Could this operate on a motorcycle?
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Re: Could this operate on a motorcycle?
 
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On 5/4/2014 5:17 PM, Russell Conner wrote:
> well, the naysayers have convinced me, the Elecraft is not the radio for me > for this application, and this is the application I need to solve first. A > home station is a year or two away, if ever. Hi Russell, Congratulations on getting your license. The experience and backgrounds of those who have offered advice is pretty widely varied -- everything from true expert to opinions only to hearsay. Most of us own Elecraft rigs, and most have owned lots of other rigs too, over the years. I've had nearly 20 in the 60 years I've been a ham. Many of us own and use 2M and 440 MHz rigs -- I certainly do -- and I mostly use them on the road. I agree with the advice that Elecraft does not make a product to do what you want on your motorcycle -- for the short distances involved, I'd be looking at either a 2M rig if all the guys in your group are hams, or an FRS radio if they are not, looking for something you can fit with a suitable headset. As others have noted, the KX3 is a great rig for home, backpacking, and travel. That's what it's designed for. When you are ready for a rig like that, it's head and shoulders above the rest. Sort of like the difference between a Harley and a motor scooter. :) 73, Jim K9YC ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to [hidden email] |
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Hmm. What I think the biggest issue is that I am both a motorcycle enthusiast and a budding HAM enthusiast... although the shine is coming off quickly. "Motor scooters" come in 600+ cc now, they are as big and fast as half the motorcycles out there. BMW's C600 will cruise all day long, and you can get up and 1000 miles again the next day if you want. This highlights the difficulty: lack of mine and others knowledge of both spheres in equal depth. I know motorcycles. I don't know HAM as well. You all know the HAM as well, but there seems to be not an overlap with motorcycles so much. And, considering the spec this was designed for: "home, backpacking, and travel." it sounds like another product: cell phones. I have broken 3 phones packpacking, so I guess the KX3 is out altogether if it is not as rugged as as say, a Galaxy S phone. My 2c worth. On Sun, May 4, 2014 at 5:59 PM, Jim Brown-10 [via Elecraft] <[hidden email]> wrote:
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Re: Could this operate on a motorcycle?
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Hmmm.... kinda biting the hand that feeds you, here. ;-)
Considering your last three posts, you are kinda sound just a little bit angry we do not agree with your plan. You are, of course, free to buy the rig and use the radio as you think best, but it may be just a wee bit inappropriate to blame us for your disappointment that we do not think the rig is the best tool for the given task. Your condescending remarks are misplaced and tantamount to a lawyer impeaching his own witness ... sorry he asked, not because he was out of line, or that the question was improper; but because he simply did not get the answer he wanted! You impugn our knowledge of the application ... but frankly there are many among us who have deep insight into, and experience in, the very application you ask about. Good luck on the project, your club is lucky to have such a staunch advocate researching the options. Just MY take... Happy days, OM. ------------------- K8JHR ---------------------- On 5/4/2014 9:10 PM, rgconner wrote: > Hmm. What I think the biggest issue is that I am both a motorcycle > enthusiast and a budding HAM enthusiast... although the shine is coming off > quickly. > > "Motor scooters" come in 600+ cc now, they are as big and fast as half the > motorcycles out there. BMW's C600 will cruise all day long, and you can get > up and 1000 miles again the next day if you want. > > This highlights the difficulty: lack of mine and others knowledge of both > spheres in equal depth. I know motorcycles. I don't know HAM as well. You > all know the HAM as well, but there seems to be not an overlap with > motorcycles so much. > > And, considering the spec this was designed for: "home, backpacking, and > travel." it sounds like another product: cell phones. > > And we motorcyclists mount our cellphones to the handlebars all the time, > even small tablets. > > So I am surprised those products fair better than the KX3 in the > overlapping "home, backpacking, and travel." environment. > > I have broken 3 phones packpacking, so I guess the KX3 is out altogether if > it is not as rugged as as say, a Galaxy S phone. > > My 2c worth. > > On Sun, May 4, 2014 at 5:59 PM, Jim Brown-10 [via Elecraft] < > [hidden email]> wrote: > >> On 5/4/2014 5:17 PM, Russell Conner wrote: >>> well, the naysayers have convinced me, the Elecraft is not the radio for >> me >>> for this application, and this is the application I need to solve first. >> A >>> home station is a year or two away, if ever. >> >> Hi Russell, >> >> Congratulations on getting your license. The experience and backgrounds >> of those who have offered advice is pretty widely varied -- everything >> from true expert to opinions only to hearsay. Most of us own Elecraft >> rigs, and most have owned lots of other rigs too, over the years. I've >> had nearly 20 in the 60 years I've been a ham. Many of us own and use 2M >> and 440 MHz rigs -- I certainly do -- and I mostly use them on the road. >> >> I agree with the advice that Elecraft does not make a product to do what >> you want on your motorcycle -- for the short distances involved, I'd be >> looking at either a 2M rig if all the guys in your group are hams, or an >> FRS radio if they are not, looking for something you can fit with a >> suitable headset. >> >> As others have noted, the KX3 is a great rig for home, backpacking, and >> travel. That's what it's designed for. When you are ready for a rig like >> that, it's head and shoulders above the rest. Sort of like the >> difference between a Harley and a motor scooter. :) >> >> 73, Jim K9YC >> ______________________________________________________________ >> Elecraft mailing list >> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft >> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm >> Post: mailto:[hidden email]<http://user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=7588568&i=0> >> >> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net >> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html >> Message delivered to [hidden email]<http://user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=7588568&i=1> >> >> >> ------------------------------ >> If you reply to this email, your message will be added to the discussion >> below: >> >> http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/Could-this-operate-on-a-motorcycle-tp7588505p7588568.html >> To unsubscribe from Could this operate on a motorcycle?, click here< >> . >> NAML<http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/template/NamlServlet.jtp?macro=macro_viewer&id=instant_html%21nabble%3Aemail.naml&base=nabble.naml.namespaces.BasicNamespace-nabble.view.web.template.NabbleNamespace-nabble.view.web.template.NodeNamespace&breadcrumbs=notify_subscribers%21nabble%3Aemail.naml-instant_emails%21nabble%3Aemail.naml-send_instant_email%21nabble%3Aemail.naml> >> > > > > > -- > View this message in context: http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/Could-this-operate-on-a-motorcycle-tp7588505p7588570.html > Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com. > ______________________________________________________________ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:[hidden email] > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > Message delivered to [hidden email] > Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to [hidden email] |
Re: Could this operate on a motorcycle?
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In reply to this post by Phil Kane-2
On 5/4/2014 5:30 PM, Phil Kane wrote:
> Consider the RF Exposure hazard of sitting that close to a 100 watt > antenna! 50 W may even be too much. Personally, I'd use some kind of mast, and get the antenna UP so I was under the radiation pattern instead of in it, and if the HT on low power drove it to 20-30 watts, that's what I'd use most of the time. ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to [hidden email] |
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In reply to this post by rgconner
As I have stated many times. 5w is not cutting it.
Sorry, it is not. People saying it is all I need is not changing the facts. With a 5.1Db gain antenna, the local terrain is killing the signals in larger than 12 man groups, single file through the hills. We need more in many cases. On Sun, May 4, 2014 at 6:29 PM, Walter Underwood <[hidden email]>wrote: > You asked about a specific application, "co-ordinating rider > leader/wingman/tailgunners actions during rides". A VHF mobile or VHF/UHF > mobile is perfect for that. They are small, affordable, and the mobile > antennas are efficient. > > The issue is not Elecraft, it is using HF for this purpose. HF mobile > antennas are inefficient, often losing 10dB compared to a full-sized > antenna. That means you really need 100W. One reply suggested two 100W HF > rigs, the IC-706 and IC-7000. > > The Elecraft 100W amp would work for this, but it raises the cost to > around $2500 per vehicle, which is 10X the cost of a 2m mobile radio. One > of the reasons Elecraft gave for building the 100W amp was to make the KX3 > usable mobile. > > 6m or 10m do not have much advantage over 2m in this application, so there > is no reason to spend more money to run on those bands. If you did want > those bands, the IC-8900R covers 10m through 70cm with 50W for $400 (35W on > 70cm) (http://www.universal-radio.com/catalog/fm_txvrs/0890.html). > > I'm a backpacker and I love my KX3. I go lots of places where cell phones > don't work. But I would not recommend it for a motorcycle. I'm driving up > to Oregon next week and I'll try to get on the noontime net with 10W > mobile, but I don't really expect that to work. > > wunder > K6WRU > http://observer.wunderwood.org/ > > On May 4, 2014, at 6:10 PM, rgconner <[hidden email]> wrote: > > > Hmm. What I think the biggest issue is that I am both a motorcycle > > enthusiast and a budding HAM enthusiast... although the shine is coming > off > > quickly. > > > > "Motor scooters" come in 600+ cc now, they are as big and fast as half > the > > motorcycles out there. BMW's C600 will cruise all day long, and you can > get > > up and 1000 miles again the next day if you want. > > > > This highlights the difficulty: lack of mine and others knowledge of both > > spheres in equal depth. I know motorcycles. I don't know HAM as well. You > > all know the HAM as well, but there seems to be not an overlap with > > motorcycles so much. > > > > And, considering the spec this was designed for: "home, backpacking, and > > travel." it sounds like another product: cell phones. > > > > And we motorcyclists mount our cellphones to the handlebars all the time, > > even small tablets. > > > > So I am surprised those products fair better than the KX3 in the > > overlapping "home, backpacking, and travel." environment. > > > > I have broken 3 phones packpacking, so I guess the KX3 is out altogether > if > > it is not as rugged as as say, a Galaxy S phone. > > > > My 2c worth. > > > > On Sun, May 4, 2014 at 5:59 PM, Jim Brown-10 [via Elecraft] < > > [hidden email]> wrote: > > > >> On 5/4/2014 5:17 PM, Russell Conner wrote: > >>> well, the naysayers have convinced me, the Elecraft is not the radio > for > >> me > >>> for this application, and this is the application I need to solve > first. > >> A > >>> home station is a year or two away, if ever. > >> > >> Hi Russell, > >> > >> Congratulations on getting your license. The experience and backgrounds > >> of those who have offered advice is pretty widely varied -- everything > >> from true expert to opinions only to hearsay. Most of us own Elecraft > >> rigs, and most have owned lots of other rigs too, over the years. I've > >> had nearly 20 in the 60 years I've been a ham. Many of us own and use 2M > >> and 440 MHz rigs -- I certainly do -- and I mostly use them on the road. > >> > >> I agree with the advice that Elecraft does not make a product to do what > >> you want on your motorcycle -- for the short distances involved, I'd be > >> looking at either a 2M rig if all the guys in your group are hams, or an > >> FRS radio if they are not, looking for something you can fit with a > >> suitable headset. > >> > >> As others have noted, the KX3 is a great rig for home, backpacking, and > >> travel. That's what it's designed for. When you are ready for a rig like > >> that, it's head and shoulders above the rest. Sort of like the > >> difference between a Harley and a motor scooter. :) > >> > >> 73, Jim K9YC > >> ______________________________________________________________ > >> Elecraft mailing list > >> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > >> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > >> Post: mailto:[hidden email]< > http://user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=7588568&i=0> > >> > >> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > >> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > >> Message delivered to [hidden email]< > http://user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=7588568&i=1> > >> > >> > >> ------------------------------ > >> If you reply to this email, your message will be added to the discussion > >> below: > >> > >> > http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/Could-this-operate-on-a-motorcycle-tp7588505p7588568.html > >> To unsubscribe from Could this operate on a motorcycle?, click here< > > > >> . > >> NAML< > http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/template/NamlServlet.jtp?macro=macro_viewer&id=instant_html%21nabble%3Aemail.naml&base=nabble.naml.namespaces.BasicNamespace-nabble.view.web.template.NabbleNamespace-nabble.view.web.template.NodeNamespace&breadcrumbs=notify_subscribers%21nabble%3Aemail.naml-instant_emails%21nabble%3Aemail.naml-send_instant_email%21nabble%3Aemail.naml > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > -- > > View this message in context: > http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/Could-this-operate-on-a-motorcycle-tp7588505p7588570.html > > Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com. > > ______________________________________________________________ > > Elecraft mailing list > > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > > Post: mailto:[hidden email] > > > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > > Message delivered to [hidden email] > > -- > Walter Underwood > [hidden email] > > > > ______________________________________________________________ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:[hidden email] > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > Message delivered to [hidden email] > Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to [hidden email] |
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How big is that unit, what brand and model?
If something is the same size and does 50-70w, I am all for it. My stated requirement is to mount it on the handlebars, and that space is just about 4x9x3, the size of the RAM mount box I specified. So what unit meets those previously stated requirements? On Sun, May 4, 2014 at 6:47 PM, Walter Underwood <[hidden email]>wrote: > I am pretty sure I never suggested using a 5W rig. Mobile VHF rigs are > 50-75W. > > The KX3 is limited to 10W (8W at 12m and above), so it would not give any > more range than a 5W HT. > > wunder > K6WRU > > On May 4, 2014, at 6:39 PM, Russell Conner <[hidden email]> wrote: > > > As I have stated many times. 5w is not cutting it. > > Sorry, it is not. People saying it is all I need is not changing the > facts. With a 5.1Db gain antenna, the local terrain is killing the signals > in larger than 12 man groups, single file through the hills. > > > > We need more in many cases. > > > > > > On Sun, May 4, 2014 at 6:29 PM, Walter Underwood <[hidden email]> > wrote: > > You asked about a specific application, "co-ordinating rider > leader/wingman/tailgunners actions during rides". A VHF mobile or VHF/UHF > mobile is perfect for that. They are small, affordable, and the mobile > antennas are efficient. > > > > The issue is not Elecraft, it is using HF for this purpose. HF mobile > antennas are inefficient, often losing 10dB compared to a full-sized > antenna. That means you really need 100W. One reply suggested two 100W HF > rigs, the IC-706 and IC-7000. > > > > The Elecraft 100W amp would work for this, but it raises the cost to > around $2500 per vehicle, which is 10X the cost of a 2m mobile radio. One > of the reasons Elecraft gave for building the 100W amp was to make the KX3 > usable mobile. > > > > 6m or 10m do not have much advantage over 2m in this application, so > there is no reason to spend more money to run on those bands. If you did > want those bands, the IC-8900R covers 10m through 70cm with 50W for $400 > (35W on 70cm) (http://www.universal-radio.com/catalog/fm_txvrs/0890.html). > > > > I'm a backpacker and I love my KX3. I go lots of places where cell > phones don't work. But I would not recommend it for a motorcycle. I'm > driving up to Oregon next week and I'll try to get on the noontime net with > 10W mobile, but I don't really expect that to work. > > > > wunder > > K6WRU > > http://observer.wunderwood.org/ > > > > On May 4, 2014, at 6:10 PM, rgconner <[hidden email]> wrote: > > > > > Hmm. What I think the biggest issue is that I am both a motorcycle > > > enthusiast and a budding HAM enthusiast... although the shine is > coming off > > > quickly. > > > > > > "Motor scooters" come in 600+ cc now, they are as big and fast as half > the > > > motorcycles out there. BMW's C600 will cruise all day long, and you > can get > > > up and 1000 miles again the next day if you want. > > > > > > This highlights the difficulty: lack of mine and others knowledge of > both > > > spheres in equal depth. I know motorcycles. I don't know HAM as well. > You > > > all know the HAM as well, but there seems to be not an overlap with > > > motorcycles so much. > > > > > > And, considering the spec this was designed for: "home, backpacking, > and > > > travel." it sounds like another product: cell phones. > > > > > > And we motorcyclists mount our cellphones to the handlebars all the > time, > > > even small tablets. > > > > > > So I am surprised those products fair better than the KX3 in the > > > overlapping "home, backpacking, and travel." environment. > > > > > > I have broken 3 phones packpacking, so I guess the KX3 is out > altogether if > > > it is not as rugged as as say, a Galaxy S phone. > > > > > > My 2c worth. > > > > > > On Sun, May 4, 2014 at 5:59 PM, Jim Brown-10 [via Elecraft] < > > > [hidden email]> wrote: > > > > > >> On 5/4/2014 5:17 PM, Russell Conner wrote: > > >>> well, the naysayers have convinced me, the Elecraft is not the radio > for > > >> me > > >>> for this application, and this is the application I need to solve > first. > > >> A > > >>> home station is a year or two away, if ever. > > >> > > >> Hi Russell, > > >> > > >> Congratulations on getting your license. The experience and > backgrounds > > >> of those who have offered advice is pretty widely varied -- everything > > >> from true expert to opinions only to hearsay. Most of us own Elecraft > > >> rigs, and most have owned lots of other rigs too, over the years. I've > > >> had nearly 20 in the 60 years I've been a ham. Many of us own and use > 2M > > >> and 440 MHz rigs -- I certainly do -- and I mostly use them on the > road. > > >> > > >> I agree with the advice that Elecraft does not make a product to do > what > > >> you want on your motorcycle -- for the short distances involved, I'd > be > > >> looking at either a 2M rig if all the guys in your group are hams, or > an > > >> FRS radio if they are not, looking for something you can fit with a > > >> suitable headset. > > >> > > >> As others have noted, the KX3 is a great rig for home, backpacking, > and > > >> travel. That's what it's designed for. When you are ready for a rig > like > > >> that, it's head and shoulders above the rest. Sort of like the > > >> difference between a Harley and a motor scooter. :) > > >> > > >> 73, Jim K9YC > > >> ______________________________________________________________ > > >> Elecraft mailing list > > >> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > > >> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > > >> Post: mailto:[hidden email]< > http://user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=7588568&i=0> > > >> > > >> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > > >> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > > >> Message delivered to [hidden email]< > http://user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=7588568&i=1> > > >> > > >> > > >> ------------------------------ > > >> If you reply to this email, your message will be added to the > discussion > > >> below: > > >> > > >> > http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/Could-this-operate-on-a-motorcycle-tp7588505p7588568.html > > >> To unsubscribe from Could this operate on a motorcycle?, click here< > > > > >> . > > >> NAML< > http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/template/NamlServlet.jtp?macro=macro_viewer&id=instant_html%21nabble%3Aemail.naml&base=nabble.naml.namespaces.BasicNamespace-nabble.view.web.template.NabbleNamespace-nabble.view.web.template.NodeNamespace&breadcrumbs=notify_subscribers%21nabble%3Aemail.naml-instant_emails%21nabble%3Aemail.naml-send_instant_email%21nabble%3Aemail.naml > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > View this message in context: > http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/Could-this-operate-on-a-motorcycle-tp7588505p7588570.html > > > Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com. > > > ______________________________________________________________ > > > Elecraft mailing list > > > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > > > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > > > Post: mailto:[hidden email] > > > > > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > > > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > > > Message delivered to [hidden email] > > > > -- > > Walter Underwood > > [hidden email] > > > > > > > > ______________________________________________________________ > > Elecraft mailing list > > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > > Post: mailto:[hidden email] > > > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > > Message delivered to [hidden email] > > > > -- > Walter Underwood > [hidden email] > > > > ______________________________________________________________ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:[hidden email] > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > Message delivered to [hidden email] > Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to [hidden email] |
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Yep, great if I had a K1600 or a Goldwing, etc, but the small cockpit of
the F700gs does not have that sort of room. A detachable faceplate might do the trick, but still not be weatherproof enough. Private emails with gary to cut down on the cross talk has pointed out a key thing I had not considered: I am listening in an open vechicle, over a headset in a helmet. The sound quality of the KX3 is going to be lost, and fidelity won't be much better than the FT-60, without all the issues of mounting. So there you go. Killed by a requirement I had not considered but became clear as Gary and I shared ideas. On Sun, May 4, 2014 at 7:23 PM, Walter Underwood <[hidden email]>wrote: > I'm showing pages from Universal Radio because they are informative, not > to recommend that shop over anyone else. All of these rigs are roughly 2 > inches tall, 6 inches wide, and 6-7 inches deep. The front panel is on the > small end, so the faceplate size is about 2x6, much smaller than a car > radio. > > In alphabetical order, and some prices are with rebates... > > Alinco DR-135TMkIII, 50W, $170 - > http://www.universal-radio.com/catalog/fm_txvrs/1980.html > ICOM IC-2300H, 65W, $200 - > http://www.universal-radio.com/catalog/fm_txvrs/5023.html > ICOM IC-V8000, 75W, $220 - > http://www.universal-radio.com/catalog/fm_txvrs/4080.html > Kenwood TM-281A, 65W, $245 - > http://www.universal-radio.com/catalog/fm_txvrs/0281.html > Yaesu FT-1900R, 55W, $165 - > http://www.universal-radio.com/catalog/fm_txvrs/1900.html > Yaesu FT-2900R, 75W, $150 - > http://www.universal-radio.com/catalog/fm_txvrs/2900.html > > wunder > K6WRU > > On May 4, 2014, at 6:54 PM, Russell Conner <[hidden email]> wrote: > > > How big is that unit, what brand and model? > > > > If something is the same size and does 50-70w, I am all for it. > > > > My stated requirement is to mount it on the handlebars, and that space > is just about 4x9x3, the size of the RAM mount box I specified. > > > > So what unit meets those previously stated requirements? > > > > > > On Sun, May 4, 2014 at 6:47 PM, Walter Underwood <[hidden email]> > wrote: > > I am pretty sure I never suggested using a 5W rig. Mobile VHF rigs are > 50-75W. > > > > The KX3 is limited to 10W (8W at 12m and above), so it would not give > any more range than a 5W HT. > > > > wunder > > K6WRU > > > > On May 4, 2014, at 6:39 PM, Russell Conner <[hidden email]> wrote: > > > > > As I have stated many times. 5w is not cutting it. > > > Sorry, it is not. People saying it is all I need is not changing the > facts. With a 5.1Db gain antenna, the local terrain is killing the signals > in larger than 12 man groups, single file through the hills. > > > > > > We need more in many cases. > > > > > > > > > On Sun, May 4, 2014 at 6:29 PM, Walter Underwood < > [hidden email]> wrote: > > > You asked about a specific application, "co-ordinating rider > leader/wingman/tailgunners actions during rides". A VHF mobile or VHF/UHF > mobile is perfect for that. They are small, affordable, and the mobile > antennas are efficient. > > > > > > The issue is not Elecraft, it is using HF for this purpose. HF mobile > antennas are inefficient, often losing 10dB compared to a full-sized > antenna. That means you really need 100W. One reply suggested two 100W HF > rigs, the IC-706 and IC-7000. > > > > > > The Elecraft 100W amp would work for this, but it raises the cost to > around $2500 per vehicle, which is 10X the cost of a 2m mobile radio. One > of the reasons Elecraft gave for building the 100W amp was to make the KX3 > usable mobile. > > > > > > 6m or 10m do not have much advantage over 2m in this application, so > there is no reason to spend more money to run on those bands. If you did > want those bands, the IC-8900R covers 10m through 70cm with 50W for $400 > (35W on 70cm) (http://www.universal-radio.com/catalog/fm_txvrs/0890.html). > > > > > > I'm a backpacker and I love my KX3. I go lots of places where cell > phones don't work. But I would not recommend it for a motorcycle. I'm > driving up to Oregon next week and I'll try to get on the noontime net with > 10W mobile, but I don't really expect that to work. > > > > > > wunder > > > K6WRU > > > http://observer.wunderwood.org/ > > > > > > On May 4, 2014, at 6:10 PM, rgconner <[hidden email]> wrote: > > > > > > > Hmm. What I think the biggest issue is that I am both a motorcycle > > > > enthusiast and a budding HAM enthusiast... although the shine is > coming off > > > > quickly. > > > > > > > > "Motor scooters" come in 600+ cc now, they are as big and fast as > half the > > > > motorcycles out there. BMW's C600 will cruise all day long, and you > can get > > > > up and 1000 miles again the next day if you want. > > > > > > > > This highlights the difficulty: lack of mine and others knowledge of > both > > > > spheres in equal depth. I know motorcycles. I don't know HAM as > well. You > > > > all know the HAM as well, but there seems to be not an overlap with > > > > motorcycles so much. > > > > > > > > And, considering the spec this was designed for: "home, backpacking, > and > > > > travel." it sounds like another product: cell phones. > > > > > > > > And we motorcyclists mount our cellphones to the handlebars all the > time, > > > > even small tablets. > > > > > > > > So I am surprised those products fair better than the KX3 in the > > > > overlapping "home, backpacking, and travel." environment. > > > > > > > > I have broken 3 phones packpacking, so I guess the KX3 is out > altogether if > > > > it is not as rugged as as say, a Galaxy S phone. > > > > > > > > My 2c worth. > > > > > > > > On Sun, May 4, 2014 at 5:59 PM, Jim Brown-10 [via Elecraft] < > > > > [hidden email]> wrote: > > > > > > > >> On 5/4/2014 5:17 PM, Russell Conner wrote: > > > >>> well, the naysayers have convinced me, the Elecraft is not the > radio for > > > >> me > > > >>> for this application, and this is the application I need to solve > first. > > > >> A > > > >>> home station is a year or two away, if ever. > > > >> > > > >> Hi Russell, > > > >> > > > >> Congratulations on getting your license. The experience and > backgrounds > > > >> of those who have offered advice is pretty widely varied -- > everything > > > >> from true expert to opinions only to hearsay. Most of us own > Elecraft > > > >> rigs, and most have owned lots of other rigs too, over the years. > I've > > > >> had nearly 20 in the 60 years I've been a ham. Many of us own and > use 2M > > > >> and 440 MHz rigs -- I certainly do -- and I mostly use them on the > road. > > > >> > > > >> I agree with the advice that Elecraft does not make a product to do > what > > > >> you want on your motorcycle -- for the short distances involved, > I'd be > > > >> looking at either a 2M rig if all the guys in your group are hams, > or an > > > >> FRS radio if they are not, looking for something you can fit with a > > > >> suitable headset. > > > >> > > > >> As others have noted, the KX3 is a great rig for home, backpacking, > and > > > >> travel. That's what it's designed for. When you are ready for a rig > like > > > >> that, it's head and shoulders above the rest. Sort of like the > > > >> difference between a Harley and a motor scooter. :) > > > >> > > > >> 73, Jim K9YC > > > >> ______________________________________________________________ > > > >> Elecraft mailing list > > > >> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > > > >> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > > > >> Post: mailto:[hidden email]< > http://user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=7588568&i=0> > > > >> > > > >> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > > > >> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > > > >> Message delivered to [hidden email]< > http://user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=7588568&i=1> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> ------------------------------ > > > >> If you reply to this email, your message will be added to the > discussion > > > >> below: > > > >> > > > >> > http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/Could-this-operate-on-a-motorcycle-tp7588505p7588568.html > > > >> To unsubscribe from Could this operate on a motorcycle?, click here< > > > > > >> . > > > >> NAML< > http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/template/NamlServlet.jtp?macro=macro_viewer&id=instant_html%21nabble%3Aemail.naml&base=nabble.naml.namespaces.BasicNamespace-nabble.view.web.template.NabbleNamespace-nabble.view.web.template.NodeNamespace&breadcrumbs=notify_subscribers%21nabble%3Aemail.naml-instant_emails%21nabble%3Aemail.naml-send_instant_email%21nabble%3Aemail.naml > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > View this message in context: > http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/Could-this-operate-on-a-motorcycle-tp7588505p7588570.html > > > > Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com. > > > > ______________________________________________________________ > > > > Elecraft mailing list > > > > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > > > > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > > > > Post: mailto:[hidden email] > > > > > > > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > > > > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > > > > Message delivered to [hidden email] > > > > > > -- > > > Walter Underwood > > > [hidden email] > > > > > > > > > > > > ______________________________________________________________ > > > Elecraft mailing list > > > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > > > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > > > Post: mailto:[hidden email] > > > > > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > > > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > > > Message delivered to [hidden email] > > > > > > > -- > > Walter Underwood > > [hidden email] > > > > > > > > ______________________________________________________________ > > Elecraft mailing list > > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > > Post: mailto:[hidden email] > > > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > > Message delivered to [hidden email] > > > > -- > Walter Underwood > [hidden email] > > > > ______________________________________________________________ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:[hidden email] > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > Message delivered to [hidden email] > Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to [hidden email] |
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In reply to this post by rgconner
On Sun, 4 May 2014 16:35:16 -0700, Russell Conner wrote:
> Well, I thought I mentioned we were all using Comet or Diamond, I think the worse is a Db5.1 gain anntena and the Elmer has a SWR meter, and we are all losing less than 10% on most of the bands we use. Are you aware of the radiation pattern of a high gain antenna? Look into it. Gary - AG0N ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to [hidden email] |
Re: Could this operate on a motorcycle?
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In reply to this post by rgconner
Russell-
Congrats on the Tech license. You started an interesting thread. As I see it you are on a sport bike looking to keep in contact through varied terrain with 12 or so other bikes. I'm a Gold Winger, with over a decade on the marque, and we use our CBs, contrary to some comments here. It's not always easy and there are limits with distance and terrain. I seen some pretty amazing HT VHF/UHF set-ups on Wings-APRS and all! You speak of requirements and I'm not sure what exactly you need. Reading between the lines, there seems to be a direction to be in contact with all riders on the ride 100% of the time. The rig has to fit on/in your scoot. An unspoken requirement is that every rider on the ride is a licensed ham. A potential requirement is to able to contact emergency responders whenever needed. I don't think that any of these is a reasonable requirement. Sport riders in the Front Range near Denver/Boulder/Ft Collins most often are seen with the FRS clip on transceivers. I have seen no sport rider using CBs. Still there are areas and terrain where communications are minimal-even with satellite phones! When the problem looks insurmountable, perhaps a requirement revisit is the answer. First, 12 bikes in a group presents certain risks to all on the road-cagers, too. Operating a radio while riding twisties is a distraction that I think may be counter productive. I suggest that there are other ride models that may be more beneficial to you and your friends. Breaking into smaller, more manageable groups-say of 3-5 bikes, might be suggested. Smaller groups are more likely to maintain a closer distance lead to drag. Tighter groups would be able to maintain contact with each bike in the group at a lower wattage. FRS helmet radios are less expensive and are designed for your application. If you do find a radio that will fit the next problem will be an antenna and installation that won't make the scoot look trashed. Good luck with the problem. Jin KC0TRK |
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You don't have the requirements right.
We split to under 12 if we have more than 12 bikes, sometimes less, we broke into 4 and 4 once, just because we had a less skilled group on what was to be a spirited ride. There is no requirement for 100% rider participation. Only the ride officials, Captains, wingmen, and tail gunners are likely to be HAM operators. Last ride I was on, I was the only HAM, we used FRS. With PTT and helmet speakers, the operation is no more complex than hitting the horn or flashing the lights. It is right there by the thumb of the Clutch hand. CB is worse than useless. It is dangerous because key ups with intentional feedback startle you. no one turns on the CB in central Califoria, it appears to be populated by crack addicts. FRS/MURS is iffy, we were at Point Reyes and the working farms around us were chattering away on Blue Dot, Green Dot, and even some of the GMRS channels. We get what sounds like warehouses and gravel yards, and even garbage dumps chatter when we ride around. But no repeaters if the ride gets split. Happened this weekend, I lead the rear group 5 miles out of the way because the lead group followed where the Lead captian wanted to go, not where the directions said to go. Having him call "Left at Road X" would have got my attention, because the instructions said RIGHT. See why we want them? HAM is relatively uncrowded, with usually well behaved citizens on the waves. ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to [hidden email] |
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P.S. I stirred the pot, something I am sort of known for. =)
Believe me, we put a lot of thought into this, it is not a whim. ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to [hidden email] |
Re: Could this operate on a motorcycle?
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Administrator
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In reply to this post by rgconner
Folks - time to end the thread. We are drifting OT and also -way- exceeding the
daily single topic posting limit for the list. 73 Eric List Moderator elecraft.com On 5/4/2014 8:52 PM, Russell Conner wrote: > You don't have the requirements right. > > We split to under 12 if we have more than 12 bikes, sometimes less, we > broke into 4 and 4 once, just because we had a less skilled group on what > was to be a spirited ride. > ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to [hidden email] |
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In reply to this post by rgconner
A KX3 or any of the K line is not suitable for use on a vehicle that
requires so much concentration, coordination and attention to all aspects of its operation. Especially a road bike where all of the fore mentioned is of upmost importance for safety and staying uninjured and alive. As others have pointed out, a much more appropriate communication device would be either a handle bar mounted, or even a belt mounted hand held transceiver, for either 2 meters or 440 MHz, or one with a dual band capability. They operate in the FM mode, thus are more immune to man made noise and ignition noise interference. Once set to a desired (mutual with all operators) channel, they don't require further rider attention, other than maybe an occasional adjustment of the audio volume. They can be used with helmet mounted hearing pieces and microphones. A conveniently located, handle bar mounted, Push To Talk (PTT) switch coupled with a low profile(19") quarter wave whip, mounted on the rear of the bike, will be required. Depending on the terrain, the bike to bike range, can be as much as 15 miles, more than enough for the leader to be alerted to a problem by the "tail gunner". I'm a long time dirt bike, dual sport, quad and side x side rider and have organized and participated in many group rides and events. We have often used similar equipment for event control. In fact I have a permanently mounted, mobile, dual band (2M/440 MHz) transceiver in my competitive grade Polaris RZR side x side. Chuck, W7CS ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to [hidden email] |
Re: Could this operate on a motorcycle?
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Administrator
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Folks,
We closed this thread earlier this evening. 73, Eric List Moderator elecraft.com On 5/4/2014 11:33 PM, Chuck Smallhouse wrote: > A KX3 or any of the K line is not suitable for use on a vehicle that requires > so much concentration, coordination and attention to all aspects of its operatio ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to [hidden email] |
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