Elecraft

Do we need 2 groups?

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Michael Walker

Do we need 2 groups?

It is clear that the members of this group are amazingly social and love
their product.

However, I am concerned that the off topic (but valid) dialogues get away
from the actual charter of the original group and the the fact that
Elecraft staff are part of this group.

Why not have someone clone this group for those off topic conversations and
then everyone is happy and we aren't clouding the technical conversations
that are directly related to the product.

Mike va3mw
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Lynn W. Taylor, WB6UUT

Re: Do we need 2 groups?

In other words, divide up the group so that we all have to subscribe to
several lists instead of just one?

Each of those groups will of course tend to wander off topic, and likely
into topics that belong on the other group(s).....

We'd also see crossposts, like tp the Yahoo KX3 list and this one.

I've been around reflectors for about 25 years, and this is what they
do. Trying to tame them by making more groups will fail.

Best we all just learn to self-moderate a little better. Myself included.

There is a wonderful piece of software called POPfile, that is pretty
amazing in its' ability to sort mail. I haven't tried it on this list,
but I'm quite tempted. I think it'd solve the problem for those who
can't just skim and delete.

73 -- Lynn

On 6/27/2014 6:47 AM, Michael Walker wrote:

> It is clear that the members of this group are amazingly social and love
> their product.
>
> However, I am concerned that the off topic (but valid) dialogues get away
> from the actual charter of the original group and the the fact that
> Elecraft staff are part of this group.
>
> Why not have someone clone this group for those off topic conversations and
> then everyone is happy and we aren't clouding the technical conversations
> that are directly related to the product.
>
> Mike va3mw
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>

KM3K

Re: Do we need 2 groups?

In reply to this post by Michael Walker

Hello,
Yahoo has a feature that I use for each of my groups.
I cannot recall the name used for it but, basically without going into great detail, it is condenses the day's emails for that group into one email. I scan the summary and, if any topic looks interesting, I scroll down to read it; otherwise, I delete that email.
Some groups may have as many as 15 postings in that summary, so with this feature, rather than having to delete 15 emails, I delete only one.
I'd like to have that feature here as well.
Just my $0.02.
73 Jerry KM3K
Sent from my NOOK

"Lynn W. Taylor, WB6UUT" <[hidden email]> wrote:

In other words, divide up the group so that we all have to subscribe to
several lists instead of just one?

Each of those groups will of course tend to wander off topic, and likely
into topics that belong on the other group(s).....

We'd also see crossposts, like tp the Yahoo KX3 list and this one.

I've been around reflectors for about 25 years, and this is what they
do. Trying to tame them by making more groups will fail.

Best we all just learn to self-moderate a little better. Myself included.

There is a wonderful piece of software called POPfile, that is pretty
amazing in its' ability to sort mail. I haven't tried it on this list,
but I'm quite tempted. I think it'd solve the problem for those who
can't just skim and delete.

73 -- Lynn

On 6/27/2014 6:47 AM, Michael Walker wrote:

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Don Wilhelm-4

Re: Do we need 2 groups?

Jerry,

You *can* do that on the Elecraft reflector. Go to
http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft, log in, and set your
mail delivery to "Digest".

I find that inconvenient to post a reply, or even to read through it,
and some replying to a digest post do not delete the 'extra' and you
find the entire digest being sent back to the reflector.

You might try what I consider better, just by creating a filter in your
email client. First create an Elecraft folder in your Inbox.
Then create a filter so that everything with [Elecraft] in the subject
line is moved to the Elecraft folder.

Now you have your own personal digest that you can view at any time.
Delete those emails that are not of interest, reply to those you wish
to, or save some for future reference. Quick and easy and it does not
clutter your Inbox.

73,
Don W3FPR

On 6/27/2014 10:48 AM, Jsodus wrote:

> Hello,
> Yahoo has a feature that I use for each of my groups.
> I cannot recall the name used for it but, basically without going into great detail, it is condenses the day's emails for that group into one email. I scan the summary and, if any topic looks interesting, I scroll down to read it; otherwise, I delete that email.
> Some groups may have as many as 15 postings in that summary, so with this feature, rather than having to delete 15 emails, I delete only one.
> I'd like to have that feature here as well.
> Just my $0.02.
> 73 Jerry KM3K
> Sent from my NOOK
>
>

ejkkjh

Re: Do we need 2 groups?

In reply to this post by Michael Walker

I have asked Elecraft a couple times to create an email list for official
announcements from them, like new firmware releases, new products, technical
info releases, etc. Lots of companies have similar email lists for product
announcements etc. , where only Elecraft would send emails. The only reason
I am part of this list is to receive info from Elecraft, not to be part of a
ham radio chat list, like this list is now. I belong to approximately 20
email lists relating to ham radio, this list by far, has many more off topic
posts than all the others combined. So in my experience this is not the
norm for off topic posts.
A good example is nearly 40 posts over last couple days about RF in trees.
So I have lots of Elecraft gear and I have lots of trees, so it must be
relevant......
Emory WM3M
PS - if you feel the need to disagree with me, please reply off list to this
email. 73

-----Original Message-----
From: Michael Walker
Sent: Friday, June 27, 2014 9:47 AM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: [Elecraft] Do we need 2 groups?

It is clear that the members of this group are amazingly social and love
their product.

However, I am concerned that the off topic (but valid) dialogues get away
from the actual charter of the original group and the the fact that
Elecraft staff are part of this group.

Why not have someone clone this group for those off topic conversations and
then everyone is happy and we aren't clouding the technical conversations
that are directly related to the product.

Mike va3mw
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Michael Walker

Re: Do we need 2 groups?

I am aware of Digest, and that is fine, but I don't want Digest my real
time Elecraft discussions. Digest has its own set of issues as you loose
the subject of the conversation when you reply unless you stay on top of
it.

Then again, I could leave and join as required since I sold move of
Elecraft stuff (other than the KPA5 and the non-functioning KRC2).

IF we followed the [OT] format, then I can easily write a rule to take care
of it as well. Personally, I subscribe to 19 email forums. All of which I
have a variety of filters installed on. With those forums, I get 4-600
emails a day (and zero spam thanks to Gmail).

I leave it to the Moderators to solve. I just thought I would ask. I was
also concerned that the SME's (subject matter experts) from Elecraft would
stop paying attention, and that would be a great loss.

73 all, Mike va3mw
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Eric Swartz - WA6HHQ

Re: Do we need 2 groups?

Administrator

In reply to this post by ejkkjh

Gentlemen,

As per the list guidelines and in the interest of keeping list traffic reasonable, please avoid discussing list requests, splitting lists etc on the list. Emailing the moderator is always OK though. :-)

We -are- planning on setting up a parallel Elecraft announcement only list in the near future. Stay tuned.

73,

Eric
Moderator
elecraft.com
_..._

> On Jun 27, 2014, at 5:17 PM, <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> I have asked Elecraft a couple times to create an email list for official announcements from them, like new firmware releases, new products, technical info releases, etc. Lots of companies have similar email lists for product announcements etc. , where only Elecraft would send emails. The only reason I am part of this list is to receive info from Elecraft, not to be part of a ham radio chat list, like this list is now. I belong to approximately 20 email lists relating to ham radio, this list by far, has many more off topic posts than all the others combined. So in my experience this is not the norm for off topic posts.
> A good example is nearly 40 posts over last couple days about RF in trees. So I have lots of Elecraft gear and I have lots of trees, so it must be relevant......
> Emory WM3M
> PS - if you feel the need to disagree with me, please reply off list to this email. 73
>
>
> -----Original Message----- From: Michael Walker
> Sent: Friday, June 27, 2014 9:47 AM
> To: [hidden email]
> Subject: [Elecraft] Do we need 2 groups?
>
> It is clear that the members of this group are amazingly social and love
> their product.
>
> However, I am concerned that the off topic (but valid) dialogues get away
> from the actual charter of the original group and the the fact that
> Elecraft staff are part of this group.
>
> Why not have someone clone this group for those off topic conversations and
> then everyone is happy and we aren't clouding the technical conversations
> that are directly related to the product.
>
> Mike va3mw
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to [hidden email]
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to [hidden email]

Dake Holloway, K4EQ

Re: Do we need 2 groups?

In reply to this post by Michael Walker

Only problem is I get my email on my phone too and haven't found a way to filter mail on it. Hence, I get seemingly dozens of OT emails on it daily. No problem on the laptop.

Don Wilhelm <[hidden email]> wrote:

>Jerry,
>
>You *can* do that on the Elecraft reflector. Go to
>http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft, log in, and set your
>mail delivery to "Digest".
>
>I find that inconvenient to post a reply, or even to read through it,
>and some replying to a digest post do not delete the 'extra' and you
>find the entire digest being sent back to the reflector.
>
>You might try what I consider better, just by creating a filter in your
>email client. First create an Elecraft folder in your Inbox.
>Then create a filter so that everything with [Elecraft] in the subject
>line is moved to the Elecraft folder.
>
>Now you have your own personal digest that you can view at any time.
>Delete those emails that are not of interest, reply to those you wish
>to, or save some for future reference. Quick and easy and it does not
>clutter your Inbox.
>
>73,
>Don W3FPR
>
>On 6/27/2014 10:48 AM, Jsodus wrote:
>> Hello,
>> Yahoo has a feature that I use for each of my groups.
>> I cannot recall the name used for it but, basically without going into great detail, it is condenses the day's emails for that group into one email. I scan the summary and, if any topic looks interesting, I scroll down to read it; otherwise, I delete that email.
>> Some groups may have as many as 15 postings in that summary, so with this feature, rather than having to delete 15 emails, I delete only one.
>> I'd like to have that feature here as well.
>> Just my $0.02.
>> 73 Jerry KM3K
>> Sent from my NOOK
>>
>>
>
>______________________________________________________________
>Elecraft mailing list
>Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
>This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>Message delivered to [hidden email]

Elecraft mailing list

Re: Do we need 2 groups?

In reply to this post by Michael Walker

Why not have someone clone this group for the sore heads who's delete key is broken.

Willis 'Cookie' Cooke, TDXS DX Chairman
K5EWJ & Trustee N5BPS, USS Cavalla, USS Stewart

On Friday, June 27, 2014 8:49 AM, Michael Walker <[hidden email]> wrote:

It is clear that the members of this group are amazingly social and love
their product.

However, I am concerned that the off topic (but valid) dialogues get away
from the actual charter of the original group and the the fact that
Elecraft staff are part of this group.

Why not have someone clone this group for those off topic conversations and
then everyone is happy and we aren't clouding the technical conversations
that are directly related to the product.

Mike va3mw
______________________________________________________________
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
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______________________________________________________________
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Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:[hidden email]

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Elecraft mailing list

Re: Do we need 2 groups?

In reply to this post by Lynn W. Taylor, WB6UUT

The actual charter as I understand it is to discuss matters related to Amateur Radio in a rational manner. It is sponsored by Elecraft, so things related to Elecraft are emphasized. I do not recall any clause limiting the topics to those which all Amateurs agree (is there any such?) Certainly there have been some topics that are more controversial than average discussed on this forum with a sharp divide of opinions, but since Elecraft products can be used or discarded by the actions of ARRL and FCC, I would say the controversy is exactly on target. I would rather that only my views be elaborated and I am sure that others have the same wish, but it is not going to happen. How else other than discussion can we reach any reasonable solution?

Willis 'Cookie' Cooke, TDXS DX Chairman
K5EWJ & Trustee N5BPS, USS Cavalla, USS Stewart

On Friday, June 27, 2014 12:11 PM, "Lynn W. Taylor, WB6UUT" <[hidden email]> wrote:

In other words, divide up the group so that we all have to subscribe to
several lists instead of just one?

Each of those groups will of course tend to wander off topic, and likely
into topics that belong on the other group(s).....

We'd also see crossposts, like tp the Yahoo
KX3 list and this one.

I've been around reflectors for about 25 years, and this is what they
do. Trying to tame them by making more groups will fail.

Best we all just learn to self-moderate a little better. Myself included.

There is a wonderful piece of software called POPfile, that is pretty
amazing in its' ability to sort mail. I haven't tried it on this list,
but I'm quite tempted. I think it'd solve the problem for those who
can't just skim and delete.

73 -- Lynn

On 6/27/2014 6:47 AM, Michael Walker wrote:
> It is clear that the members of this group are amazingly social and love
> their product.
>
> However, I am
concerned that the off topic (but valid) dialogues get away

> from the actual charter of the original group and the the fact that
> Elecraft staff are part of this group.
>
> Why not have someone clone this group for those off topic conversations and
> then everyone is happy and we aren't clouding the technical conversations
> that are directly related to the product.
>
> Mike va3mw
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to [hidden email]

>

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EricJ-2

Re: Do we need 2 groups?

Between self-moderation and Eric's very reasonable tolerance of OT
posts, I don't think further measures are necessary. Breaking it up into
subgroups just means the experts we all rely on most will have less
reason to hang around answering questions. That would be a very negative
consequence.

What would REALLY help is that more people use meaningful subject lines,
particularly using Elecraft model numbers, and OT when that is the case.
I filter out KX3 and K3 because I don't have those rigs. Lots of posts
have to do with those two rigs, but don't note it in the subject line.
Not a problem, though, because I have a functioning Delete key and I'm
trained to use it.

Ironically, this thread about OT complaints and splitting up the group
is far less interesting than any of the OT threads that precipitated it.

Eric
KE6US

On 6/27/2014 1:17 PM, WILLIS COOKE via Elecraft wrote:

> The actual charter as I understand it is to discuss matters related to Amateur Radio in a rational manner. It is sponsored by Elecraft, so things related to Elecraft are emphasized. I do not recall any clause limiting the topics to those which all Amateurs agree (is there any such?) Certainly there have been some topics that are more controversial than average discussed on this forum with a sharp divide of opinions, but since Elecraft products can be used or discarded by the actions of ARRL and FCC, I would say the controversy is exactly on target. I would rather that only my views be elaborated and I am sure that others have the same wish, but it is not going to happen. How else other than discussion can we reach any reasonable solution?
>
> Willis 'Cookie' Cooke, TDXS DX Chairman
> K5EWJ & Trustee N5BPS, USS Cavalla, USS Stewart
>
>
> On Friday, June 27, 2014 12:11 PM, "Lynn W. Taylor, WB6UUT" <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>
>
> In other words, divide up the group so that we all have to subscribe to
> several lists instead of just one?
>
> Each of those groups will of course tend to wander off topic, and likely
> into topics that belong on the other group(s).....
>
> We'd also see crossposts, like tp the Yahoo
> KX3 list and this one.
>
> I've been around reflectors for about 25 years, and this is what they
> do. Trying to tame them by making more groups will fail.
>
> Best we all just learn to self-moderate a little better. Myself included.
>
> There is a wonderful piece of software called POPfile, that is pretty
> amazing in its' ability to sort mail. I haven't tried it on this list,
> but I'm quite tempted. I think it'd solve the problem for those who
> can't just skim and delete.
>
> 73 -- Lynn
>
> On 6/27/2014 6:47 AM, Michael Walker wrote:
>> It is clear that the members of this group are amazingly social and love
>> their product.
>>
>> However, I am
> concerned that the off topic (but valid) dialogues get away
>> from the actual charter of the original group and the the fact that
>> Elecraft staff are part of this group.
>>
>> Why not have someone clone this group for those off topic conversations and
>> then everyone is happy and we aren't clouding the technical conversations
>> that are directly related to the product.
>>
>> Mike va3mw
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> Elecraft mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>> Message delivered to [hidden email]
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to [hidden email]
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to [hidden email]
>
>