http://elecraft.85.s1.nabble.com/43-Vertical-and-the-K2-tuner-tp2481408p2483177.html
Keith, in theory the 5/8 vertical should be 3 db stronger than the 1/4 vertical installed in the same position. A ground plane on top of a house could easily be as good or better than a 5/8 wave ground mounted and radiating into the side of the house and some trees. 3 db is about 1/2 S unit anyway, so it will not be a large difference. You are correct about the far field conductivity being very important in how a vertical antenna will play, whether it is mounted on top of a tower or house or ground mounted. The radials are most important to bring up the radiation efficiency, the far field is most important for the take off angle.
The 43 foot vertical will have a higher radiation resistance than a shorter vertical for all bands, making it easier to get the efficiency up. It will still be lower than 50 ohms for 160, 80 and 60 meters, about 50 ohms for 40 and higher for the upper frequencies. I don't have one because I have a 3 element SteppIR with the 30/40 dipole trombone at 21 meters. I don't think the 43 foot vertical will play as well, but they do play well. I have worked several of the Zero-Five offering and they all play well. I would expect the DXE, Hygain and MFJ to play well also, but they are newer and I don't know anyone who has one. All still need a good ground plane and will play much better with conductive soil.
> From: Darwin, Keith <
[hidden email]>
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] 43' Vertical and the K2 tuner
> To: "James Apple" <
[hidden email]>,
[hidden email]
> Date: Sunday, March 15, 2009, 2:39 PM
> A few years ago, I was really on the 5/8 vertical bandwagon.
> I thought it was the cat's meow. The problem was that
> real world A/B testing did NOT show it to be any better than
> a 1/4 wave vert.
>
> I had a 5/8 wave vert for 15 meters. Ground mounted over
> 16 radials. An ATU at the base took care of the small
> impedance mismatch and RG-213 carried the signal to the rig.
> Hot stuff - or so I thought.
>
> I also had a 1/4 wave ground plane (4 radials) on the roof
> of my single story house. It was fed with RG-58. I spent a
> lot of time with an A/B switch listening to both antennas.
> You'd think the 5/8 with it's mondo low-angle
> radiation pattern would walk all over the 1/4 wave but it
> DID NOT. DX signals as the band was just opening or closing
> were sometimes stronger on the 5/8, other times on the 1/4.
> There was no clear winner.
>
> It was years before I found the answer.
>
> Apparently, that wonderful low angle radiation that we want
> out of the 5/8 wave antenna depends HEAVILY on the ground
> conductivity many, many wavelengths away from the antenna.
> Far out of the reach of any ground radial system, poor soil
> conductivity is sucking the low angle radiation down to near
> zero. Sure, over salt water it is fabulous, but for the
> vast majority, it just doesn't pan out that way.
>
> So, for "normal" soil, it seems the best height
> is something less than 1/2 wave.
>
> I run a 33' vertical with a Hustler 80M resonator on
> top. It resonates on 80 and 40 and does pretty well on
> those two bands. It also delivers the goods on 30 meters
> due to the remote tuner. On 20 meters and higher it
> isn't really all that impressive.
>
> - Keith N1AS -
> - K3 711 -
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From:
[hidden email] on behalf of James
> Apple
> Sent: Sun 3/15/2009 9:26 AM
> To:
[hidden email]
> Subject: [Elecraft] 43' Vertical and the K2 tuner
>
> After the ice storm of 2009, I'm looking for an new
> antenna. I've
> been considering the 43' verticals by DXE,HyGain and
> MFJ. But I'm not
> sure if my K2 tuner will have the range needed. The DXE
> site has a
> warning about internal tuners. Anyone using a K2 and a
> 43' vertical ?
> how's it play ?
>
> Thanks in Advance
>
> - Jim (WB1DOG)
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