Yaesu FT-2000 v K-3?
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Has anyone had a chance to compare the K3 to the Yaesu FT-2000? They seem to be in the same general price range, and I'm thinking about buying one of them...
Tnx and 73 de KD4CSO, Arthur _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
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I was also thinking about the FT-2000, having read about the problems owners
of the expensive FTDX-9000 'flagship radio' have encountered I decided to avoid Yaesu at all costs. The FT-2000 has some nice visual features and a fine tuning dial, the receiver figures are not what one would expect however. I was actually waiting for the not-yet announced (just a rumour) Kenwood HF radio when the K3 positing was made by Wayne on April 28th. I think the K3 features and Elecraft support significantly surpass those offered by Yaesu. Elecraft listen, Yaesu don't seem to. Simon Brown, HB9DRV ----- Original Message ----- From: "Arthur Laurent" <[hidden email]> Has anyone had a chance to compare the K3 to the Yaesu FT-2000? They seem to be in the same general price range, and I'm thinking about buying one of them... _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
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In reply to this post by Arthur Laurent
Arthur.... The FT2000 looks like a fine radio and if its like the FT1000MP...well...it will be a winner. But, the K3 looks like a fine radio too. But it boils down to this.... You can order at FT2000 right now....and get it in a week or so. You can order a K3 right now....but you are going to wait away. How long? Very hard to say, but I think that "E" has been deluged with orders. So, the backlog is going to be rather hugh. I don't think they are shipping until the middle of the summer. There are a lot of offerings out there now with the new OMNI and the FT2000 and FT450 and now the K3. Knowing what my K2 does...and how well it works...and how much I love the radio...I am waiting for the K3. The k3 has features on ti the I,Y,K and the T have not provided. I think the RX numbers will be fantastic... well very competitive. The K3 has been engineered for Hams by Hams. That is a plus. Knowing the guys at E and understanding what they've done over the years, I think that my money is on the guys from Aptos, CA. So I would pick E over I, Y, K and T at this point.,,,but you going to have to WAIT! Lee - K0WA In our day and age it seems that Common Sense is in short supply. If you don't have any Common Sense - get some Common Sense and use it. If you can't find any Common Sense, ask for help from somebody who has some Common Sense. Is Common Sense devine? _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
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There is a basic difference in the choice of IF frequencies. The Y2K
main receiver has first IF at 69.45MHz, second at 450khz, and last at 30Khz for the DSP. The Elecraft has the first IF at 8.215Mhz and the second at 15Khz for DSP. This choice reveals a lot. There are many more choices (bandwidth, skirt, etc) for crystal filters at reasonable cost for a MF frequency such as 8.215 than for a VHF frequency of 69.45Mhz. Not surprising that Y offers only 15, 6, and 3Khz bandwidth filters for the first filter (roofing filter) at 69.45Mhz. Elecraft already has many more choices and still more to come. My guess is that with so many options available for the first filter in the rig, Elecraft will handily beat the Y2K in most receiver measurement numbers. Raj -- Rajiv Dewan, N2RD [hidden email] FN13fc -- On May 10, 2007, at 9:48 AM, Lee Buller wrote: > > > Arthur.... > > The FT2000 looks like a fine radio and if its like the > FT1000MP...well...it will be a winner. But, the K3 looks like a > fine radio too. But it boils down to this.... > > You can order at FT2000 right now....and get it in a week or so. > > You can order a K3 right now....but you are going to wait away. > How long? Very hard to say, but I think that "E" has been deluged > with orders. So, the backlog is going to be rather hugh. I don't > think they are shipping until the middle of the summer. > > There are a lot of offerings out there now with the new OMNI and > the FT2000 and FT450 and now the K3. Knowing what my K2 does...and > how well it works...and how much I love the radio...I am waiting > for the K3. The k3 has features on ti the I,Y,K and the T have not > provided. I think the RX numbers will be fantastic... well very > competitive. The K3 has been engineered for Hams by Hams. That is > a plus. Knowing the guys at E and understanding what they've done > over the years, I think that my money is on the guys from Aptos, CA. > > So I would pick E over I, Y, K and T at this point.,,,but you going > to have to WAIT! > > Lee - K0WA > > > > > > > > > In our day and age it seems that Common Sense is in short supply. > If you don't have any Common Sense - get some Common Sense and use > it. If you can't find any Common Sense, ask for help from somebody > who has some Common Sense. Is Common Sense devine? > _______________________________________________ > Elecraft mailing list > Post to: [hidden email] > You must be a subscriber to post to the list. > Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): > http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm > Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
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One area where Yaesu excels is the tuning knob, especially the FTDX-9000
which is a joy to use. A K3 add-on for later could be an external VFO - Elecraft or 3rd-party companies could then make luxurious dials, gold-plated even. A 2 inch tuning knob is too small IMO, but I rarely tune by hand anyway as I sit in the digital sub-bands and let the computer tune the radio. Simon Brown, HB9DRV ----- Original Message ----- From: "Rajiv Dewan, N2RD" <[hidden email]> > [chop] _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
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Simon,
The knob on the K3 is weighted and a custom design (and very nice as is). I don't think the physical size of the K3 could accomodate a larger knob. ...and...thanks for your great work with HRD! 73 Greg AB7R On Thu, 10 May 2007 18:49:39 +0200 "Simon Brown (HB9DRV)" <[hidden email]> wrote: > One area where Yaesu excels is the tuning knob, >especially the FTDX-9000 which is a joy to use. > > A K3 add-on for later could be an external VFO - >Elecraft or 3rd-party companies could then make luxurious >dials, gold-plated even. A 2 inch tuning knob is too >small IMO, but I rarely tune by hand anyway as I sit in >the digital sub-bands and let the computer tune the >radio. > > Simon Brown, HB9DRV > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Rajiv Dewan, N2RD" ><[hidden email]> > > >> [chop] > > _______________________________________________ > Elecraft mailing list > Post to: [hidden email] > You must be a subscriber to post to the list. > Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): > http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm > Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
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In reply to this post by Simon (HB9DRV)
I am owner of a K2 with all of the accessories etc. Very nice radio and I
enjoyed the build and operation of the radio. I use an FT1000D as my main station radio. I enjoy the 200w capability and 99% of the time I don't need my Alpha 87A. In fact, a lot of the time after turning on the amp I work the station with the exciter before the 3 minute warmup period is over! I am considering an FT2000D as a possible replacement for the 14 year old FT1000D but I intend to wait a long time for Yaesu to get the "bugs" out of the software and hardware design. I don't like being the test guinea pig for new equipment! I had an opportunity to play with the K3 at the Visalia DX Convention. The features are very impressive and the front panel is very user friendly. I like the modular concept and would go the "build it myself" route when and if I decide to buy. I can't enough good things about the Elecraft design philosophy and customer service. One thing that would help would be an additional option for a 200w capable radio ---- the K3D!!! I wonder if that is a future possiblity??!! 73 Elliott WA6TLA _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
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In reply to this post by Greg - AB7R
Hi Greg, I'm thinking *external* in a nice brass box :-)
Simon Brown, HB9DRV ----- Original Message ----- From: "FISCHER,GREG" <[hidden email]> > The knob on the K3 is weighted and a custom design (and > very nice as is). I don't think the physical size of the > K3 could accomodate a larger knob. _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
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In reply to this post by Elliott Lawrence
On May 10, 2007, at 10:06 AM, Elliott Lawrence wrote:
> One thing that would help would be an additional option for a 200w > capable radio ---- the K3D!!! I wonder if that is a future > possiblity??!! Do you really think that 3dB will be enough of an advantage? That is all you will get when you go from 100W to 200W. It seems to me that one needs at least 6dB to make enough difference to make the effort worthwhile. 6dB seems to be the difference between, "I know you are there but I can't quite copy you," and, "QSL." If you started at 100W then you would need 400W to make that difference. I tend to think that 10dB is about the right increment and that would be 1000W. That leads me to feel that if you need more power than 100W you are going to need an external amplifier. And then there is the issue of path symmetry. Path loss is going to be the same in both directions. Given that most rigs out there are in the 100W range the signal arriving at each end will be the same. Hmmm. Oh! The K3 is likely to have a much better receiver than the one the other guy is using. So if he is using 100W and you have acceptable copy on him you might need a 3dB-6dB improvement in your signal in order to deliver an equivalent readability signal to the other end. Interesting thought. Maybe a 200-300W PA wouldn't be such a bad idea after all. 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
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<> Do you really think that 3dB will be enough of an advantage? That is
<> all you will get when you go from 100W to 200W. 3 dB helps sometimes, and some of the contests have a 150W limit for "low power". I could see myself going for the 200 W version if it were available, but its availability would not be a deciding factor in buying the rig or not. I also am deciding between the FT-2000 and the K3. Until the surprise K3 announcement, I had settled on the Yaesu. Fortunately, my time frame for purchase isn't until Dec or Jan, so I have some time to sort things out. I like the size of the FT-2000 and all the dedicated knobs. I think its performance should be more than adequate for my purposes (CW contesting and DXing). On the other hand, the K3 receiver should have better ultimate performance and I like the flexibility of the roofing filter selection, the complete sub-receiver and the ease of firmware upgrades. Needless to say, the Elecraft support/ service, the ability to repair the rig myself and this list are all strong points in favor of the K3. If Elecraft announces a high-performance panadaptor with external LCD display support that should just about seal the deal ;>) 73 ... Craig AC0DS _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
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In reply to this post by Brian Lloyd-6
Brian has some good points. Personally, I think the jump to 400-1000
Watts from 100 is so great that you really need to think of a separate amplifier. 100 W is clearly enough for 90% of QSOs (that I make, anyway), and it would be a shame to compromise a good 100 W transceiver package to allow for an internal QRO amp and/or power supply. After > 40 years as a ham, I finally broke down and bought a used/upgraded SB-220 for my station. It has helped on occasion, and it's kind of an interesting piece of gear in its own right. One thing I have noticed, though, is that if I call CQ at 100 W, I get nice replies. If I call CQ at 1000 W, I get lots of very weak replies. That's the flip side of "reciprocity". Yes, it's good to have a good receiver, but you may need to strain to work those marginal Q's. (Actually, that's half the fun, especially if it's Swains Island.) 73 Martin AA6E Brian Lloyd wrote: > On May 10, 2007, at 10:06 AM, Elliott Lawrence wrote: > >> One thing that would help would be an additional option for a 200w >> capable radio ---- the K3D!!! I wonder if that is a future >> possiblity??!! > > Do you really think that 3dB will be enough of an advantage? That is all > you will get when you go from 100W to 200W. > > It seems to me that one needs at least 6dB to make enough difference to > make the effort worthwhile. 6dB seems to be the difference between, "I > know you are there but I can't quite copy you," and, "QSL." If you > started at 100W then you would need 400W to make that difference. > > I tend to think that 10dB is about the right increment and that would be > 1000W. That leads me to feel that if you need more power than 100W you > are going to need an external amplifier. > > And then there is the issue of path symmetry. Path loss is going to be > the same in both directions. Given that most rigs out there are in the > 100W range the signal arriving at each end will be the same. Hmmm. > > Oh! The K3 is likely to have a much better receiver than the one the > other guy is using. So if he is using 100W and you have acceptable copy > on him you might need a 3dB-6dB improvement in your signal in order to > deliver an equivalent readability signal to the other end. Interesting > thought. Maybe a 200-300W PA wouldn't be such a bad idea after all. > > 73 de Brian, WB6RQN > Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com > > > _______________________________________________ > Elecraft mailing list > Post to: [hidden email] > You must be a subscriber to post to the list. > Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): > http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm > Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
Re: Yaesu FT-2000 v K-3?
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Readability reciprocity is a very interesting question. Since I'm a 6M
operator, things might be a little different for me than on the HF bands, but probably not all that much. In contests, unless you are operating a really Big Gun station and are solidly in the high-power category by choice, you can't run an amplifier anyway and stay in the low-power class. So it comes down to basic DXing, busting pile-ups, etc. How much power is enough? How much is too much? The quality of the receiver has a lot to do with it, but an even bigger consideration is your noise floor. Part of that is simple geography, and part of it has a lot to do with the kind of antenna you're running. If you're in a very quiet rural environment and using a fairly sharp yagi, then you're going to be able to hear a pin drop on 6M. Couple that with a good receiver, and you probably have at least a 6 dB receive advantage over 90% of the guys you're going to be working, who are mostly going to be in a typical suburban environment with plenty of man-made QRN. This is kind of the conclusion I came to, anyway, and it's bearing out pretty well. I run 400W on 6M SSB/CW, and that seems to be just about right. You really have to experiment. If you find yourself struggling to hear more than 20% or so of your contacts, then I would say you're running too much power. If you find yourself losing a lot of QSOs where you can copy the other guys Q5, you're probably running too little power for your low-noise environment. (And how I envy you!) To the point of the original post, I agree that putting a 200W amplifier module in the K3 would probably not be worth it, and putting 400W inside the box is almost certainly unfeasible. Go with an external amp. Bill / W5WVO Martin AA6E wrote: > Brian has some good points. Personally, I think the jump to 400-1000 > Watts from 100 is so great that you really need to think of a separate > amplifier. 100 W is clearly enough for 90% of QSOs (that I make, > anyway), and it would be a shame to compromise a good 100 W > transceiver package to allow for an internal QRO amp and/or power > supply. > After > 40 years as a ham, I finally broke down and bought a > used/upgraded SB-220 for my station. It has helped on occasion, and > it's kind of an interesting piece of gear in its own right. One > thing I have noticed, though, is that if I call CQ at 100 W, I get > nice replies. If I call CQ at 1000 W, I get lots of very weak > replies. That's the flip side of "reciprocity". Yes, it's good to > have a good receiver, but you may need to strain to work those > marginal Q's. (Actually, that's half the fun, especially if it's > Swains Island.) > 73 Martin AA6E > > Brian Lloyd wrote: >> On May 10, 2007, at 10:06 AM, Elliott Lawrence wrote: >> >>> One thing that would help would be an additional option for a 200w >>> capable radio ---- the K3D!!! I wonder if that is a future >>> possiblity??!! >> >> Do you really think that 3dB will be enough of an advantage? That is >> all you will get when you go from 100W to 200W. >> >> It seems to me that one needs at least 6dB to make enough difference >> to make the effort worthwhile. 6dB seems to be the difference >> between, "I know you are there but I can't quite copy you," and, >> "QSL." If you started at 100W then you would need 400W to make that >> difference. I tend to think that 10dB is about the right increment and >> that >> would be 1000W. That leads me to feel that if you need more power >> than 100W you are going to need an external amplifier. >> >> And then there is the issue of path symmetry. Path loss is going to >> be the same in both directions. Given that most rigs out there are >> in the 100W range the signal arriving at each end will be the same. >> Hmmm. Oh! The K3 is likely to have a much better receiver than the one >> the >> other guy is using. So if he is using 100W and you have acceptable >> copy on him you might need a 3dB-6dB improvement in your signal in >> order to deliver an equivalent readability signal to the other end. >> Interesting thought. Maybe a 200-300W PA wouldn't be such a bad idea >> after all. 73 de Brian, WB6RQN >> Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Elecraft mailing list >> Post to: [hidden email] >> You must be a subscriber to post to the list. >> Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): >> http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft >> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm >> Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com > > _______________________________________________ > Elecraft mailing list > Post to: [hidden email] > You must be a subscriber to post to the list. > Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): > http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm > Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
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In reply to this post by Brian Lloyd-6
There's one more thing to consider.
I contest at the 5W level, and work almost everything I can hear eventually. That being the case, 100w might let me work those stations a bit sooner, but once I've done that, those 100w won't help me hear any better. Gotta hear them to work them. Money spent on an improved antenna system would far outweigh money spent on extra power, especially at the 3dB increase level. 73, Bob N6WG ----- Original Message ----- From: "Brian Lloyd" <[hidden email]> To: "Elliott Lawrence" <[hidden email]> Cc: <[hidden email]> Sent: Thursday, May 10, 2007 11:58 AM Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Yaesu FT-2000 v K-3? > On May 10, 2007, at 10:06 AM, Elliott Lawrence wrote: > > > One thing that would help would be an additional option for a 200w > > capable radio ---- the K3D!!! I wonder if that is a future > > possiblity??!! > > Do you really think that 3dB will be enough of an advantage? That is > all you will get when you go from 100W to 200W. > > It seems to me that one needs at least 6dB to make enough difference > to make the effort worthwhile. 6dB seems to be the difference > between, "I know you are there but I can't quite copy you," and, > "QSL." If you started at 100W then you would need 400W to make that > difference. > > I tend to think that 10dB is about the right increment and that would > be 1000W. That leads me to feel that if you need more power than 100W > you are going to need an external amplifier. > > And then there is the issue of path symmetry. Path loss is going to > be the same in both directions. Given that most rigs out there are in > the 100W range the signal arriving at each end will be the same. Hmmm. > > Oh! The K3 is likely to have a much better receiver than the one the > other guy is using. So if he is using 100W and you have acceptable > copy on him you might need a 3dB-6dB improvement in your signal in > order to deliver an equivalent readability signal to the other end. > Interesting thought. Maybe a 200-300W PA wouldn't be such a bad idea > after all. > > 73 de Brian, WB6RQN > Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com > > > _______________________________________________ > Elecraft mailing list > Post to: [hidden email] > You must be a subscriber to post to the list. > Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): > http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm > Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
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In reply to this post by Bill VanAlstyne W5WVO
On May 10, 2007, at 4:54 PM, Bill W5WVO wrote: > Readability reciprocity is a very interesting question. Since I'm a > 6M operator, things might be a little different for me than on the > HF bands, but probably not all that much. Yeah, I was forgetting the difference in noise floor. Sorry. Never mind. :-) 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
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100 watts vs. 200 watts. 3 dB of gain. I think it does more for the
operators ego & confidence than it does for their signal. - Keith N1AS - - K2 5411.ssb.100 - _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
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Darwin, Keith wrote:
> 100 watts vs. 200 watts. 3 dB of gain. I think it does more for the > operators ego & confidence than it does for their signal. I believe that the 200 watt version of the FT-2000 has a class-A mode of operation for SSB, which provides 75 watts output with much better IMD specs. This requires a beefier final stage. Although I don't operate SSB, my friends that do say that the general run of transceivers are pretty poor in terms of IMD (this is *before* the less-competent operators use excessive processing, change the settings of internal power adjustments, or yell into the mic), and they think that this feature is definitely a good thing. -- 73, Vic, K2VCO Fresno CA http://www.qsl.net/k2vco _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
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In reply to this post by Darwin, Keith
Darwin, Keith wrote:
> 100 watts vs. 200 watts. 3 dB of gain. I think it does more for the > operators ego & confidence than it does for their signal. > perhaps this might be better understood if we look at it from the idea of we are running qrp 5w now for some reason you want/need to get that last piece of info to/from the other party so you kick in the 200w's for that short term need. lots of difference between 5w to 200w = 18+db as compared to 100w to 1000w = 9+db hope I did the math correctly ;-/ -- GB & 73's KA5OAI Sam Morgan _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
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Well, db = 10 * log(p2/p1)
5w to 200w is actually +16 dB 100w to 1000w is +10 dB But hey, it's the thought that counts :-) -----Original Message----- From: Sam Morgan lots of difference between 5w to 200w = 18+db as compared to 100w to 1000w = 9+db hope I did the math correctly ;-/ _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
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And more importantly, 5w to 100w is 13db. 13db is pretty close to 16db<g>
(Close, as in horseshoes and Atom Bombs). Dan -----Original Message----- From: [hidden email] [mailto:[hidden email]]On Behalf Of Darwin, Keith Sent: Friday, May 11, 2007 1:08 PM To: [hidden email] Subject: RE: [Elecraft] Yaesu FT-2000 v K-3? Well, db = 10 * log(p2/p1) 5w to 200w is actually +16 dB 100w to 1000w is +10 dB But hey, it's the thought that counts :-) -----Original Message----- From: Sam Morgan lots of difference between 5w to 200w = 18+db as compared to 100w to 1000w = 9+db hope I did the math correctly ;-/ _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
dB conversions (was: Yaesu FT-2000 v K-3?)
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In reply to this post by Sam Morgan
On May 11, 2007, at 9:57 AM, Sam Morgan wrote:
> lots of difference between > 5w to 200w = 18+db 16dB 5x2=10 (+3dB) 10x2=20 (+3dB) 20x10=200 (+10dB) > as compared to > 100w to 1000w = 9+db 10dB x2 = 3dB x2.5 = 4dB x4 = 6dB x5 = 7dB x8 = 9dB x10 = 10dB If you know that x2 = 3dB and x10 = 10dB you can do all of the above in your head in a second or two. I banged out x2, x4, and x8 (3dB, 6dB, and 9dB) just like that. Then I worked backwards from x10. x5 is X10/2 or 10dB-3dB=7dB. If you want something in between one of these values you can just "split the difference" (interpolate). With this you can usually estimate any multiplier within 1dB without having to resort to a calculator. 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
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