Interesting K3 Pan Adapter Development
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Hi Frank, GI4NKB: >Why would I want to remove my hands from keyboard and mouse to reach across a bench to fiddle with knobs when a mouse click or click and drag can do the same only quicker? To state that a mouse or keyboard does not make for rapid tweaking is akin to saying a keyboard and mouse does not make for rapid letter writing. I would ask the article's author Vic K1LT who has "been there and done that". I notice many who are "no knobs" advocates are never seen high in contest standings. K1LT actually does place well in contests so I tend to attach some credibility to his comments. I found 112 K1LT contest results hits below: http://dayton.contesting.com/archives//html/3830/ ...but I don't see any results for GI4NKB. When I begin to see some "no knobs" folks placing high in actual results, then I will become a true believer. Until then, I am like the guys from Missouri..."Show Me". >Yes it will because then more people will be staring at a spectrum scope and clicking on it to qsy to any intersting looking signals but wondering why they then have to leave this environment to fiddle with knobs The beauty of a K3 / Panadapter is that you can use mouse, knobs or both. You are not forced to only either/or. 73, Bill W4ZV _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
Re: Interesting K3 Pan Adapter Development
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Given that "no knobs" operations are pretty new, and only possible
with some radios, I think you may be confusing a correlation with a causation. When "no knobs" operators have the experience that "with knobs" operators do, then we may see different results. It also is dependent on the "no knobs" interface. It does look as if the K3 is the radio that may make this transition and experience possible. 73, doug Date: Thu, 01 Nov 2007 13:17:49 -0400 From: Bill Tippett <[hidden email]> Hi Frank, GI4NKB: >Why would I want to remove my hands from keyboard and mouse to reach across a bench to fiddle with knobs when a mouse click or click and drag can do the same only quicker? To state that a mouse or keyboard does not make for rapid tweaking is akin to saying a keyboard and mouse does not make for rapid letter writing. I would ask the article's author Vic K1LT who has "been there and done that". I notice many who are "no knobs" advocates are never seen high in contest standings. K1LT actually does place well in contests so I tend to attach some credibility to his comments. I found 112 K1LT contest results hits below: http://dayton.contesting.com/archives//html/3830/ ...but I don't see any results for GI4NKB. When I begin to see some "no knobs" folks placing high in actual results, then I will become a true believer. Until then, I am like the guys from Missouri..."Show Me". >Yes it will because then more people will be staring at a spectrum scope and clicking on it to qsy to any intersting looking signals but wondering why they then have to leave this environment to fiddle with knobs The beauty of a K3 / Panadapter is that you can use mouse, knobs or both. You are not forced to only either/or. 73, Bill W4ZV _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
Re: Interesting K3 Pan Adapter Development
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In reply to this post by Bill W4ZV
Bill Tippett wrote:
> > > Hi Frank, Hi Bill! > I would ask the article's author Vic K1LT who > has "been there and done that". I notice many who are "no > knobs" advocates are never seen high in contest standings. > K1LT actually does place well in contests so I tend to attach > some credibility to his comments. > > I found 112 K1LT contest results hits below: > > http://dayton.contesting.com/archives//html/3830/ > > ...but I don't see any results for GI4NKB. When I begin to > see some "no knobs" folks placing high in actual results, > then I will become a true believer. Until then, I am like > the guys from Missouri..."Show Me". Thanks for that Bill. I hadn't realised until you pointed it out that to win a contest I don't need huge amounts of real estate, an antenna farm, massive power and skill. All I need are knobs! Rather than avoiding the issues raised and cherry picking K1LT's article what you should be doing is asking yourself "why is K1LT using SDR?" think about it. Oh and please don't label me as a "no knobs" person, I've plenty of radios with knobs on them including K2's. I simply find as one who has used computers for fun and work for years that it is no big deal using a computer to control a radio it is in truth very intuitive and quick. If you'd read my original post properly you would realise that if contesting with a computer based logger you're effectively a "no knobs" person anyway! Whether you care to admit it or not :) > >Yes it will because then more people will be staring at a spectrum scope > and clicking on it to qsy to any intersting looking signals but > wondering why they then have to leave this environment to fiddle with > knobs > > The beauty of a K3 / Panadapter is that you can use > mouse, knobs or both. You are not forced to only either/or. And neither are you forced to do either with a Flex/PowerSDR combo. 73, Frank GI4NKB -- _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
Re: Interesting K3 Pan Adapter Development
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Frank, Et Al,
Okay. I have to fess up... I'm a programmer (or am trying to make some money doing it!). The real question is, how well is the interface written? I've seen really, really bad interfaces. Better off with pen and paper. Or, to keep the analogy, better off with "knobs." But, on the other hand, a well designed interface makes the task almost a joy. And, in fact, even in the "real world" of knobs, there are good and bad designs. In the long run, I expect that flexibility, price and customization of computer interfaces will, for many Amateur applications, outstrip the physical interface. Myself, I like the physical. I guess in that way, I'm "old school." I like dipping meters and turning knobs. There is a challenge and a fuller relationship between operator and machine when there one is more involved. This is also one of the reasons I like kits and straight key CW. Of course, there are things I do on the computer that help operation, like logging and a spectrum programs (yeah, I'm a geek too!). Regards, kurtt Kurt Pawlikowski, AKA WB9FMC (KX-1) The Pinrod Corporation [hidden email] (773) 284-9500 http://pinrod.com Frank Hunter wrote: > Bill Tippett wrote: >> >> >> Hi Frank, > > Hi Bill! > >> I would ask the article's author Vic K1LT who >> has "been there and done that". I notice many who are "no >> knobs" advocates are never seen high in contest standings. >> K1LT actually does place well in contests so I tend to attach >> some credibility to his comments. >> >> I found 112 K1LT contest results hits below: >> >> http://dayton.contesting.com/archives//html/3830/ >> >> ...but I don't see any results for GI4NKB. When I begin to >> see some "no knobs" folks placing high in actual results, >> then I will become a true believer. Until then, I am like >> the guys from Missouri..."Show Me". > > Thanks for that Bill. I hadn't realised until you pointed it out that > to win a contest I don't need huge amounts of real estate, an antenna > farm, massive power and skill. All I need are knobs! Rather than > avoiding the issues raised and cherry picking K1LT's article what you > should be doing is asking yourself "why is K1LT using SDR?" think > about it. Oh and please don't label me as a "no knobs" person, I've > plenty of radios with knobs on them including K2's. I simply find as > one who has used computers for fun and work for years that it is no > big deal using a computer to control a radio it is in truth very > intuitive and quick. If you'd read my original post properly you would > realise that if contesting with a computer based logger you're > effectively a "no knobs" person anyway! Whether you care to admit it > or not :) > >> >Yes it will because then more people will be staring at a spectrum >> scope >> and clicking on it to qsy to any intersting looking signals but >> wondering why they then have to leave this environment to fiddle with >> knobs >> >> The beauty of a K3 / Panadapter is that you can use >> mouse, knobs or both. You are not forced to only either/or. > > And neither are you forced to do either with a Flex/PowerSDR combo. > > 73, Frank GI4NKB Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
Re: Interesting K3 Pan Adapter Development
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Kurt Pawlikowski wrote:
> Frank, Et Al, Hello Kurt! > Okay. I have to fess up... I'm a programmer (or am trying to make > some money doing it!). I'm not :) > The real question is, how well is the interface > written? I've seen really, really bad interfaces. Better off with pen > and paper. Or, to keep the analogy, better off with "knobs." But, on the > other hand, a well designed interface makes the task almost a joy. And, > in fact, even in the "real world" of knobs, there are good and bad > designs. Well like everything it has it's good and bad points, eg I'd really like the noise reduction function to have a slider to control it and a keyboard shortcut for the MOX button would be nice, on the other hand changing TX and RX bandwidth "on the fly" is pretty neat. But remember it is only software! Better than that it's open source software, so you can improve the bits you don't like (if you have the ability) in fact it is actively encouraged. Why don't you head on over to Flex's site and download PowerSDR and a few audio files and try it for yourself? > In the long run, I expect that flexibility, price and > customization of computer interfaces will, for many Amateur > applications, outstrip the physical interface. I agree, it was seminal moment for me when my softrock took to the air, here was a few cheap componemts with clever software offering a price/performance ratio that was simply staggering. > Myself, I like the > physical. I guess in that way, I'm "old school." I like dipping meters > and turning knobs. There is a challenge and a fuller relationship > between operator and machine when there one is more involved. This is > also one of the reasons I like kits and straight key CW. Oh I love my knobs and meters too :) To me there is no greater thrill than working dx with a few watts from a homebuilt RX/TX and cw, but I imagine the relationship between operator and machine is just as rewarding for someone who has written or improved the code controlling his radio. TBH, I see little if any difference between turning a knob or twiddling a mouse wheel - they both get the job done. Should we not as hams have always done use or modify that which is cheaply available? In days gone past it was military surplus, nowadays it is cheap consumer pc hardware and electronics that is available with the added bonus that it keeps getting cheaper and better, we ignore it because it has no knobs at our peril! I'll make this my last posting on the subject to the group as I'm sure it's starting to bore people, I'll reply to you privately Bill. 73, Frank GI4NKB -- _______________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Post to: [hidden email] You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com |
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