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43' Vertical - mine is 31ft

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k6te Wim

43' Vertical - mine is 31ft

I have a 31 foot vertical myself (S9 V31) and since I have the KPA500 I
use the 600 WATT MFJ remote auto tuner.
With about 8 radials of 30 ft it works well on 40m - 10m.
The MFJ can't tune it on 80m but the internal K3 tuner does.
Feedline is 100ft of RG213

some more pics here
http://qsl.net/k6te/antenna.htm
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w7aqk

Re: 43' Vertical - mine is 31ft

Wim DeWilder posted:

I have a 31 foot vertical myself (S9 V31) and since I have the KPA500 I
use the 600 WATT MFJ remote auto tuner.
With about 8 radials of 30 ft it works well on 40m - 10m.
The MFJ can't tune it on 80m but the internal K3 tuner does.
Feedline is 100ft of RG213

---------------------

Wim,

Is the MFJ tuner still "in line" when you tune with the K3 on 80 meters?

It seems to me that you are loading a 40 meter vertical on 80 meters, which
means your feedpoint impedance is probably very high--maybe a few thousand
ohms??? That's a pretty large order for most auto-tuners.

The K3 tuner is darn good, and just might give you a match of some sort, but
that's a stretch for it as well. 10:1 is kind of the spec limit, and I
think you may be exceeding that. Still, I'm not sure what it might be
tuning if you don't have the MFJ bypassed.

Also, that 100 feet of feedline, even though it's pretty good stuff, is
probably giving you a lot of loss since you apparently don't have a good
match at the base. As I understand it, if you don't get pretty close to 50
ohms at the base of the antenna, then your coax will just increase your
losses considerably over and above what it would normally cause due to the
length of the run.

I can "tune" my R8 vertical on 80 meters (and even 160 meters) just using
the K3's ATU, and a run of about 50 feet of coax. However, I am certain
that my efficiency is crap! I've only tried this a couple of times because
it scares me to death to try it!

Dave W7AQK

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WA2SI

Re: 43' Vertical

Eric, please don't shut this thread down. I have gleaned so much useful information and personal opinions re. this K3/43 ft. vertical antenna combination. I'm pretty confident that there are others who feel similarly.

I'm not really sure how "noise ratio" or SNR truly pertains to a reflector where we can exchange or learn from others' experiences and/or opinions. Please let the less e-mail client savvy folks utilize their delete buttons on this one.

I've often enjoyed reading a particular thread/topic only to be silently disappointed when such an interesting topic (Vy much on topic, I might add.) is quelled at the height of its popularity. It's just so easy to create an Elecraft folder, create an Elecraft rule to move all e-mails with [Elecraft] in the subject line to the aforementioned folder, and, finally, delete what doesn't tickle one's fancy.

Vy 73 de Bert
WA2SI

Sent from my android device.
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k6te Wim

Re: 43' Vertical - mine is 31ft

In reply to this post by w7aqk

Dave,

the MFJ remote tuner allows to set it to bypass mode easily, by turning
the power OFF on the BIAS-T in the shack. So I'm only using the K3 tuner
on 80 meters. But you're right it's not the greatest setup on 80m but does
get some signal out, I'm not very active on that band indeed.

- Wim

------------

Dave W7AQK Wrote

Wim,

Is the MFJ tuner still "in line" when you tune with the K3 on 80 meters?

Tom McCulloch

Re: 43' Vertical

In reply to this post by WA2SI

Ditto here - great thread. I'm learning a lot (but then I guess I have
a lot to learn..hi)

Tom
WB2QDG
K2 1103

On 9/4/2013 3:20 PM, Bert Craig wrote:

> Eric, please don't shut this thread down. I have gleaned so much useful information and personal opinions re. this K3/43 ft. vertical antenna combination. I'm pretty confident that there are others who feel similarly.
>
> I'm not really sure how "noise ratio" or SNR truly pertains to a reflector where we can exchange or learn from others' experiences and/or opinions. Please let the less e-mail client savvy folks utilize their delete buttons on this one.
>
> I've often enjoyed reading a particular thread/topic only to be silently disappointed when such an interesting topic (Vy much on topic, I might add.) is quelled at the height of its popularity. It's just so easy to create an Elecraft folder, create an Elecraft rule to move all e-mails with [Elecraft] in the subject line to the aforementioned folder, and, finally, delete what doesn't tickle one's fancy.
>
> Vy 73 de Bert
> WA2SI
>
> Sent from my android device.
> ______________________________________________________________
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AD6XY

Re: 43' Vertical - mine is 31ft

In reply to this post by k6te Wim

Nice location - handy for Elecraft too.

there is a tree in the background that looks tempting as an antenna support. At the moment it looks like you have one of those QTHs with almost no man-made noise which coupled with an inefficient 80m antenna is frustrating when people you can hear perfectly well can't hear you.

The remote auto-tuner at the base is in exactly the right place, but you will need to give it some help.

Adding an extra coil at the base which you can bypass with relays will probably allow you to tune the vertical on 80m. Not ideal but it will be better than an 80m mobile whip and they work to some extent. The KPA500 will then help overcome the poor radiation efficiency. With 600W, you need to ensure the coil will handle the power, but that's not so hard to achieve. It does not need to be a coil, you could use a phasing line along the fence instead.

Even if the K3 will tune it, there might be significant feeder losses and you are down on power without the linear.

Mike

Doug Turnbull

[KX1] paddle question

Dear OMs and Yls,
I just took delivery of a KX1 purchased used. I am most impressed with
the small radio and have now made four QSOs with fellow EUs running 4 Watts
to a 4 el SteppIR at 24M. Well the test will come when I change over to a
hank of wire operated against a counterpoise. The receiver is amazing to
me and the transmitter pretty good. So much is in such a small package.

My main gripe just now is the lousy paddle which comes with the KX1 as a
option. I also have a KX3 also purchased used and waiting for me in
Connecticut. It has a paddle which I have tried on my friends KX3 - this
paddle is much better than the one on the KX1. Can I swap the KX3 paddle
onto the KX1? I know Bengali has an elegant wee paddle which mounts on
the KX1 or KX3 depending on the attachment purchased. This may be my
ultimate solution but the KX3 paddle if it mounts would be a big help.

I do not want to carry around an external paddle weighing more than the
KX1. The extremely small size and weight have a great attraction to me.
Having a big bag of accessories is not to my liking. A simple radio and
some wire seems to be ideal for me. The KX3 is for different
applications.

The receiver is great fun on both CW and SSB and the stability of it
impresses me. Today was discussing the old Hallicrafters SX28 and you know
the KX1 seems to have a better receiver. I think this small wonder is great
fun and can see why Elecraft has kept it in the product line.

73 Doug EI2CN

K3, KX3, KX1

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stan levandowski

Re: [KX1] paddle question

Good morning, Doug. You can not use the KX3PD paddle directly with the
KX1 because the KX3PD is a two point mount and uses a very
different plug and jack arrangement, whereas, the KX1PD is a single
point mount and the plug is an integral 1/8 inch stereo.

If you wanted to use the KX3PD with the KX1 you would have to fabricate
your own "transition mount."

The Begali Adventure that you refer to will work on both radios because
you would purchase individual mounts for each of the radios.

Yes, the KX1 is a *still* a neat little rig and I frequently take it
out, instead of my KX3, just because the QSOs "earned" on 900 milliwatts
with a 26 foot piece of wire and a 16' counterpoise are very rewarding.

73, Stan WB2LQF

On Sat, Sep 07, 2013 at 07:09 AM, Doug Turnbull wrote:

> Dear OMs and Yls,

> I just took delivery of a KX1 purchased used. I am most
> impressed with
> the small radio and have now made four QSOs with fellow EUs running 4
> Watts
> to a 4 el SteppIR at 24M. Well the test will come when I change over
> to a
> hank of wire operated against a counterpoise. The receiver is
> amazing to
> me and the transmitter pretty good. So much is in such a small
> package.
>
> My main gripe just now is the lousy paddle which comes with the
> KX1 as a
> option. I also have a KX3 also purchased used and waiting for me in
> Connecticut. It has a paddle which I have tried on my friends KX3 -
> this
> paddle is much better than the one on the KX1. Can I swap the KX3
> paddle
> onto the KX1? I know Bengali has an elegant wee paddle which mounts
> on
> the KX1 or KX3 depending on the attachment purchased. This may be my
> ultimate solution but the KX3 paddle if it mounts would be a big help.
>
> I do not want to carry around an external paddle weighing more than
> the
> KX1. The extremely small size and weight have a great attraction to
> me.
> Having a big bag of accessories is not to my liking. A simple radio
> and
> some wire seems to be ideal for me. The KX3 is for different
> applications.
>
> The receiver is great fun on both CW and SSB and the stability of
> it
> impresses me. Today was discussing the old Hallicrafters SX28 and you
> know
> the KX1 seems to have a better receiver. I think this small wonder is
> great
> fun and can see why Elecraft has kept it in the product line.
>
> 73 Doug EI2CN
>
> K3, KX3, KX1
>
>
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
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> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>

EricJ-2

Re: [KX1] paddle question

In reply to this post by Doug Turnbull

I found the KX1 paddle to be, at best, an acquired skill. One that I
chose not to acquire. I used the frame to homebrew a tiny touch paddle,
but that was just for fun. It worked very nicely,but required a button
battery that I didn't want to have to depend on when camping. I settled
on the Palm Mini Paddle. It's a lot cheaper than the Bengali Adventure
(which wasn't available then), and is an excellent performer, nearly
indestructible and packs very small. They make a mount to put it on the
KX1, but I find a paddle bolted to a rig to be too inflexible for
comfortable operating.

Eric
KE6US

On 9/7/2013 4:09 AM, Doug Turnbull wrote:

> Dear OMs and Yls,
> I just took delivery of a KX1 purchased used. I am most impressed with
> the small radio and have now made four QSOs with fellow EUs running 4 Watts
> to a 4 el SteppIR at 24M. Well the test will come when I change over to a
> hank of wire operated against a counterpoise. The receiver is amazing to
> me and the transmitter pretty good. So much is in such a small package.
>
> My main gripe just now is the lousy paddle which comes with the KX1 as a
> option. I also have a KX3 also purchased used and waiting for me in
> Connecticut. It has a paddle which I have tried on my friends KX3 - this
> paddle is much better than the one on the KX1. Can I swap the KX3 paddle
> onto the KX1? I know Bengali has an elegant wee paddle which mounts on
> the KX1 or KX3 depending on the attachment purchased. This may be my
> ultimate solution but the KX3 paddle if it mounts would be a big help.
>
> I do not want to carry around an external paddle weighing more than the
> KX1. The extremely small size and weight have a great attraction to me.
> Having a big bag of accessories is not to my liking. A simple radio and
> some wire seems to be ideal for me. The KX3 is for different
> applications.
>
> The receiver is great fun on both CW and SSB and the stability of it
> impresses me. Today was discussing the old Hallicrafters SX28 and you know
> the KX1 seems to have a better receiver. I think this small wonder is great
> fun and can see why Elecraft has kept it in the product line.
>
> 73 Doug EI2CN
>
> K3, KX3, KX1
>
>
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>
>

Doug Turnbull

Re: [KX1] paddle question

Hi Eric,
I thought of the palm mini but like the idea of a paddle attached to the
KX1/KX3. We agree the KX1 paddle sucks. Sorry Elecraft, I have an awful
lot that is good to say about you but your KXPD1 is not one of them. Truth
should not be suppressed.
73 Doug EI2CN

-----Original Message-----
From: [hidden email]
[mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of EricJ
Sent: 07 September 2013 18:58
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] [KX1] paddle question

I found the KX1 paddle to be, at best, an acquired skill. One that I
chose not to acquire. I used the frame to homebrew a tiny touch paddle,
but that was just for fun. It worked very nicely,but required a button
battery that I didn't want to have to depend on when camping. I settled
on the Palm Mini Paddle. It's a lot cheaper than the Bengali Adventure
(which wasn't available then), and is an excellent performer, nearly
indestructible and packs very small. They make a mount to put it on the
KX1, but I find a paddle bolted to a rig to be too inflexible for
comfortable operating.

Eric
KE6US

On 9/7/2013 4:09 AM, Doug Turnbull wrote:
> Dear OMs and Yls,
> I just took delivery of a KX1 purchased used. I am most impressed
with
> the small radio and have now made four QSOs with fellow EUs running 4
Watts
> to a 4 el SteppIR at 24M. Well the test will come when I change over to
a
> hank of wire operated against a counterpoise. The receiver is amazing to
> me and the transmitter pretty good. So much is in such a small package.
>
> My main gripe just now is the lousy paddle which comes with the KX1
as a
> option. I also have a KX3 also purchased used and waiting for me in
> Connecticut. It has a paddle which I have tried on my friends KX3 - this
> paddle is much better than the one on the KX1. Can I swap the KX3
paddle
> onto the KX1? I know Bengali has an elegant wee paddle which mounts on
> the KX1 or KX3 depending on the attachment purchased. This may be my
> ultimate solution but the KX3 paddle if it mounts would be a big help.
>
> I do not want to carry around an external paddle weighing more than
the
> KX1. The extremely small size and weight have a great attraction to me.
> Having a big bag of accessories is not to my liking. A simple radio and
> some wire seems to be ideal for me. The KX3 is for different
> applications.
>
> The receiver is great fun on both CW and SSB and the stability of it
> impresses me. Today was discussing the old Hallicrafters SX28 and you
know
> the KX1 seems to have a better receiver. I think this small wonder is
great

> fun and can see why Elecraft has kept it in the product line.
>
> 73 Doug EI2CN
>
> K3, KX3, KX1
>
>
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>
>

Don Butler

Re: [KX1] paddle question

I think we often become much too critical and forget that the KX1 and
KXPD1 are designed for portable use, particularly light backpacking and
portable operation. I therefore believe it is unfair to compare them
with other paddles and transceivers. I own a KX1/KDPD1 and a KX3/KXPD3,
and also have two K3s (with which I use a Begali Magnetic Signature
paddle). The Begali is far, far superior to these small portable
paddles of course ... As it should be.... the KXPD3 is better than the
KXPD1 . but as far as I'm concerned the KXPD1 is also perfectly
satisfactory for the type of operation for which it is primarily
intended. I did have difficulty when I first got it, but quickly
learned that it works almost perfectly if I squeeze the paddles at the
very tips rather than the "mid-paddle" area..in my hands it was that
simple to solve the problem.

I think the KX1 and KX3 are both engineering marvels and I love them
both. When I'm operating portable, I think an occasional dropped dit or
dah is a very small price to pay for the convenience of having light,
easy to carry paddles securely mounted to a totally self-contained
portable transceiver.

Don, N5LZ

-----Original Message-----
From: [hidden email]
[mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Doug Turnbull
Sent: Saturday, September 07, 2013 1:10 PM
To: 'EricJ'; [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] [KX1] paddle question

Hi Eric,
I thought of the palm mini but like the idea of a paddle attached to
the
KX1/KX3. We agree the KX1 paddle sucks. Sorry Elecraft, I have an
awful
lot that is good to say about you but your KXPD1 is not one of them.
Truth
should not be suppressed.
73 Doug EI2CN

-----Original Message-----
From: [hidden email]
[mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of EricJ
Sent: 07 September 2013 18:58
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] [KX1] paddle question

I found the KX1 paddle to be, at best, an acquired skill. One that I
chose not to acquire. I used the frame to homebrew a tiny touch paddle,
but that was just for fun. It worked very nicely,but required a button
battery that I didn't want to have to depend on when camping. I settled
on the Palm Mini Paddle. It's a lot cheaper than the Bengali Adventure
(which wasn't available then), and is an excellent performer, nearly
indestructible and packs very small. They make a mount to put it on the
KX1, but I find a paddle bolted to a rig to be too inflexible for
comfortable operating.

Eric
KE6US

On 9/7/2013 4:09 AM, Doug Turnbull wrote:
> Dear OMs and Yls,
> I just took delivery of a KX1 purchased used. I am most
impressed
with
> the small radio and have now made four QSOs with fellow EUs running 4
Watts
> to a 4 el SteppIR at 24M. Well the test will come when I change over
to
a
> hank of wire operated against a counterpoise. The receiver is
amazing to
> me and the transmitter pretty good. So much is in such a small
package.
>
> My main gripe just now is the lousy paddle which comes with the
> KX1
as a
> option. I also have a KX3 also purchased used and waiting for me in
> Connecticut. It has a paddle which I have tried on my friends KX3 -
this
> paddle is much better than the one on the KX1. Can I swap the KX3
paddle
> onto the KX1? I know Bengali has an elegant wee paddle which mounts
on
> the KX1 or KX3 depending on the attachment purchased. This may be my
> ultimate solution but the KX3 paddle if it mounts would be a big help.
>
> I do not want to carry around an external paddle weighing more
> than
the
> KX1. The extremely small size and weight have a great attraction to
me.
> Having a big bag of accessories is not to my liking. A simple radio
and
> some wire seems to be ideal for me. The KX3 is for different
> applications.
>
> The receiver is great fun on both CW and SSB and the stability of
> it impresses me. Today was discussing the old Hallicrafters SX28 and
> you
know
> the KX1 seems to have a better receiver. I think this small wonder is
great

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Doug Turnbull

Re: [KX1] paddle question

Don, Your points are taken. The KXPD3 is by far a better paddle than the
KXPD1 from this operator's point of view. I can struggle with the KXPD1
but hate it so the very dear Bengali will probably be my solution. We are
all different but for me the KXPD1 does not meet Elecraft standards. The
KX1 on the other hand is a marvel for such a small box. Thank you for your
tips! I will keep them in mind and soldier on with the KXPD1 until a
Bengali is in my hands. It is too bad the KXPD3 can not be used with the
KX1. We are all entitled and perhaps I am just not good enough to use the
KXPD1. 73 Doug EI2CN and thank you again.

-----Original Message-----
From: Donald Butler [mailto:[hidden email]]
Sent: 07 September 2013 20:01
To: 'Doug Turnbull'; 'EricJ'; [hidden email]
Subject: RE: [Elecraft] [KX1] paddle question

I think we often become much too critical and forget that the KX1 and
KXPD1 are designed for portable use, particularly light backpacking and
portable operation. I therefore believe it is unfair to compare them
with other paddles and transceivers. I own a KX1/KDPD1 and a KX3/KXPD3,
and also have two K3s (with which I use a Begali Magnetic Signature
paddle). The Begali is far, far superior to these small portable
paddles of course ... As it should be.... the KXPD3 is better than the
KXPD1 . but as far as I'm concerned the KXPD1 is also perfectly
satisfactory for the type of operation for which it is primarily
intended. I did have difficulty when I first got it, but quickly
learned that it works almost perfectly if I squeeze the paddles at the
very tips rather than the "mid-paddle" area..in my hands it was that
simple to solve the problem.

I think the KX1 and KX3 are both engineering marvels and I love them
both. When I'm operating portable, I think an occasional dropped dit or
dah is a very small price to pay for the convenience of having light,
easy to carry paddles securely mounted to a totally self-contained
portable transceiver.

Don, N5LZ

-----Original Message-----
From: [hidden email]
[mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Doug Turnbull
Sent: Saturday, September 07, 2013 1:10 PM
To: 'EricJ'; [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] [KX1] paddle question

Hi Eric,
I thought of the palm mini but like the idea of a paddle attached to
the
KX1/KX3. We agree the KX1 paddle sucks. Sorry Elecraft, I have an
awful
lot that is good to say about you but your KXPD1 is not one of them.
Truth
should not be suppressed.
73 Doug EI2CN

-----Original Message-----
From: [hidden email]
[mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of EricJ
Sent: 07 September 2013 18:58
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] [KX1] paddle question

I found the KX1 paddle to be, at best, an acquired skill. One that I
chose not to acquire. I used the frame to homebrew a tiny touch paddle,
but that was just for fun. It worked very nicely,but required a button
battery that I didn't want to have to depend on when camping. I settled
on the Palm Mini Paddle. It's a lot cheaper than the Bengali Adventure
(which wasn't available then), and is an excellent performer, nearly
indestructible and packs very small. They make a mount to put it on the
KX1, but I find a paddle bolted to a rig to be too inflexible for
comfortable operating.

Eric
KE6US

On 9/7/2013 4:09 AM, Doug Turnbull wrote:
> Dear OMs and Yls,
> I just took delivery of a KX1 purchased used. I am most
impressed
with
> the small radio and have now made four QSOs with fellow EUs running 4
Watts
> to a 4 el SteppIR at 24M. Well the test will come when I change over
to
a
> hank of wire operated against a counterpoise. The receiver is
amazing to
> me and the transmitter pretty good. So much is in such a small
package.
>
> My main gripe just now is the lousy paddle which comes with the
> KX1
as a
> option. I also have a KX3 also purchased used and waiting for me in
> Connecticut. It has a paddle which I have tried on my friends KX3 -
this
> paddle is much better than the one on the KX1. Can I swap the KX3
paddle
> onto the KX1? I know Bengali has an elegant wee paddle which mounts
on
> the KX1 or KX3 depending on the attachment purchased. This may be my
> ultimate solution but the KX3 paddle if it mounts would be a big help.
>
> I do not want to carry around an external paddle weighing more
> than
the
> KX1. The extremely small size and weight have a great attraction to
me.
> Having a big bag of accessories is not to my liking. A simple radio
and
> some wire seems to be ideal for me. The KX3 is for different
> applications.
>
> The receiver is great fun on both CW and SSB and the stability of
> it impresses me. Today was discussing the old Hallicrafters SX28 and
> you
know
> the KX1 seems to have a better receiver. I think this small wonder is
great