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Jim Brown-10

Re: mic

On Sun,6/11/2017 11:45 AM, kevino z wrote:
> I don't think you meant to, but your post came off as if we bought some snake oil.

Heil IS snake oil. As audio professionals say about Bose, "better sound
through marketing."

The Yamaha CM500 and Koss SB45 are at least as good, and cost a LOT less.

73, Jim K9YC

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Joe Subich, W4TV-4

Re: mic

In reply to this post by kevino z

On 6/11/2017 2:45 PM, kevino z wrote:
> Although headsets like my Heil Pro 7 may be more money, am I really
> "wasting" money on buying a "fancy brand name" considering the
> unit consists of mic and incredible speakers?

Yes, at about $250 retail (plus adapter cable), the Pro 7 is more than
five times as expensive as the Yamaha CM-500 (electret mic), Koss SB40
(dynamic mic) or SB45 (electret mic) headsets. Both the Yamaha and
Koss headsets have outstanding 120 Ohm headset drivers with sensitivity
rated at 96dB/mW and microphones well tailored for voice work. Heil
does not even publish the impedance or sensitivity for their headset
drivers!

For the price of a Heil Pro 7 one could get a Broadcast headset like
the Audio Technica BPHS1 ($199), Sennheiser HMD280 ($249) or Shure
BRH440M ($249) - all of which are significantly higher quality than
the Pro7 (and field proven).

73,

... Joe, W4TV

On 6/11/2017 2:45 PM, kevino z wrote:

> Although headsets like my Heil Pro 7 may be more money, am I really "wasting" money on buying a "fancy brand name" considering the unit consists of mic and incredible speakers? It is a complete package. Besides the amazing electret mic, the sound from the headphones helps me to enjoy the hobby more and allows me to pick out signals I would not be able to without them. I don't think you meant to, but your post came off as if we bought some snake oil.
>
> -Kevin (KK4YEL)
>
> No trees were killed in the sending of this message. However, a large number of electrons were terribly inconvenienced !
>
>> On Jun 11, 2017, at 10:41, Joe Subich, W4TV <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>>
>> Bob and Jim have excellent points.
>>
>> There is one advantage for the electret mic compared to a dynamic
>> mic. Electrets are generally 26 dB "hotter" than a dynamic mic
>> and thus are much more resistant to common mode RF feedback and
>> magnetic coupling. However, that assumes the transceiver is
>> designed for the higher input level and properly reduces gain
>> before the mic gain control.
>>
>> Mics of any kind - dynamic or condenser/electret - with wide frequency
>> response are completely wasted for amateur radio (or any communications
>> application). You really want a clean 200 Hz - 4 Hz response. Lower
>> frequencies cause distortion and waste power, higher frequencies are
>> simply lost in the "channel noise".
>>
>> Like Bob and Jim, I spent my professional life in the recording and
>> broadcast industries. Amateurs waste far too much on over spec'd
>> microphones and fancy "brand name" advertising campaigns.
>>
>> 73,
>>
>> ... Joe, W4TV
>

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Bill-3

Re: mic

After having tinkered with many different kinds of mics on the K3 - I
feel very confident in saying that a K3 can make ANY mic sound great. It
is all about learning to use the menu settings and not about how much
you spend for the microphone.

This is not to say that some microphones are not physically better
built, or may look better to the beholder. It is only about how they can
be made to sound.

Bill W2BLC K3-Line

--
Many of life's problems can be solved by simply deciding what
we can do without. - John Dolan

--
Many of life's problems can be solved by simply deciding what
we can do without. - John Dolan

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k6dgw

Re: mic

In reply to this post by Joe Subich, W4TV-4

Just curious ... I inherited a David Clark noise cancelling aviation
headset/mic from a neighbor who was a US Forest Service pilot. I've
never tried it, the connector is strange. I'm not even sure I know
where it is right now. Will it work with my K3 if I can find it and get
the connector compatible? I know they're expensive.

Maybe it will cancel the powerline noise on 80? [:-))

73,

Fred ["Skip"] K6DGW
Sparks NV DM09dn
Washoe County

On 6/11/17 12:55 PM, Joe Subich, W4TV wrote:

>
> On 6/11/2017 2:45 PM, kevino z wrote:
>> Although headsets like my Heil Pro 7 may be more money, am I really
>> "wasting" money on buying a "fancy brand name" considering the
>> unit consists of mic and incredible speakers?
>
> Yes, at about $250 retail (plus adapter cable), the Pro 7 is more than
> five times as expensive as the Yamaha CM-500 (electret mic), Koss SB40
> (dynamic mic) or SB45 (electret mic) headsets. Both the Yamaha and
> Koss headsets have outstanding 120 Ohm headset drivers with sensitivity
> rated at 96dB/mW and microphones well tailored for voice work. Heil
> does not even publish the impedance or sensitivity for their headset
> drivers!
>
> For the price of a Heil Pro 7 one could get a Broadcast headset like
> the Audio Technica BPHS1 ($199), Sennheiser HMD280 ($249) or Shure
> BRH440M ($249) - all of which are significantly higher quality than
> the Pro7 (and field proven).
>
> 73,
>
> ... Joe, W4TV

Matt Zilmer-3

Re: mic

It might work, Fred. Check this page:
http://www.acousticom.com/2015/aviation-headset-information-specs/

I always thought that aviation headsets met some earlier mic standard
(carbon?), but this page says that's not right. Note that the actual
headset speakers/transducrers have a rather high impedance, though I
suspect they may work with a K3S anyway.

Someone else can chime on a load of 300 ohms using the K3S's headphone
driver circuit. My DCs are way too buried to find and check this right now.

73,

matt W6NIA

On 6/11/2017 1:29 PM, Fred Jensen wrote:

> Just curious ... I inherited a David Clark noise cancelling aviation
> headset/mic from a neighbor who was a US Forest Service pilot. I've
> never tried it, the connector is strange. I'm not even sure I know
> where it is right now. Will it work with my K3 if I can find it and
> get the connector compatible? I know they're expensive.
>
> Maybe it will cancel the powerline noise on 80? [:-))
>
> 73,
>
> Fred ["Skip"] K6DGW
> Sparks NV DM09dn
> Washoe County
>
> On 6/11/17 12:55 PM, Joe Subich, W4TV wrote:
>>
>> On 6/11/2017 2:45 PM, kevino z wrote:
>>> Although headsets like my Heil Pro 7 may be more money, am I really
>>> "wasting" money on buying a "fancy brand name" considering the
>>> unit consists of mic and incredible speakers?
>>
>> Yes, at about $250 retail (plus adapter cable), the Pro 7 is more than
>> five times as expensive as the Yamaha CM-500 (electret mic), Koss SB40
>> (dynamic mic) or SB45 (electret mic) headsets. Both the Yamaha and
>> Koss headsets have outstanding 120 Ohm headset drivers with sensitivity
>> rated at 96dB/mW and microphones well tailored for voice work. Heil
>> does not even publish the impedance or sensitivity for their headset
>> drivers!
>>
>> For the price of a Heil Pro 7 one could get a Broadcast headset like
>> the Audio Technica BPHS1 ($199), Sennheiser HMD280 ($249) or Shure
>> BRH440M ($249) - all of which are significantly higher quality than
>> the Pro7 (and field proven).
>>
>> 73,
>>
>> ... Joe, W4TV
>
> ______________________________________________________________
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--
"A delay is better than a disaster."
-- unknown

Matt Zilmer, W6NIA
[Shiraz]

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Clay Autery

Re: mic

In reply to this post by k6dgw

If you can get the pinout, I don't see why it could not be made to
work... Just put the right connector on it... I'd put a Y and two
connectors on it so I could plug it in the back... I dig the clean
front face look.

My guess is that the connector was a proprietary one matching the
connector in his aircraft. I've seen some odd ones. :-)

______________________
Clay Autery, KY5G

On 6/11/2017 3:29 PM, Fred Jensen wrote:

Jim Brown-10

Re: mic

In reply to this post by k6dgw

True "noise cancelling" mics sound awful. They work on the principle of
cancelling noise more than an inch or two from the mouth. SUPER noisy
places like aircraft are the ONLY place to use them.

Most hams who have too much background noise either don't work the mic
close enough (it should be an inch or two above and alongside the
mouth), or have processing and/or mic gain turned up way too high.

73, Jim K9YC

On Sun,6/11/2017 1:29 PM, Fred Jensen wrote:

Jim Brown-10

Re: mic

In reply to this post by Clay Autery

On Sun,6/11/2017 1:39 PM, Clay Autery wrote:
> If you can get the pinout, I don't see why it could not be made to
> work

It can be made to connect, no problem. But if it's a true
noise-cancelling mic, it will sound awful. :)

That's very different from a DIRECTIONAL mic, which has the approximate
pattern of a 2-el Yagi. So it receives 3-6 dB less noise, but it also
boosts the bass, which is a bad thing for audio "punch."

The boom headset mics we've been discussing are omni-directional mics
(all-directional). And no bass boost.

73, Jim K9YC

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Jack Spitznagel

Re: mic

In reply to this post by k6dgw

Fred,

I have a widget that adapts a Sennheiser S1 av-noise canceler to my KX3. Use it for hi noise situations and it works like charm, even Massey-Ferguson mobile.🙂
Try it with the David Clarks.
Was connector a mismatched size pair of phone jacks or a complex military looking connector?

Jack -KD4IZ

Sent from my iPhone

> On Jun 11, 2017, at 15:29, Fred Jensen <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> Just curious ... I inherited a David Clark noise cancelling aviation headset/mic from a neighbor who was a US Forest Service pilot. I've never tried it, the connector is strange. I'm not even sure I know where it is right now. Will it work with my K3 if I can find it and get the connector compatible? I know they're expensive.
>
> Maybe it will cancel the powerline noise on 80? [:-))
>
> 73,
>
> Fred ["Skip"] K6DGW
> Sparks NV DM09dn
> Washoe County
>
>> On 6/11/17 12:55 PM, Joe Subich, W4TV wrote:
>>
>>> On 6/11/2017 2:45 PM, kevino z wrote:
>>> Although headsets like my Heil Pro 7 may be more money, am I really
>>> "wasting" money on buying a "fancy brand name" considering the
>>> unit consists of mic and incredible speakers?
>>
>> Yes, at about $250 retail (plus adapter cable), the Pro 7 is more than
>> five times as expensive as the Yamaha CM-500 (electret mic), Koss SB40
>> (dynamic mic) or SB45 (electret mic) headsets. Both the Yamaha and
>> Koss headsets have outstanding 120 Ohm headset drivers with sensitivity
>> rated at 96dB/mW and microphones well tailored for voice work. Heil
>> does not even publish the impedance or sensitivity for their headset
>> drivers!
>>
>> For the price of a Heil Pro 7 one could get a Broadcast headset like
>> the Audio Technica BPHS1 ($199), Sennheiser HMD280 ($249) or Shure
>> BRH440M ($249) - all of which are significantly higher quality than
>> the Pro7 (and field proven).
>>
>> 73,
>>
>> ... Joe, W4TV
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
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> Message delivered to [hidden email]

Clay Autery

Re: mic

In reply to this post by Jim Brown-10

I was simply answering the question that the man asked, Jim. <smile>
Don't reckon I even alluded to it "working well".

______________________
Clay Autery, KY5G

On 6/11/2017 3:48 PM, Jim Brown wrote:

> On Sun,6/11/2017 1:39 PM, Clay Autery wrote:
>> If you can get the pinout, I don't see why it could not be made to
>> work
>
> It can be made to connect, no problem. But if it's a true
> noise-cancelling mic, it will sound awful. :)
>
> That's very different from a DIRECTIONAL mic, which has the
> approximate pattern of a 2-el Yagi. So it receives 3-6 dB less noise,
> but it also boosts the bass, which is a bad thing for audio "punch."
>
> The boom headset mics we've been discussing are omni-directional mics
> (all-directional). And no bass boost.
>
> 73, Jim K9YC

k6dgw

Re: mic - David Clark

In reply to this post by Jack Spitznagel

Hmmm ... I've had it for several years and it saw some use before I got
it but I doubt it's old enough to be a carbon mic like the WW2 T-17.

I just assumed the "noise cancelling" part applied to the headphones. I
didn't know it might apply to the mic. There's no external noise in my
shack to cancel anyway.

The connector is round and the contacts stick out of the face. I think
there are 6, maybe Headphones, Mic, and PTT? There's a push-switch in
the cable. It looks like the connector fits over the panel connector
and you twist is to lock it ... like a BNC. I don't think the
headphones are stereo which is a big negative with my K3.

I was just curious. This sounds like a project for some time when I
have exactly nothing else to do. [:-) Thanks for the info

73,

Fred ["Skip"] K6DGW
Sparks NV DM09dn
Washoe County

On 6/11/17 1:51 PM, Jack Spitznagel wrote:
> Fred,
>
> I have a widget that adapts a Sennheiser S1 av-noise canceler to my KX3. Use it for hi noise situations and it works like charm, even Massey-Ferguson mobile.🙂
> Try it with the David Clarks.
> Was connector a mismatched size pair of phone jacks or a complex military looking connector?
>
> Jack -KD4IZ
>
>

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Art Peters

Re: mic

In reply to this post by Jim Brown-10

Jim,

I know better than to disagree with someone who knows what he is talking about, to be open, I've read, studied and benefited from your work.

The point that I'll say is that the Yamaha headset, which I did buy largely from your raving reviews, did a fine job, but were never as comfortable as my other headsets. I do use them as a spare and for guest ops. In fact, if I wear them for more than a couple hours, I get a rather nasty headache...

So, I'd like to add to this conversation. While we have great ability to leverage a wide variety of mics, for me at least, fit and comfort are equal.

73 es God Bless,

Art / K0ACP

Sent from my iPhone

> On Jun 11, 2017, at 3:06 PM, Jim Brown <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> On Sun,6/11/2017 11:45 AM, kevino z wrote:
>> I don't think you meant to, but your post came off as if we bought some snake oil.
>
> Heil IS snake oil. As audio professionals say about Bose, "better sound through marketing."
>
> The Yamaha CM500 and Koss SB45 are at least as good, and cost a LOT less.
>
> 73, Jim K9YC
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
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>
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Bill Frantz

Re: mic

In reply to this post by Elecraft mailing list

As Jim says, "For most cases...", But.

When I help provide communication for the Los Gatos Children's
Holliday Parade, it is not "most cases". When operating next to
the parade route, there is frequently a high school marching
band going full blast just 20 feet away. The problem isn't in
the RF link, which is 2M FM. It's in the AF link with QRM for
both transmit and receive. The David Clark headset might be just
the right thing for this kind of environment.

When foot mobile along the parade route, I use Sennenheiser
noise canceling headphones plugged into a Yaesu MH-34 speaker
mike which seems to be "good enough". The CM-500 headset works
well for the net control station, which is a bit further away
from the parade route.

73 Bill AE6JV

On 6/11/17 at 1:44 PM, [hidden email] (Jim Brown) wrote:

>True "noise cancelling" mics sound awful. They work on the
>principle of cancelling noise more than an inch or two from the
>mouth. SUPER noisy places like aircraft are the ONLY place to
>use them.
>
>Most hams who have too much background noise either don't work
>the mic close enough (it should be an inch or two above and
>alongside the mouth), or have processing and/or mic gain turned
>up way too high.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Bill Frantz |"Web security is like medicine - trying to
do good for
408-356-8506 |an evolved body of kludges" - Mark Miller
www.pwpconsult.com |

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Grant Youngman-2

Re: mic

In reply to this post by Art Peters

In one way or another I agree with all sides of this discussion.

As to audio quality on a typical ham SSB transceiver, whether you have a Neumann M150 Tube or a 3+ orders of magnitude less costly $5 RatShack (when there was a RatShack) condenser cartridge, it’s unlikely the guy on the other end will notice the difference, since his bandwidth is probably set to 2.x KHz and the band is not pristinely quiet. You may feel better, you might sound absolutely fabulous on your audio chain or local transmit monitor, but the other guy isn’t going to care or notice.

Building something that you like? Modifying something to work better for you? Whether it’s a mic or anything else .. that’s a good thing. It’s instructive, personally satisfying, and can keep you busy and out of “low”places, which is something my wife highly encourages :-)

At any mic price point, no matter how fancy the external audio chain, I just wish there was a way to cure the age old issue (renewed emphasis on the Wouff-Hong perhaps?) of mic gain set too high on a rig overdriving an amp. And in the midst of that, ops insisting on “eating” the microphone while speaking after having finely adjusted their TX EQ while NOT trying to swallow the mic. In so many ways, knowing how to USE a mic, is more important than how big the diaphragm is …

At one time, I had a very large collection of microphones — cheap, expensive, condenser, dynamic, Elvis, not Elvis, new, vintage. Used them all here and there. I’m down to 3 or so. An RE-20 that I’ve had forever and was used for all of my now disassembled “studio n” AM/SSB stations through a Rane splitter, a D-104 because …. D-104 … and some day I might buy another Ranger, and the MH2/3 depending on which radio I’m using. Oh, and a CM500 headset which I like, but which I rarely use because earbuds and the MH(x) hand mics are just less bulk to deal with on an outing to the beach.

> On Jun 11, 2017, at 7:16 PM, Art Peters <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> Jim,
>
> I know better than to disagree with someone who knows what he is talking about, to be open, I've read, studied and benefited from your work.
>

Grant NQ5T
K3 #2091, KX3 #8342

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bdenley

Re: mic

In reply to this post by Joe Subich, W4TV-4

I agree on the Koss. It cost me less than $40 and audio reports are all good. BTW, I also like my old Astatic 10DA on SSB.

Brian
KB1VBF
Sent from my iPad

> On Jun 11, 2017, at 3:55 PM, Joe Subich, W4TV <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>
>> On 6/11/2017 2:45 PM, kevino z wrote:
>> Although headsets like my Heil Pro 7 may be more money, am I really
>> "wasting" money on buying a "fancy brand name" considering the
>> unit consists of mic and incredible speakers?
>
> Yes, at about $250 retail (plus adapter cable), the Pro 7 is more than
> five times as expensive as the Yamaha CM-500 (electret mic), Koss SB40
> (dynamic mic) or SB45 (electret mic) headsets. Both the Yamaha and
> Koss headsets have outstanding 120 Ohm headset drivers with sensitivity
> rated at 96dB/mW and microphones well tailored for voice work. Heil
> does not even publish the impedance or sensitivity for their headset
> drivers!
>
> For the price of a Heil Pro 7 one could get a Broadcast headset like
> the Audio Technica BPHS1 ($199), Sennheiser HMD280 ($249) or Shure
> BRH440M ($249) - all of which are significantly higher quality than
> the Pro7 (and field proven).
>
> 73,
>
> ... Joe, W4TV
>
>
>> On 6/11/2017 2:45 PM, kevino z wrote:
>> Although headsets like my Heil Pro 7 may be more money, am I really "wasting" money on buying a "fancy brand name" considering the unit consists of mic and incredible speakers? It is a complete package. Besides the amazing electret mic, the sound from the headphones helps me to enjoy the hobby more and allows me to pick out signals I would not be able to without them. I don't think you meant to, but your post came off as if we bought some snake oil.
>> -Kevin (KK4YEL)
>> No trees were killed in the sending of this message. However, a large number of electrons were terribly inconvenienced !
>>> On Jun 11, 2017, at 10:41, Joe Subich, W4TV <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> Bob and Jim have excellent points.
>>>
>>> There is one advantage for the electret mic compared to a dynamic
>>> mic. Electrets are generally 26 dB "hotter" than a dynamic mic
>>> and thus are much more resistant to common mode RF feedback and
>>> magnetic coupling. However, that assumes the transceiver is

John Severyn

Re: mic - David Clark

In reply to this post by k6dgw

Hi Fred,
Aviation headsets come with a variety of mikes, some dynamic, but most
today are electret. "Noise Cancelling" in aviation lingo usually means
some sort of seal over or in the ear. "Electronic Noise Cancelling"
means the earpieces have active noise cancelling circuitry in addition
to the ear-seal. (the seal can be over the ear or in the ear, like a
hearing aid, but most David Clark models are "over the ear"). The
microphone is also most probably of a noise cancelling design.

The David Clark line is considered to be fairly high quality and has
been around for a long time, since 1941. They make a wide variety of
gear, from G-suits, high altitude pressure suits, helmets, headsets etc.

http://www.davidclarkcompany.com/aviation/fixed-wing-passive.php

Various connectors are available, from LEMO to larger phone jacks and
some specialized models.

The above link is for their present line of fixed wing headsets. I have
several pairs of older H10-40 units, no longer made. The mike is a
electret with very good noise cancelling and made to perform in a very
high noise environment, with passive noise reduction, over the ear
seals. Fidelity is not the goal. Voice communication in a very high
noise environment of a piston engine propellor aircraft is the goal.

Other models are made for helicopter use (different connector became
standard in helicopters).

No connection to David Clark. Just a satisfied customer.

73
John AF6QO

On 6/11/2017 2:44 PM, Fred Jensen wrote:

> Hmmm ... I've had it for several years and it saw some use before I got
> it but I doubt it's old enough to be a carbon mic like the WW2 T-17.
>
> I just assumed the "noise cancelling" part applied to the headphones. I
> didn't know it might apply to the mic. There's no external noise in my
> shack to cancel anyway.
>
> The connector is round and the contacts stick out of the face. I think
> there are 6, maybe Headphones, Mic, and PTT? There's a push-switch in
> the cable. It looks like the connector fits over the panel connector
> and you twist is to lock it ... like a BNC. I don't think the
> headphones are stereo which is a big negative with my K3.
>
> I was just curious. This sounds like a project for some time when I
> have exactly nothing else to do. [:-) Thanks for the info
>
> 73,
>
> Fred ["Skip"] K6DGW
> Sparks NV DM09dn
> Washoe County
>
> On 6/11/17 1:51 PM, Jack Spitznagel wrote:
>> Fred,
>>
>> I have a widget that adapts a Sennheiser S1 av-noise canceler to my
>> KX3. Use it for hi noise situations and it works like charm, even
>> Massey-Ferguson mobile.🙂
>> Try it with the David Clarks.
>> Was connector a mismatched size pair of phone jacks or a complex
>> military looking connector?
>>
>> Jack -KD4IZ
>>
>>
>
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Dwight Anderson

Re: mic

In reply to this post by k6dgw

Hello Fred;

I did not find much information on the web about using aviation headsets on
ham radios. However if you search for using these headsets with gamming
computers, there is a lot more information.

Eventually I found the following information.

I was surprised how much I like the noise cancellation and the quality of
the sound. I have a window fan running in my shack in the summer.

I found the following adapter that worked for my KX3 and a Bose Aviation
headset. At least for my headset the noise cancelation is only the
earphones not the microphone.

http://www.sportys.com/pilotshop/general-aviation-twin-plugs-to-pc-headset-a
dapter.html?___SID=U

http://www.pilotshop.com/catalog/pspages/pilotUSA40.php

or here

I did find a schematic on the web but never tried to build it.

https://www.flightsim.com/vbfs/content.php?1985-How-ToAdapt-Aviation-Headset
s-To-Computers

Much Regards
Dwight
WM5F

snip **************************
Just curious ... I inherited a David Clark noise cancelling aviation
headset/mic from a neighbor who was a US Forest Service pilot. I've never
tried it, the connector is strange.

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w8fn

Re: mic - David Clark

In reply to this post by John Severyn

This thread has drifted into a discussion of headsets, so I'll throw in
my 2 cents worth and QRT. I realize they're pricey, but I use and love
the Radiosport headsets. I have both a RS-60CF headset with the electret
mic element and a RS-20 receive-only headset. When properly adjusted
both are extremely comfortable -- they're the only phones I've ever used
that I can wear for a full contest weekend over my glasses with no
problem whatsoever. They're NOT hi-fi phones; my understanding is that
they were originally designed for auto racing pit communications, and
the transducers are tailored for voice communication. They also have
superb isolation from outside noise, somewhere around 28 dB. I can't
hear the phone on my radio desk ring when I have them on. I also have a
Yamaha CM-500 set, and the Radiosports blow them away, as well they
should at almost 5X the price. For me, the substantial price difference
is worth every cent. YMMV.

73...
Randy, W8FN

On 6/11/2017 8:32 PM, John Severyn wrote:

> Hi Fred,
> Aviation headsets come with a variety of mikes, some dynamic, but most
> today are electret. "Noise Cancelling" in aviation lingo usually means
> some sort of seal over or in the ear. "Electronic Noise Cancelling"
> means the earpieces have active noise cancelling circuitry in addition
> to the ear-seal. (the seal can be over the ear or in the ear, like a
> hearing aid, but most David Clark models are "over the ear"). The
> microphone is also most probably of a noise cancelling design.
>
> The David Clark line is considered to be fairly high quality and has
> been around for a long time, since 1941. They make a wide variety of
> gear, from G-suits, high altitude pressure suits, helmets, headsets etc.
>
> http://www.davidclarkcompany.com/aviation/fixed-wing-passive.php
>
> Various connectors are available, from LEMO to larger phone jacks and
> some specialized models.
>
> The above link is for their present line of fixed wing headsets. I have
> several pairs of older H10-40 units, no longer made. The mike is a
> electret with very good noise cancelling and made to perform in a very
> high noise environment, with passive noise reduction, over the ear
> seals. Fidelity is not the goal. Voice communication in a very high
> noise environment of a piston engine propellor aircraft is the goal.
>
> Other models are made for helicopter use (different connector became
> standard in helicopters).
>
> No connection to David Clark. Just a satisfied customer.
>
> 73
> John AF6QO
>
> On 6/11/2017 2:44 PM, Fred Jensen wrote:
>> Hmmm ... I've had it for several years and it saw some use before I got
>> it but I doubt it's old enough to be a carbon mic like the WW2 T-17.
>>
>> I just assumed the "noise cancelling" part applied to the headphones. I
>> didn't know it might apply to the mic. There's no external noise in my
>> shack to cancel anyway.
>>
>> The connector is round and the contacts stick out of the face. I think
>> there are 6, maybe Headphones, Mic, and PTT? There's a push-switch in
>> the cable. It looks like the connector fits over the panel connector
>> and you twist is to lock it ... like a BNC. I don't think the
>> headphones are stereo which is a big negative with my K3.
>>
>> I was just curious. This sounds like a project for some time when I
>> have exactly nothing else to do. [:-) Thanks for the info
>>
>> 73,
>>
>> Fred ["Skip"] K6DGW
>> Sparks NV DM09dn
>> Washoe County
>>
>> On 6/11/17 1:51 PM, Jack Spitznagel wrote:
>>> Fred,
>>>
>>> I have a widget that adapts a Sennheiser S1 av-noise canceler to my
>>> KX3. Use it for hi noise situations and it works like charm, even
>>> Massey-Ferguson mobile.🙂
>>> Try it with the David Clarks.
>>> Was connector a mismatched size pair of phone jacks or a complex
>>> military looking connector?
>>>
>>> Jack -KD4IZ
>>>
>>>
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Dwayne Rohmer

Re: mic

In reply to this post by k6dgw

Skip,

I converted an '80's era H10-40A David Clark aviation headset. Adapting
it for use with the K3 required a complete rebuild. The microphone isn't
the only issue. The headband, domes, and mike boom can be salvaged, but
you may want to consider replacing the remaining parts.

The original aviation spec microphone is not a good match for amateur
radio. Consider replacment with an Acousticom 5730-CA electret, a
communications mike that works well with the K3. It's an easy fit to the
David Clark wire boom, not expensive, and produces good audio with TX EQ
settings set to "0".

The original earphones were wired for 150 ohms (300 ohms each, wired in
parallel, mono audio). They were replaced with original David Clark 19
ohm, Part# 10376G-30, available on ebay for $12.00 each. The earphone
frequency response is 200 - 5500 Hz, excellent for CW and SSB, forget
the ipod.

To use the two speaker output of the K3, you'll have to replace the
original headset wiring to provide separate audio to each earphone.
Acousticom also has a wire assembly with microphone wires and stereo
speaker wires in one outer jacket, separated on one end to attach two
3.5mm plugs that you need for the K3.

The original foam ear seals were broken down from age. They didn't seal
well, and extended wear caused ear pain. They were replaced with the gel
filled type. Gel seals won't compress, are more comfortable, and
provide a better seal from noise.

I wouldn't recommend this if you have to purchase an old headset, but if
you already have one and want to put it to use, the rebuild may be worth
considering. When you get done, you'll have a decent headset that can be
used in a noisy environment.

73,

Dwayne WV5I

On 6/11/2017 3:29 PM, Fred Jensen wrote:

Wes Stewart-2

Re: mic - David Clark

In reply to this post by k6dgw

I have and have used a David Clark H10-30 headset on my TS870. The microphone
element is an amplified dynamic. I don't recall what the original mic connector
was; I cut if off and used the Kenwood standard 8-pin. The headphones use a
standard 1/4" mono plug. I always got good audio reports but then I was using a
TS870.

I have some documentation around here some place but I can say a gentleman at
David Clark was very helpful and sent me plenty of information.

The main problem for me was that the phones really clamp your head and they're
pretty heavy, which can get tiring.

Wes N7WS

6/11/2017 2:44 PM, Fred Jensen wrote:

> Hmmm ... I've had it for several years and it saw some use before I got it but
> I doubt it's old enough to be a carbon mic like the WW2 T-17.
>
> I just assumed the "noise cancelling" part applied to the headphones. I
> didn't know it might apply to the mic. There's no external noise in my shack
> to cancel anyway.
>
> The connector is round and the contacts stick out of the face. I think there
> are 6, maybe Headphones, Mic, and PTT? There's a push-switch in the cable.
> It looks like the connector fits over the panel connector and you twist is to
> lock it ... like a BNC. I don't think the headphones are stereo which is a
> big negative with my K3.
>
> I was just curious. This sounds like a project for some time when I have
> exactly nothing else to do. [:-) Thanks for the info
>
> 73,
>
> Fred ["Skip"] K6DGW
> Sparks NV DM09dn
> Washoe County

123