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Happy But Very Sad

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Mike Bellow

Happy But Very Sad

Hi All
I recently picked up a used K2 locally here that was out of
alignment,had to wait for freq probe that I ordered from Elecraft which
arrived very fast,after doing a alignment on the radio,and After I set
it up,I was very happy to see it works very well.This is my first
Elecraft radio and this one is a #01014 serial number one of the early
ones I guess.Now the Sad Part......Today I was listening on 14060 as
usual for qrp stations and heard a very very faint station calling CQ
Qrp,if I were to tag a rst report on this one I would say 119 no s meter
reading at all but I could copy it fine.For comparison I hooked my Brand
New "2 months old" Yaesu Ft-950 and guess what??????? Could not hear
anything there but Static........no signal at all.............$1400.00
for this radio........Now I'm Happy but very sad.....

W2TI/QRP
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W0WFH Bill

Re: Happy But Very Sad

I just purchased a late model K2 because a couple friends of mine was bragging how super a receiver the K2 had and after 2 weeks of using my K2 I have found the same thing you have I have been running aYaesu FT 920 for 15 years it my main 6 meter radio I worked 112 countries with here in the midwest can't wait to get a transverter on the K2 to see just how well it going to hear on the vhf/uhf bands with transverters. Good things come in small
packages and not a super prices either. Was about to buy a new FTdx 5000 really big buck now I thinking more along the lines of a K3 complete station. All made in the good old USA!!!!!
73, Bill, W0WFH
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N0AZZ

Re: Happy But Very Sad

Bill having owned the FTDX-5000MP for over 2 yrs I'm sure you would be very
pleased with it and have quite a few more options than a fully loaded K3 at
about the same price and 6m is a dream on it. Performance wise has the 5000
is on top but the K3 is still very close the 5000 has had many firmware
updates that improved it from even the original test numbers that were
published by QST and Sherwood. In fact Sherwood tested one of the 5000's
that were on the way to CA for repair so really didn't get all the numbers.
I have used a Yaesu VL-1000 amp for over 5 years a KW on 6-160m full auto
band switching and never a problem of any kind.

I enjoy the Elecraft line very much and they make wonderful equipment that
few cam matches and I'm looking forward to getting my loaded K2/100 on line
soon. I'm now looking at an Elecraft Power/SWR meter to match my tuner I
also like things to match but can use the K2 for an exciter for the Quarda
if needed. But I really wanted it mostly for a QRP rig and use the 100w for
Field Day maybe.

73,
Fred/N0AZZ

-----Original Message-----
From: [hidden email]
[mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Yahoo!
Sent: Friday, June 22, 2012 4:29 AM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Happy But Very Sad

I just purchased a late model K2 because a couple friends of mine was
bragging how super a receiver the K2 had and after 2 weeks of using my K2 I
have found the same thing you have I have been running aYaesu FT 920 for 15
years it my main 6 meter radio I worked 112 countries with here in the
midwest can't wait to get a transverter on the K2 to see just how well it
going to hear on the vhf/uhf bands with transverters. Good things come in
small packages and not a super prices either. Was about to buy a new FTdx
5000 really big buck now I thinking more along the lines of a K3 complete
station. All made in the good old USA!!!!!
73, Bill, W0WFH
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Keith Heimbold

Re: Happy But Very Sad

I would debate the comment about the same price. I got my fully loaded used K3/100 for about $1500 less than what i would pay for a FT5000MP and then recently bought a second less than fully loaded K3/100 with the "savings" for Remoterig twin mode. I am sure the FT5000MP is a schweet top of the line rig and I may end up buying one down the road but for now I am stoked with the K3. I mean my two K3s.

Keith
AG6AZ

Sent from my iPhone please excuse typos

On Jun 22, 2012, at 4:54 AM, "Fred Smith" <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Bill having owned the FTDX-5000MP for over 2 yrs I'm sure you would be very
> pleased with it and have quite a few more options than a fully loaded K3 at
> about the same price and 6m is a dream on it. Performance wise has the 5000
> is on top but the K3 is still very close the 5000 has had many firmware
> updates that improved it from even the original test numbers that were
> published by QST and Sherwood. In fact Sherwood tested one of the 5000's
> that were on the way to CA for repair so really didn't get all the numbers.
> I have used a Yaesu VL-1000 amp for over 5 years a KW on 6-160m full auto
> band switching and never a problem of any kind.
>
> I enjoy the Elecraft line very much and they make wonderful equipment that
> few cam matches and I'm looking forward to getting my loaded K2/100 on line
> soon. I'm now looking at an Elecraft Power/SWR meter to match my tuner I
> also like things to match but can use the K2 for an exciter for the Quarda
> if needed. But I really wanted it mostly for a QRP rig and use the 100w for
> Field Day maybe.
>
> 73,
> Fred/N0AZZ
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [hidden email]
> [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Yahoo!
> Sent: Friday, June 22, 2012 4:29 AM
> To: [hidden email]
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Happy But Very Sad
>
> I just purchased a late model K2 because a couple friends of mine was
> bragging how super a receiver the K2 had and after 2 weeks of using my K2 I
> have found the same thing you have I have been running aYaesu FT 920 for 15
> years it my main 6 meter radio I worked 112 countries with here in the
> midwest can't wait to get a transverter on the K2 to see just how well it
> going to hear on the vhf/uhf bands with transverters. Good things come in
> small packages and not a super prices either. Was about to buy a new FTdx
> 5000 really big buck now I thinking more along the lines of a K3 complete
> station. All made in the good old USA!!!!!
> 73, Bill, W0WFH
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> -----
> No virus found in this message.
> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
> Version: 2012.0.1913 / Virus Database: 2437/5084 - Release Date: 06/21/12
>
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Jason Hissong-2

Re: Happy But Very Sad

In reply to this post by Mike Bellow

Sell the 950 and use the proceeds to get all the additional options
for your K2 (or maybe a nice chunk of change to save for a K3).

Just don't expect to sell it to many on this list.. :-)

I am building my third K2 (I sold the previous ones to pay for other
things, not because of the radio) and will be eventually putting all
the extras in it. It will become my main station rig. My 756 will
then be used for 6 meters or eventually sold.

Someday a K3 will find its way into my shack but until then, the K2
will fill my needs just fine.

Congrats on your K2.

73,
Jason N8XE

On 6/21/12, Mike Bellow <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Hi All
> I recently picked up a used K2 locally here that was out of
> alignment,had to wait for freq probe that I ordered from Elecraft which
> arrived very fast,after doing a alignment on the radio,and After I set
> it up,I was very happy to see it works very well.This is my first
> Elecraft radio and this one is a #01014 serial number one of the early
> ones I guess.Now the Sad Part......Today I was listening on 14060 as
> usual for qrp stations and heard a very very faint station calling CQ
> Qrp,if I were to tag a rst report on this one I would say 119 no s meter
> reading at all but I could copy it fine.For comparison I hooked my Brand
> New "2 months old" Yaesu Ft-950 and guess what??????? Could not hear
> anything there but Static........no signal at all.............$1400.00
> for this radio........Now I'm Happy but very sad.....
>
>
> W2TI/QRP
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>

Mike Sanders

Re: Happy But Very Sad

6 Meters?
I have 2 K2s one 10W unit and 1 100W unit.
Both are pretty well loaded up.
I just bought a 6 and 2 meter Elecraft transverter
used. Got them on the bench yesterday and finally
working after I corrected a problem I made.
Anyway I have used a lot of radios on 6, 2 and
beyond for a long time. Also a lot of good IF radios
with good transverters.
The XV50 and XV144 are about as good as I have
seen or used. Yesterday I measured the RX sensitivity
on an IFR1200 super S at .1 microvolt and well less
than that for a usable signal on CW. That is about
-130db. I think I will enjoy using these Elecraft Tvrtrs.
They both did rated output easily and can drive external
amplifiers.
Please do not take my RX measurements as gospel
but I am pretty sure they are very close to what I found
with this service monitor. Obviously your mileage may
vary.
So my 756PROIII and 746PRO may not see much 6 or
2 meter use in the future. With the 100W K2 driving the
PW1 they may not see much use at all..................73

Mike Sanders
KOAZ

-----Original Message-----
From: [hidden email]
[mailto:[hidden email]]On Behalf Of Jason Hissong
Sent: Friday, June 22, 2012 8:39 AM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Happy But Very Sad

Sell the 950 and use the proceeds to get all the additional options
for your K2 (or maybe a nice chunk of change to save for a K3).

Just don't expect to sell it to many on this list.. :-)

I am building my third K2 (I sold the previous ones to pay for other
things, not because of the radio) and will be eventually putting all
the extras in it. It will become my main station rig. My 756 will
then be used for 6 meters or eventually sold.

Someday a K3 will find its way into my shack but until then, the K2
will fill my needs just fine.

Congrats on your K2.

73,
Jason N8XE

On 6/21/12, Mike Bellow <[hidden email]> wrote:

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Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 10.0.1424 / Virus Database: 2433/5086 - Release Date: 06/22/12
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Scott Manthe-2

Re: Happy But Very Sad

In reply to this post by N0AZZ

A fully-loaded K3 is about $4900, and that assumes 8 pole filters in all
slots in both receivers. A fully loaded FT-5000 is $5600. The FT-5000
exceeds the K3's receiver performance in one category, and trails the K3
in every other RX performance category. The K3 also has a superior
transmitter, as evidenced by the IMD numbers in ARRL test results and
elsewhere.

So, yes, the FT-5000 is on top in one RX category and the amount of IMD
its transmitter can splatter across the bands, and all for only $700
more. And they throw the key clicks in for free! But that splatter and
key clicks are valuable weapons in the contesting arsenal, because ops
near an FT-5000 can't work 'em if they can't hear 'em.

73,
Scott, N9AA

On 6/22/12 7:54 AM, Fred Smith wrote:
> Bill having owned the FTDX-5000MP for over 2 yrs I'm sure you would be very
> pleased with it and have quite a few more options than a fully loaded K3 at
> about the same price and 6m is a dream on it. Performance wise has the 5000
> is on top but the K3 is still very close...
>
> 73,
> Fred/N0AZZ
>
>

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wayne burdick

Re: Happy But Very Sad

Administrator

Another nice thing about the K3 is that you can take it to Field Day.
(10 pounds vs. 50 pounds, and 1 amp receive current drain vs. 3 or 4
amps :)

73,
Wayne
N6KR

On Jun 22, 2012, at 10:26 AM, Scott Manthe wrote:

>
> A fully-loaded K3 is about $4900, and that assumes 8 pole filters in
> all
> slots in both receivers. A fully loaded FT-5000 is $5600. The FT-5000
> exceeds the K3's receiver performance in one category, and trails
> the K3
> in every other RX performance category. The K3 also has a superior
> transmitter, as evidenced by the IMD numbers in ARRL test results and
> elsewhere.
>
> So, yes, the FT-5000 is on top in one RX category and the amount of
> IMD
> its transmitter can splatter across the bands, and all for only $700
> more. And they throw the key clicks in for free! But that splatter and
> key clicks are valuable weapons in the contesting arsenal, because ops
> near an FT-5000 can't work 'em if they can't hear 'em.
>
> 73,
> Scott, N9AA
>
>
> On 6/22/12 7:54 AM, Fred Smith wrote:
>> Bill having owned the FTDX-5000MP for over 2 yrs I'm sure you would
>> be very
>> pleased with it and have quite a few more options than a fully
>> loaded K3 at
>> about the same price and 6m is a dream on it. Performance wise has
>> the 5000
>> is on top but the K3 is still very close...
>>
>> 73,
>> Fred/N0AZZ
>>
>>
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
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> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

w0mu

Re: Happy But Very Sad

I love the size. With big hands I thought the smaller footprint might
be a negative. It is not! All the knobs are easy to use, buttons easy
to push and not push 3 at the same time. What I find is I rarely have
to change anything when operating. Other rigs I was always trying to
tune this, improve the reception etc. Not with the K3.

Mike W0MU

W0MU-1 CC Cluster w0mu.net:23 or w0mu-1.dnsdynamic.com
Http://www.w0mu.com

On 6/22/2012 11:48 AM, Wayne Burdick wrote:

> Another nice thing about the K3 is that you can take it to Field Day.
> (10 pounds vs. 50 pounds, and 1 amp receive current drain vs. 3 or 4
> amps :)
>
> 73,
> Wayne
> N6KR
>
> On Jun 22, 2012, at 10:26 AM, Scott Manthe wrote:
>
>> A fully-loaded K3 is about $4900, and that assumes 8 pole filters in
>> all
>> slots in both receivers. A fully loaded FT-5000 is $5600. The FT-5000
>> exceeds the K3's receiver performance in one category, and trails
>> the K3
>> in every other RX performance category. The K3 also has a superior
>> transmitter, as evidenced by the IMD numbers in ARRL test results and
>> elsewhere.
>>
>> So, yes, the FT-5000 is on top in one RX category and the amount of
>> IMD
>> its transmitter can splatter across the bands, and all for only $700
>> more. And they throw the key clicks in for free! But that splatter and
>> key clicks are valuable weapons in the contesting arsenal, because ops
>> near an FT-5000 can't work 'em if they can't hear 'em.
>>
>> 73,
>> Scott, N9AA
>>
>>
>> On 6/22/12 7:54 AM, Fred Smith wrote:
>>> Bill having owned the FTDX-5000MP for over 2 yrs I'm sure you would
>>> be very
>>> pleased with it and have quite a few more options than a fully
>>> loaded K3 at
>>> about the same price and 6m is a dream on it. Performance wise has
>>> the 5000
>>> is on top but the K3 is still very close...
>>>
>>> 73,
>>> Fred/N0AZZ
>>>
>>>
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> Elecraft mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> ______________________________________________________________
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Bill K9YEQ

Re: Happy But Very Sad

In reply to this post by wayne burdick

Exactly... or take the KX3, even lighter... or take both and share :-)

73,
Bill
K9YEQ

-----Original Message-----
From: [hidden email]
[mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Wayne Burdick
Sent: Friday, June 22, 2012 12:49 PM
To: Scott Manthe
Cc: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Happy But Very Sad

Another nice thing about the K3 is that you can take it to Field Day.
(10 pounds vs. 50 pounds, and 1 amp receive current drain vs. 3 or 4 amps :)

73,
Wayne
N6KR

On Jun 22, 2012, at 10:26 AM, Scott Manthe wrote:

>
> A fully-loaded K3 is about $4900, and that assumes 8 pole filters in
> all slots in both receivers. A fully loaded FT-5000 is $5600. The
> FT-5000 exceeds the K3's receiver performance in one category, and
> trails the K3 in every other RX performance category. The K3 also has
> a superior transmitter, as evidenced by the IMD numbers in ARRL test
> results and elsewhere.
>
> So, yes, the FT-5000 is on top in one RX category and the amount of
> IMD its transmitter can splatter across the bands, and all for only
> $700 more. And they throw the key clicks in for free! But that
> splatter and key clicks are valuable weapons in the contesting
> arsenal, because ops near an FT-5000 can't work 'em if they can't hear
> 'em.
>
> 73,
> Scott, N9AA
>
>
> On 6/22/12 7:54 AM, Fred Smith wrote:
>> Bill having owned the FTDX-5000MP for over 2 yrs I'm sure you would
>> be very pleased with it and have quite a few more options than a
>> fully loaded K3 at about the same price and 6m is a dream on it.
>> Performance wise has the 5000 is on top but the K3 is still very
>> close...
>>
>> 73,
>> Fred/N0AZZ
>>
>>
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email
> list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

N0AZZ

Re: Happy But Very Sad

In reply to this post by Scott Manthe-2

The base model 5000 sells for $4895 and still has more options plus 200w and
a class A transmitter you need to check you specs since all the updates and
upgrades were done to this radio. As far as the transmitter it's one of the
cleanest made. Key clicks mean nothing to me even though I think that was
fixed by Yaesu since the first were released. I'm a SSB/Digital op so CW
wasn't in the mix for me.

73,

Fred/N0AZZ

-----Original Message-----
From: [hidden email]
[mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Scott Manthe
Sent: Friday, June 22, 2012 12:27 PM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Happy But Very Sad

A fully-loaded K3 is about $4900, and that assumes 8 pole filters in all
slots in both receivers. A fully loaded FT-5000 is $5600. The FT-5000
exceeds the K3's receiver performance in one category, and trails the K3 in
every other RX performance category. The K3 also has a superior transmitter,
as evidenced by the IMD numbers in ARRL test results and elsewhere.

So, yes, the FT-5000 is on top in one RX category and the amount of IMD its
transmitter can splatter across the bands, and all for only $700 more. And
they throw the key clicks in for free! But that splatter and key clicks are
valuable weapons in the contesting arsenal, because ops near an FT-5000
can't work 'em if they can't hear 'em.

73,
Scott, N9AA

On 6/22/12 7:54 AM, Fred Smith wrote:
> Bill having owned the FTDX-5000MP for over 2 yrs I'm sure you would be
very
> pleased with it and have quite a few more options than a fully loaded K3
at
> about the same price and 6m is a dream on it. Performance wise has the
5000
> is on top but the K3 is still very close...
>
> 73,
> Fred/N0AZZ
>
>

______________________________________________________________
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No virus found in this message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 2012.0.1913 / Virus Database: 2437/5084 - Release Date: 06/21/12

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vk4tux

Re: Happy But Very Sad

In reply to this post by Scott Manthe-2

K3 a superior transmitter in imd product results? Your kidding right?
Out in the real world the K3 has a bad rep for splatter and imd3 product.
See;

http://www.eham.net/ehamforum/smf/index.php/topic,75182.0.html

Those of us with K3's running 15v PS with heavy cable inputs, driving clean
amps escape the wrath of the imd police.
The 5000 is way better esp in class A operation.

>A fully-loaded K3 is about $4900, and that assumes 8 pole filters in all
slots in both receivers. A fully loaded FT-5000 is $5600. The FT-5000
exceeds the K3's >receiver performance in one category, and trails the K3 in
every other RX performance category. The K3 also has a superior transmitter,
as evidenced by the >IMD numbers in ARRL test results and elsewhere.

>73,
>Scott, N9AA

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vk4tux

Re: Happy But Very Sad

Also see

http://www.mail-archive.com/elecraft@.../msg70785.html

-----Original Message-----
From: [hidden email]
[mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Adrian
Sent: Saturday, 23 June 2012 7:48 AM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Happy But Very Sad

K3 a superior transmitter in imd product results? Your kidding right?
Out in the real world the K3 has a bad rep for splatter and imd3 product.
See;

http://www.eham.net/ehamforum/smf/index.php/topic,75182.0.html

Those of us with K3's running 15v PS with heavy cable inputs, driving clean
amps escape the wrath of the imd police.
The 5000 is way better esp in class A operation.

>A fully-loaded K3 is about $4900, and that assumes 8 pole filters in
>all
slots in both receivers. A fully loaded FT-5000 is $5600. The FT-5000
exceeds the K3's >receiver performance in one category, and trails the K3 in
every other RX performance category. The K3 also has a superior transmitter,
as evidenced by the >IMD numbers in ARRL test results and elsewhere.

>73,
>Scott, N9AA

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Scott Manthe-2

Re: Happy But Very Sad

In reply to this post by N0AZZ

I've never seen a FT5000 for anywhere close to $4900, if you got yours
for that let us know where and I'll buy one tomorrow to resell. The
cheapest I've seen them sell for is $5300. And yes, as long as you run
it in class A and don't turn on the processor, it has a relatively clean
transmitter, but then it is a 75 watt radio, not 200.

73,
Scott, N9AA

On 6/22/12 5:22 PM, Fred Smith wrote:

> The base model 5000 sells for $4895 and still has more options plus 200w and
> a class A transmitter you need to check you specs since all the updates and
> upgrades were done to this radio. As far as the transmitter it's one of the
> cleanest made. Key clicks mean nothing to me even though I think that was
> fixed by Yaesu since the first were released. I'm a SSB/Digital op so CW
> wasn't in the mix for me.
>
> 73,
>
> Fred/N0AZZ
>
>

wayne burdick

Re: Happy But Very Sad

Administrator

In reply to this post by vk4tux

Adrian wrote:

> K3 a superior transmitter in imd product results?....

Adrian,

The K3 is a 12-volt-powered transceiver. When running at 100 W and
from a typical DC supply, its transmit 3rd-order IMD is very similar
to that of other 12-V radios, as confirmed by multiple test labs.

A transceiver with a class-A final or running from much higher supply
voltages (15 V is OK, as you mentioned) will have better IMD. But
radios with built-in supplies are not suited for portability -- a
major design goal of the K3, which is used by more DXpeditions than
any other rig.

Also, I suspect most "splatter" comments derive from improper
adjustment of the K3 when used with an external amplifier.

Some amplifier manufacturers still insist on instructing users to
crank up their radio's power output to maximum when driving the amp,
forcing the use of wideband ALC at the radio, and that can indeed
result in splatter. But if you adjust the K3's power output as
described in the owner's manual (with no more drive than required for
full amp power), and do not depend on aggressive ALC action, its
signal will be very clean. This allows all of the K3's fast ALC to be
achieved *ahead* of the crystal filter, avoiding the wideband ALC
splatter characteristic of transceivers designed for "crank-it-all-the-
way-up" mode.

Also note that the K3 typically runs at 20-50 W when driving the
KPA500 or other amp with similar gain, resulting in excellent third-
order IMD.

If anyone had a K3 exhibiting IMD worse than specified, we would
certainly repair it at no charge.

73,
Wayne
N6KR

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wayne burdick

Re: Happy But Very Sad

Administrator

In reply to this post by vk4tux

That's a pretty old posting, Adrian. We long ago restricted max power
to 110 W in firmware, and the radio is specified at 100 W. Using the
recommended supply voltage (14 V) at the recommended power level (100
W) there should be no difference between the K3 and other nominal-12 V
transceivers.

Note that the difference between 110 and 100 W is only 0.4 dB, so I
suggest sticking with 100 W.

73,
Wayne
N6KR

On Jun 22, 2012, at 3:12 PM, Adrian wrote:

> Also see
>
> http://www.mail-archive.com/elecraft@.../msg70785.html
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Scott Manthe-2

Re: Happy But Very Sad

In reply to this post by vk4tux

I said the K3's transmitter was superior to the FT-5000, not perfect.
The ARRL review lists the 3rd order TX IMD numbers at -30db for the 5000
and -29 dB for the K3, but those numbers alone don't tell the whole
story. Take at look at the ARRL's phase noise numbers and spectral
display characteristics for the FT-5000's transmitted signal and compare
them to the K3 and then get back to us. To be fair, the K3 tested does
seem to have an issue with inferior 9th order IMD numbers, though.

These figures were without the FT-5000's processor turned on, which of
course, dirties up the 5000's signal quite a bit, unless that "feature"
has been fixed. If it has, many contesters will be tearing up, because
that and the key clicks help FT5000 ops get higher scores.

Re: your other post, my K3 is rated at 100 watts output, so I'm sure
someone running one at 120 watts will notice that the performance does
degrade. I find the slightly higher PS voltage an intriguing idea.

The FT-5000 is a fine rig, and is fairly clean in class A mode, with the
processor turned off, but most people don't run them that way.

73,
Scott, N9AA

On 6/22/12 5:48 PM, Adrian wrote:

> K3 a superior transmitter in imd product results? Your kidding right?
> Out in the real world the K3 has a bad rep for splatter and imd3 product.
> See;
>
> http://www.eham.net/ehamforum/smf/index.php/topic,75182.0.html
>
> Those of us with K3's running 15v PS with heavy cable inputs, driving clean
> amps escape the wrath of the imd police.
> The 5000 is way better esp in class A operation.
>

Robert Vargas (KP4Y)

Re: Happy But Very Sad

Love my K3 as I know I will love my KX3 on order and I love Elecraft customer support and the fact that the owners stand behind their products and are real gentlemen. However, if I had $5K to spend and the difference between a fully loaded K3 and the FT-5000 was around $500-$700, I would blindly go with the FT-5000. The specs are close for me and I have operated the FT-5000 and believe that it also has a great receiver. The difference I believe lies in the construction/workmanship of both radios and I'm reminded about that every time I turn the K3 VFO. I believe that the KX3 pricing is more inline with what you are getting but the K3 is IMHO slightly overpriced for a kit. But, I then have to realize that someone has to pay for the magnificent intellectual work that Wayne and Eric have done in the development of the K3's firmware, and that is worth the money. I really look forward to better construction/workmanship for the K4...

Robert, KP4Y

________________________________
From: Scott Manthe <[hidden email]>
To: [hidden email]
Sent: Friday, June 22, 2012 6:54 PM
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Happy But Very Sad

I said the K3's transmitter was superior to the FT-5000, not perfect.
The ARRL review lists the 3rd order TX IMD numbers at -30db for the 5000
and -29 dB for the K3, but those numbers alone don't tell the whole
story. Take at look at the ARRL's phase noise numbers and spectral
display characteristics for the FT-5000's transmitted signal and compare
them to the K3 and then get back to us. To be fair, the K3 tested does
seem to have an issue with inferior 9th order IMD numbers, though.

These figures were without the FT-5000's processor turned on, which of
course, dirties up the 5000's signal quite a bit, unless that "feature"
has been fixed. If it has, many contesters will be tearing up, because
that and the key clicks help FT5000 ops get higher scores.

Re: your other post, my K3 is rated at 100 watts output, so I'm sure
someone running one at 120 watts will notice that the performance does
degrade. I find the slightly higher PS voltage an intriguing idea.

The FT-5000 is a fine rig, and is fairly clean in class A mode, with the
processor turned off, but most people don't run them that way.

73,
Scott, N9AA

On 6/22/12 5:48 PM, Adrian wrote:

Paul VanOveren-2

Re: Happy But Very Sad

In reply to this post by vk4tux

You read one bad review on Eham and make that kind of statement.." .Out in
the real world the K3 has a bad rep for splatter and imd3 pro" I have K3
# 758, now over 4 yrs old, and have run it at 100 watts (as recommended)
barefoot, into a Alpha 76 PA @ 50 watts and now into a Elecraft KPA 500 with
25-30 watts. After more than 5500 qsos over the 4 yrs, ragchewing, chasing
dx and contesting, I have had the following numbers of bad audio,
splattering or key clicks reports, 0 , zero, nata, none, zlich.
IMHO, to make a statement like that (without any documentation) is
reckless and unwarranted. I have heard many reports from owners and others,
about the FT5000 re: key clicks, splattering, etc, but certainly would not
go on the Yeasu reflector and spread such stuff around.

NF8J
Paul

-----Original Message-----
From: Adrian
Sent: Friday, June 22, 2012 5:48 PM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Happy But Very Sad

K3 a superior transmitter in imd product results? Your kidding right?

http://www.eham.net/ehamforum/smf/index.php/topic,75182.0.html

Those of us with K3's running 15v PS with heavy cable inputs, driving clean
amps escape the wrath of the imd police.
The 5000 is way better esp in class A operation.

>A fully-loaded K3 is about $4900, and that assumes 8 pole filters in all
slots in both receivers. A fully loaded FT-5000 is $5600. The FT-5000
exceeds the K3's >receiver performance in one category, and trails the K3 in
every other RX performance category. The K3 also has a superior transmitter,
as evidenced by the >IMD numbers in ARRL test results and elsewhere.

>73,
>Scott, N9AA

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N0AZZ

Re: Happy But Very Sad

In reply to this post by Robert Vargas (KP4Y)

Robert:

I could not agree with you more I own all brands of equipment and all have
their positive and negative aspects in one way or another. I'm currently on
6 different radio reflectors and try to keep up to date with all new models
and specs for them just something I enjoy doing.

There is one thing that Elecraft does that stands well above all others and
that is service and support and some of the best documentation for their
kits of any I have ever seen. I as have said I am a proud owner of a K2 and
plan on buying other products as well. Discussions on radios have raged for
over 75 yrs I guess and will continue far after I'm gone. Anyone up for a
SDR receiver discussion? 8-)

73'

Fred/N0AZZ

-----Original Message-----
From: [hidden email]
[mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Robert Vargas
Sent: Friday, June 22, 2012 6:14 PM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Happy But Very Sad

Love my K3 as I know I will love my KX3 on order and I love
Elecraft customer support and the fact that the owners stand behind their
products and are real gentlemen. However, if I had $5K to spend and the
difference between a fully loaded K3 and the FT-5000 was around $500-$700, I
would blindly go with the FT-5000. The specs are close for me and I have
operated the FT-5000 and believe that it also has a great receiver. The
difference I believe lies in the construction/workmanship of both radios and
I'm reminded about that every time I turn the K3 VFO. I believe that the KX3
pricing is more inline with what you are getting but the K3 is IMHO slightly
overpriced for a kit. But, I then have to realize that someone has to pay
for the magnificent intellectual work that Wayne and Eric have done in the
development of the K3's firmware, and that is worth the money. I really look
forward to better construction/workmanship for the K4...

Robert, KP4Y

________________________________
From: Scott Manthe <[hidden email]>
To: [hidden email]
Sent: Friday, June 22, 2012 6:54 PM
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Happy But Very Sad

I said the K3's transmitter was superior to the FT-5000, not perfect.
The ARRL review lists the 3rd order TX IMD numbers at -30db for the 5000 and
-29 dB for the K3, but those numbers alone don't tell the whole story. Take
at look at the ARRL's phase noise numbers and spectral display
characteristics for the FT-5000's transmitted signal and compare them to the
K3 and then get back to us. To be fair, the K3 tested does seem to have an
issue with inferior 9th order IMD numbers, though.

These figures were without the FT-5000's processor turned on, which of
course, dirties up the 5000's signal quite a bit, unless that "feature"
has been fixed. If it has, many contesters will be tearing up, because that
and the key clicks help FT5000 ops get higher scores.

Re: your other post, my K3 is rated at 100 watts output, so I'm sure someone
running one at 120 watts will notice that the performance does degrade. I
find the slightly higher PS voltage an intriguing idea.

The FT-5000 is a fine rig, and is fairly clean in class A mode, with the
processor turned off, but most people don't run them that way.

73,
Scott, N9AA

On 6/22/12 5:48 PM, Adrian wrote:

> K3 a superior transmitter in imd product results? Your kidding right?
> Out in the real world the K3 has a bad rep for splatter and imd3 product.
> See;
>
> http://www.eham.net/ehamforum/smf/index.php/topic,75182.0.html
>
> Those of us with K3's running 15v PS with heavy cable inputs, driving
> clean amps escape the wrath of the imd police.
> The 5000 is way better esp in class A operation.
>

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