WA3WSJ's EPA Skunk Works Site - Check it out!
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Hello all!
I liked the EPA Skunk Works name so much that I created a Skunk Works area on my website. This page is dedicated to all those hams, including myself, who have constructed just bad antennas over the years. I call it my antenna graveyard site. This is where all those "great antennas" are laid to rest. Keep the names coming for the new vertical! I'll post a list of proposed names soon. http://www.wa3wsj.com/SkunkWorks.html 72, Ed, WA3WSJ _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
Re: WA3WSJ's EPA Skunk Works Site - Check it out!
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My first thought on reading 'EPA Skunk Works' was some sort of super
secret, super high-tech stuff made by the environmental protection agency...hi hi. I've certainly made my share of terrible antennas, but I wasn't quick enough to take pictures of them. My best worst antenna was a 6M dipole tacked to my bedroom wall, facing the TV. With 50 watts of FM it hit the local repeater just great, and only took a month to destroy my TV's receiver with overload. My runner-up best worst antenna was my indoor mini trapped 10M vertical which 'strangely' would never tune up, until that time I was testing it and holding onto the wrong thing. Suddenly 1.5:1 match at 50 watts of 10M and OUCH WHY IS MY HAND SO HOT?! 73 de Stephanie va3uxb K2#5311 - K1#2132 p.s. fortunately I've got my own home now, so my antennas can be outside instead of inside! On 7-Apr-06, at 11.55 .44, Edward R. Breneiser wrote: > Hello all! > > I liked the EPA Skunk Works name so much that I created a Skunk Works > area on my website. This page is dedicated to all those hams, > including > myself, who have constructed just bad antennas over the years. I > call it > my antenna graveyard site. This is where all those "great antennas" > are > laid to rest. Keep the names coming for the new vertical! > > I'll post a list of proposed names soon. > > http://www.wa3wsj.com/SkunkWorks.html > > > 72, > Ed, WA3WSJ > Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
RE: WA3WSJ's EPA Skunk Works Site - Check it out!
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In reply to this post by WA3WSJ
I too have no photos.
My worst was a 10/15/20 parallel dipole tacked to the wall of my apartment in CA. It gave a very low swr on 40 meters by obviously coupling into the building wiring system. When I sent CQ, the neighbor's TV would switch on and off. Like Stephanie, I have my own house now so the antennas can stay safely outside. - Keith KD1E - - K2 5411 (that's real close to Stephanie's at sn 5311) - -----Original Message----- From: [hidden email] [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Stephanie Maks I've certainly made my share of terrible antennas, but I wasn't quick enough to take pictures of them. My best worst antenna was a 6M dipole tacked to my bedroom wall, facing the TV. With 50 watts of FM it hit the local repeater just great, and only took a month to destroy my TV's receiver with overload. My runner-up best worst antenna was my indoor mini trapped 10M vertical which 'strangely' would never tune up, until that time I was testing it and holding onto the wrong thing. Suddenly 1.5:1 match at 50 watts of 10M and OUCH WHY IS MY HAND SO HOT?! 73 de Stephanie va3uxb K2#5311 - K1#2132 p.s. fortunately I've got my own home now, so my antennas can be outside instead of inside! _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
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In reply to this post by WA3WSJ
Hmmm ... be careful. Lockheed (now Lockheed Martin and not related to
the inventor of the Retro-Encabulator) may have a trademark registered on "Skunk Works." It became fairly famous for secret airplanes such as the U2 and F-117A. Fred K6DGW Edward R. Breneiser wrote: > Hello all! > > I liked the EPA Skunk Works name so much that I created a Skunk Works > area on my website. _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
RE: WA3WSJ's EPA Skunk Works Site - Check it out!
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A-yep. Skunk Works(r) is a registered trademark of Lockheed-Martin
Corporation. It began during WWII in Burbank, California but later moved to more "secure" quarters. Anyone heard of "Groom Lake" or "Area 51"? That's them! (Or part of them). Still, many companies and organizations have called the location where their 'secret' new product development is going on the "company skunk works". As in all of those still trying to figure out exactly where the Elecraft "skunk works" are located...Hi! Ron AC7AC -----Original Message----- Hmmm ... be careful. Lockheed (now Lockheed Martin and not related to the inventor of the Retro-Encabulator) may have a trademark registered on "Skunk Works." It became fairly famous for secret airplanes such as the U2 and F-117A. Fred K6DGW Edward R. Breneiser wrote: > Hello all! > > I liked the EPA Skunk Works name so much that I created a Skunk Works > area on my website. _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
Re: WA3WSJ's EPA Skunk Works Site - Check it out!
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In reply to this post by WA3WSJ
You skipped my favorite aircraft: the Blackbird. Every time I see a photo I just admire the lines of that plane. There is supposed to be one located in McMinnville, Oregon. I was in a waiting room waiting for Pat when I noticed the guy sitting next to me going through the maintenance manuals for the plane. He is one of the engineers volunteering to refit the Blackbird for display. I need to go down there one day. The Spruce Goose is there as well.
Kevin. KD5ONS -----Original Message----- >From: Fred Jensen <[hidden email]> >Sent: Apr 7, 2006 1:25 PM >To: Elecraft Reflector <[hidden email]> >Subject: Re: [Elecraft] WA3WSJ's EPA Skunk Works Site - Check it out! > >Hmmm ... be careful. Lockheed (now Lockheed Martin and not related to >the inventor of the Retro-Encabulator) may have a trademark registered >on "Skunk Works." It became fairly famous for secret airplanes such as >the U2 and F-117A. > >Fred K6DGW > >Edward R. Breneiser wrote: >> Hello all! >> >> I liked the EPA Skunk Works name so much that I created a Skunk Works >> area on my website. >_______________________________________________ >Elecraft mailing list >Post to: [hidden email] >You must be a subscriber to post to the list. >Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): > http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > >Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm >Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
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Kevin Rock wrote:
> You skipped my favorite aircraft: the Blackbird. I skipped a few other less well publicized ones too, for obvious reasons. The original Lockheed Skunk Works occupied Bldg 357 (a hangar) at the Burbank CA Airport, and the engineering offices were in Bldg 90, which you could see from I-5. > There is supposed to be one located in McMinnville, Oregon. There is. It is in the Evergreen Aviation Museum across from the airport not far out of town. It is parked under the wing of the Spruce Goose, and looks like a model next to that monster, although by itself, it is pretty big. Evergreen, with a base at the airport across the road has an "interesting" history also. It's a great indoor aviation museum if you like airplanes. I have a cool T-shirt from that visit. The Spruce Goose is really made mostly out out of birch, but I guess "Birch Goose" just didn't have the right ring to it. It was designed to carry 600 or so troops across the Atlantic at the amazing speed of 110 kts ... and I thought the grind across the S. China Sea in C-130's at 250 kts was awful. Fred K6DGW _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
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In reply to this post by k6dgw
And Kelly Johnson's other masterpiece, the SR-71 Blackbird.
A wire resonant vertical antenna doesn't exactly fit the image of the cutting edge technology associated with the Skunk Works. Not to mention that Lockheed Martin owns both the name and the skunk logo that EPA Skunk Works has appropriated. Eric KE6US www.ke6us.com -----Original Message----- From: [hidden email] [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Fred Jensen Sent: Friday, April 07, 2006 10:26 AM To: Elecraft Reflector Subject: Re: [Elecraft] WA3WSJ's EPA Skunk Works Site - Check it out! Hmmm ... be careful. Lockheed (now Lockheed Martin and not related to the inventor of the Retro-Encabulator) may have a trademark registered on "Skunk Works." It became fairly famous for secret airplanes such as the U2 and F-117A. Fred K6DGW Edward R. Breneiser wrote: > Hello all! > > I liked the EPA Skunk Works name so much that I created a Skunk Works > area on my website. _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
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In reply to this post by Ron D'Eau Claire-2
Actually, quite a bit of the original Skunk Works stayed at Burbank at least
into the late 70's and early 80's. A good friend of mine was an engineer there and often had to make late night runs into work to supervise lifting some exotic flight surface out of a jig. That's the extent of my knowledge of his work. Any further questions were deflected with a statement about band conditions or some such. Eric KE6US www.ke6us.com -----Original Message----- From: [hidden email] [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Ron D'Eau Claire Sent: Friday, April 07, 2006 11:02 AM To: 'Elecraft Reflector' Subject: RE: [Elecraft] WA3WSJ's EPA Skunk Works Site - Check it out! A-yep. Skunk Works(r) is a registered trademark of Lockheed-Martin Corporation. It began during WWII in Burbank, California but later moved to more "secure" quarters. Anyone heard of "Groom Lake" or "Area 51"? That's them! (Or part of them). Still, many companies and organizations have called the location where their 'secret' new product development is going on the "company skunk works". As in all of those still trying to figure out exactly where the Elecraft "skunk works" are located...Hi! Ron AC7AC -----Original Message----- Hmmm ... be careful. Lockheed (now Lockheed Martin and not related to the inventor of the Retro-Encabulator) may have a trademark registered on "Skunk Works." It became fairly famous for secret airplanes such as the U2 and F-117A. Fred K6DGW Edward R. Breneiser wrote: > Hello all! > > I liked the EPA Skunk Works name so much that I created a Skunk Works > area on my website. _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
RE: WA3WSJ's EPA Skunk Works Site - Check it out!
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In reply to this post by k6dgw
Reminds me of a customer of mine, who DOES understand the social position of
being a customer. I was driving along I-10 (I think, somewhere in the Florida Panhandle) and saw a Blackbird parked alongside of the expressway. I immediately exited and found the SR-71 on display at some museum. While looking at this magnificient expression of aviation technology, my beeper went off. Tom knew I was on vacation, and knew not to interrupt me, but he beeped anyway - because it was important. I called him on my cellphone and told him "I'm standing under a Blackbird!", then asked what he needed. I don't remember what he needed, but it wasn't important enough for him even to mention on that call. He said Cool!, asked me to take some pictures of the plane and to call back later. He was not going to interrupt looking at the SR-71 (or RS-71, if LBJ could read better) for some silly computer issue. I've always liked a little balance in a customer<g>. Dan / WG4S Kevin Rock wrote: > You skipped my favorite aircraft: the Blackbird. _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
RE: WA3WSJ's EPA Skunk Works Site - Check it out!
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That would most likely have been the A-12 at Battleship park in Mobile,
AL. It would be right off I-10. http://www.ussalabama.com/ For anyone interested in Blackbirds, try this site: http://www.visi.com/~jweeks/sr71/index.html On topic, I haven't made or put up any antennas yet. :) I imagine when I do I'll have some stinkers as well. I'm thinking about a dipole running the ridge of my house. I could hit a half-wave for 40 meters. Then there are those really tall fir trees in the front yard... Walt, KE7GWZ On Fri, 2006-04-07 at 17:40 -0400, Dan Barker wrote: > Reminds me of a customer of mine, who DOES understand the social position of > being a customer. > > I was driving along I-10 (I think, somewhere in the Florida Panhandle) and > saw a Blackbird parked alongside of the expressway. I immediately exited and > found the SR-71 on display at some museum. > > While looking at this magnificient expression of aviation technology, my > beeper went off. Tom knew I was on vacation, and knew not to interrupt me, > but he beeped anyway - because it was important. > > I called him on my cellphone and told him "I'm standing under a Blackbird!", > then asked what he needed. I don't remember what he needed, but it wasn't > important enough for him even to mention on that call. He said Cool!, asked > me to take some pictures of the plane and to call back later. He was not > going to interrupt looking at the SR-71 (or RS-71, if LBJ could read better) > for some silly computer issue. > > I've always liked a little balance in a customer<g>. > > Dan / WG4S > > Kevin Rock wrote: > > You skipped my favorite aircraft: the Blackbird. > > _______________________________________________ > Elecraft mailing list > Post to: [hidden email] > You must be a subscriber to post to the list. > Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): > http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm > Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
Skunks and Antennas (WAS:] WA3WSJ's EPA Skunk Works Site - Check it out!)
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Walt KE7GWZ wrote:
On topic, I haven't made or put up any antennas yet. :) I imagine when I do I'll have some stinkers as well. I'm thinking about a dipole running the ridge of my house. I could hit a half-wave for 40 meters. Then there are those really tall fir trees in the front yard... ----------------- Both of those will work. Feed that 66 foot wire with good open wire line and you can get out well on 80 too. I always go for the option that puts the radiator as much in the clear and away from objects as possible. Some cheap balloons from the party supply will get a wire into those trees - just use two people, one on either side of the tree on a calm morning until it's over the best spot, then one person pulls down while the other plays out very lightweight thread, followed by heavier thread, followed by string, followed by rope... Fitting the subject, I do antenna work only in the daytimes here on the edge of the Gayles Creek wetlands in Forest Grove, Oregon, ever since the night I was out stringing some wire and stepped over a cat roaming the yard. A few minutes later I got a better look a the "cat" from the ladder and saw the stripes. Glad I didn't startle it. I keep the garage door closed at night too. The fastest way to ruin a morning is to start the car and scare a pole cat snoozing under it, keeping warm. Ron AC7AC _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
Re: Skunks and Antennas (WAS:] WA3WSJ's EPA Skunk Works Site - Check it out!)
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Well, I'm in Beaverton so try to keep the big cats out west. I'll just
watch for the local raccoons here. :) On the antenna though, I don't think the tree is feasible due to location. The ridge line (on some poles for a touch more height) is quite doable and could easily feed into where my radio will one day be. However, I'm a little concerned about the signal going too vertical and having a bad angle on the horizon. Should I be considering a vertical antenna if I really want to DX? New guy here so please correct any bad assumptions I'm making... Walt, KE7GWZ On Fri, 2006-04-07 at 18:07 -0700, Ron D'Eau Claire wrote: > Walt KE7GWZ wrote: > > On topic, I haven't made or put up any antennas yet. :) I imagine when I > do I'll have some stinkers as well. I'm thinking about a dipole running the > ridge of my house. I could hit a half-wave for 40 meters. Then there are > those really tall fir trees in the front yard... > > ----------------- > > Both of those will work. Feed that 66 foot wire with good open wire line and > you can get out well on 80 too. > > I always go for the option that puts the radiator as much in the clear and > away from objects as possible. Some cheap balloons from the party supply > will get a wire into those trees - just use two people, one on either side > of the tree on a calm morning until it's over the best spot, then one person > pulls down while the other plays out very lightweight thread, followed by > heavier thread, followed by string, followed by rope... > > Fitting the subject, I do antenna work only in the daytimes here on the edge > of the Gayles Creek wetlands in Forest Grove, Oregon, ever since the night I > was out stringing some wire and stepped over a cat roaming the yard. A few > minutes later I got a better look a the "cat" from the ladder and saw the > stripes. Glad I didn't startle it. I keep the garage door closed at night > too. The fastest way to ruin a morning is to start the car and scare a pole > cat snoozing under it, keeping warm. > > Ron AC7AC > > _______________________________________________ > Elecraft mailing list > Post to: [hidden email] > You must be a subscriber to post to the list. > Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): > http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm > Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
RE: Skunks and Antennas (WAS:] WA3WSJ's EPA Skunk WorksSite - Check it out!)
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Walk, KE7GWZ asked:
The ridge line (on some poles for a touch more height) is quite doable and could easily feed into where my radio will one day be. However, I'm a little concerned about the signal going too vertical and having a bad angle on the horizon. Should I be considering a vertical antenna if I really want to DX? -------------------------------- How far above the ground would your ridge wire be? What bands do you want to work most? Contrary to what people are likely to say, world-wide DX does NOT go away now, but it can get harder to find for many of us urban dwellers. The reason is that the DX will be on lower frequencies where we are unable to erect efficient antennas. First of all, let's consider a good antenna for making lots of reliable QSOs independent of almost all sun conditions. A horizontal antenna from about 0.1 to 0.4 wavelengths above the ground will provide that out to 1,000 miles or so. So if your ridge antenna is up 30 feet, it will do a credible job for short skip on 80 and 40. It will provide good DX on 20 meters and higher frequencies. Where you will find he most DX during the sunspot minimum will be at the lower frequencies. 160 meters will see regular openings, 80 will see a lot and they grow less and less frequent as the frequency increases. That doesn't mean that 20 meters will not have lots of DX, it just isn't as regular as before. A funny thing about the way propagation works, the most efficient frequencies for DX are those very close to the Maximum Usable Frequency (MUF). During sunspot maxima that is most often up near 30 MHz. At the same time the losses in the atmosphere caused by RF absorption by ions created by solar radiation decrease as frequency increases. That's why you never hear DX on the standard broadcast band (550 kHz - 1700 kHz) at any point in the sunspot cycle except at night, and then you can hear DX if you find a clear channel at any point in the sunspot cycle. It's almost independent of the sunspots. 160 meters is a lot like that, 80 less, etc. So when the sunspots move the MUF up to the higher frequencies, the DX is more common but it by no means goes away at sunspot minimum. It just moves to lower frequencies and, because of the ionization produced by sunshine during daylight hours, DX occurs only at night on the lower frequencies. It's interesting to look at the old magazine articles as the short waves were "discovered" by Hams and the big news wasn't "DX", it was "Daylight DX!" The ranges worked weren't what was so surprising, it was that DX could be heard during daylight for the first time in the whole history of radio. But, to get a good horizontal DX antenna on 80 meters, you need one about 100 feet above the ground! For 160 meters it needs to be closer to twice that high! Few of us can even consider such a high antenna. That's where verticals come in to play. A horizontal antenna at ideal height has a gain of about 5 or 6 dB over an "isotropic" antenna at angles useful for DX. (An isotropic is a fictional antenna of zero size that is convenient to use for comparing antenna designs.) So your horizontal at a good height will make your effective radiated power about 4 times greater. A K2/100 will radiate as much as a 400 watt rig feeding a 0 dBi (the "i" refers to an isotropic radiator) antenna. Since few of us can put up horizontal antennas at ideal heights on 80 or 160, we consider verticals. Verticals do not provide the gain a horizontal antenna has. Indeed, they frequently have about 0 dbi or even a little less. Although many theoretical antenna models show that a vertical has maximum gain at the horizon (0 degrees elevation) that is not the case in practice. That will occur only if there are no ground losses. Vertical induce larger currents in the ground that are mostly converted into heat (unless the station has the good fortune to live on a sheet of metal extending many thousands of feet in all directions, or perhaps second best is to be on the salt-water oceans). Almost all radiation from a vertical below about 20 degrees is lost to the ground. Theses are "far field" losses, occurring many wavelengths from the antenna, so the largest field of radials won't help. Bottom line, we live with the fact that a good vertical has about 6 dB less gain at useful angles than a horizontal at ideal heights: our effective radiated power is about 1/4 what it would be with that ideal horizontal antenna. Now, there's another loss issue with verticals. If the vertical is not a dipole (it is not 1/2 wavelength long) it will depend on currents flowing into the ground for efficient operation. These currents increase rapidly as the antenna is made shorter. They are fairly large when the vertical is 1/4 wave long, and grow extremely fast as the length drops below 1/4 wavelength. These are physical, not electrical lengths. That is, on 80 meters a 66 foot tall vertical will show a base impedance of about 35 ohms and be self-resonant when worked against ground. If you make it shorter, say 33 feet tall, you can use loading coils to bring it back to resonance but the impedance will be much less than 35 ohms. The ground resistance is in series with the antenna impedance, so the power is shared between them. For example, if you have an excellent ground with only 35 ohms resistance, it will consume 3 dB - half of our RF - leaving only half of what's left to be radiated. A 35-ohm ground is a good ground indeed. Many radial system are lucky to be that good. Your ground resistance can be 10 times that in many installations. So, assuming a 35 ohm ground, you now have an antenna that radiates 9 dB or more less than a horizontal at ideal height. The output from a K2/100 is no longer equal to 400 watts into an isotropic antenna like it would be into a horizontal at ideal height, it's now equal to 40 watts into an isotropic antenna into a typical 1/4 wave vertical. Quite a drop! But it's one we are often compelled to live with in our urban lots. And on 160 it's often worse as we must live with an ever-shorter antenna. And that's why most Hams mourn the loss of the active sunspots. The DX is still there but most of us lack the resources or the real estate to reach it as reliably as we can on the higher frequencies. But it is there and a lot of Hams can find it with perseverance. It's just harder. And keep in mind that the higher frequencies will continue to see DX openings. The sunspot minimum doesn't mean the higher frequencies are dead, they will simply be open less often than before. But when they are the DX will roll in. On my tiny lot, I'll continue to use my 65 foot doublet on 80 meters and up. On 80 and 40 it will provide me with many contacts out to 1,000 to 2,000 miles just about any evening. When 30, 20 or higher bands are open, I can work the world. I'll just do a little less "working the world" over the next few years, but Ham radio will be just as fun! Ron AC7AC _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
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In reply to this post by Kevin Rock
In a message dated 4/7/2006 11:57:35 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, [hidden email] writes: http://www.wa3wsj.com/SkunkWorks.html Okay I found it. Funny thing, I didn't mind getting spammed that time. /Bill K3UJ _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
Re: Skunks and Antennas (WAS:] WA3WSJ's EPA Skunk Works Site - Check it out!)
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In reply to this post by Walt Armour
On Apr 7, 2006, at 8:45 PM, Walt Armour wrote: > Well, I'm in Beaverton so try to keep the big cats out west. I'll > just > watch for the local raccoons here. :) > > On the antenna though, I don't think the tree is feasible due to > location. The ridge line (on some poles for a touch more height) is > quite doable and could easily feed into where my radio will one day > be. > However, I'm a little concerned about the signal going too vertical > and > having a bad angle on the horizon. > > Should I be considering a vertical antenna if I really want to DX? > > New guy here so please correct any bad assumptions I'm making... > > Walt, KE7GWZ I don't have any usable trees on my lot (unusual for the NW) and when I moved here (Bainbridge Island, WA) six years ago I put up a wire antenna about three feet above the ridge line of the house and attached garage. The garage part was at a right angle to the house part. It was about 65 feet long on one leg and 34 feet on the other. I fed it at the corner with coax and used a MFJ tuner, although for some bands the tuner on my TS-570D would match things fairly well by itself (this was before I built my K2). I didn't really expect much in the way of performance, but our local DX club had a "friendly competition" in 2001 to see who could work the most DX in one year running QRP levels. I couldn't really compete with the guys who had beams (one guy worked over 240 countries), but I did work 100 countries (plus several more running QRO) using that antenna using all bands from 40 to 10 meters. That was much better than I had expected, but of course it was at a different part of the sunspot cycle and propagation was much better than it is currently. I replaced it with a Hy-Gain AV-640 vertical mounted to a piece of 2 in pipe I strapped to the side of the house. I have had better results with the vertical, but the ridge line antenna did more than just warm the clouds. 73, Bob, N7XY _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
RE: Skunks and Antennas (WAS:] WA3WSJ's EPA Skunk WorksSite - Check it out!)
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Bob, N7XY wrote:
I replaced it with a Hy-Gain AV-640 vertical mounted to a piece of 2 in pipe I strapped to the side of the house. I have had better results with the vertical, but the ridge line antenna did more than just warm the clouds. -------------------------- You are one of those people many of us envy, even if you can't put up a tower and beam. You live on an island surrounded by salt water. Sure, it's a fair-sized island, but it's a far better environment than many of us have for verticals. One of the problems with comparing antennas, even verticals vs. horizontals, is that unless one can do really fast switching between the two antennas, making the change in a second or two at most, it's very hard to tell the difference. Even if the difference is 6 dB or more - a full S-Unit on most receivers - it can be hard to spot unless it's done very quickly. And different antennas will favor different propagation. It's more than just the angle of maximum radiation but many other factors come into play as well. One can apply many basic rules and concepts when choosing an antenna type, but the most universally true rules that seem to hold up over time are: 1) Bigger is better than smaller. 2) Higher is better than lower. It's what we do to achieve those the best we can in any given situation that leaves many of us staring at our rooflines so much the neighbors start wondering if we're a bit "touched in the head"... One commercial group who has done a lot to document the best tradeoffs in installing verticals, and who has had their verticals used successfully on many DX-peditions, is Force 12 in California. Of course, their DX-pedition verticals were also all (as far as I know) on an island or beach overlooking salt water <G>, but they put out some great signals. They have done a lot of work testing and documenting things like the advantage of elevated radials, which help avoid close-in ground losses by minimizing the coupling of RF currents to the earth. They have a very informative FAQ page at http://force12inc.com/F12-Sigma-FAQ-1.htm or http://tinyurl.com/p5u2e. Ron AC7AC _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
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In reply to this post by Kevin Rock
Don't forget the P-38 "Lightening".
Doug W6JD -------------- Original message -------------- From: "EricJ" <[hidden email]> > And Kelly Johnson's other masterpiece, the SR-71 Blackbird. > > A wire resonant vertical antenna doesn't exactly fit the image of the > cutting edge technology associated with the Skunk Works. Not to mention that > Lockheed Martin owns both the name and the skunk logo that EPA Skunk Works > has appropriated. > > Eric > KE6US > www.ke6us.com > > -----Original Message----- > From: [hidden email] > [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Fred Jensen > Sent: Friday, April 07, 2006 10:26 AM > To: Elecraft Reflector > Subject: Re: [Elecraft] WA3WSJ's EPA Skunk Works Site - Check it out! > > Hmmm ... be careful. Lockheed (now Lockheed Martin and not related to the > inventor of the Retro-Encabulator) may have a trademark registered on "Skunk > Works." It became fairly famous for secret airplanes such as the U2 and > F-117A. > > Fred K6DGW > > Edward R. Breneiser wrote: > > Hello all! > > > > I liked the EPA Skunk Works name so much that I created a Skunk Works > > area on my website. > _______________________________________________ > Elecraft mailing list > Post to: [hidden email] > You must be a subscriber to post to the list. > Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): > http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm > Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com > _______________________________________________ > Elecraft mailing list > Post to: [hidden email] > You must be a subscriber to post to the list. > Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): > http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm > Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
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