Elecraft

k-pod data cable

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NOEL POULIN

k-pod data cable

Hello,
Anybody in this group, using a different length data cable supplied with
the k-pod??The cable uses two 6P6C modular male connectors, and requires
5 conductors..
Elecraft supplies a 36" long cable??
I would need longer cable....but wondering if the Pod will be working
correctly???
Noel

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Jim Brown-10

Re: k-pod data cable

Another point. Ribbon cable is TERRIBLE for RFI susceptibility. Twisted
pair is FAR superior IF each signals is on a pair. CAT5/6 is four
tightly twisted pairs, 100 ohm impedance, each a different twist ratio
to minimize crosstalk. I don't know anything about how the K-Pod uses
that cable. For RFI, twisting is more important than shielding.

73, Jim K9YC

On Mon,1/16/2017 8:23 AM, Ron D'Eau Claire wrote:
> If you decide to try a
> longer ribbon cable first and are not interested in making your own, buy an
> RJ45 cable and F-F coupler to extend the Elecraft cable.

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Wes Stewart-2

Re: k-pod data cable

In reply to this post by NOEL POULIN

1) Let's get it straight that the connector is RJ12, not RJ45. I've already
posted on using an adapter to extend the Elecraft-supplied cable from the radio
to the K-Pod.

2) I have Macro 13 (tap F5) set to activate MSG 1 (SWT 21) As I've written
before, many times, tapping this button resulted in "MSG1" displayed on the
radio but no message was transmitted.

On 1/16/2017 9:23 AM, Ron D'Eau Claire wrote:

> Jeff makes an excellent point about long data cables. If you decide to try a
> longer ribbon cable first and are not interested in making your own, buy an
> RJ45 cable and F-F coupler to extend the Elecraft cable. Be sure to put the
> Elecraft cable closest to the K3, since it does not have pin 1 connected,
> and use the RJ45 cable for the rest of the run.
>
> Let me repeat my earlier comment: Macros 1 through 8 are accessed by HOLDING
> the KPOD switches for more than 1/2 second. Tapping (holding for less than
> 1/2 second) accesses K3 Macros 9 though 16. That might be what some of the
> people experiencing "unreliable" switch behavior are doing and not getting
> the reaction they expect from macros 1 through 8.
>
> 73, Ron AC7AC

Elecraft mailing list

Re: k-pod data cable

In reply to this post by Jim Brown-10

A little info for those wanting to make longer cables

As I understand it the Elecraft connector is a Modified MPLAB IDC 2 In-Circut Programming connector

Here are the pin outs as I read them
1 Unused - MCLR, Low to reset CPU
2 +5 vDC - VCC5
3 Ground - VSS
4 Data - PGD
5 Clock - PGC
6 +5 vDC - VCC5

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Bill Frantz

Re: k-pod data cable

In reply to this post by NOEL POULIN

Yesterday I built a 5 foot long cable using 6P6C connectors and
some telephone grade flat cable with pin 1 clipped at each end.
(I identified which pin was #1 by measuring the Elecraft
supplied cable.) It seems to work fine, but I haven't used it
enough for those little hidden problems to show up.

If I need to move to twisted pair to get better isolation
(thanks Jim), I will need to identify which wires to twist
together. From Harry's pin out below, it looks like twisting
pins 3&4 (Ground and Data) as well as pins 5&6 (Clock and VCC5)
should do the trick.

73 Bill AE6JV

On 1/16/17 at 6:51 AM, [hidden email] (NOEL POULIN) wrote:

>Anybody in this group, using a different length data cable
>supplied with the k-pod??The cable uses two 6P6C modular male
>connectors, and requires 5 conductors..
>Elecraft supplies a 36" long cable??
>I would need longer cable....but wondering if the Pod will be working correctly???

On 1/16/17 at 10:10 AM, [hidden email] (Harry Yingst
via Elecraft) wrote:

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CA 95032

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Cady, Fred-2

Re: k-pod data cable

In reply to this post by Wes Stewart-2

2) I have Macro 13 (tap F5) set to activate MSG 1 (SWT 21) As I've written
before, many times, tapping this button resulted in "MSG1" displayed on the
radio but no message was transmitted.

Remember there are two banks of memories. I'll bet the Macro label is MSG1 (which is displayed when the macro is executing) but you are in one of the banks that doesn't have the message programmed into it. To switch banks, hold the REC key. Unfortunately that is a toggle so you can't hold it in a macro and have to be in Bank 1 or Bank 2 deterministically.

Cheers,
Fred KE7X

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Jim Brown-10

Re: k-pod data cable

In reply to this post by Elecraft mailing list

If I were to make up an extension using CAT5/6, I would use one pair for
PGD, another for PGC, and the other two for VCC5, tying the four returns
of each pair together and wiring it to Ground. I'm taking it for granted
that MCLR is really unused.

73, Jim K9YC

On Mon,1/16/2017 10:10 AM, Harry Yingst via Elecraft wrote:

> A little info for those wanting to make longer cables
>
> As I understand it the Elecraft connector is a Modified MPLAB IDC 2 In-Circut Programming connector
>
> Here are the pin outs as I read them
> 1 Unused - MCLR, Low to reset CPU
> 2 +5 vDC - VCC5
> 3 Ground - VSS
> 4 Data - PGD
> 5 Clock - PGC
> 6 +5 vDC - VCC5
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
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Jean-François Ménard

Re: k-pod data cable

In reply to this post by NOEL POULIN

You read my mind Jim! :-) :-)

Best 73 de Jeff | VA2SS

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Jean-François Ménard

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Clay Autery

Re: k-pod data cable

In reply to this post by Jim Brown-10

That's the way to do it, Jim....

I spent some hours pouring over the docs and MCLR is NOT used in this
implementation.

73,

______________________
Clay Autery, KY5G
MONTAC Enterprises
(318) 518-1389

On 1/16/2017 5:01 PM, Jim Brown wrote:

> If I were to make up an extension using CAT5/6, I would use one pair
> for PGD, another for PGC, and the other two for VCC5, tying the four
> returns of each pair together and wiring it to Ground. I'm taking it
> for granted that MCLR is really unused.
>
> 73, Jim K9YC
>
> On Mon,1/16/2017 10:10 AM, Harry Yingst via Elecraft wrote:
>> A little info for those wanting to make longer cables
>>
>> As I understand it the Elecraft connector is a Modified MPLAB IDC 2
>> In-Circut Programming connector
>>
>> Here are the pin outs as I read them
>> 1 Unused - MCLR, Low to reset CPU
>> 2 +5 vDC - VCC5
>> 3 Ground - VSS
>> 4 Data - PGD
>> 5 Clock - PGC
>> 6 +5 vDC - VCC5
>>
>> ______________________________________________________________

Wes Stewart-2

Re: k-pod data cable

In reply to this post by Cady, Fred-2

Hi Fred (I have one of your books BTW)

Save your money. When I said. "As I've written before", what I had said earlier
was:

"I saw a similar problem. Only tapping a button appeared to send the command to
the K3 but the K3 failed to respond. For example, I had my K-Pod set up to use
a tap of F5 to invoke M1, where my call was stored. Tapping F5 would result in
"MSG 1" showing up in the VFO B space on the display but M1 was not activated.
(Tony G6GLP) has also reported this problem. Tapping M1 on the K3 works every
time."

Read the last sentence. Additionally, there are other messages in Bank 2 so
something should have been sent.

But this thread and others---IMHO of course---exposes a missed opportunity.
Instead of this Mickey Mouse way of writing a limited number of macros, that
have to be sent to the K3 and stored, only to be executed by a K-Pod over a
dubious interface, the macros should simply be saved in the K-Pod in the first
place and sent via USB and/or RS232.

Wes N7WS

On 1/16/2017 3:43 PM, Cady, Fred wrote:
> 2) I have Macro 13 (tap F5) set to activate MSG 1 (SWT 21) As I've written
> before, many times, tapping this button resulted in "MSG1" displayed on the
> radio but no message was transmitted.
>
> Remember there are two banks of memories. I'll bet the Macro label is MSG1 (which is displayed when the macro is executing) but you are in one of the banks that doesn't have the message programmed into it. To switch banks, hold the REC key. Unfortunately that is a toggle so you can't hold it in a macro and have to be in Bank 1 or Bank 2 deterministically.
>
> Cheers,
> Fred KE7X
>

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Elecraft mailing list

Re: k-pod data cable

In reply to this post by Clay Autery

I believe MCLR is used to put the PIC (microcontroller) into programming mode
I'm an Atmel guy so I'm not much up on PICs

From: Clay Autery <[hidden email]>
To: [hidden email]
Sent: Monday, January 16, 2017 7:10 PM
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] k-pod data cable

That's the way to do it, Jim....

I spent some hours pouring over the docs and MCLR is NOT used in this
implementation.

73,

______________________
Clay Autery, KY5G
MONTAC Enterprises
(318) 518-1389

On 1/16/2017 5:01 PM, Jim Brown wrote:

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Bill Frantz

Re: k-pod data cable

In reply to this post by Wes Stewart-2

It is likely that the interface used by the K-Pod is the I2C bus
<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/I%C2%B2C>, a very commonly used
bus in the chip world. I use it to connect the real-time clock
board to my BeagleBone Black board.

I2C is a 2 way, multi-master bus protocol that might be ideal
for tying the ever-growing collection of Elecraft devices.

We would really like to send commands from whatever device we're
using, whether it is the controls of the K3, a keyboard attached
to a P3, the panel of a KPA500, or the K-Pod. While USB could
support this kind of network, I2C is much simpler and cheaper.
RS232, as a point to point protocol, really shouldn't be considered.

73 Bill AE6JV

On 1/16/17 at 4:38 PM, [hidden email] (Wes Stewart) wrote:

>But this thread and others---IMHO of course---exposes a missed
>opportunity. Instead of this Mickey Mouse way of writing a
>limited number of macros, that have to be sent to the K3 and
>stored, only to be executed by a K-Pod over a dubious
>interface, the macros should simply be saved in the K-Pod in
>the first place and sent via USB and/or RS232.

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(408)356-8506 | fear is fear itself." - FDR | 16345
Englewood Ave
www.pwpconsult.com | Inaugural address, 3/4/1933 | Los Gatos,
CA 95032

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Wes Stewart-2

Re: k-pod data cable

Bill,

I dunno. I'm an RF guy and this uProcessor stuff makes my eyes glaze over.

That said, your own reference says in part: "short-distance, intra-board
communication." It seems to me that the problems seen are related to
interconnections between the K3 and the K-Pod. And it seems the longer, the worser.

As I understand it, and I could very well be totally wrong, a couple of
micro-controller pins are brought out to an unshielded connector without any
buffering or filtering. From that point the environment is anyone's guess. The
only reason that there isn't one of Jim Brown's Pin 1 problems, is pin 1 isn't
used :-)

Wes N7WS

On 1/16/2017 8:08 PM, Bill Frantz wrote:

> It is likely that the interface used by the K-Pod is the I2C bus
> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/I%C2%B2C>, a very commonly used bus in the chip
> world. I use it to connect the real-time clock board to my BeagleBone Black
> board.
>
> I2C is a 2 way, multi-master bus protocol that might be ideal for tying the
> ever-growing collection of Elecraft devices.
>
> We would really like to send commands from whatever device we're using,
> whether it is the controls of the K3, a keyboard attached to a P3, the panel
> of a KPA500, or the K-Pod. While USB could support this kind of network, I2C
> is much simpler and cheaper. RS232, as a point to point protocol, really
> shouldn't be considered.
>
> 73 Bill AE6JV

Bill Frantz

Re: k-pod data cable

I read "short distance..." after sending my stuff. I think you
are correct about the I2C electrical connection, but I still
think Elecraft needs a box to box communication protocol which
allows multi-masters. USB would do, but probably isn't the only
choice. Ethernet?

There is a question of just how much distance needs to be
supported. If you have your KPA500 at the base of your antenna,
that is quite a distance, on the other hand, you probably don't
need to control you K3 from there.

73 Bill AE6JV

On 1/16/17 at 8:23 PM, [hidden email] (Wes Stewart) wrote:

>Bill,
>
>I dunno. I'm an RF guy and this uProcessor stuff makes my eyes glaze over.
>
>That said, your own reference says in part: "short-distance,
>intra-board communication." It seems to me that the problems
>seen are related to interconnections between the K3 and the
>K-Pod. And it seems the longer, the worser.
>
>As I understand it, and I could very well be totally wrong, a
>couple of micro-controller pins are brought out to an
>unshielded connector without any buffering or filtering. From
>that point the environment is anyone's guess. The only reason
>that there isn't one of Jim Brown's Pin 1 problems, is pin 1
>isn't used :-)
>
>Wes N7WS
>
>
>On 1/16/2017 8:08 PM, Bill Frantz wrote:
>>It is likely that the interface used by the K-Pod is the I2C
>>bus <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/I%C2%B2C>, a very commonly
>>used bus in the chip world. I use it to connect the real-time
>>clock board to my BeagleBone Black board.
>>
>>I2C is a 2 way, multi-master bus protocol that might be ideal
>>for tying the ever-growing collection of Elecraft devices.
>>
>>We would really like to send commands from whatever device
>>we're using, whether it is the controls of the K3, a keyboard
>>attached to a P3, the panel of a KPA500, or the K-Pod. While
>>USB could support this kind of network, I2C is much simpler
>>and cheaper. RS232, as a point to point protocol, really
>>shouldn't be considered.
>>
>>73 Bill AE6JV

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www.pwpconsult.com | Can we make something even worse?

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Lyle Johnson

Re: k-pod data cable

The KPOD does not use I2C.

It comes with a very short cable for good reasons.

Increasing the length somewhat is probably OK. Increasing it a lot is
probably a very bad idea.

"Just because you can doesn't mean you should" comes to mind.

73,

Lyle KK7P

>>> It is likely that the interface used by the K-Pod is the I2C bus

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Wes Stewart-2

Fwd: Re: k-pod data cable

In reply to this post by Wes Stewart-2

Further to this. At the time I wrote the previous message my K3S/100F was back
at the factory again. On a previous visit Elecraft had installed the resistor
need to power the K-Pod through the RJ12 connection. So I was using my old K3
without the mod and powering the K-Pod from an external power supply. Couple
that with the extension cable and I was reluctant to insist that the K-pod was
really the culprit in the "dropped message" problem.

But since the radio has returned, I've used the K-Pod with the factory-supplied
cable and I still get instances of a button tap activating a message, as
displayed on the radio, but no message is actually sent. BTW, this is with the
TX disabled, so I don't want to hear the all too frequent, "You have RF in the
shack and need a common-mode choke" answer.

Unfortunately, I have to keep this paperweight connected to the radio since when
my fiancee asked what I wanted for Christmas, I said, "a K-Pod" and she bought
it for me.

If Elecraft wants me to change my opinion on this they will make it possible to
store the macros IN THE K-POD and play them out instead of the convoluted way
it's done now. IMHO of course.

Wes N7WS

-------- Forwarded Message --------
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] k-pod data cable
Date: Mon, 16 Jan 2017 11:02:53 -0700
From: Wes Stewart <[hidden email]>
To: [hidden email]

1) Let's get it straight that the connector is RJ12, not RJ45. I've already
posted on using an adapter to extend the Elecraft-supplied cable from the radio
to the K-Pod.

2) I have Macro 13 (tap F5) set to activate MSG 1 (SWT 21) As I've written
before, many times, tapping this button resulted in "MSG1" displayed on the
radio but no message was transmitted.

On 1/16/2017 9:23 AM, Ron D'Eau Claire wrote: