Dreaded ERR 12V Message

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Dreaded ERR 12V Message

Elecraft mailing list
While operating 20CW with about 100 watts, my K3 (S/N 1428) suddenly displayed the dreaded ERR 12V  message. The circuit breaker did not trip. I was not able to operate even at low power until I powered off and then back on. I was able to operate again, but it would intermittently display the message again. I was able to operate fine with 10 watts (after powering off/on) This happened on other bands and on SSB.  I noticed that as I turned the power level clockwise  while listening that the background noise noticeable dropped with the power level went over 12 watts. I also occasionally got the message even while not transmitting.


Any other advice (besides replacing the KPA3 power connector)?
Thanks,
Gerry, W1GD
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Re: Dreaded ERR 12V Message

Don Wilhelm-4
Gerry,

There are several reasons for ERR 12V - look in the manual Error chart
for possible activities.
There is another possibility that is not in the manual.  See
http://www.elecraft.com/manual/KPA3%20Power%20Connector%20Replacement.pdf

I am curious why you said "other than replacing the KPA3 power
connector" - unless you have already made that change.

On earlier K3s, gold pins were not initially used for the 12v power pins
to the KPA3.  In some cases, the tinned pins were not sufficient to
carry the required current.
Elecraft does offer a KPA3CONMDKT to allow you to change those pins to
gold plated types.  You may order that kit from [hidden email].  I
recall they are being provided at no cost.

The kit is not difficult to install, but it does require removing the
rear panel from the K3 to gain access and you can expect to spend some
time removing screws.

73,
Don W3FPR

On 5/3/2015 3:34 PM, Gerry Kersus via Elecraft wrote:
> While operating 20CW with about 100 watts, my K3 (S/N 1428) suddenly displayed the dreaded ERR 12V  message. The circuit breaker did not trip. I was not able to operate even at low power until I powered off and then back on. I was able to operate again, but it would intermittently display the message again. I was able to operate fine with 10 watts (after powering off/on) This happened on other bands and on SSB.  I noticed that as I turned the power level clockwise  while listening that the background noise noticeable dropped with the power level went over 12 watts. I also occasionally got the message even while not transmitting.
>
>
> Any other advice (besides replacing the KPA3 power connector)?
> Thanks,
> Gerry, W1GD
>

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Re: Dreaded ERR 12V Message

Elecraft mailing list
In reply to this post by Elecraft mailing list
 Gerry,

Don's last suggestion and link is almost certainly answers the problem. Having owned two K3's in that serial range, I had the exact same issue with both. Both had the tin connectors. Replaced both with Elecraft supplied gold and no problems since. Elecraft will likely give you the gold connectors.  With the earlier rigs, it's not a question of "if", it's when!

John
N0IJ

Sent from my iPhone

> On May 3, 2015, at 2:34 PM, Gerry Kersus via Elecraft <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> While operating 20CW with about 100 watts, my K3 (S/N 1428) suddenly displayed the dreaded ERR 12V  message. The circuit breaker did not trip. I was not able to operate even at low power until I powered off and then back on. I was able to operate again, but it would intermittently display the message again. I was able to operate fine with 10 watts (after powering off/on) This happened on other bands and on SSB.  I noticed that as I turned the power level clockwise  while listening that the background noise noticeable dropped with the power level went over 12 watts. I also occasionally got the message even while not transmitting.
>
>
> Any other advice (besides replacing the KPA3 power connector)?
> Thanks,
> Gerry, W1GD
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
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Re: Dreaded ERR 12V Message

Elecraft mailing list
In reply to this post by Don Wilhelm-4
Tnx Don,
Actually I did look at the K3 Manual but the breaker has not tripped. Since the KPA3 does work some of the time, I assume it's not a KPA3 short.  


I read this list regularly and I am aware of the connector issue with early K3s including mine.  In fact, I believe that I have the replacement connector because Elecraft sent it to me when I had issues with other connectors.  I have not replaced it since I didn't have this problem before.  


I have already reviewed the replacement instructions -- it does seem like a fair about of dis-assembly is needed to access the connector. While I've done this level of dis-assembly several times before, I was just hoping to avoid it.  As I recall there was also another hard-wired fix, but I'm not sure it's any easier to install.


I guess I'll go find the new connector.......


73,
Gerry, W1GD



-----Original Message-----
From: Don Wilhelm <[hidden email]>
To: w1gd <[hidden email]>; elecraft <[hidden email]>
Sent: Sun, May 3, 2015 4:29 pm
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Dreaded ERR 12V Message


Gerry,

There are several reasons for ERR 12V - look in the manual Error chart

for possible activities.
There is another possibility that is not in the
manual.  See

http://www.elecraft.com/manual/KPA3%20Power%20Connector%20Replacement.pdf

I
am curious why you said "other than replacing the KPA3 power
connector" -
unless you have already made that change.

On earlier K3s, gold pins were not
initially used for the 12v power pins
to the KPA3.  In some cases, the tinned
pins were not sufficient to
carry the required current.
Elecraft does offer a
KPA3CONMDKT to allow you to change those pins to
gold plated types.  You may
order that kit from [hidden email].  I
recall they are being provided at
no cost.

The kit is not difficult to install, but it does require removing
the
rear panel from the K3 to gain access and you can expect to spend some

time removing screws.

73,
Don W3FPR

On 5/3/2015 3:34 PM, Gerry Kersus
via Elecraft wrote:
> While operating 20CW with about 100 watts, my K3 (S/N
1428) suddenly displayed the dreaded ERR 12V  message. The circuit breaker did
not trip. I was not able to operate even at low power until I powered off and
then back on. I was able to operate again, but it would intermittently display
the message again. I was able to operate fine with 10 watts (after powering
off/on) This happened on other bands and on SSB.  I noticed that as I turned the
power level clockwise  while listening that the background noise noticeable
dropped with the power level went over 12 watts. I also occasionally got the
message even while not transmitting.
>
>
> Any other advice (besides
replacing the KPA3 power connector)?
> Thanks,
> Gerry, W1GD
>


 
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Re: Dreaded ERR 12V Message

Don Wilhelm-4
Gerry,

Yes, gaining access to bypass the pins to implement the hard-wired fix
is just about the same as installing the pins.
That hard wired fix is good for situations when on a DXpedition and
there is not time to get the parts to the customer.

73,
Don W3FPR

On 5/3/2015 4:56 PM, Gerry Kersus via Elecraft wrote:

> Tnx Don,
> Actually I did look at the K3 Manual but the breaker has not tripped. Since the KPA3 does work some of the time, I assume it's not a KPA3 short.
>
>
> I read this list regularly and I am aware of the connector issue with early K3s including mine.  In fact, I believe that I have the replacement connector because Elecraft sent it to me when I had issues with other connectors.  I have not replaced it since I didn't have this problem before.
>
>
> I have already reviewed the replacement instructions -- it does seem like a fair about of dis-assembly is needed to access the connector. While I've done this level of dis-assembly several times before, I was just hoping to avoid it.  As I recall there was also another hard-wired fix, but I'm not sure it's any easier to install.
>
>
> I guess I'll go find the new connector.......
>
>
>

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Re: Dreaded ERR 12V Message

Elecraft mailing list
In reply to this post by Elecraft mailing list
Don,
This is to provide closure to my problem:


I did locate the new connectors. After dis-assembly of the K3, I found that the 6 pins on P67B on the K3 Main board were discolored.  I replaced the 6 pins as well as the mating 13x2 connector J67B on the KPAIO3 board. Even under magnification, I could not see any discoloration on the P68B connector.  So, I just replaced the 6 pins with the new gold pin connection and not the J68B.  


After 48 hours, including about 100 contacts in the CQ M contest, everything seems to be normal.


I did encounter an problem during dis-assembly:  When trying to remove the two 4-40 pan head screws holding the rear panel to the bottom 2D fasteners, neither screw would budge.  (There were no problems with any other screws).  I even tried my reliable screw extractor, but that didn't work either -- it's like the screws had galled.  I re-assembled the K3 without those two screws, but I will need to order two new 2D connectors and 4-40 pan head screws.


Tnx again for your help.


Gerry, W1GD



-----Original Message-----
From: w1gd <[hidden email]>
To: don <[hidden email]>; elecraft <[hidden email]>
Sent: Sun, May 3, 2015 4:56 pm
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Dreaded ERR 12V Message


 Tnx Don,  
Actually I did look at the K3 Manual but the breaker has not tripped. Since the KPA3 does work some of the time, I assume it's not a KPA3 short.    
   
   
   
   
I read this list regularly and I am aware of the connector issue with early K3s including mine.  In fact, I believe that I have the replacement connector because Elecraft sent it to me when I had issues with other connectors.  I have not replaced it since I didn't have this problem before.    
   
   
   
   
I have already reviewed the replacement instructions -- it does seem like a fair about of dis-assembly is needed to access the connector. While I've done this level of dis-assembly several times before, I was just hoping to avoid it.  As I recall there was also another hard-wired fix, but I'm not sure it's any easier to install.  
   
   
   
   
I guess I'll go find the new connector.......  
   
   
   
   
73,  
   
Gerry, W1GD  
   
   
   
-----Original Message-----    
 From: Don Wilhelm <[hidden email]>    
 To: w1gd <[hidden email]>; elecraft <[hidden email]>    
 Sent: Sun, May 3, 2015 4:29 pm    
 Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Dreaded ERR 12V Message    
     
     
     
Gerry,

There are several reasons for ERR 12V - look in the manual Error chart

for possible activities.
There is another possibility that is not in the
manual.  See

http://www.elecraft.com/manual/KPA3%20Power%20Connector%20Replacement.pdf

I
am curious why you said "other than replacing the KPA3 power
connector" -
unless you have already made that change.

On earlier K3s, gold pins were not
initially used for the 12v power pins
to the KPA3.  In some cases, the tinned
pins were not sufficient to
carry the required current.
Elecraft does offer a
KPA3CONMDKT to allow you to change those pins to
gold plated types.  You may
order that kit from [hidden email].  I
recall they are being provided at
no cost.

The kit is not difficult to install, but it does require removing
the
rear panel from the K3 to gain access and you can expect to spend some

time removing screws.

73,
Don W3FPR

On 5/3/2015 3:34 PM, Gerry Kersus
via Elecraft wrote:
> While operating 20CW with about 100 watts, my K3 (S/N
1428) suddenly displayed the dreaded ERR 12V  message. The circuit breaker did
not trip. I was not able to operate even at low power until I powered off and
then back on. I was able to operate again, but it would intermittently display
the message again. I was able to operate fine with 10 watts (after powering
off/on) This happened on other bands and on SSB.  I noticed that as I turned the
power level clockwise  while listening that the background noise noticeable
dropped with the power level went over 12 watts. I also occasionally got the
message even while not transmitting.
>
>
> Any other advice (besides
replacing the KPA3 power connector)?
> Thanks,
> Gerry, W1GD
>


     
   
   
 

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Re: Dreaded ERR 12V Message

Don Wilhelm-5
Gerry,

I am glad it has worked well for you.

Did you install stainless steel screws in the past?  That may be one
reason for the galling.  Steel into aluminum is not usually a problem,
but it can be at times - it is worse with stainless steel than with
regular steel screws.  The black screws are supposed to have a bit of a
lubricating coating, but it does no harm to give it a little bit more
lubrication - and I do mean a *little* bit - add a drop to the screw
threads and blot the excess off with a paper towel, that is all it takes.
When you replace the 2D connectors and the screws, us a tiny drop of oil
on the threads - remember, you do not want any runoff.

73,
Don W3FPR


On 5/10/2015 4:37 PM, Gerry Kersus via Elecraft wrote:

> Don,
> This is to provide closure to my problem:
>
>
> I did locate the new connectors. After dis-assembly of the K3, I found that the 6 pins on P67B on the K3 Main board were discolored.  I replaced the 6 pins as well as the mating 13x2 connector J67B on the KPAIO3 board. Even under magnification, I could not see any discoloration on the P68B connector.  So, I just replaced the 6 pins with the new gold pin connection and not the J68B.
>
>
> After 48 hours, including about 100 contacts in the CQ M contest, everything seems to be normal.
>
>
> I did encounter an problem during dis-assembly:  When trying to remove the two 4-40 pan head screws holding the rear panel to the bottom 2D fasteners, neither screw would budge.  (There were no problems with any other screws).  I even tried my reliable screw extractor, but that didn't work either -- it's like the screws had galled.  I re-assembled the K3 without those two screws, but I will need to order two new 2D connectors and 4-40 pan head screws.
>
>

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Re: Dreaded ERR 12V Message

Elecraft mailing list
 No, these were the stock screws.  I'm surprised they stuck like they did.  None of the other black screws have  had a problem and the radio has certainly have never been in a high humidity environment.  I will used the "little" bit of lubricant when I replace them.


73,
Gerry, D1GD



-----Original Message-----
From: Don Wilhelm <[hidden email]>
To: w1gd <[hidden email]>; elecraft <[hidden email]>
Sent: Sun, May 10, 2015 5:39 pm
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Dreaded ERR 12V Message


Gerry,

I am glad it has worked well for you.

Did you install stainless
steel screws in the past?  That may be one
reason for the galling.  Steel into
aluminum is not usually a problem,
but it can be at times - it is worse with
stainless steel than with
regular steel screws.  The black screws are supposed
to have a bit of a
lubricating coating, but it does no harm to give it a
little bit more
lubrication - and I do mean a *little* bit - add a drop to the
screw
threads and blot the excess off with a paper towel, that is all it
takes.
When you replace the 2D connectors and the screws, us a tiny drop of oil

on the threads - remember, you do not want any runoff.

73,
Don
W3FPR


On 5/10/2015 4:37 PM, Gerry Kersus via Elecraft wrote:
> Don,
>
This is to provide closure to my problem:
>
>
> I did locate the new
connectors. After dis-assembly of the K3, I found that the 6 pins on P67B on the
K3 Main board were discolored.  I replaced the 6 pins as well as the mating 13x2
connector J67B on the KPAIO3 board. Even under magnification, I could not see
any discoloration on the P68B connector.  So, I just replaced the 6 pins with
the new gold pin connection and not the J68B.
>
>
> After 48 hours, including
about 100 contacts in the CQ M contest, everything seems to be normal.
>
>
>
I did encounter an problem during dis-assembly:  When trying to remove the two
4-40 pan head screws holding the rear panel to the bottom 2D fasteners, neither
screw would budge.  (There were no problems with any other screws).  I even
tried my reliable screw extractor, but that didn't work either -- it's like the
screws had galled.  I re-assembled the K3 without those two screws, but I will
need to order two new 2D connectors and 4-40 pan head screws.
>
>


 
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Re: Dreaded ERR 12V Message

Elecraft mailing list

I had a stuck screw on my KPA500 that would not budge I removed
all but the offending screw then turned the 2d block to loosen it.



      From: Gerry Kersus via Elecraft <[hidden email]>
 To: [hidden email]; [hidden email]
 Sent: Sunday, May 10, 2015 7:43 PM
 Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Dreaded ERR 12V Message
   
 No, these were the stock screws.  I'm surprised they stuck like they did.  None of the other black screws have  had a problem and the radio has certainly have never been in a high humidity environment.  I will used the "little" bit of lubricant when I replace them.


73,
Gerry, D1GD





-----Original Message-----
From: Don Wilhelm <[hidden email]>
To: w1gd <[hidden email]>; elecraft <[hidden email]>
Sent: Sun, May 10, 2015 5:39 pm
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Dreaded ERR 12V Message


Gerry,

I am glad it has worked well for you.

Did you install stainless
steel screws in the past?  That may be one
reason for the galling.  Steel into
aluminum is not usually a problem,
but it can be at times - it is worse with
stainless steel than with
regular steel screws.  The black screws are supposed
to have a bit of a
lubricating coating, but it does no harm to give it a
little bit more
lubrication - and I do mean a *little* bit - add a drop to the
screw
threads and blot the excess off with a paper towel, that is all it
takes.
When you replace the 2D connectors and the screws, us a tiny drop of oil

on the threads - remember, you do not want any runoff.

73,
Don
W3FPR


On 5/10/2015 4:37 PM, Gerry Kersus via Elecraft wrote:
> Don,
>
This is to provide closure to my problem:
>
>
> I did locate the new
connectors. After dis-assembly of the K3, I found that the 6 pins on P67B on the
K3 Main board were discolored.  I replaced the 6 pins as well as the mating 13x2
connector J67B on the KPAIO3 board. Even under magnification, I could not see
any discoloration on the P68B connector.  So, I just replaced the 6 pins with
the new gold pin connection and not the J68B.
>
>
> After 48 hours, including
about 100 contacts in the CQ M contest, everything seems to be normal.
>
>
>
I did encounter an problem during dis-assembly:  When trying to remove the two
4-40 pan head screws holding the rear panel to the bottom 2D fasteners, neither
screw would budge.  (There were no problems with any other screws).  I even
tried my reliable screw extractor, but that didn't work either -- it's like the
screws had galled.  I re-assembled the K3 without those two screws, but I will
need to order two new 2D connectors and 4-40 pan head screws.
>
>


 
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Re: Dreaded ERR 12V Message

Elecraft mailing list
Guys, if you must add lub to any thread, put a drop on a cloth and wipe the threads with it.  Do not over lub the threads. 

Mel, K6KBE

      From: Harry Yingst via Elecraft <[hidden email]>
 To: "[hidden email]" <[hidden email]>; "[hidden email]" <[hidden email]>; "[hidden email]" <[hidden email]>
 Sent: Sunday, May 10, 2015 5:01 PM
 Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Dreaded ERR 12V Message
   

I had a stuck screw on my KPA500 that would not budge I removed
all but the offending screw then turned the 2d block to loosen it.



      From: Gerry Kersus via Elecraft <[hidden email]>
 To: [hidden email]; [hidden email]
 Sent: Sunday, May 10, 2015 7:43 PM
 Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Dreaded ERR 12V Message
 
 No, these were the stock screws.  I'm surprised they stuck like they did.  None of the other black screws have  had a problem and the radio has certainly have never been in a high humidity environment.  I will used the "little" bit of lubricant when I replace them.


73,
Gerry, D1GD





-----Original Message-----
From: Don Wilhelm <[hidden email]>
To: w1gd <[hidden email]>; elecraft <[hidden email]>
Sent: Sun, May 10, 2015 5:39 pm
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Dreaded ERR 12V Message


Gerry,

I am glad it has worked well for you.

Did you install stainless
steel screws in the past?  That may be one
reason for the galling.  Steel into
aluminum is not usually a problem,
but it can be at times - it is worse with
stainless steel than with
regular steel screws.  The black screws are supposed
to have a bit of a
lubricating coating, but it does no harm to give it a
little bit more
lubrication - and I do mean a *little* bit - add a drop to the
screw
threads and blot the excess off with a paper towel, that is all it
takes.
When you replace the 2D connectors and the screws, us a tiny drop of oil

on the threads - remember, you do not want any runoff.

73,
Don
W3FPR


On 5/10/2015 4:37 PM, Gerry Kersus via Elecraft wrote:
> Don,
>
This is to provide closure to my problem:
>
>
> I did locate the new
connectors. After dis-assembly of the K3, I found that the 6 pins on P67B on the
K3 Main board were discolored.  I replaced the 6 pins as well as the mating 13x2
connector J67B on the KPAIO3 board. Even under magnification, I could not see
any discoloration on the P68B connector.  So, I just replaced the 6 pins with
the new gold pin connection and not the J68B.
>
>
> After 48 hours, including
about 100 contacts in the CQ M contest, everything seems to be normal.
>
>
>
I did encounter an problem during dis-assembly:  When trying to remove the two
4-40 pan head screws holding the rear panel to the bottom 2D fasteners, neither
screw would budge.  (There were no problems with any other screws).  I even
tried my reliable screw extractor, but that didn't work either -- it's like the
screws had galled.  I re-assembled the K3 without those two screws, but I will
need to order two new 2D connectors and 4-40 pan head screws.
>
>


 
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Re: Dreaded ERR 12V Message

David Orman
I would use anti-seize for the threads instead of a normal lubricant, it
can reduce issues between dissimilar metals and reduce galling.

On Sun, May 10, 2015 at 7:09 PM, Mel Farrer via Elecraft <
[hidden email]> wrote:

> Guys, if you must add lub to any thread, put a drop on a cloth and wipe
> the threads with it.  Do not over lub the threads.
>
> Mel, K6KBE
>
>       From: Harry Yingst via Elecraft <[hidden email]>
>  To: "[hidden email]" <[hidden email]>; "[hidden email]" <[hidden email]>; "
> [hidden email]" <[hidden email]>
>  Sent: Sunday, May 10, 2015 5:01 PM
>  Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Dreaded ERR 12V Message
>
>
> I had a stuck screw on my KPA500 that would not budge I removed
> all but the offending screw then turned the 2d block to loosen it.
>
>
>
>       From: Gerry Kersus via Elecraft <[hidden email]>
>  To: [hidden email]; [hidden email]
>  Sent: Sunday, May 10, 2015 7:43 PM
>  Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Dreaded ERR 12V Message
>
>  No, these were the stock screws.  I'm surprised they stuck like they
> did.  None of the other black screws have  had a problem and the radio has
> certainly have never been in a high humidity environment.  I will used the
> "little" bit of lubricant when I replace them.
>
>
> 73,
> Gerry, D1GD
>
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Don Wilhelm <[hidden email]>
> To: w1gd <[hidden email]>; elecraft <[hidden email]>
> Sent: Sun, May 10, 2015 5:39 pm
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Dreaded ERR 12V Message
>
>
> Gerry,
>
> I am glad it has worked well for you.
>
> Did you install stainless
> steel screws in the past?  That may be one
> reason for the galling.  Steel into
> aluminum is not usually a problem,
> but it can be at times - it is worse with
> stainless steel than with
> regular steel screws.  The black screws are supposed
> to have a bit of a
> lubricating coating, but it does no harm to give it a
> little bit more
> lubrication - and I do mean a *little* bit - add a drop to the
> screw
> threads and blot the excess off with a paper towel, that is all it
> takes.
> When you replace the 2D connectors and the screws, us a tiny drop of oil
>
> on the threads - remember, you do not want any runoff.
>
> 73,
> Don
> W3FPR
>
>
> On 5/10/2015 4:37 PM, Gerry Kersus via Elecraft wrote:
> > Don,
> >
> This is to provide closure to my problem:
> >
> >
> > I did locate the new
> connectors. After dis-assembly of the K3, I found that the 6 pins on P67B
> on the
> K3 Main board were discolored.  I replaced the 6 pins as well as the
> mating 13x2
> connector J67B on the KPAIO3 board. Even under magnification, I could not
> see
> any discoloration on the P68B connector.  So, I just replaced the 6 pins
> with
> the new gold pin connection and not the J68B.
> >
> >
> > After 48 hours, including
> about 100 contacts in the CQ M contest, everything seems to be normal.
> >
> >
> >
> I did encounter an problem during dis-assembly:  When trying to remove the
> two
> 4-40 pan head screws holding the rear panel to the bottom 2D fasteners,
> neither
> screw would budge.  (There were no problems with any other screws).  I even
> tried my reliable screw extractor, but that didn't work either -- it's
> like the
> screws had galled.  I re-assembled the K3 without those two screws, but I
> will
> need to order two new 2D connectors and 4-40 pan head screws.
> >
> >
>
>
>
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Re: Dreaded ERR 12V Message

Greg - AB7R
In reply to this post by Elecraft mailing list
Gerry,

Send an email to K3Support (Gary) and ask him for the diagram for bypassing
the header for the 12V line.  I may have it at home somewhere but not sure.

73
Greg


On Sun, May 3, 2015 at 12:34 PM, Gerry Kersus via Elecraft <
[hidden email]> wrote:

> While operating 20CW with about 100 watts, my K3 (S/N 1428) suddenly
> displayed the dreaded ERR 12V  message. The circuit breaker did not trip. I
> was not able to operate even at low power until I powered off and then back
> on. I was able to operate again, but it would intermittently display the
> message again. I was able to operate fine with 10 watts (after powering
> off/on) This happened on other bands and on SSB.  I noticed that as I
> turned the power level clockwise  while listening that the background noise
> noticeable dropped with the power level went over 12 watts. I also
> occasionally got the message even while not transmitting.
>
>
> Any other advice (besides replacing the KPA3 power connector)?
> Thanks,
> Gerry, W1GD
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