Elecraft

K3 VLF transverter?

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Bob KD7YZ

K3 VLF transverter?

Howdy K3' people:

I'd like to listen down around and below 100kHz

Well, and be ready to transmit if they approve us to xmit in the 137kHz
area ( I think that's the proposed new band anyway).

Anyone using a good transverter for that area on their K3?

thanks

--
73
KD7YZ Bob

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John Hendricks-2

Fwd: K3 VLF transverter?

Look at April 2002 QST for building plans. This Upconverter along with the Sept 2001 QST Active LF Antenna works very well.

John Hendricks
Sent from my iPod

Begin forwarded message:

> From: KD7YZ Bob <[hidden email]>
> Date: November 30, 2012, 6:50:27 PST
> To: K3 List <[hidden email]>
> Subject: [Elecraft] K3 VLF transverter?
>
> Howdy K3' people:
>
> I'd like to listen down around and below 100kHz
>
> Well, and be ready to transmit if they approve us to xmit in the 137kHz
> area ( I think that's the proposed new band anyway).
>
> Anyone using a good transverter for that area on their K3?
>
> thanks
>
>
>
> --
> 73
> KD7YZ Bob
>
> ______________________________________________________________
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>
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k6dgw

Re: K3 VLF transverter?

In reply to this post by Bob KD7YZ

On 11/30/2012 6:50 AM, KD7YZ Bob wrote:
> Howdy K3' people:
>
> I'd like to listen down around and below 100kHz

I use a Palomar VLF converter [0-500Kc --> 3.5-4MHz] coupled to my flag
pole on the deck with about 9m of insulated wire. It is receive only
and actually goes up to about 580Kc before things start to drop off.
The LORAN-C station in Middletown CA overloaded the front end but
LORAN-C is gone now and I've occasionally heard a couple of the XSH-xx
stations. KSM on 426Kc on Saturdays is usually around S8 during the
day. Alas, I don't think the converter is made any more.
>
> Well, and be ready to transmit if they approve us to xmit in the 137kHz
> area ( I think that's the proposed new band anyway).

135.7-137.8 I think. I've seen two TX strategies: One is to divide a
crystal oscillator [the one I saw used a cheap CB crystal] down to a
frequency within the 2.1 KHz bandwidth, the other mixed a crystal
oscillator with a VCXO such that the difference frequency fell in the
band. An EFHW antenna is "only" 1.1km long. :-) 2.1KHz would
accommodate one SSB signal?

73,

Fred K6DGW
- Northern California Contest Club
- CU in the 2013 Cal QSO Party 5-6 Oct 2013
- www.cqp.org

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Tony McClenny

Heil Kenwood / Elecraft AD-1-KM Modular Connector

If anyone needs this Headphone to Rig adaptor cable, I have one in original
package (never opened), which I would like to send to a good home. Price is
only $15 plus actual shipping cost.

- Tony, N3ME -

118 Ashwood Street
Bethany Beach, DE 19930-9699
(302) 539-5638
Grid: FM28lm

http://www.n3me.net
Elecraft K3 # 2462
PVRC Member

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Bob KD7YZ

Re: K3 VLF transverter?

In reply to this post by k6dgw

On Friday Jensen used a Straight-Key to send:
-------------Original Comment-------

> band. An EFHW antenna is "only" 1.1km long. :-)
I can do that here.

> 2.1KHz would
> accommodate one SSB signal?

that's funny! I forgot that one .. but I was thinking really about JT9-1
mode .. wsjtx from K1JT ... nice and narrow

--
Best regards,
Bob KD7YZ Win7-64bit + K3

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Mike Morrow-3

Re: K3 VLF transverter?

In reply to this post by Bob KD7YZ

> KSM on 426Kc on Saturdays is usually around S8 during the day.

That's a very interesting operation, ham/commercial operator led and
fully described at:

http://radiomarine.org/gallery/show?keyword=ksmstation&panel=pab1_2

I miss MF maritime Morse more than any other radio service, and I regret
dropping my commercial radiotelegraph ticket 20 years ago.

>> Well, and be ready to transmit if they approve us to xmit in the 137kHz
>> area (I think that's the proposed new band anyway).
>
> 135.7-137.8 I think.

There's only a recent NPRM before the FCC for that band, but US authorization
is unlikely in the near future...if ever.

One hopes for quick FCC authorization for the 472 to 479 kHz band that WARC
approved in 2012:
http://www.arrl.org/news/amateur-radio-gets-secondary-mf-allocation-at-wrc-12

This MF band should be most interesting...a link back in radio history.

New improved and fully-assembled Palomar Engineers VLF converters appear to be
available through K1EL Ham Radio Kits. See: http://k1el.tripod.com/VLF.html .

I use a US Navy AN/WRR-3B receiver for 14 to 600 kHz reception.

73,
Mike / KK5F
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Mike B-12

Re: K3 VLF transverter?

There's also the Jackson Harbor Press converter, at http://wb9kzy.com/lfconv.htm

73,

Mike, KW1ND
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Jim Low man

Re: K3 VLF transverter?

In reply to this post by Mike Morrow-3

That's quite an operation that MRHS runs, and it's all-volunteer.

It's great to see the preservation effort, unlike VOA stations that are
being left to whatever.

If you ever get a chance to visit, MRHS holds operations most Saturdays,
and a chance to visit Point Reyes National Seashore makes it even better.
Licensed amateurs can operate K6KPH on 7.050 and 14.050 MHz as guests,
and they recently got operations going on 17m. The crew there are most
hospitable.
We were there last summer, on July 12th, for the "Night of Nights"
event. This is the date that commercial marine radio traffic ceased
using CW.
Richard Dillman and some of his crew were at Pacificon both last year
and this year, with a remote operation that keyed the transmitters at
Bolinas Bay from the hotel.
He gave quite an interesting presentation last year, but for some reason
was turned down this year.
They are selling T-shirts through Zazzle to generate operating funds.
Donations are also welcome, as they have a rhombic antenna that needs
some work.

73 de Jim - AD6CW

On 11/30/2012 12:53 PM, Mike Morrow wrote:

>> KSM on 426Kc on Saturdays is usually around S8 during the day.
> That's a very interesting operation, ham/commercial operator led and
> fully described at:
>
> http://radiomarine.org/gallery/show?keyword=ksmstation&panel=pab1_2
>
> I miss MF maritime Morse more than any other radio service, and I regret
> dropping my commercial radiotelegraph ticket 20 years ago.
>
> 73, Mike / KK5F

Joe Subich, W4TV-4

Re: K3 VLF transverter?

In reply to this post by Mike B-12

The Palomar and Jackson Harbor products are both *receive converters*.
They are not transverters (transceive converters) which is the topic
of this thread.

At this time I know of no transceive (transmit *and* receive)
converter for the amateur LF/VLF allocations. Perhaps Elecraft
will be offering an XL10 transverter (say 10 watt output with
switchable output filters for 137 and 490 KHz) by the time the
"bands" are open. Shouldn't be that hard to do with 10 MHz IF.

73,

... Joe, W4TV

On 11/30/2012 4:26 PM, Mike wrote:

> There's also the Jackson Harbor Press converter, at http://wb9kzy.com/lfconv.htm
>
> 73,
>
> Mike, KW1ND
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>

Mike B-12

Re: K3 VLF transverter?

On 11/30/2012 04:56 PM, Joe Subich, W4TV wrote:
>
> The Palomar and Jackson Harbor products are both *receive converters*.

Correct.
> They are not transverters (transceive converters) which is the topic
> of this thread.
>
> At this time I know of no transceive (transmit *and* receive)
> converter for the amateur LF/VLF allocations.

Nor do I. That's why I mentioned a receive converter - at least it's 1/2 of the
equation.

73,

Mike, KW1ND
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k6dgw

Re: K3 VLF transverter?

In reply to this post by Bob KD7YZ

Narrowband weak signal digital modes that can get some gain from
source/channel coding will probably dominate LF operation if we in the
US ever get a general allocation. US utility companies run their PLC
systems in that range and are, or at least act like they are, very
worried about QRM. Since they are SCADA systems for control of the
power grid, and the FCC is sensitive to it, so any allocation is likely
to have a fairly stringent ERP limit, and signals will be weak for sure.

I don't know how high an EFHW would have to be to be effective. With
the exception of high power coastal stations [huge rhombics/curtains],
most LF TX antennas are vertical-ish.

I was kidding about the SSB. :-) I just noticed the BW was 2.1 KHz
which was the BW of the Collins mech filter for SSB.

I don't know what the market for a suitable transverter would be for
Elecraft but my guess is ... not big. What comes out the 8.125 MHz BNC
IF connector when you transmit?

73,

Fred K6DGW
- Northern California Contest Club
- CU in the 2013 Cal QSO Party 5-6 Oct 2013
- www.cqp.org

On 11/30/2012 12:36 PM, KD7YZ Bob wrote:

>
> On Friday Jensen used a Straight-Key to send:
> -------------Original Comment-------
>
>> band. An EFHW antenna is "only" 1.1km long. :-)
> I can do that here.
>
>> 2.1KHz would
>> accommodate one SSB signal?
>
> that's funny! I forgot that one .. but I was thinking really about JT9-1
> mode .. wsjtx from K1JT ... nice and narrow
>

Edward R Cole

Re: K3 VLF transverter?

In reply to this post by Bob KD7YZ

I am working up a design for a 470-480 KHz transverter to have a 25w
output. One version would use the K3 in TEST mode on 10.470-10.480
being mixed with a high stability 10-MHz OCXO. But also looking at a
version that would use 3.570-3.580 mixing with a 3.1 MHz xtal osc.
for the usual ham radio that will not transmit outside of a ham
band. A built-in 20 dB 50w attenuator would lower HF transmitter
levels. This would lower 25w to .25w and an adjustable 0-20 dB
attenuator would lower the level for correct input to the mixer. A
low-level sma connector would permit driving the adjustable atten
directly with up to 100mw.

I already have a prototype mixer-buffer that outputs 10mw for
transmit-only. I chose 25w as antennas at 500-KHz exhibit very low
efficiency (my 43x122 foot inverted-L radiates 4.15w ERP with 100w
output from my 500-KHz transmitter). A 25w output would result in
about 1w ERP which is the highest permitted level expected for the
new ham band.

I still have to chose a good preamp design and final amp design. I
will use pin-diode switching.

At this point its only on-paper idea, but I hope to be early in the
market when the band is finally offered for ham use.

Ed - KL7UW
Sixty North Electronics
"Kits made by KL7UW"
www.kl7uw.com

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Geoffrey Mackenzie-Kennedy-3

Re: K3 VLF transverter?

Ed,

Because in the past my e-mails direct to you have not been delivered, could
you please let me know if you receive the direct copy this e-mail.

Depending on your requirements for a good preamp (OIP2, OIP3, NF, Gain etc),
I might be able to offer some suggestions if this would be of any help.

To avoid cluttering up the List, I would prefer to do this "Off Lisr".

My apology to all for posting this.

73,

Geoff
LX2AO

On December 02, 2012 at 11:35 AM, Edward R Cole wrote:

< snip >

> I still have to chose a good preamp design and final amp design. I will
> use pin-diode switching.
>
> At this point its only on-paper idea, but I hope to be early in the market
> when the band is finally offered for ham use.

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Edward R Cole

Re: K3 VLF transverter?

In reply to this post by Bob KD7YZ

Geoff,

I have not received direct e-mails from you. I have copied your
e-mail and the Elecraft Reflector to see if I can make it back to
you. Thanks to the list for this test with Geoff.

I would be interested in preamp designs you have.

73, Ed - KL7UW

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Geoffrey Mackenzie-Kennedy-3

Re: K3 VLF transverter?

Ed,

I received your direct e-mail which you sent to me on Dec.3, thanks.
According to a kind person who subscribes to the Elecraft List, it appears
that my IP address may be on a few Anti Spam engines, hence my mail to you
is being blocked.

73,
Geoff
LX2AO

On December 03, 2012 at 6:47 PM, Edward R Cole wrote:

> Geoff,
>
> I have not received direct e-mails from you. I have copied your e-mail
> and the Elecraft Reflector to see if I can make it back to you. Thanks to
> the list for this test with Geoff.
>
> I would be interested in preamp designs you have.
>
> 73, Ed - KL7UW

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