FT5000 review in Radcom
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It seems as if Peter Hart, having pushed the K3 into second place after the
Perseus SDR (in his Radcom review a month ago) for close-in strong signal performance (I was very surprised not to see that mentioned in this forum), has now pushed it one further place down, following his review of the new FT5000 in this month's Radcom. In his league table, the K3 is now in 3rd place. Peter is very complimentary about the FT5000's close-in ("best he's ever measured") receive performance, but closer reading of the article reveals criticism in other areas of the new radio's performance, for example the frequency disparity between its dual receivers, and the resulting effect on diversity reception. The review is not entirely positive. One has to be real about this. The likely price of the FT5000 will, I suspect, be several times that of the K3. It won't run off 12V, and it certainly would not fit on my operating desk! I also would not be prepared to spend that kind of money. I would also wager that 99.9% of users would notice no real world difference in receive performance between it and the K3, or indeed one or two other other top end radios. It is, however, very pretty...! Horses for courses.... 73 Stephen G4SJP ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html |
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That's very interesting. I predicted this before units were delivered because the two FT5000 RXs are not identical. I knew because Orion suffers the same problem, and the FT5000 is essentially a clone of Orion. I asked on the FT5000 lists whether anyone had noticed beating between the RXs in diversity but no users have reported it. I suppose it takes trained ears like Peter's to notice such things. Will be interesting to read the full review. 73, Bill |
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In reply to this post by Stephen Prior
Third in place ??? I will not believe it until I see the performance reports from Sherwood labs.
AD4C "For a refined ham it is compulsory to own a k3" --- On Fri, 5/21/10, Stephen Prior <[hidden email]> wrote: From: Stephen Prior <[hidden email]> Subject: [Elecraft] FT5000 review in Radcom To: "elecraft" <[hidden email]> Date: Friday, May 21, 2010, 9:49 PM It seems as if Peter Hart, having pushed the K3 into second place after the Perseus SDR (in his Radcom review a month ago) for close-in strong signal performance (I was very surprised not to see that mentioned in this forum), has now pushed it one further place down, following his review of the new FT5000 in this month's Radcom. In his league table, the K3 is now in 3rd place. Peter is very complimentary about the FT5000's close-in ("best he's ever measured") receive performance, but closer reading of the article reveals criticism in other areas of the new radio's performance, for example the frequency disparity between its dual receivers, and the resulting effect on diversity reception. The review is not entirely positive. One has to be real about this. The likely price of the FT5000 will, I suspect, be several times that of the K3. It won't run off 12V, and it certainly would not fit on my operating desk! I also would not be prepared to spend that kind of money. I would also wager that 99.9% of users would notice no real world difference in receive performance between it and the K3, or indeed one or two other other top end radios. It is, however, very pretty...! Horses for courses.... 73 Stephen G4SJP ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html |
Re: FT5000 review in Radcom
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On Sat, May 22, 2010 at 8:33 AM, Hector Padron <[hidden email]> wrote:
> Third in place ??? I will not believe it until I see the performance reports from Sherwood labs. > > AD4C > Why not? I wouldn't be surprised to see incremental improvement in this area, now that it is finally receiving the attention it deserves. Contesters should be happy that more manufacturers are heeding the call to produce properly designed down conversion receivers in the mold of Orion, and K3. Choice is good. Bob NW8L ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html |
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Yes you are absolutely right,all companies should use the same circuit design or even improve it further more but its hard to believe that a company that has been sleeping in the darkness in regards to receiver performance sudenly has woke up,like I said,I don't know who is that Radcom or what,I will trust only when I see the performance checked by Sherwood labs and if it is the truth well then we have to congratulate Yaesu.
AD4C "For a refined ham it is compulsory to own a k3" --- On Sat, 5/22/10, Bob Cunnings <[hidden email]> wrote: From: Bob Cunnings <[hidden email]> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] FT5000 review in Radcom To: [hidden email] Date: Saturday, May 22, 2010, 3:14 PM On Sat, May 22, 2010 at 8:33 AM, Hector Padron <[hidden email]> wrote: > Third in place ??? I will not believe it until I see the performance reports from Sherwood labs. > > AD4C > Why not? I wouldn't be surprised to see incremental improvement in this area, now that it is finally receiving the attention it deserves. Contesters should be happy that more manufacturers are heeding the call to produce properly designed down conversion receivers in the mold of Orion, and K3. Choice is good. Bob NW8L ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html |
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RadCom is the monthly journal of the RSGB, currently in its 86th year of
publication, although it has gone under other names in the past such as the RSGB Bulletin. Peter Hart is a well respected reviewer, unfortunately the review does not list the equipment he has used; nevertheless his reviews are well respected. 73 Stephen On 22/05/2010 16:21, "Hector Padron" <[hidden email]> wrote: > > Yes you are absolutely right,all companies should use the same circuit design > or even improve it further more but its hard to believe that a company that > has been sleeping in the darkness in regards to receiver performance sudenly > has woke up,like I said,I don't know who is that Radcom or what,I will trust > only when I see the performance checked by Sherwood labs and if it is the > truth well then we have to congratulate Yaesu. > > AD4C > > > > "For a refined ham it is compulsory to own a k3" > > --- On Sat, 5/22/10, Bob Cunnings <[hidden email]> wrote: > > > From: Bob Cunnings <[hidden email]> > Subject: Re: [Elecraft] FT5000 review in Radcom > To: [hidden email] > Date: Saturday, May 22, 2010, 3:14 PM > > > On Sat, May 22, 2010 at 8:33 AM, Hector Padron <[hidden email]> wrote: >> Third in place ??? I will not believe it until I see the performance reports >> from Sherwood labs. >> >> AD4C >> > > Why not? I wouldn't be surprised to see incremental improvement in > this area, now that it is finally receiving the attention it deserves. > Contesters should be happy that more manufacturers are heeding the > call to produce properly designed down conversion receivers in the > mold of Orion, and K3. Choice is good. > > Bob NW8L > ______________________________________________________________ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:[hidden email] > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > > > > > ______________________________________________________________ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:[hidden email] > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html |
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In reply to this post by Stephen Prior
Hector, I would not get too excited about a few DBs on way or another. It is just not going to make that much difference. Also, diversity receive with the 5000 is not going to work as well as in the K3.
The bothersome thing about the FT dx 5000 mp to me is the weight.....another 52 pound rig that will be a pain in the rear to box up and ship for repairs. I am 69 years old now and have an Icom 7700. I shipped it out once for repair and it was a pain getting it boxed up and shipped. Not only that, but repairs are expensive with the big rigs. IF you lose a logic board then you are looking at a $2k repair bill including shipping both ways. Strong points for the K3, lighter weight, easy to ship, repairs are not expensive, and can be done in the field on occasion. Great performance.......also a great rig for portable operation. The only negative is the user interface which is not really that great when compared to the competition. Some will take me to task for this comment, but I feel it is warranted. Yaesu and Kenwood have both jumped on the down conversion band wagon now. They see the success of Elecraft and want a piece of the market. Elecraft is winning the hearts and minds of contesters and dxers, but to some extent casual operators still like the bigger rigs with more convenience operationally. My guess is the the FT 5000 will be a big seller, as the user interface should be more friendly, plus the high performance stats of the receiver will be attractive. The price for the MP version is about 6,200. A fully loaded K3 can run over $5k, so not too much difference in price when you think about feature sets of the two rigs when loaded with comparable features. The Kenwood 950 with two roofing filters 2.8 and 500 hz priced at 1,800 could be a sleeper for many looking for a lower price version of the K3. Time will tell as we go forward......it will be interesting to see what develops! Toby W4CAK ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html |
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Toby Pennington wrote:
> Strong points for the K3, lighter weight, easy to ship, repairs are not expensive, and can be done in the field on occasion. Great performance.......also a great rig for portable operation. The only negative is the user interface which is not really that great when compared to the competition. Some will take me to task for this comment, but I feel it is warranted. > The user interface is fine for portability, but I would agree that many more functions could be mapped out on the front panel, ie. dedicated sub-RX controls (bandwidth, preamp/att, etc.), dual S-meters, larger LCD so VFO B freq. stays put and text feedback displayed elsewhere. More generous spacing of controls would be a big plus also. I know it was mentioned that there were no plans for a K4, etc., something to the effect of protecting K3 owners investment, but I would think an upgrade kit with a larger case, front panel, et.al., to bring the ergonomics up to "desktop" standards would be considered. There would be no need to replace the internals, other than maybe front panel board, interfacing to exiting MPU, etc. Perhaps even enough empty space left in the new case for an internal PS. 73 - Eric NO3M ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html |
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In reply to this post by Tobyp
I think the idea of competition is good for all so having Yaesu or Kenwood come out with rigs that challenge Elecraft is a good thing.
However, in all this kind of talk I never see or hear of the best reason to go with Elecraft -- at least from my own perspective. It is that these guys, Eric and Wayne, are probably on average 15 to 20 years younger then I am so as long as they are making money, I am sure to benefit by their future creations. I like the idea of a backup rig and I may get bored with my Icom 756 Pro III as a backup so having the option of buying the new Kenwood or the FT 5000 is kind of nice. And, I can always consider buying another K3. 73, phil, K7PEH On May 22, 2010, at 9:07 AM, Toby Pennington wrote: > Hector, I would not get too excited about a few DBs on way or another. It is just not going to make that much difference. Also, diversity receive with the 5000 is not going to work as well as in the K3. > > The bothersome thing about the FT dx 5000 mp to me is the weight.....another 52 pound rig that will be a pain in the rear to box up and ship for repairs. I am 69 years old now and have an Icom 7700. I shipped it out once for repair and it was a pain getting it boxed up and shipped. Not only that, but repairs are expensive with the big rigs. IF you lose a logic board then you are looking at a $2k repair bill including shipping both ways. > > Strong points for the K3, lighter weight, easy to ship, repairs are not expensive, and can be done in the field on occasion. Great performance.......also a great rig for portable operation. The only negative is the user interface which is not really that great when compared to the competition. Some will take me to task for this comment, but I feel it is warranted. > > Yaesu and Kenwood have both jumped on the down conversion band wagon now. They see the success of Elecraft and want a piece of the market. Elecraft is winning the hearts and minds of contesters and dxers, but to some extent casual operators still like the bigger rigs with more convenience operationally. > > My guess is the the FT 5000 will be a big seller, as the user interface should be more friendly, plus the high performance stats of the receiver will be attractive. The price for the MP version is about 6,200. A fully loaded K3 can run over $5k, so not too much difference in price when you think about feature sets of the two rigs when loaded with comparable features. > > The Kenwood 950 with two roofing filters 2.8 and 500 hz priced at 1,800 could be a sleeper for many looking for a lower price version of the K3. > > Time will tell as we go forward......it will be interesting to see what develops! > > Toby W4CAK > > > > > > > ______________________________________________________________ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:[hidden email] > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html |
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In reply to this post by Tobyp
Since I lived through the CB Heyday of the 1970s all I need to know is that it is from the same nice people that gave every CBer his dream rig, the FT-101, but the weight carries great weight with me. I like to put my K3 in a brief case and the power supply, key, mike and some tools in another and carry it out to the USS Cavalla, SSK-244 on Pelican Island, TX. I can carry both brief cases, along with my ample 69 year old body on board, down the ladder and through two bulkhead ports to the radio room in one trip. And, I have a first class transceiver when I get there! Also, it fits in the not so ample space that is available. I don't think I could make it with a FT5000. Look for me June 6&7 for the Museum Ships of the Air weekend. CW ops are centered around 40 KHz above the bottom of the bands. I will be on 20 and 40 and the higher bands if they are open. We also have the USS Stewart, DE-214 along side which will be operating SSB. We will both be using KK5W, the Brazos Valley ARC club call sign. We count two ships for one plus NA-143 for IOTA Willis 'Cookie' Cooke K5EWJ ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html |
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In reply to this post by Tobyp
Again Toby you are absolutely right,time will say what is going to happen in the market with the new yaesu rig,when I read by first time the manual and saw the new factory installed real six poles roofing filters for 15, 6 and 3 Khz I thought that was a deep improvement in performance but like I said,we have to read what the trustable source about it.
That as you said don't mean at all that many K3 users will jump in to it to purchase it because after we have reduced space on the desk with our K3 and after you have transported it easily to all other places as portable,unit,it makes it more attarctive that all those big radios.Maybe it might be a couple of db better in performance which after all it won't make any difference. In any case "cudos" for Yaesu. By the way speaking about dxpeditions and K3's next weekend the 29th and 30th, I will be operating in CW the DXPedition to Peanut island here in Palm beach county,FL, I will be using for 48 hours my K3 as well as my friend Julio AD4Z will bring his K3,there will be a bunch of other radios that will be FT-1000MP's and IC-756ProIII and ProII. We will be very active in 160 to 6M in all modes.Call sign will be W4K at the former JFK bunker built for the October missiles crisis.More info will be found at qrz.com AD4C "For a refined ham it is compulsory to own a k3" --- On Sat, 5/22/10, Toby Pennington <[hidden email]> wrote: From: Toby Pennington <[hidden email]> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] FT5000 review in Radcom To: [hidden email] Date: Saturday, May 22, 2010, 4:07 PM Hector, I would not get too excited about a few DBs on way or another. It is just not going to make that much difference. Also, diversity receive with the 5000 is not going to work as well as in the K3. The bothersome thing about the FT dx 5000 mp to me is the weight.....another 52 pound rig that will be a pain in the rear to box up and ship for repairs. I am 69 years old now and have an Icom 7700. I shipped it out once for repair and it was a pain getting it boxed up and shipped. Not only that, but repairs are expensive with the big rigs. IF you lose a logic board then you are looking at a $2k repair bill including shipping both ways. Strong points for the K3, lighter weight, easy to ship, repairs are not expensive, and can be done in the field on occasion. Great performance.......also a great rig for portable operation. The only negative is the user interface which is not really that great when compared to the competition. Some will take me to task for this comment, but I feel it is warranted. Yaesu and Kenwood have both jumped on the down conversion band wagon now. They see the success of Elecraft and want a piece of the market. Elecraft is winning the hearts and minds of contesters and dxers, but to some extent casual operators still like the bigger rigs with more convenience operationally. My guess is the the FT 5000 will be a big seller, as the user interface should be more friendly, plus the high performance stats of the receiver will be attractive. The price for the MP version is about 6,200. A fully loaded K3 can run over $5k, so not too much difference in price when you think about feature sets of the two rigs when loaded with comparable features. The Kenwood 950 with two roofing filters 2.8 and 500 hz priced at 1,800 could be a sleeper for many looking for a lower price version of the K3. Time will tell as we go forward......it will be interesting to see what develops! Toby W4CAK ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html |
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In reply to this post by Cookie
You are absolutely right Ray, Mia Culpa. It is June 5 & 6 and I think we will have some activity Friday night, June 4 as well.
Willis 'Cookie' Cooke K5EWJ ________________________________ From: Raymond Anderson <[hidden email]> To: WILLIS COOKE <[hidden email]> Sent: Sat, May 22, 2010 2:02:50 PM Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Museum Ships/FT5000 Isn't that the 5&6 of June Ray K8RDJ On Sat, May 22, 2010 at 12:38 PM, WILLIS COOKE <[hidden email]> wrote: >Since I lived through the CB Heyday of the 1970s all I need to know is that it is from the same nice people that gave every CBer his dream rig, the FT-101, but the weight carries great weight with me. > >I like to put my K3 in a brief case and the power supply, key, mike and some tools in another and carry it out to the USS Cavalla, SSK-244 on Pelican Island, TX. I can carry both brief cases, along with my ample 69 year old body on board, down the ladder and through two bulkhead ports to the radio room in one trip. And, I have a first class transceiver when I get there! Also, it fits in the not so ample space that is available. I don't think I could make it with a FT5000. > >Look for me June 6&7 for the Museum Ships of the Air weekend. CW ops are centered around 40 KHz above the bottom of the bands. I will be on 20 and 40 and the higher bands if they are open. We also have the USS Stewart, DE-214 along side which will be operating SSB. We will both be using KK5W, the Brazos Valley ARC club call sign. We count two ships for one plus NA-143 for IOTA > >Willis 'Cookie' Cooke >K5EWJ > > > >______________________________________________________________ >Elecraft mailing list >Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft >Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm >Post: mailto:[hidden email] > >This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net >Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html |
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