longwire & the auto tuner

[Orrin Winton]

Just some notes for people who might want to hear my experiences with the
T1-A Elecraft tuner i just got.

I first tried it with an approx. 100-ft longwire, no radials.  The
tuner would take
the swr down all the way to 1.0 on 20m, 40m, but on 75m and 80m i would be
left with "three bars" of swr on my FT-817, 2.5 on the T1.

I then laid out a 66-ft radial.  No improvement on 75m and 80m. In fact, no
apparent change at all.

So i added about 50 ft to the longwire, making it about 150 ft long
(40 ft up in the
trees).  The swr problem got worse. Minimum swr was above 3.0 now, totally
unusable.  The ground radial did nothing to help.

So i added ANOTHER 50 ft to the longwire, making it about 200 ft long.  Now
everything is fine on 20, 40, 80, and 160.  However, the ground radial seems to
do nothing to make things better or worse, at least as viewed at my radio.

Now i have to find a longwire length of "less than 100 ft" that will
tune up well on
those bands (20, 40, 75, 80) for going portable.

Orrin wn1z
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[Michael Babineau]

[hidden email] wrote :

 > Now i have to find a longwire length of "less than 100 ft" that will
 > tune up well on
 > those bands (20, 40, 75, 80) for going portable.

Orrin :

Try about 87 feet (26.5 meters) of wire. This is a good length to cover
most
of the HF bands  as it is not near a multiple of a 1/2 wave on any of
the bands
(except 10m) so it will present a reasonable impedance that the tuner
can match.

Michael VE3WMB

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[Rolf Moberg, OH6KXL]

Michael Babineau wrote:
> Try about 87 feet (26.5 meters) of wire. This is a good length to cover
> most of the HF bands  as it is not near a multiple of a 1/2 wave on any of
> the bands

I installed 26.5 meters end fed wire today. 13 radials are buried about
2 to 5 centimeters below the ground. Their lengts are between 10 and 30
meters. Feed end of the antenna is about 3 meters from ground. The other
end is about 8 meters. First impressions with newly built K2 with SGC
231 coupler.

80m: performance OK for local work
40m: Europeans heard. OK
30m: Europeans. OK.
20m: band dead or antenna performance very poor due to low height
17m: Europeans. OK. band not open
15m: K2 is giving _only_ 4 or 5 watts output!
12m: K2 is giving _only_ 4 or 5 watts output AND when pressing TUNE K2
      will switch immediately to receive mode.

K2 gives 10W or more in 15m and 12m when driving to dummy load. Is this
phenomenon in 12m normal? (switching to receive mode)

20m is SO quiet that S meter is almost constantly showing nothing.

By the way, do you have dealers in USA who are selling baluns for dipole
antennas which are supplied with N connectors? I cannot find them from
Finland. If you know, please let me know the dealer, privately.

Rolf Moberg
oh6kxl
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I have a 160 meter inverted-L which I have used as a longwire (which it really is) and have had very good luck with 130 feet of wire....and 17 radials.  The KAT100 will match it very well on 160, 80, 40 and 30 meters.  I have worked several stations using the antenna on those bands, but have not used anything higher than 30 meters since I have a tri-bander up at 65 feet.
 
A longwire is a good antenna if there is a good counterpoise (ground or radials or a large body of salt water).  I have played around with them using a simple 365 pf BC cap and a coil of wire and I can load one every time.
 
Lee - K0WA
 


Common sense is in short supply - get some and use it.
If you can't find any common sense, ask for help from
somebody that has some common sense. - Lee Buller
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[zeke7237]

On 6/28/05, Lee Buller <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> A longwire is a good antenna if there is a good counterpoise (ground or radials or a large >body of salt water).  I have played around with them using a simple 365 pf BC cap and a >coil of wire and I can load one every time.
>

I'm staying at a house on the beach in Westbrook, CT for the week .. I
got a 16.5 foot crappie pole from Cabela's, a surf rod holder from
Benny's, tied an 87 foot piece of wire to the eyelet and at low tide
set the pole in the rod holder into the sand. It's been there for 6
cycles of the tides now and it looks like it's holding steady :) The
wire runs over a minimum of 20 feet of ocean, and maybe 55 feet at
high tide.

I have it connected to the red post on my ZM2, and a 17 foot
counterpoise hangs out of the window and is sort of run along the side
of the house (away from the water) attaches to the black post (link to
ground). It tunes fine on 80/40/30/20 with the ATS .. with the KX1 I
tune it by hand and then kick in the ATU so I don't have to manually
retune on 30/40. Guess I really should go over to the radioshaft and
see if they have a banana-to-bnc adapter to see how the KX1 handles it
alone ...

de John/W1RT
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[Rolf Moberg, OH6KXL]

After installing end fed "long wire" 26.5m antenna few meters higher
situation become even worse in 15m and 12m.

15m: K2 is giving _only_ 2 or 3 watts output!
12m: when pressing TUNE, K2 will switch immediately to receive mode.

Is this a symptom of a) a big impedance or b) "RF in the shack"-problem.
Does the K2 has some kind of protection. I suspect SG231 autotuner
cannot tune the antenna in those bands and SWR in the feedline between
the K2 and auto tuner is big. Could this cause K2 to switch to receive?
K2 will give normal output to dummy load.

Second topic, do you have dealers in USA who are selling baluns for
dipole antennas which are supplied with N connectors? I cannot find them
from
Finland. If you know, please let me know the dealer, privately.

Rolf Moberg
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[Tom McCulloch]

Rolf,

  Are you using a counterpoise with that end fed?  If you aren't try one.  If you already are try raising it off the ground a bit.

Tom
WB2QDG
K2 1103

 -------------- Original message ----------------------
From: "Rolf Moberg, OH6KXL" <[hidden email]>

> After installing end fed "long wire" 26.5m antenna few meters higher
> situation become even worse in 15m and 12m.
>
> 15m: K2 is giving _only_ 2 or 3 watts output!
> 12m: when pressing TUNE, K2 will switch immediately to receive mode.
>
> Is this a symptom of a) a big impedance or b) "RF in the shack"-problem.
> Does the K2 has some kind of protection. I suspect SG231 autotuner
> cannot tune the antenna in those bands and SWR in the feedline between
> the K2 and auto tuner is big. Could this cause K2 to switch to receive?
> K2 will give normal output to dummy load.
>
> Second topic, do you have dealers in USA who are selling baluns for
> dipole antennas which are supplied with N connectors? I cannot find them
> from
> Finland. If you know, please let me know the dealer, privately.
>
> Rolf Moberg
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[Rolf Moberg, OH6KXL]

[hidden email] wrote:

>   Are you using a counterpoise with that end fed?  If you aren't try one.  If you already are try raising it off the ground a bit.

Yes! I have 13 pieces of "counterpoise". Their lengths vary between
8meters and 30 meters. They are buried below the grass to allow
lawnmover and children to play.

Basic question is:
"Does the K2 switch to receive, when SWR is too much in coax line?"

Rolf
oh6kxl
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