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AF1 - Practical Use Question

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stan levandowski

AF1 - Practical Use Question

I just completed the AF1 kit and it appears to work properly. It
doesn't seem like it does all that much more for my K2 on which I
already have the KAF2 installed. But on my KX1 it definitely makes a
difference.

Here's the rub and I'm wondering how other users of the AF-1 handle it:

Whether it's the K2 or the KX1 I'm using it on, when I go to transmit I
lose the sidetone! I'm no technical genius but I've pretty much figured
out that this is to be expected with the AF-1 being in the audio line
out and not an integral part of the transceiver like the KAF2 with which
there is no such problem.

So I adjust the filter and bring out a weak signal nice a clear and just
right, but when I want to transmit I have to turn the AF-1 OFF in order
to hear my sidetone.

Is this just the nature of the beast or did I miss something here?

Thanks for any input,

Stan Levandowski WB2LQF
HF QRP CW -- Doing more with less for over 50 years!
QCWA #35038 OOTC #4558 NAQCC #4740 SKCC #6488 FISTS #14992
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Don Wilhelm-4

Re: AF1 - Practical Use Question

Stan,

The AF1 has a sharp audio filter, and there is no "mute" signal into it,
so any tone at the AF1 center frequency should get through.

BUT - the AF1 center frequency must be at the same pitch as your
sidetone for that tone to get through the AF1 filter.

I suspect that the menu setting for STP on your K2 and KX1 is not the
same as the center frequency you have set on the AF1.

73,
Don W3FPR

On 12/14/2010 5:07 PM, stan levandowski wrote:

> I just completed the AF1 kit and it appears to work properly. It
> doesn't seem like it does all that much more for my K2 on which I
> already have the KAF2 installed. But on my KX1 it definitely makes a
> difference.
>
> Here's the rub and I'm wondering how other users of the AF-1 handle it:
>
> Whether it's the K2 or the KX1 I'm using it on, when I go to transmit I
> lose the sidetone! I'm no technical genius but I've pretty much figured
> out that this is to be expected with the AF-1 being in the audio line
> out and not an integral part of the transceiver like the KAF2 with which
> there is no such problem.
>
> So I adjust the filter and bring out a weak signal nice a clear and just
> right, but when I want to transmit I have to turn the AF-1 OFF in order
> to hear my sidetone.
>
> Is this just the nature of the beast or did I miss something here?
>
>

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AC7AC

Re: AF1 - Practical Use Question

In reply to this post by stan levandowski

CONTENTS DELETED

The author has deleted this message.

stan levandowski

Re: AF1 - Practical Use Question

In reply to this post by stan levandowski

Stan, it sounds like you do not have the AF1 tuned to the same
frequency as
> the K2 sidetone.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Don and Ron, thank you both. I guess I have some studying to do in the
K2 and KX1 manuals. My simple mind doesn't always grasp some of these
concepts at first!. You've put me on the right track now and confirmed
that it's my faulty set up and operation, not the nature of the option.

I'll wake up tomorrow and get serious about remedying it; tonight I've
dusted off my old bug and I'm going to try my luck in the NAQCC Sprint.

Stan Levandowski WB2LQF
HF QRP CW -- Doing more with less for over 50 years!
QCWA #35038 OOTC #4558 NAQCC #4740 SKCC #6488 FISTS #14992

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Don Wilhelm-4

Re: AF1 - Practical Use Question

Stan,

Another subtle point that some do not grasp without further information
is that the sidetone pitch entered into the menu is also used to control
the transmit offset (except on the K1). If you do not have your
sidetone pitch and the audio frequency that you are listening to the
sending station in agreement, then you will end up coping him "off
frequency".

So bottom line - set the menu sidetone pitch to the same frequency as
you wish to listen to (and have your IF filters aligned to), and you
will potentially make more contacts.

73,
Don W3FPR

On 12/14/2010 7:02 PM, stan levandowski wrote:
> Stan, it sounds like you do not have the AF1 tuned to the same
> frequency as
>> the K2 sidetone.
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stan levandowski

Re: AF1 - Practical Use Question

In reply to this post by stan levandowski

Don, thanks very much. Now all I have to do is figure out how to do all
this and try to understand it at the same time. My sidetone pitch on
the K2 is set to 0.60 and I seem to recall that was a K2 default option
which I didn't mess around with. Presently, I don't seem to have any
difficulty with the transmit offset. I use "Spot" to make the other
station "disappear" and Voila - contact!

I'll wake up tomorrow and get working on understanding and fixing all
this.

73,

Stan Levandowski WB2LQF
HF QRP CW -- Doing more with less for over 50 years!
QCWA #35038 OOTC #4558 NAQCC #4740 SKCC #6488 FISTS #14992

On Tue, Dec 14, 2010 at 8:02 PM, Don Wilhelm wrote:

> Stan,
>
> Another subtle point that some do not grasp without further
> information is that the sidetone pitch entered into the menu is also
> used to control the transmit offset (except on the K1). If you do not
> have your sidetone pitch and the audio frequency that you are
> listening to the sending station in agreement, then you will end up
> coping him "off frequency".
>
> So bottom line - set the menu sidetone pitch to the same frequency as
> you wish to listen to (and have your IF filters aligned to), and you
> will potentially make more contacts.
>
> 73,
> Don W3FPR
>
> On 12/14/2010 7:02 PM, stan levandowski wrote:
>> Stan, it sounds like you do not have the AF1 tuned to the same
>> frequency as
>>> the K2 sidetone.

Don Wilhelm-4

Re: AF1 - Practical Use Question

Stan,

If you have problems deciphering the AF1 peaking controls to place the
peak at 600 Hz (or whatever your chosen sidetone pitch may be), I
suggest using Spectrogram (or Spectrum Lab or another FFT audio spectrum
analyzer) to set the AF1 peak to the same frequency as your K2
sidetone. Use a broadband noise source at the K2 antenna and peak the
displayed response at your chosen sidetone pitch. The AF1 has a wide
range of frequencies, and if not set correctly, you will not enjoy the
full capability of this audio filter.

You can "set it by ear" if you are good at such stuff, but many cannot
do that - I use Spectrogram as my "crutch".

73,
Don W3FPR

On 12/14/2010 8:23 PM, stan levandowski wrote:

> Don, thanks very much. Now all I have to do is figure out how to do all
> this and try to understand it at the same time. My sidetone pitch on
> the K2 is set to 0.60 and I seem to recall that was a K2 default option
> which I didn't mess around with. Presently, I don't seem to have any
> difficulty with the transmit offset. I use "Spot" to make the other
> station "disappear" and Voila - contact!
>
> I'll wake up tomorrow and get working on understanding and fixing all
> this.
>
> 73,
>
> Stan Levandowski WB2LQF
> HF QRP CW -- Doing more with less for over 50 years!
> QCWA #35038 OOTC #4558 NAQCC #4740 SKCC #6488 FISTS #14992
>
>
> On Tue, Dec 14, 2010 at 8:02 PM, Don Wilhelm wrote:
>
>> Stan,
>>
>> Another subtle point that some do not grasp without further
>> information is that the sidetone pitch entered into the menu is also
>> used to control the transmit offset (except on the K1). If you do not
>> have your sidetone pitch and the audio frequency that you are
>> listening to the sending station in agreement, then you will end up
>> coping him "off frequency".
>>
>> So bottom line - set the menu sidetone pitch to the same frequency as
>> you wish to listen to (and have your IF filters aligned to), and you
>> will potentially make more contacts.
>>
>> 73,
>> Don W3FPR
>>
>> On 12/14/2010 7:02 PM, stan levandowski wrote:
>>> Stan, it sounds like you do not have the AF1 tuned to the same
>>> frequency as
>>>> the K2 sidetone.
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>

stan levandowski

Re: AF1 - Practical Use Question

In reply to this post by stan levandowski

Don, I don't have any of that fancy equipment unfortunately. But I just
met with success anyway!

I was expecting to hear a "pure" sidetone - what I hear is a buzzing
sound along with some modulation that sounds reasonably close to the 600
Hz I set. When I took my hand away from the AF1, the buzzing stopped
and the sidetone, still sounding just a little bit constricted in the
BP2 position (not nice and pure and loud like in the barefoot K2) was
completely reasonable and useable.

There is a Sprint on right now. I found an extremely weak signal on
7.033 with lots of QRM. Using the AF1 I was able to copy him and QSL
the exchange. And he came right back to me so apparently I don't have
any issues with offsets.

I am quite impressed by this experience. And I don't even know yet if
I'm really using it correctly!

Very impressive item!

I have an enclosure on order and that should solve the hand issue. In
receive, the hand on the knob does nothing bad; on transmit it does.

Thanks for your assist tonight!

Stan Levandowski WB2LQF
HF QRP CW -- Doing more with less for over 50 years!
QCWA #35038 OOTC #4558 NAQCC #4740 SKCC #6488 FISTS #14992

On Tue, Dec 14, 2010 at 8:34 PM, Don Wilhelm wrote:

> Stan,
>
> If you have problems deciphering the AF1 peaking controls to place the
> peak at 600 Hz (or whatever your chosen sidetone pitch may be), I
> suggest using Spectrogram (or Spectrum Lab or another FFT audio
> spectrum analyzer) to set the AF1 peak to the same frequency as your
> K2 sidetone. Use a broadband noise source at the K2 antenna and peak
> the displayed response at your chosen sidetone pitch. The AF1 has a
> wide range of frequencies, and if not set correctly, you will not
> enjoy the full capability of this audio filter.
>
> You can "set it by ear" if you are good at such stuff, but many cannot
> do that - I use Spectrogram as my "crutch".
>
> 73,
> Don W3FPR
>
> On 12/14/2010 8:23 PM, stan levandowski wrote:
>> Don, thanks very much. Now all I have to do is figure out how to do
>> all
>> this and try to understand it at the same time. My sidetone pitch on
>> the K2 is set to 0.60 and I seem to recall that was a K2 default
>> option
>> which I didn't mess around with. Presently, I don't seem to have any
>> difficulty with the transmit offset. I use "Spot" to make the other
>> station "disappear" and Voila - contact!
>>
>> I'll wake up tomorrow and get working on understanding and fixing all
>> this.
>>
>> 73,
>>
>> Stan Levandowski WB2LQF
>> HF QRP CW -- Doing more with less for over 50 years!
>> QCWA #35038 OOTC #4558 NAQCC #4740 SKCC #6488 FISTS #14992
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Dec 14, 2010 at 8:02 PM, Don Wilhelm wrote:
>>
>>> Stan,
>>>
>>> Another subtle point that some do not grasp without further
>>> information is that the sidetone pitch entered into the menu is also
>>> used to control the transmit offset (except on the K1). If you do
>>> not
>>> have your sidetone pitch and the audio frequency that you are
>>> listening to the sending station in agreement, then you will end up
>>> coping him "off frequency".
>>>
>>> So bottom line - set the menu sidetone pitch to the same frequency
>>> as
>>> you wish to listen to (and have your IF filters aligned to), and you
>>> will potentially make more contacts.
>>>
>>> 73,
>>> Don W3FPR
>>>
>>> On 12/14/2010 7:02 PM, stan levandowski wrote:
>>>> Stan, it sounds like you do not have the AF1 tuned to the same
>>>> frequency as
>>>>> the K2 sidetone.
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> Elecraft mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>>

AC7AC

Re: AF1 - Practical Use Question

CONTENTS DELETED

The author has deleted this message.

Don Wilhelm-5

Re: AF1 - Practical Use Question

Ron,

I wonder if the "buzz" is audio pickup from hand coupling. I hear that
a lot if I put my hand on the audio circuits of the KX1 (which I do for
a test). Since the AF1 (and all mini-modules) are open board circuits,
I assume that is within the realm of possibility.

73,
Don W3FPR

On 12/14/2010 10:01 PM, Ron D'Eau Claire wrote:

> The "buzz" is interesting. With the tight bandpass, the sidetone (and
> received signals) from the K3 should be closer to a pure sine wave than
> ever.
>
> Ron AC7AC
>
> -----Original Message-----
> Don, I don't have any of that fancy equipment unfortunately. But I just
> met with success anyway!
>
> I was expecting to hear a "pure" sidetone - what I hear is a buzzing
> sound along with some modulation that sounds reasonably close to the 600
> Hz I set. When I took my hand away from the AF1, the buzzing stopped
> and the sidetone, still sounding just a little bit constricted in the
> BP2 position (not nice and pure and loud like in the barefoot K2) was
> completely reasonable and useable.
>
>
>
>

Don Wilhelm-5

Re: AF1 - Practical Use Question

In reply to this post by AC7AC

Stan,

If that "hand effect" occurs while transmitting, then it can be
attributed to RF-in-the-shack. The only cure for that is to work on
your antenna system. If your transmitting antenna is close to the
operating position, there may be no real cure. OTOH, if the transmit
antenna is not coupling directly into your operating position, that may
be an indication that RF from the antenna is being coupled back into the
operating position - the use of baluns or transmission line chokes, or
effective RF Grounds (try a 1/4 wave "counterpoise" wire) would be means
to minimize that effect.

73,
Don W3FPR

On 12/14/2010 10:01 PM, Ron D'Eau Claire wrote: