K3/HL-1.2Kfx
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I've purchased a preowned THP amplifier to use until the KPA500 is
available. The Amp calls for ALC. Not having that, is there any precaution to be noted? Want to be sure before hooking it us. Phil Philip LaMarche LaMarche Enterprises, Inc [hidden email] www.LaMarcheEnterprises.com <http://www.lamarcheenterprises.com/> 727-944-3226 727-937-8834 Fax 727-510-5038 Cell www.w9dvm.com <http://www.w9dvm.com/> K3 #1605 CCA 98-00827 CRA 1701 W9DVM ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html |
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Don't overdrive it.
--- On Fri, 7/2/10, Phil LaMarche <[hidden email]> wrote: From: Phil LaMarche <[hidden email]> Subject: [Elecraft] K3/HL-1.2Kfx To: [hidden email] Date: Friday, July 2, 2010, 10:45 AM I've purchased a preowned THP amplifier to use until the KPA500 is available. The Amp calls for ALC. Not having that, is there any precaution to be noted? Want to be sure before hooking it us. Phil Philip LaMarche LaMarche Enterprises, Inc [hidden email] www.LaMarcheEnterprises.com <http://www.lamarcheenterprises.com/> 727-944-3226 727-937-8834 Fax 727-510-5038 Cell www.w9dvm.com <http://www.w9dvm.com/> K3 #1605 CCA 98-00827 CRA 1701 W9DVM ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html |
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In reply to this post by Phil LaMarche-2
> I've purchased a preowned THP amplifier to use until the KPA500 is > available. The Amp calls for ALC. Not having that > ... In addition to setting the drive power to the level needed by the amp, the K3* does* have ALC support. It is covered in the manual under the description for the ACC conenctor as well as a section headed "External ALC." 73, Lyle KK7P ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html |
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On Fri, 02 Jul 2010 10:00:19 -0700, Lyle Johnson <[hidden email]>
wrote: The K3 does have ALC output, but you shouldn't use it. Using ALC on any amplifier, with any rig will usually cause transmitted signal problems. Just tune the amp with the recommended drive and put it on standby when not using it (don't forget to reset the power if you turned it up after tuning). I use an Alpha 87A and have never used the ALC on it in the 7 years I've owned it. Alpha recommends that it not be used. > >> I've purchased a preowned THP amplifier to use until the KPA500 is >> available. The Amp calls for ALC. Not having that >> ... > >In addition to setting the drive power to the level needed by the amp, >the K3* does* have ALC support. It is covered in the manual under the >description for the ACC conenctor as well as a section headed "External >ALC." > >73, > >Lyle KK7P Tom Childers N5GE Antenna 4507 Branchview Drive Arlington, TX 76017 817-478-6200 [hidden email] http://www.n5ge.com ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Amateur Radio Operator N5GE
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In reply to this post by KK7P
True!
(Lyle is always right!). But owners of older K3s who want to avail themselves of the ALC support (as a precautionary backup only) need to be reminded of the following (to which Lyle was referring): 1) Be sure you have performed the Elecraft hardware mod entitled, "K3 External ALC Modification & Band Data Pull-up Resistor Modification" (Revision A4, February 14, 2009). If your rig was manufactured prior to December 10, 2008 (approximately s/n 2362 and earlier) you must do this modification before activating the External ALC feature in the K3, otherwise damage could occur to the K3 DSP module. More recent K3s already incorporate this mod. If you are not sure, check with Elecraft to determine if your particular K3 (KIO3 specifically) included the Band Data Pull-up Mod. 2) You MUST use updated firmware versions... MCU version 1.99 (or later) and DSP version 1.76 (or later). As a matter of course, EVERYONE should already be using the most current Beta version. 3) After the above modifications have been done, set the External ALC menu setting to negative 4 volts or whatever the manufacturer of your amp recommends (CONFIG: EXT ALC ON ... -4). You must have TECH MODE enabled in order to access this menu entry. 73, Kent K9ZTV SN 21 On 7/2/2010 12:00 PM, Lyle Johnson wrote: > > In addition to setting the drive power to the level needed by the amp, > the K3* does* have ALC support. It is covered in the manual under the > description for the ACC conenctor as well as a section headed "External > ALC." > ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html |
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In reply to this post by N5GE
On 7/2/2010 10:49 AM, Radio Amateur N5GE wrote:
> The K3 does have ALC output, but you shouldn't use it. Using ALC on > any amplifier, with any rig will usually cause transmitted signal > problems. This is absolutely true, but there's no reason you can't set it to not activate under normal conditions and simply depend on it to catch mistakes, like accidentally putting 100w into an amplifier that requires 40 watts for full output. This may engender peace of mind, especially with solid-state amplifiers whose instruction books tell you that you MUST use ALC. -- Vic, K2VCO Fresno CA http://www.qsl.net/k2vco/ ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html |
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In reply to this post by N5GE
This subject comes up occasionally, and I would remind all of you that
Tokyo Hy-Power recommends the proper adjustment and use of ALC to provide a safety limit on your power output from your radio - not a contast "throttling" of your radio's output that would cause distortion like some other solid state amp company seems to recommend(?). ALC in the context of a solid-state amp is not equivalent to an amplifier using tubes. Period. So, bottom line, unless you are willing to assume the cost of repairs that might be necessary due to overdriving a THP amplifier, one should not advise to ignore the manufacturers' instructions. 73, Bob W5OV Array Solutions Tokyo Hy-Power Dealer & THP Factory Warranty Service Center > On Fri, 02 Jul 2010 10:00:19 -0700, Lyle Johnson <[hidden email]> > wrote: > > The K3 does have ALC output, but you shouldn't use it. Using ALC on > any amplifier, with any rig will usually cause transmitted signal > problems. > > Just tune the amp with the recommended drive and put it on standby > when not using it (don't forget to reset the power if you turned it up > after tuning). > > I use an Alpha 87A and have never used the ALC on it in the 7 years > I've owned it. Alpha recommends that it not be used. > >> >>> I've purchased a preowned THP amplifier to use until the KPA500 is >>> available. The Amp calls for ALC. Not having that >>> ... >> >>In addition to setting the drive power to the level needed by the amp, >>the K3* does* have ALC support. It is covered in the manual under the >>description for the ACC conenctor as well as a section headed "External >>ALC." >> >>73, >> >>Lyle KK7P > > Tom Childers > N5GE Antenna > 4507 Branchview Drive > Arlington, TX 76017 > 817-478-6200 > [hidden email] > http://www.n5ge.com > > ______________________________________________________________ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:[hidden email] > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html |
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I'm curious as to whether or not Lyle's assertion "The K3 does have
ALC output, but you shouldn't use it." will hold strictly true for the future KPA500. I wouldn't be surprised at all if the tight integration between K3 and KPA500 presumes the use of ALC since it's "there". If so, I'll need to upgrade my early K3s, which shipped with the original oddball ALC scheme, so it would be nice to know in advance. Happy Independence Day! Bob NW8L On Sun, Jul 4, 2010 at 4:46 AM, <[hidden email]> wrote: > This subject comes up occasionally, and I would remind all of you that > Tokyo Hy-Power recommends the proper adjustment and use of ALC to provide > a safety limit on your power output from your radio - not a contast > "throttling" of your radio's output that would cause distortion like some > other solid state amp company seems to recommend(?). > > ALC in the context of a solid-state amp is not equivalent to an amplifier > using tubes. Period. > > So, bottom line, unless you are willing to assume the cost of repairs that > might be necessary due to overdriving a THP amplifier, one should not > advise to ignore the manufacturers' instructions. > > 73, > > Bob W5OV > Array Solutions > Tokyo Hy-Power Dealer & > THP Factory Warranty Service Center > Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html |
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> I'm curious as to whether or not Lyle's assertion "The K3 does have > ALC output, but you shouldn't use it." Lyle never said that. Someone was quoting my response and had my name at the top followed by their assertion, and my comments a few paragraphs down. In fact, the K3 has ALC *input* that is compatible with most amplifiers, assuming the K3 has the negative ALC mod. The negative ALC has been standard in production for the K3 for many, many months now. In general, I suggest you set the K3 to run the amplifier at its normal level, and have ALC connected in case something goes mildly wrong and the amplifier requests drive be reduced , but before the amplifier faults and goes off-line. One should never crank up the transmitter/exciter to the amplifier, and then use ALC to throttle back the drive as this usually leads to splatter and other undesirable traits. The ALC has not yet been activated in the KPA500, but will be soon. My prototype KPA500 is operating nicely on the air with today's KPA500 firmware update :-) . I set the drive from the K3 to get about 450W to 500W on peaks. The amplifier is good to well over 600 watts, so that leaves plenty of margin, better IMD, etc. 73, Lyle KK7P ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html |
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> Lyle never said that. Someone was quoting my response and had my name
> at the top followed by their assertion, and my comments a few paragraphs > down. Sorry about the wrongly attributing that remark to you, Lyle. Yes, I understand the case where ALC is mis-applied as a form of drive control, it's been frequently discussed here. It was the "last ditch" amplifier protection case mentioned by W5OV in an earlier message that to my mind seemed possible and maybe even recommended in the case of the K3/KPA500 system. That's why I asked - I wondered if the KPA500 will provide ALC output and if the amp protection case would be supported. Since it will be, and seems a desirable equipment safety feature, I'll plan on updating my older K3s to be compatible. It's easy nowadays with the availability of the REMIOUPGD KIO3 replacement boards. Bob NW8L On Sun, Jul 4, 2010 at 12:41 PM, Lyle Johnson <[hidden email]> wrote: > >> I'm curious as to whether or not Lyle's assertion "The K3 does have >> ALC output, but you shouldn't use it." > > Lyle never said that. Someone was quoting my response and had my name > at the top followed by their assertion, and my comments a few paragraphs > down. > > In fact, the K3 has ALC *input* that is compatible with most amplifiers, > assuming the K3 has the negative ALC mod. The negative ALC has been > standard in production for the K3 for many, many months now. > > In general, I suggest you set the K3 to run the amplifier at its normal > level, and have ALC connected in case something goes mildly wrong and > the amplifier requests drive be reduced , but before the amplifier > faults and goes off-line. One should never crank up the > transmitter/exciter to the amplifier, and then use ALC to throttle back > the drive as this usually leads to splatter and other undesirable traits. > > The ALC has not yet been activated in the KPA500, but will be soon. My > prototype KPA500 is operating nicely on the air with today's KPA500 > firmware update :-) . I set the drive from the K3 to get about 450W to > 500W on peaks. The amplifier is good to well over 600 watts, so that > leaves plenty of margin, better IMD, etc. > > 73, > > Lyle KK7P Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[hidden email] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html |
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