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Ultimatic Keying.

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Fernando Quinones

Ultimatic Keying.

Hello.

Is there a way to get the K2 to have Ultimatic Keying ?
I presume it has to do with the base firmware.

I never developed the fine art of iambic (neither A or B) keying, so
I more or less slap the paddle left and right when I'm sending.
The HexKey stays put, by the way.
From what I've read in another list it might be right for me.

Any quick mod that can be done or is anyone looking into it?

I have looked at the schematic
and found the keyer stuff in the Control Board at J7,
stopped their since that's my technical extend.

tnx.

--

73
Fernando N2FQ/NNNØJYM
San Jose, CA
<http://pages.sbcglobal.net/n2fq>

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Don Wilhelm-3

RE: Ultimatic Keying.

Fernando,

The keying is all done inside the microprocessor chip, so your best solution
would be to opt for an external keyer. The K1EL K12 keyer can do Ultimatic
http://k1el.tripod.com/k12info.html, the OHR Basic Iambic Keyer also states
Ultimatic mode http://www.mtechnologies.com/ohr/keyer.htm, I don't know
about others, but a search of the web should reveal something.

73,
Don W3FPR

> -----Original Message-----
>
> Is there a way to get the K2 to have Ultimatic Keying ?
> I presume it has to do with the base firmware.
>
> I never developed the fine art of iambic (neither A or B) keying, so
> I more or less slap the paddle left and right when I'm sending.
> The HexKey stays put, by the way.
> From what I've read in another list it might be right for me.
>
> Any quick mod that can be done or is anyone looking into it?
>
> I have looked at the schematic
> and found the keyer stuff in the Control Board at J7,
> stopped their since that's my technical extend.
>
> tnx.
>
>

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Brian Mury-3

RE: Ultimatic Keying.

On Fri, 2005-18-02 at 17:17 -0500, W3FPR - Don Wilhelm wrote:
> The keying is all done inside the microprocessor chip, so your best
> solution
> would be to opt for an external keyer.

... or a single lever paddle!

--
73, Brian
VE7NGR

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Tom Hammond-3

Re: Ultimatic Keying.

In reply to this post by Fernando Quinones

Fernando:

Care to enlighten us with a bit of description of "Ultimatic Keying"...?

I don't use the K2's keyer AS an iambic keyer, even though the feature's
available.

What features does Ultimatic Keying have? And what keyers offer it?

73,

Tom N0SS

At 03:45 PM 2/18/05, you wrote:

>Hello.
>
>Is there a way to get the K2 to have Ultimatic Keying ?
>I presume it has to do with the base firmware.
>
>I never developed the fine art of iambic (neither A or B) keying, so
>I more or less slap the paddle left and right when I'm sending.
>The HexKey stays put, by the way.
> From what I've read in another list it might be right for me.
>
>Any quick mod that can be done or is anyone looking into it?
>
>I have looked at the schematic
>and found the keyer stuff in the Control Board at J7,
>stopped their since that's my technical extend.
>
>tnx.
>
>--
>
>73
>Fernando N2FQ/NNNØJYM San Jose, CA
><http://pages.sbcglobal.net/n2fq>
>
>_______________________________________________
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David A. Belsley

Re: Ultimatic Keying.

Tom:
It's my understanding (though I've never used it) that it responds to
a squeeze by repeating the last side closed. Thus, holding the dot
side produces a string of dots, dash side dashes. Squeeze dot/dash
give a dot followed by a string of dashes, while dash/dot produces a
dash followed by a string of dots. There is no iambic element.

best wishes,

dave belsley, w1euy

On Feb 18, 2005, at 5:45 PM, Tom Hammond wrote:

> Fernando:
>
> Care to enlighten us with a bit of description of "Ultimatic
> Keying"...?
>
> I don't use the K2's keyer AS an iambic keyer, even though the
> feature's available.
>
> What features does Ultimatic Keying have? And what keyers offer it?
>
> 73,
>
> Tom N0SS
>
> At 03:45 PM 2/18/05, you wrote:
>> Hello.
>>
>> Is there a way to get the K2 to have Ultimatic Keying ?
>> I presume it has to do with the base firmware.
>>
>> I never developed the fine art of iambic (neither A or B) keying, so
>> I more or less slap the paddle left and right when I'm sending.
>> The HexKey stays put, by the way.
>> From what I've read in another list it might be right for me.
>>
>> Any quick mod that can be done or is anyone looking into it?
>>
>> I have looked at the schematic
>> and found the keyer stuff in the Control Board at J7,
>> stopped their since that's my technical extend.
>>
>> tnx.
>>
>> --
>>
>> 73
>> Fernando N2FQ/NNNØJYM San Jose, CA
>> <http://pages.sbcglobal.net/n2fq>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Elecraft mailing list
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>> Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
>
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Ron D'Eau Claire-2

RE: Ultimatic Keying.

dave belsley, w1euy

It's my understanding (though I've never used it) that it responds to
a squeeze by repeating the last side closed. Thus, holding the dot
side produces a string of dots, dash side dashes. Squeeze dot/dash
give a dot followed by a string of dashes, while dash/dot produces a
dash followed by a string of dots. There is no iambic element.

---------------------------------------------------

Interesting! I caught Tom's query and was very interested in the answer
myself.

I can't see the advantage to normal non-iambic keying though...

When I send a "C" using an iambic keyer, I just squeeze, being sure to hit
the "dah" side first. Two finger movements for one complete 'C' (plus
letting go!)

But it'd take four if the dashes repeated, the same as if I was using it in
non-iambic mode.

A "Q" on the iambic keyer takes two finger movements too. Hit the "dah" and
during the second dash, tap the "dit" and I get a "Q" with the dit inserted
after the second dah with logic-perfect precision.

It sounds like the Ultimatic would require as many finger movements as a
"standard" keyer.

Am I missing something?

(Probably. After 20 years on an Iambic keyer I went back to a Bug because
it's more work and more satisfying. So don't ever expect me to be logical,
Mr. Spock!)

Ron AC7AC

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Fernando Quinones

Re: Ultimatic Keying.

In reply to this post by David A. Belsley

Thanks to all who responded here and by private email.
I have found an external keyer with my needs by K1EL.

Just wanted to ask before I get another do dat on the cluttered desktop.
I figure that with the resources on this list that perhaps
someone might have made a mod or such.

Please delete any references I made to iambic A or B. I should have been
more specific about my inquiry.
.
thanks to all.

--

73
Fernando N2FQ/NNNØJYM
San Jose, CA
<http://pages.sbcglobal.net/n2fq>

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k7nhb

Re: Ultimatic Keying.

In reply to this post by Fernando Quinones

There was a discussion about this just recently in the BrassPounders
news group on Yahoo. The attractiveness of Ultimatic is not its
effeciency - it is attractive to a number of cw operators because of
its ineffeciency! That is, its forgiving coordination requirements.

I bought a very nice iambic paddle - but just couldn't "control" it -
all those unintentioned dits or dahs. So I got a single level paddle
(vibrokeyer, Kent SP-1, etc.) and that worked okay. But moving an
object left/right has a little more fatigue factor than just a
squeeze.

Someone brought up Ultimatic mode and mentioned the Jackson Harbor
Keyer II - which provides Ultimatic. A cheer was raised in the news
group. Now those of us who are timing challenged can use the same
high quality, and plentiful, selection of iambic paddles. So we only
squeeze the paddles, no side-to-side as with a single level paddle.
And we get more predicable results.

The "four sound" letters sometimes take more effort than iambic - but
look at a "P". squeeze and hold the dit, squeeze the dah to insert
two dahs, release the dah for another dit. Not so bad.

But again - it wasn't an argument about which is "better" or more
efficient. It was just that some of us have struggled with the auto
dit/dah of iambic and Ultimatic mode lets us use our iambic paddles
but in a more relaxed manner.

73,
Paul, K7NHB
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Geoffrey Mackenzie-Kennedy-2

Re: Ultimatic Keying.

In reply to this post by Ron D'Eau Claire-2

Ron, AC7AC wrote:
>
> (Probably. After 20 years on an Iambic keyer I went back to a Bug because
> it's more work and more satisfying. So don't ever expect me to be logical,
> Mr. Spock!)
>

............................................................................
..........

Confession time, have yet to master fully this new fangled Iambic Keying
thing, so use the twin paddles like a single paddle bug. But the CW is
'mechanical' not like bug produced CW, and a 'friendly' dit daaaaaaah dit
cannot be sent!
73,
Geoff
GM4ESD

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Able2fly

Re: Ultimatic Keying.

In reply to this post by Fernando Quinones

What features does Ultimatic Keying have? And what keyers offer it?

73,

Tom N0SS
=====================
This from an OHR ad:

"Ultimatic is a pre-iambic keying mode in which the result of a squeeze is
that the keyer will switch to the last lever pressed rather than alternating
dits and dahs."

Bill K3UJ
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Dan Romanchik KB6NU

Re: Ultimatic Keying.

In reply to this post by Fernando Quinones

The difference between iambic and Ultimatic keying is that when you hold
down both paddles, the Ultimatic keyer sends a series of elements
corresponding to the last paddle closed instead of sending alternate dits
and dashes as an iambic keyer would. For example, the sequence L on, R on
would cause an iambic keyer to send di-dah-di-dah..... An Ultimatic keyer
would, however, send di-dah-dah-dah.....

If you count the number of paddle movements, you can see where this might be
advantageous. There's no advantage when sending a K. The sequence is R on, L
on, L off, R off for both iambic and Ultimatic keyers. Take X, however. When
using iambic keying, it's R on, R off, L on, L off, R on, R off. With
Ultimatic keying, the number of paddle movements is the same as for the
iambic - R on, L on, L off, R off. - a savings of two paddle movements. You
just hold down the left paddle a little longer for the X then for the K.

Another keyer that now supports Ultimatic keying is the N0XAS PicoKeyer
(www.hamgadgets.com). It's only $18, and fits in a mini Altoids tin. I have
no affiliation with the company; I just think it's a cool little keyer.

73!

Dan KB6NU
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
President, ARROW Comm. Assn. (www.w8pgw.org)
ARRL MI Section Affiliated Club Coordinator
CW Geek (FISTS #9342)
Read my ham radio blog at www.blurty.com/~kb6nu

----- Original Message -----
From: <[hidden email]>
To: <[hidden email]>; <[hidden email]>
Sent: Saturday, February 19, 2005 7:15 AM
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Ultimatic Keying.

> What features does Ultimatic Keying have? And what keyers offer it?
>
> 73,
>
> Tom N0SS
> =====================
> This from an OHR ad:
>
> "Ultimatic is a pre-iambic keying mode in which the result of a squeeze
is
> that the keyer will switch to the last lever pressed rather than
alternating

> dits and dahs."
>
>
> Bill K3UJ
> _______________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
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> Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
>

John Pfeifer-2

Re: Ultimatic Keying.

In reply to this post by Fernando Quinones

Another solution for getting Ultimatic keying "inside" a K2 would be the PK4 keyer from Jackson Harbor Press. It's very small, only 1" x 1.5". Jackson Harbor's contest keyer, the Island Keyer II, also supports Ultimatic. Both of these keyers are available directly from Jackson Harbor Press at:

http://home.att.net/~jacksonharbor/ham.htm

or from Morse Express at:

http://www.mtechnologies.com/jhp/

Jackson Harbor also has an explanation of Ultimatic keying at:

http://home.att.net/~jacksonharbor/ultimat.txt

I haven't tried either one of these keyers, but I do have the older PK3 (inside my Palm Radio Code Cube) and like it. Unfortunately, it doesn't do Ultimatic.

73,
John Pfeifer - KL0WN

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Douglas Westover

Re: Ultimatic Keying.

In reply to this post by Geoffrey Mackenzie-Kennedy-2

That's exactly the way I use my keyer..never really got the
hang of iambic! (old dogs and new tricks??) I find it to
work perfectly well!

Doug
W6JD

----- Original Message -----
From: "Geoffrey Mackenzie-Kennedy" <[hidden email]>
To: "Ron D'Eau Claire" <[hidden email]>
Cc: "Elecraft Discussion List" <[hidden email]>
Sent: Saturday, February 19, 2005 12:15 AM
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Ultimatic Keying.

> Ron, AC7AC wrote:
> >
> > (Probably. After 20 years on an Iambic keyer I went back to a Bug
because
> > it's more work and more satisfying. So don't ever expect me to be
logical,
> > Mr. Spock!)
> >
>
>
............................................................................

> ..........
>
> Confession time, have yet to master fully this new fangled Iambic Keying
> thing, so use the twin paddles like a single paddle bug. But the CW is
> 'mechanical' not like bug produced CW, and a 'friendly' dit daaaaaaah dit
> cannot be sent!
> 73,
> Geoff
> GM4ESD
>
> _______________________________________________
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> Post to: [hidden email]
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Rick Dettinger-2

Re: Ultimatic Keying.

In reply to this post by Geoffrey Mackenzie-Kennedy-2

I would like to see a squeeze option that would give a steady tone when the
paddle contacts are both closed. This would restore keying control to the
operator. I normally use a bug or straight key but use paddles with the KX1
when portable. The bug is more than 5 times as heavy as the rig and does
not travel well. 73 - Rick - K7MW
----- Original Message -----
From: "Geoffrey Mackenzie-Kennedy"
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Ultimatic Keying.

> >>
>
............................................................................

Ron D'Eau Claire-2

RE: Ultimatic Keying.

Rick wrote:
I would like to see a squeeze option that would give a steady tone when the
paddle contacts are both closed. This would restore keying control to the
operator.
---------------
Now we're almost back to something I asked for several years ago; A "bug
emulator" mode in which the dit side makes dits and the dah side simply keys
the tx like any self-respecting "bug". Push the dah paddle and you get a dah
until you let go!

I know, it can be done with diodes on the K2. Tie two diodes to the key
inputs that connect to the dash contacts. I do it even more accurately with
the K2. I plug my bug into it!

But the KX1 is just a little clumsy with a key bigger than it is hooked on -
and not nearly as portable. So it'd be nice for those of us who like bugs if
the KX1's paddles could behave like one.

Ron AC7AC

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Geoffrey Mackenzie-Kennedy-2

Re: Ultimatic Keying.

In reply to this post by Fernando Quinones

One step away from a bug in that a string of dahs not just one dah comes out
when you hit and hold the dah paddle. There is a circuit in "Solid State
Design for the Radio Amateur" page 178 that I think does this using three
NE555 'timer' ICs, VERY simple, with a pot controlling speed. The Dah, Dit
and Spacing times can also be adjusted to suit the user's taste. The
authors were discussing applications of the NE555, not keyers as such. CMOS
ICs would keep the power draw low.
73,
Geoff.
GM4ESD

----- Original Message -----
From: "EricJ" <[hidden email]>
To: "'Geoffrey Mackenzie-Kennedy'" <[hidden email]>
Sent: Saturday, February 19, 2005 8:50 PM
Subject: RE: [Elecraft] Ultimatic Keying.

>
> Here's what I want. A keyer that generates dits when I push one paddle. It
> generates dahs when I push the other paddle. When I push the dits paddle
> while making dahs, I don't want it to do ANYTHING--I'm busy making dahs.
> Likewise, when I push the dahs paddle when making dits, I want it to keep
> making dits. Not dahs, not dah-dits. Dits for dits and dahs for dahs. Why
> has that been so much to ask of a keyer?
>

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Dan Romanchik KB6NU

Re: Ultimatic Keying.

In reply to this post by Ron D'Eau Claire-2

In addition to having an Ultimatic keying option, the N0XAS PicoKeyer
(www.hamgadgets.com) also has a bug emulator mode.

73, Dan KB6NU

----- Original Message -----
From: "Ron D'Eau Claire" <[hidden email]>
To: "'Elecraft Discussion List'" <[hidden email]>
Sent: Sunday, February 20, 2005 1:55 AM
Subject: RE: [Elecraft] Ultimatic Keying.

> Rick wrote:
> I would like to see a squeeze option that would give a steady tone when
the
> paddle contacts are both closed. This would restore keying control to the
> operator.
> ---------------
> Now we're almost back to something I asked for several years ago; A "bug
> emulator" mode in which the dit side makes dits and the dah side simply
keys
> the tx like any self-respecting "bug". Push the dah paddle and you get a
dah
> until you let go!
>
> I know, it can be done with diodes on the K2. Tie two diodes to the key
> inputs that connect to the dash contacts. I do it even more accurately
with
> the K2. I plug my bug into it!
>
> But the KX1 is just a little clumsy with a key bigger than it is hooked
on -
> and not nearly as portable. So it'd be nice for those of us who like bugs
if

> the KX1's paddles could behave like one.
>
> Ron AC7AC
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Post to: [hidden email]
> You must be a subscriber to post to the list.
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> Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
>

EricJ-2

RE: Ultimatic Keying.

In reply to this post by Geoffrey Mackenzie-Kennedy-2

That would take care of my "dream keyer" idea. Heh heh heh. Actually, I
have gone the other way with keyers. I eliminated it altogether by
connecting a straight key directly to the K1 jack! It allows me to make dits
and dahs my way. Also turned out to be a hardy choice for the trail. It is
smaller, lighter and less fragile than any paddle of comparable quality.

Eric
KE6US

-----Original Message-----
From: Geoffrey Mackenzie-Kennedy [mailto:[hidden email]]
Sent: Sunday, February 20, 2005 1:10 AM
To: EricJ
Cc: Elecraft Discussion List
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Ultimatic Keying.

One step away from a bug in that a string of dahs not just one dah comes out
when you hit and hold the dah paddle. There is a circuit in "Solid State
Design for the Radio Amateur" page 178 that I think does this using three
NE555 'timer' ICs, VERY simple, with a pot controlling speed. The Dah, Dit
and Spacing times can also be adjusted to suit the user's taste. The
authors were discussing applications of the NE555, not keyers as such. CMOS
ICs would keep the power draw low.
73,
Geoff.
GM4ESD

----- Original Message -----
From: "EricJ" <[hidden email]>
To: "'Geoffrey Mackenzie-Kennedy'" <[hidden email]>
Sent: Saturday, February 19, 2005 8:50 PM
Subject: RE: [Elecraft] Ultimatic Keying.

>
> Here's what I want. A keyer that generates dits when I push one
> paddle. It generates dahs when I push the other paddle. When I push
> the dits paddle while making dahs, I don't want it to do ANYTHING--I'm
busy making dahs.
> Likewise, when I push the dahs paddle when making dits, I want it to
> keep making dits. Not dahs, not dah-dits. Dits for dits and dahs for
> dahs. Why has that been so much to ask of a keyer?
>

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Thom LaCosta

Re: Ultimatic Keying.

In reply to this post by Dan Romanchik KB6NU

On Sun, 20 Feb 2005, Dan KB6NU wrote:

> In addition to having an Ultimatic keying option, the N0XAS PicoKeyer
> (www.hamgadgets.com) also has a bug emulator mode.

And it would be neat if it had a selection of various "swings".....I miss my
bug....and being able to swing a bit...

73,Thom-k3hrn
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