Any sugestions from the expert here much appreciated, apart from buy a new
> radio that is...!
>
> 73 Tony G2NF
>
>
>
> --
> Sent from: http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 20
> Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2021 14:39:26 -0400
> From: Gwen Patton <[hidden email]>
> To: Andy Durbin <[hidden email]>
> Cc: "[hidden email]" <[hidden email]>
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Gurus
> Message-ID:
> <CA+nQa2N4Y+_bNkwj6J+=EJfE0JQU9gQV2=[hidden email]>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
>
> Yes, precisely!
>
> This CW signal was so normal on 15 meters that I tried replying to it. Then
> I realized whose signal it was, and checked 40m, and there was the REAL
> signal. That's why I said it was splattering all over. The audio was
> slathered all over 40m for half the allocation, up into the phone segment
> and below 7 mhz downward. But the RF was so clear 3 bands away that I
> thought he was transmitting there. But I'm not as up on what can cause
> that, and thought it might be something on MY end, so I didn't want to lay
> anything even remotely like blame on anyone. For all I knew, it was
> something weird with my antenna, or my radio, or something else, like
> resonance with a guy wire (I've heard of that happening).
>
> I'm not trying to badmouth anyone, I was just shocked that the signal was
> SO pervasive!
>
> -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
> 73,
> Gwen, NG3P
>
>
> On Thu, Jun 10, 2021 at 1:06 PM Andy Durbin <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> "Harmonics should only be heard on the harmonic frequency, not splatter
>> across the entire band."
>>
>> That depends on whether you are talking about RF frequency harmonics or
>> harmonics of the modulating audio frequency. There is a plague of stations
>> producing FT8 audio harmonics. The problem is not helped by people
>> insisting that the cure is proper ALC adjustment. While there may be rigs
>> that cause audio harmonics because of incorrect ALC adjustment it's far
>> more likely that the clipping that causes these harmonics happens in the
>> audio stages long before ALC is applied.
>>
>> Transmitting a clean signal is the responsibility of the operator not that
>> of the rig manufacturer or software application provider.
>>
>> Andy, k3wyc
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> Elecraft mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 21
> Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2021 13:03:46 -0700
> From: Jim Brown <[hidden email]>
> To: [hidden email]
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Gurus
> Message-ID:
> <[hidden email]>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed
>
> YES!
>
> Mutual friends and neighbors Garry, NI6T, and Dave, W6NL, are neighbors,
> very smart engineers, serious contesters, and live a few miles apart.
> W6NL is a retired EE prof, ran a major company, has a super contesting
> station on a mountaintop, where N5KO regularly wins CW Sprints.
>
> Garry told me about calling Dave one day in the middle of a contest to
> tell him there was a problem with his station. Dave immediately took his
> station off the air. When they met a few days later at the local
> farmer's market, Dave told him about what was wrong and how he fixed it.
>
> THAT'S how REAL hams do it.
>
> 73, Jim K9YC
>
> On 6/10/2021 12:33 PM, Josh Fiden wrote:
>> This discussion reminds me quite a few years back I was running a 756Pro and PW-1. Steve K6UM, a neighbor at the time, contacted me and said I had bad key clicks. I was glad he did. We got on the phone, made adjustments and resolved it. Prior to that I didn?t know the default CW rise time was way too fast and that letting ALC control exciter power was a terrible idea. I LEARNED something and it was FUN. When I stop learning things and having fun, I will leave this hobby. Not likely!
>>
>> From the Amateur?s Code. Seems as valid today as ever.
>>
>> The Radio Amateur is
>>
>> CONSIDERATE...He/[She] never knowingly operates in such a way as to lessen the pleasure of others.
>>
>> PROGRESSIVE...He/[She] keeps his/[her] station up to date. It is well-built and efficient. His/[Her] operating practice is above reproach.
>>
>> FRIENDLY...He/[She] operates slowly and patiently when requested; offers friendly advice and counsel to beginners; kind assistance, cooperation and consideration for the interests of others. These are the marks of the amateur spirit.
>>
>> 73
>> Josh W6XU
>>
>> Sent from my iPad
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> Elecraft mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Post to: [hidden email]
> http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> You must be a subscriber to post.
> Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
>
> End of Elecraft Digest, Vol 206, Issue 11
> *****************************************

Ed Pflueger

Re: Trying to connect K3s to Win 10 and Expert 2K amp. Db9/serial port problem

Get ahold of N6TV he probably has a solution. He has break out boxes that fill almost any configuration you might need.

Ed.. AB4IQ

-----Original Message-----
From: [hidden email] [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of [hidden email]
Sent: Thursday, June 10, 2021 6:31 PM
To: [hidden email]
Cc: Bob Hardie - W5UQ <[hidden email]>
Subject: [Elecraft] Trying to connect K3s to Win 10 and Expert 2K amp. Db9/serial port problem

I have read the Elecraft K3s manual, K3 manual, Expert 2K manual.. realize that I need to try to use db9..(RJ45) and have been told to use a Y connector (using the y connector I purchased from Elecraft for P3 display but I don’t use it).. and connect only two wires to Expert (ground and RXD- but NOT tXD)-and the the other Y I fed through a USB convertor. That goes to a Dell Win 10 computer which doesn’t even allow one to see comm ports in device manager. Yes I tried “hidden devices” but never saw Comm port or LPT anywhere.

Guess I might have to go back to a “legacy computer -windows 7, or make my linux mint do it.. I do have WSJTX running fine on IC-7600, and CiV com talks to Expert 2K fine.

Doesn’t work.

Maybe the RJ45, to two serial Db9 connectors isn’t really a split serial port.??

Any quick and easy guide to make the RJ45 work…??

Bobf

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