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Clock chip

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Re: Clock chip

Ray I agree with you!
For those who insist on having an accurate working clock. Please also insist on it going " Tic Toc "
Why are we sweating the small stuff? Times like these are when I truly believe that Wayne has us spoiled.

((((73)))) Milverton / W9MMS.

From: Ray Sills <[hidden email]>
To: Elecraft Reflector <[hidden email]>
Sent: Sunday, February 15, 2015 12:52 PM
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Clock chip

Certainly, having an accurate clock inside the rig would be handy,
especially for those who use manual logging. Even though wristwatches
with WWVB receivers can be had fairly inexpensively, I'm sure it would
be more costly for Elecraft to add it to their rigs. But, if it's
available as an option, then those who want it, can buy it.

Me? I just use the clock on my cell phone. And, it's a smart phone,
and I have a logging program I can use.

73 de Ray
K2ULR
KX3 #211

On Feb 15, 2015, at 1:24 PM, Ken G Kopp wrote:

> Given the tiny size of "atomic clock" / WWVB devices ... as in wrist
> watches ... it would seem one could be integrated into both the K3
> and KX3
> and make the clock actually usable.
>
> 73
>
> Ken - K0PP
> On Feb 15, 2015 11:17 AM, "Lynn W. Taylor, WB6UUT" <
> [hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> In which radio?
>>
>> On 2/15/2015 9:52 AM, Jim Miller wrote:
>>
>>> Elecraft, Please give us a replacement clock chip that will keep
>>> time. An
>>> adjust method for what we have?
>>>
>>>
>>> Thanks, Jim KG0KP
>>>
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>>>
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W1KSZ

Re: Clock chip

It escapes me why you need an accurate clock in your rig. You can sync your
computer to WWV, from that the time in your log is determined.

What else is a clock good for ??

Besides, unless it's locked to GPS, it will show the wrong time, no
matter how
good people say it is.

73, Dick, W1KSZ

On 2/15/2015 5:53 PM, Milverton M. Swire via Elecraft wrote:

> Ray I agree with you!
> For those who insist on having an accurate working clock. Please also insist on it going " Tic Toc "
> Why are we sweating the small stuff? Times like these are when I truly believe that Wayne has us spoiled.
>
> ((((73)))) Milverton / W9MMS.
>
> From: Ray Sills <[hidden email]>
> To: Elecraft Reflector <[hidden email]>
> Sent: Sunday, February 15, 2015 12:52 PM
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Clock chip
>
> Certainly, having an accurate clock inside the rig would be handy,
> especially for those who use manual logging. Even though wristwatches
> with WWVB receivers can be had fairly inexpensively, I'm sure it would
> be more costly for Elecraft to add it to their rigs. But, if it's
> available as an option, then those who want it, can buy it.
>
> Me? I just use the clock on my cell phone. And, it's a smart phone,
> and I have a logging program I can use.
>
> 73 de Ray
> K2ULR
> KX3 #211
>
>
>
> On Feb 15, 2015, at 1:24 PM, Ken G Kopp wrote:
>
>> Given the tiny size of "atomic clock" / WWVB devices ... as in wrist
>> watches ... it would seem one could be integrated into both the K3
>> and KX3
>> and make the clock actually usable.
>>
>> 73
>>
>> Ken - K0PP
>> On Feb 15, 2015 11:17 AM, "Lynn W. Taylor, WB6UUT" <
>> [hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>>> In which radio?
>>>
>>> On 2/15/2015 9:52 AM, Jim Miller wrote:
>>>
>>>> Elecraft, Please give us a replacement clock chip that will keep
>>>> time. An
>>>> adjust method for what we have?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Thanks, Jim KG0KP
>>>>
>>>> ______________________________________________________________
>>>> Elecraft mailing list
>>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>>>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>>>
>>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>>>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>>>> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>>>>
>>>>
>>> ______________________________________________________________
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Mike Morrow-3

Re: Clock chip

In reply to this post by hf4me

> I DO consider asking for an accurate clock in a ham radio transceiver a 'childish request'...

and

> Elecraft, please do not pay any attention to these childish request
...

We have some riding their high horses here. :-)

Radio clocks that synch to LF or GPS signals seem to me gross overkill.

How about a plain clock such as found in the last three $15 Casio watches I've purchased at Walmart...all of which gain less than 0.2 seconds per day, on or off wrist? Is something like *that* too much to ask from a ham radio internal RT clock? Button cell backup should always be provided as well.

Mike / KK5F

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Richard Gillingham

Re: Clock chip

In reply to this post by hf4me

Here in South Florida, atomic clocks will not sync it all. 73,
Gil W1RG

Sent via the Samsung Galaxy Note® 3, an AT&T 4G LTE smartphone

<div>-------- Original message --------</div><div>From: Ken G Kopp <[hidden email]> </div><div>Date:02/15/2015 1:25 PM (GMT-05:00) </div><div>To: "Lynn W. Taylor, WB6UUT" <[hidden email]> </div><div>Cc: Elecraft Reflector <[hidden email]>, [hidden email] </div><div>Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Clock chip </div><div>
</div>
Given the tiny size of "atomic clock" / WWVB devices ... as in wrist
watches ... it would seem one could be integrated into both the K3 and KX3
and make the clock actually usable.

73

Ken - K0PP
On Feb 15, 2015 11:17 AM, "Lynn W. Taylor, WB6UUT" <
[hidden email]> wrote:

> In which radio?
>
> On 2/15/2015 9:52 AM, Jim Miller wrote:
>
>> Elecraft, Please give us a replacement clock chip that will keep time. An
>> adjust method for what we have?
>>
>>
>> Thanks, Jim KG0KP
>>
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> Elecraft mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>>
>>
> ______________________________________________________________
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Chris Del Plato KQ2RP

Re: Clock chip

In reply to this post by hf4me

For myself, in relation to the KX3, I would appreciate an accurate clock so
that I could just grab and go knowing the time is correct without having to
check and reset. Especially important in portable operation, SOTA, etc.,
where one is often logging on paper. It's nice to keep the clock onscreen
while you make contacts. Sure, I could have my phone out and propped up and
use that clock, but the clock was included the KX3 for a reason, right? It
should be accurate to be useful.

73,
Chris KQ2RP
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Dwayne Rohmer

Re: Clock chip

In reply to this post by hf4me

I use the clock on the K3. Mostly to keep time as I no longer have a
wristwatch and prefer not to have to pick up the iPhone to get the time.
Those that don't need the clock can simply tap DISP and it will go away.

I also use***MAIN: Alarm, Yes* on occasion to remind me of a net. *MAIN:
Alarm* will also turn your rig ON at a preset time.

New feature request: *MAIN: Alarm, Tap 4* to toggle a slightly audible
dit every ten minutes as a reminder to ID.

The clock on my K3 has been consistently slow since new, about 5 seconds
per 24 hours. My preference is that it be a little more accurate,
perhaps something closer to a quartz watch. Nothing too elaborate, not
perfect, but more accurate than what we have now. Atomic clock accuracy
or an external reference would be overkill on the K3.

73,

Dwayne WV5I

On 2/15/2015 11:52 AM, Jim Miller wrote:

> Elecraft, Please give us a replacement clock chip that will keep time. An
> adjust method for what we have?
>
>
>
> Thanks, Jim KG0KP
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
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>

Dwayne WV5I

Re: Clock chip

In reply to this post by hf4me

I use the clock on the K3 as I no longer have a wristwatch and prefer
not to have to pick up the iPhone to get the time. Those that don't need
the clock can simply tap DISP and it will go away.

I also use***MAIN: Alarm, Yes* on occasion to remind me of a net. *MAIN:
Alarm* will also turn your rig ON at a preset time.

New feature request: *MAIN: Alarm, Tap 4* to toggle a slightly audible
dit every ten minutes as a reminder to ID.

The clock on my K3 has been consistently slow since new, about 5 seconds
per 24 hours. My preference is that it be a little more accurate,
perhaps something closer to a quartz watch. Nothing too elaborate, not
perfect, but more accurate than what we have now. Atomic clock accuracy
or an external reference would be overkill on the K3.

73,

Dwayne WV5I
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Phil Kane-2

Re: Clock chip

In reply to this post by Phil Wheeler-2

On 2/15/2015 2:33 PM, Phil Wheeler wrote:

> I agree with you, Don re no real use for a clock in a radio.

> I do wonder why there is one at all.

Is not accuracy in the time domain as worthwhile as accuracy in the
frequency domain?

I guess that all those years that I spent in government and civilian
comm centers (now renamed "network operating centers") ingrained the
need for "accurate time of day" in my operating habits.

73 de K2ASP - Phil Kane
Elecraft K2/100 s/n 5402
T2-00000208

From a Clearing in the Silicon Forest
Beaverton (Washington County) Oregon
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Phil Wheeler-2

Re: Clock chip

On 2/16/15 11:24 AM, Phil Kane wrote:
> On 2/15/2015 2:33 PM, Phil Wheeler wrote:
>
>> I agree with you, Don re no real use for a clock in a radio.
>> I do wonder why there is one at all.
> Is not accuracy in the time domain as worthwhile as accuracy in the
> frequency domain?
Likely not -- until the regs include time as well
as frequency limits.

Phil W7OX

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Edward R Cole

Re: Clock chip

In reply to this post by hf4me

I think this might have been touched upon, but I wonder if a sw app
might be possible that would update the K3 clock from your computer
(say once per day)? Of course one can manually accomplish that using
the K3 utility.

For those of us whose K3 mainly stay in the shack and can be
connected to a computer full-time that would be a nice feature that
would probably solve this "time issue" with the clock. Maybe that
feature could be added to a future version of the K3 editor?

Of course time accuracy would be that of your computer (which there
are many utilities which will maintain NIST accuracy - I use Dimension-4).

73, Ed - KL7UW
http://www.kl7uw.com
"Kits made by KL7UW"
Dubus Mag business:
[hidden email]

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Arlen Fletcher

Re: Clock chip

In reply to this post by Richard Gillingham

I’m guilty of starting a thread similar to this one a couple of months back.

My K3 clock drifts and, being a newbie, I wasn’t certain whether it was within spec or not. I learned that it is within spec - but I wanted something more accurate - not because I NEED it, but because I thought it might be a fun project.

So I designed and built a GPS clock. It uses a $40 GPS module that has a battery-backed clock chip in it (so it keeps reasonable time when there is no GPS satellite lock). It only needs a single GPS satellite for accurate time. I put it out in my garage because my shack is in the basement and GPS coverage is marginal there. It communicates with the display unit via an XBee Series One radio link, updating the display in my shack (driven by an Arduino Uno) about every 200 milliseconds. Is it overkill? Probably. But I had fun designing it, building it, and writing and debugging the code. I’m a ham… I do things like this because it’s fun - and since I’m not selling it I don’t have to worry too much about how practical it is. It’d be nice if the K3 clock was more accurate - but then I wouldn’t have learned about GPS timekeeping, XBees, and driving an I2C display and GPS unit from an Arduino! :-)

73

Arlen, AA7F

> On Feb 15, 2015, at 5:19 PM, Richard Gillingham <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>
> Here in South Florida, atomic clocks will not sync it all. 73,
> Gil W1RG
>
> Sent via the Samsung Galaxy Note® 3, an AT&T 4G LTE smartphone
>
> <div>-------- Original message --------</div><div>From: Ken G Kopp <[hidden email]> </div><div>Date:02/15/2015 1:25 PM (GMT-05:00) </div><div>To: "Lynn W. Taylor, WB6UUT" <[hidden email]> </div><div>Cc: Elecraft Reflector <[hidden email]>, [hidden email] </div><div>Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Clock chip </div><div>
> </div>
> Given the tiny size of "atomic clock" / WWVB devices ... as in wrist
> watches ... it would seem one could be integrated into both the K3 and KX3
> and make the clock actually usable.
>
> 73
>
> Ken - K0PP
> On Feb 15, 2015 11:17 AM, "Lynn W. Taylor, WB6UUT" <
> [hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> In which radio?
>>
>> On 2/15/2015 9:52 AM, Jim Miller wrote:
>>
>>> Elecraft, Please give us a replacement clock chip that will keep time. An
>>> adjust method for what we have?
>>>
>>>
>>> Thanks, Jim KG0KP
>>>
>>> ______________________________________________________________
>>> Elecraft mailing list
>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>>
>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>>> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>>>
>>>
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> Elecraft mailing list
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>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>
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> ______________________________________________________________
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Jeff Herr

Re: Clock chip Hey Wayne!

is the RTC implemented in the PIC chip?

i did not see a rtc chip in the prints....my eyesight these days.....

why dont we just try to understand how it works and then we can accept what we see.

-----Original Message-----
From: Elecraft [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Arlen Fletcher
Sent: Wednesday, February 18, 2015 08:05 AM
To: Richard Gillingham
Cc: Elecraft Mailing List; [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Clock chip

I’m guilty of starting a thread similar to this one a couple of months back.

My K3 clock drifts and, being a newbie, I wasn’t certain whether it was within spec or not. I learned that it is within spec - but I wanted something more accurate - not because I NEED it, but because I thought it might be a fun project.

So I designed and built a GPS clock. It uses a $40 GPS module that has a battery-backed clock chip in it (so it keeps reasonable time when there is no GPS satellite lock). It only needs a single GPS satellite for accurate time. I put it out in my garage because my shack is in the basement and GPS coverage is marginal there. It communicates with the display unit via an XBee Series One radio link, updating the display in my shack (driven by an Arduino Uno) about every 200 milliseconds. Is it overkill? Probably. But I had fun designing it, building it, and writing and debugging the code. I’m a ham… I do things like this because it’s fun - and since I’m not selling it I don’t have to worry too much about how practical it is. It’d be nice if the K3 clock was more accurate - but then I wouldn’t have learned about GPS timekeeping, XBees, and driving an I2C display and GPS unit from an Arduino! :-)

73

Arlen, AA7F

> On Feb 15, 2015, at 5:19 PM, Richard Gillingham <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>
> Here in South Florida, atomic clocks will not sync it all. 73, Gil
> W1RG
>
> Sent via the Samsung Galaxy Note® 3, an AT&T 4G LTE smartphone
>
> <div>-------- Original message --------</div><div>From: Ken G Kopp
> <[hidden email]> </div><div>Date:02/15/2015 1:25 PM (GMT-05:00)
> </div><div>To: "Lynn W. Taylor, WB6UUT" <[hidden email]>
> </div><div>Cc: Elecraft Reflector <[hidden email]>,
> [hidden email] </div><div>Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Clock chip </div><div> </div> Given the tiny size of "atomic clock" / WWVB devices ... as in wrist watches ... it would seem one could be integrated into both the K3 and KX3 and make the clock actually usable.
>
> 73
>
> Ken - K0PP
> On Feb 15, 2015 11:17 AM, "Lynn W. Taylor, WB6UUT" <
> [hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> In which radio?
>>
>> On 2/15/2015 9:52 AM, Jim Miller wrote:
>>
>>> Elecraft, Please give us a replacement clock chip that will keep
>>> time. An adjust method for what we have?
>>>
>>>
>>> Thanks, Jim KG0KP
>>>
>>> ______________________________________________________________
>>> Elecraft mailing list
>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>>
>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this
>>> email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to
>>> [hidden email]
>>>
>>>
>> ______________________________________________________________
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Mike Morrow-3

Re: Clock chip Hey Wayne!

> is the RTC implemented in the PIC chip?
>
> i did not see a rtc chip in the prints...

The KXBC3 has no stand-alone RTC chip. Its PIC (U3) carries out
the RTC functions with an attached 32768 kHz crystal.

One should not expect great time-keeping accuracy from that.

Mike / KK5F
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Mike Morrow-3

Re: Clock chip Hey Wayne!

In reply to this post by Jeff Herr

> The KXBC3 has no stand-alone RTC chip. Its PIC (U3) carries out
> the RTC functions with an attached 32768 kHz crystal.

That should be "32.768 kHz". :-)

Mike / KK5F
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