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HEAVY KNOBS??

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Mike K4PI

HEAVY KNOBS??

I admit I would never have bought one until I tried one on demo at Dayton. It is night and day to me. Pricey yes but for me I will pay it.. Had a K3 with the CNC knob not been there to feel I would have never bought one. You cannot adjust the felt tension on the original K3 knob to get the feel of the heavier knob on the main VFO. I opted for the rotating spinner and I really like the feel. Each to his own. It is like the feel of a CW paddle. The heavier 2nd VFO knob did not make all that much difference. I found a knob just a shade bigger than the present 2nd VFO knob with a rotating spinner, and I plan to fill it with lead. I actually put the main VFO on the 2nd and it works but crowds things a little. If anyone wants to see pix of both let me know. 73 Mike K4PI
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David Pratt

Re: HEAVY KNOBS??

This has been discussed many times before, Ron, and I believe there was a
warning that the use of heavier knobs could render the Elecraft warranty nul
and void. In the UK we tend to require smaller knobs, but maybe that's
because we have smaller fingers ;-)

73 de David G4DMP

-----Original Message-----
From: Ron D'Eau Claire
Sent: Sunday, May 27, 2012 7:55 PM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] HEAVY KNOBS??

I wonder if anyone has studied the long-term effects on the encoder bushings
and shafts that must support those knobs? AFAIK, it's just a simple bushing
- no ball or roller bearing races - so all of the wear is on the lower side
of the bushing.

Ron AC7AC

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Eric Swartz - WA6HHQ

Re: HEAVY KNOBS??

Administrator

In reply to this post by Mike K4PI

Ron is incorrect. The K3 has a ball bearing bushing in its VFO A and B encoders.

73,
Eric
www.elecraft.com
_..._

On May 27, 2012, at 11:55 AM, "Ron D'Eau Claire" <[hidden email]> wrote:

> I wonder if anyone has studied the long-term effects on the encoder bushings
> and shafts that must support those knobs? AFAIK, it's just a simple bushing
> - no ball or roller bearing races - so all of the wear is on the lower side
> of the bushing.
>
> Ron AC7AC
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Rick Dettinger-3

Re: HEAVY KNOBS??

Great! That should be good for about a 1 kilogram knob. Above that,
we might need a double set of tapered roller bearings.

73,
Rick K7MW

On May 27, 2012, at 12:18 PM, Eric Swartz WA6HHQ - Elecraft wrote:

> Ron is incorrect. The K3 has a ball bearing bushing in its VFO A and
> B encoders.
>
> 73,
> Eric
> www.elecraft.com
> _..._
>
>
> On May 27, 2012, at 11:55 AM, "Ron D'Eau Claire" <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> I wonder if anyone has studied the long-term effects on the encoder
>> bushings
>> and shafts that must support those knobs? AFAIK, it's just a simple
>> bushing
>> - no ball or roller bearing races - so all of the wear is on the
>> lower side
>> of the bushing.
>>
>> Ron AC7AC
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Gary Gregory

Re: HEAVY KNOBS??

*I think I will stick with the knobs designed by Wayne. Functionality
before eye candy....:-)

Gary
*
On 28 May 2012 05:31, Rick Dettinger <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Great! That should be good for about a 1 kilogram knob. Above that,
> we might need a double set of tapered roller bearings.
>
> 73,
> Rick K7MW
>
>
> On May 27, 2012, at 12:18 PM, Eric Swartz WA6HHQ - Elecraft wrote:
>
> > Ron is incorrect. The K3 has a ball bearing bushing in its VFO A and
> > B encoders.
> >
> > 73,
> > Eric
> > www.elecraft.com
> > _..._
> >
> >
> > On May 27, 2012, at 11:55 AM, "Ron D'Eau Claire" <[hidden email]> wrote:
> >
> >> I wonder if anyone has studied the long-term effects on the encoder
> >> bushings
> >> and shafts that must support those knobs? AFAIK, it's just a simple
> >> bushing
> >> - no ball or roller bearing races - so all of the wear is on the
> >> lower side
> >> of the bushing.
> >>
> >> Ron AC7AC
> > ______________________________________________________________
> > Elecraft mailing list
> > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
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--
Gary
VK4FD - Motorhome Mobile
Elecraft Equipment
K3 #679, KPA-500 #018 KAT-500#??
Living the dream!!!
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Bob K6UJ

Re: HEAVY KNOBS??

I'm with you Gary but I did find one knob that is tempting to try.
You should be able to really spin down the band with this one.
Bob
K6UJ

http://www.amazon.com/Handle-Dished-Chrome-Plated-Revolving/dp/B002IBCDWW

On May 27, 2012, at 2:12 PM, Gary Gregory wrote:

> *I think I will stick with the knobs designed by Wayne. Functionality
> before eye candy....:-)
>
> Gary
> *
> On 28 May 2012 05:31, Rick Dettinger <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> Great! That should be good for about a 1 kilogram knob. Above that,
>> we might need a double set of tapered roller bearings.
>>
>> 73,
>> Rick K7MW
>>
>>
>> On May 27, 2012, at 12:18 PM, Eric Swartz WA6HHQ - Elecraft wrote:
>>
>>> Ron is incorrect. The K3 has a ball bearing bushing in its VFO A and
>>> B encoders.
>>>
>>> 73,
>>> Eric
>>> www.elecraft.com
>>> _..._
>>>
>>>
>>> On May 27, 2012, at 11:55 AM, "Ron D'Eau Claire" <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>
>>>> I wonder if anyone has studied the long-term effects on the encoder
>>>> bushings
>>>> and shafts that must support those knobs? AFAIK, it's just a simple
>>>> bushing
>>>> - no ball or roller bearing races - so all of the wear is on the
>>>> lower side
>>>> of the bushing.
>>>>
>>>> Ron AC7AC
>>> ______________________________________________________________
>>> Elecraft mailing list
>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
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>>
>> ______________________________________________________________
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>>
>
>
>
> --
> Gary
> VK4FD - Motorhome Mobile
> Elecraft Equipment
> K3 #679, KPA-500 #018 KAT-500#??
> Living the dream!!!
> ______________________________________________________________
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k6dgw

Re: HEAVY KNOBS??

I remember some military transmitters with "knobs" about like that. :-)

73,

Fred K6DGW
Auburn CA

On 5/27/2012 10:52 PM, Bob K6UJ wrote:
> I'm with you Gary but I did find one knob that is tempting to try.
> You should be able to really spin down the band with this one.
> Bob
> K6UJ
>
> http://www.amazon.com/Handle-Dished-Chrome-Plated-Revolving/dp/B002IBCDWW
>

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Tony Estep

Re: HEAVY KNOBS??

On Sun, May 27, 2012 at 8:54 PM, Ron D'Eau Claire <[hidden email]> wrote:

> ....including the little spinner handle?...

==========
Well, the little crank has its downside. I built a home-brew precision
oscillator that uses an optical encoder, and I got a cool-looking knob with
a crank at our local parts, junk and surplus store (gateway electronics,
great place). Turns out that the crank-handle is just heavy enough so that
at some knob positions the weight of it can turn the encoder slightly. Of
course, if you have a felt washer you can avoid this, but I must say it
took me by surprise and left me a little disappointed, because the knob
looks so cool.

Tony KT0NY

--
http://www.isb.edu/faculty/facultydir.aspx?ddlFaculty=352
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Bob-270

Re: HEAVY KNOBS??

In reply to this post by Gary Gregory

Well it is both. I was firmly in the, "That's just plain nuts, $150 for 2
knobs!" camp until
I had the opportunity to use a K3 with them. Two days later I ordered them.
Maybe not
the best analogy but there is a lot of difference in handling between a sports
car and a
sedan too. And it not just a for spin hang time thing.

Well when Phil posted his for sale and mentioned the new versions I looked at them
and doing so was a horrible mistake. I had a nostalgia attack, they so reminded me
of the Heath SB series I had and the Collins S Line I like most others wanted.
Plain
and simple eye candy for sure.

Must be some interest in them, mine sold in 26 minutes. And I also have back up
offers in case.

I'll never have a 100 foot tower with stacked Yagi's here. So I'll have to be
content with
some trinkets and jewels.

73,
Bob
K2TK ex KN2TKR (1956) & K2TKR

On 5/27/2012 5:12 PM, Gary Gregory wrote:

> *I think I will stick with the knobs designed by Wayne. Functionality
> before eye candy....:-)
>
> Gary
> *
> On 28 May 2012 05:31, Rick Dettinger<[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> Great! That should be good for about a 1 kilogram knob. Above that,
>> we might need a double set of tapered roller bearings.
>>
>> 73,
>> Rick K7MW
>>
>>
>> On May 27, 2012, at 12:18 PM, Eric Swartz WA6HHQ - Elecraft wrote:
>>
>>> Ron is incorrect. The K3 has a ball bearing bushing in its VFO A and
>>> B encoders.
>>>
>>> 73,
>>> Eric
>>> www.elecraft.com
>>> _..._
>>>
>>>
>>> On May 27, 2012, at 11:55 AM, "Ron D'Eau Claire"<[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>
>>>> I wonder if anyone has studied the long-term effects on the encoder
>>>> bushings
>>>> and shafts that must support those knobs? AFAIK, it's just a simple
>>>> bushing
>>>> - no ball or roller bearing races - so all of the wear is on the
>>>> lower side
>>>> of the bushing.
>>>>
>>>> Ron AC7AC
>>> ______________________________________________________________
>>> Elecraft mailing list
>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>>
>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> Elecraft mailing list
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>>
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>>
>
>

Bob K6UJ

MCU 4.51, any affect on APF ?

In reply to this post by k6dgw

Can anyone give me feedback on 4.51 for the K3 as far as affecting the APF on CW sigs ?
>From what I've read so far the NB and NR are enhanced, I was wondering if it has any affect on the APF.

tnx,

Bob
K6UJ

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Vic Rosenthal

Re: MCU 4.51, any affect on APF ?

I certainly can't quantify it, but it seems to me that the APF does not work as well now
as it did before 4.51.

It used to be a magic bullet.

On 5/27/2012 8:31 PM, Bob K6UJ wrote:
> Can anyone give me feedback on 4.51 for the K3 as far as affecting the APF on CW sigs ?
>> From what I've read so far the NB and NR are enhanced, I was wondering if it has any affect on the APF.
>
>
> tnx,
>
> Bob
> K6UJ

--
Vic, K2VCO
Fresno CA
http://www.qsl.net/k2vco/
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Guy, K2AV

Re: MCU 4.51, any affect on APF ?

As reported in earlier threads, 4.51 does seem to change the APF to a
broader, less peaky shape, but it is less "noisy", so the previous
impression of a signal jumping out of the tip of an inverted audio V of
noise is no longer there. You no longer have the inverted audio V full of
noise to tell you where to tune the signal to peak it up. You have to
"remember" it, or tune very slowly across it. The peak is still there.
Personally, I like it a little better this way, but's that's only my take.

It was reported by pre-beta testers as well. Dunno what Wayne is going to
do about it. Also the CWT has been jostled in 4.51. That too under
advisement by the brain trust.

73, Guy.

On Sun, May 27, 2012 at 11:55 PM, Vic K2VCO <[hidden email]> wrote:

> I certainly can't quantify it, but it seems to me that the APF does not
> work as well now
> as it did before 4.51.
>
> It used to be a magic bullet.
>
> On 5/27/2012 8:31 PM, Bob K6UJ wrote:
> > Can anyone give me feedback on 4.51 for the K3 as far as affecting the
> APF on CW sigs ?
> >> From what I've read so far the NB and NR are enhanced, I was wondering
> if it has any affect on the APF.
> >
> >
> > tnx,
> >
> > Bob
> > K6UJ
>
>
> --
> Vic, K2VCO
> Fresno CA
> http://www.qsl.net/k2vco/
> ______________________________________________________________
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wayne burdick

Re: MCU 4.51, any affect on APF ?

Administrator

In reply to this post by Bob K6UJ

We'll be doing careful measurements of APF pre-/post-4.51 this week.
There was no intentional change to it, and to me, at least, it still
sounds the same.

Wayne
N6KR

On May 27, 2012, at 8:31 PM, Bob K6UJ wrote:

> Can anyone give me feedback on 4.51 for the K3 as far as affecting
> the APF on CW sigs ?
>> From what I've read so far the NB and NR are enhanced, I was
>> wondering if it has any affect on the APF.
>
>
> tnx,
>
> Bob
> K6UJ
>
>
>
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
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Bob K6UJ

Re: MCU 4.51, any affect on APF ?

great, thanks Wayne

Bob
K6UJ

On May 28, 2012, at 8:20 AM, Wayne Burdick wrote:

> We'll be doing careful measurements of APF pre-/post-4.51 this week. There was no intentional change to it, and to me, at least, it still sounds the same.
>
> Wayne
> N6KR
>
> On May 27, 2012, at 8:31 PM, Bob K6UJ wrote:
>
>> Can anyone give me feedback on 4.51 for the K3 as far as affecting the APF on CW sigs ?
>>> From what I've read so far the NB and NR are enhanced, I was wondering if it has any affect on the APF.
>>
>>
>> tnx,
>>
>> Bob
>> K6UJ
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> Elecraft mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
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>>
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>

Joe Subich, W4TV-4

Re: MCU 4.51, any affect on APF ?

In reply to this post by wayne burdick

Wayne,

This may be entirely dependent on signal level vs. AGC threshold.

Prior to MCU 4.5x APF was generally working with signals that had
already activated the AGC thus the peaking occurred above the
threshold/slope. With the higher threshold, the noise is not held
to a well defined level so the effect of the APF may not be as
pronounced for signals below the threshold.

The same issues are probably involved with the perceived CW decode
issues. It is no longer sufficient to simply set threshold to auto
and turn on decode. Now it can require some tweaking of the decode
threshold as well as frequency and bandwidth to get good decoding.

73,

... Joe, W4TV

On 5/28/2012 11:20 AM, Wayne Burdick wrote:

> We'll be doing careful measurements of APF pre-/post-4.51 this week.
> There was no intentional change to it, and to me, at least, it still
> sounds the same.
>
> Wayne
> N6KR
>
> On May 27, 2012, at 8:31 PM, Bob K6UJ wrote:
>
>> Can anyone give me feedback on 4.51 for the K3 as far as affecting
>> the APF on CW sigs ?
>>> From what I've read so far the NB and NR are enhanced, I was
>>> wondering if it has any affect on the APF.
>>
>>
>> tnx,
>>
>> Bob
>> K6UJ
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> Elecraft mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>
> ______________________________________________________________
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Keith Heimbold

Re: MCU 4.51, any affect on APF ?

I was using the CWT decode functionality this weekend and still notice a decreased sensitivity or ability to decode but with a little tweaking I was able to get it to function. It may not be as good as previously but it still works fairly well. I am glad that Wayne and crew are looking into this.

Keith
AG6AZ

Sent from my iPhone please excuse typos

On May 28, 2012, at 12:58 PM, "Joe Subich, W4TV" <[hidden email]> wrote:

>
> Wayne,
>
> This may be entirely dependent on signal level vs. AGC threshold.
>
> Prior to MCU 4.5x APF was generally working with signals that had
> already activated the AGC thus the peaking occurred above the
> threshold/slope. With the higher threshold, the noise is not held
> to a well defined level so the effect of the APF may not be as
> pronounced for signals below the threshold.
>
> The same issues are probably involved with the perceived CW decode
> issues. It is no longer sufficient to simply set threshold to auto
> and turn on decode. Now it can require some tweaking of the decode
> threshold as well as frequency and bandwidth to get good decoding.
>
> 73,
>
> ... Joe, W4TV
>
>
> On 5/28/2012 11:20 AM, Wayne Burdick wrote:
>> We'll be doing careful measurements of APF pre-/post-4.51 this week.
>> There was no intentional change to it, and to me, at least, it still
>> sounds the same.
>>
>> Wayne
>> N6KR
>>
>> On May 27, 2012, at 8:31 PM, Bob K6UJ wrote:
>>
>>> Can anyone give me feedback on 4.51 for the K3 as far as affecting
>>> the APF on CW sigs ?
>>>> From what I've read so far the NB and NR are enhanced, I was
>>>> wondering if it has any affect on the APF.
>>>
>>>
>>> tnx,
>>>
>>> Bob
>>> K6UJ
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ______________________________________________________________
>>> Elecraft mailing list
>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
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>>>
>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>>
>> ______________________________________________________________
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>>
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>>
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