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K3: Make Monitor level track AF level?

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w8fn

K3: Make Monitor level track AF level?

I'm finally coming to terms with K3 3260, born July '09. It's at last
fully integrated into the station, and the diversity receive
capability just blows what's left of my mind. This thing is like a
race car: it rolls off the trailer pretty damn fast, but once you
start fine-tuning it it just gets better and better. To further
belabor the race car analogy, my trusty old FT-1000D is like a NASCAR
stocker, big and heavy but a bulletproof performer. The K3 is like an
Indycar or a Formula I car, maybe somewhat more delicate and fussy,
but able to perform at a considerably higher level once it's set up
and the driver learns to get the most from it.

Now that I (mostly) know how to operate the K3, I suppose I'm
qualified to start picking nits about how certain things work. The
thing that bothers me the most is the Monitor function, especially
for CW. For any serious DX or contest work I always use headphones,
but I sometimes like to just grab the paddle and work somebody using
the station speaker. I normally keep the Monitor level set at about
20-25, since that's what I find most comfortable when I'm using
headphones. When I'm using the speaker, I can hardly hear the
sidetone or the spot tone. If I go ahead and crank up the Monitor
level to where I can hear it in the speakers, the next time I use
headphones I'll forget to readjust the level and the sidetone will
practically rip my head off. Unfortunately, the Monitor level is
independent from the AF level so just turning down the volume, which
I always do when using phones, doesn't keep me from getting blasted.

What I would like to see would be a firmware change that allows the
Monitor level to be adjusted to a percentage of the main receive
level, or perhaps set to a specific offset value in dB, such that the
relative levels between the main audio and the monitor signal always
track as the AF control is varied. I take the audio from the K3 rear
panel SPKRS jack to route into my station audio switching for either
the headphones or the speaker, so I would rather see it done this way
than by making a Monitor level change when the hardware detects that
the phones have been plugged in.

I've looked through the reflector archives and can't seem to find any
posts that address my concern. That doesn't mean there aren't any; I
just didn't see them. Does this suggestion "sound" like a useful
firmware tweak to anyone else here?

73...
Randy, W8FN

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Steve Ellington

Re: K3: Make Monitor level track AF level?

Randy:
I have just the opposite problem. With my 32 ohm headphones I have to crank
up the sidetone to 40 but down to 15 with the 8 ohm speaker. It wouldn't be
so bad if I didn't have to listen to the tone while adjusting. There's 2
problems with this method. If I want to change sidetone level while in QSO,
I miss words the other station is sending or have to pause my sending while
adjusting the level. Why must that tone be present? I know of no other rig
that does this. If I remove my headphones and start to call CQ, I blast the
entire house with my sidetone. I quickly remember that I forgot to turn it
down before removing my cans. So I push the sidetone button and blast
everyone again until I can get it cranked down. This is a very strange
system. If I wanted to hear the tone, I could just press the "Pitch" button!
Having the sidetone track with the AF gain is nice as long as it's also
independently adjustable but for some reason there are some ops who are
strongly opposed to this....Something to do with riding the AF gain for weak
signals etc.... Anyway. I would just like to be able to disable the tone
when adjusting the level.

Steve
N4LQ
[hidden email]
----- Original Message -----
From: "Randy Farmer" <[hidden email]>
To: <[hidden email]>
Sent: Friday, September 18, 2009 2:35 PM
Subject: [Elecraft] K3: Make Monitor level track AF level?

> I'm finally coming to terms with K3 3260, born July '09. It's at last
> fully integrated into the station, and the diversity receive
> capability just blows what's left of my mind. This thing is like a
> race car: it rolls off the trailer pretty damn fast, but once you
> start fine-tuning it it just gets better and better. To further
> belabor the race car analogy, my trusty old FT-1000D is like a NASCAR
> stocker, big and heavy but a bulletproof performer. The K3 is like an
> Indycar or a Formula I car, maybe somewhat more delicate and fussy,
> but able to perform at a considerably higher level once it's set up
> and the driver learns to get the most from it.
>
> Now that I (mostly) know how to operate the K3, I suppose I'm
> qualified to start picking nits about how certain things work. The
> thing that bothers me the most is the Monitor function, especially
> for CW. For any serious DX or contest work I always use headphones,
> but I sometimes like to just grab the paddle and work somebody using
> the station speaker. I normally keep the Monitor level set at about
> 20-25, since that's what I find most comfortable when I'm using
> headphones. When I'm using the speaker, I can hardly hear the
> sidetone or the spot tone. If I go ahead and crank up the Monitor
> level to where I can hear it in the speakers, the next time I use
> headphones I'll forget to readjust the level and the sidetone will
> practically rip my head off. Unfortunately, the Monitor level is
> independent from the AF level so just turning down the volume, which
> I always do when using phones, doesn't keep me from getting blasted.
>
> What I would like to see would be a firmware change that allows the
> Monitor level to be adjusted to a percentage of the main receive
> level, or perhaps set to a specific offset value in dB, such that the
> relative levels between the main audio and the monitor signal always
> track as the AF control is varied. I take the audio from the K3 rear
> panel SPKRS jack to route into my station audio switching for either
> the headphones or the speaker, so I would rather see it done this way
> than by making a Monitor level change when the hardware detects that
> the phones have been plugged in.
>
> I've looked through the reflector archives and can't seem to find any
> posts that address my concern. That doesn't mean there aren't any; I
> just didn't see them. Does this suggestion "sound" like a useful
> firmware tweak to anyone else here?
>
> 73...
> Randy, W8FN
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:[hidden email]
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

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w8fn

Re: K3: Make Monitor level track AF level?

>It wouldn't be so bad if I didn't have to listen to the tone while
>adjusting. There's 2 problems with this method. If I want to change
>sidetone level while in QSO, I miss words the other station is
>sending or have to pause my sending while adjusting the level. Why
>must that tone be present? ... If I wanted to hear the tone, I could
>just press the "Pitch" button!

Or the "Spot" button. I thought that's what it's there for. I quite
agree. The pitch adjustment on the K3 has seemed weird to me from day
one. Why not just be able to adjust the Pitch in receive mode and
hear the received audio tone change in real time? I certainly don't
understand why it's necessary to mute the receive audio while the
pitch is being adjusted. I definitely don't know what's going on
under the software hood when the pitch is adjusted, but it seems to
me it can't be all that much different from what happens when you
just turn the Shift knob on the front panel. I expected to hear that
effect the first time I played with the pitch, but that wasn't what
happened. It sent me to the manual to see if I had screwed up the
configuration somehow.

And as long as we're asking for changes, why not make the CW and Data
mode monitor levels independent? I sure don't need to listen to
transmitted PSK tones like I do CW sidetone.

>Having the sidetone track with the AF gain is nice as long as it's
>also independently adjustable but for some reason there are some ops
>who are strongly opposed to this....Something to do with riding the
>AF gain for weak signals etc....

How about a configuration item such as MonTk = ON or MonTk = OFF?

>Anyway. I would just like to be able to disable the tone when
>adjusting the level.

Me, too.

73...
Randy, W8FN

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Brett Howard

Re: K3: Make Monitor level track AF level?

In reply to this post by w8fn

This was asked for in the past and it turns out that more people wanted
it the way it is at the moment but it was not really a landslide it was
fairly balanced.

Personally I agree and would like the option to have it track the AF
knob. But this hasn't really risen to the top of the list (if it even
made the list) considering that it was the less popular option last
time.

~Brett

On Fri, 2009-09-18 at 13:35 -0500, Randy Farmer wrote:

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