[K3] Why is the serial data transfer rate so slow?

[Barry]

Did a firmware update this morning.  After I awoke from my nap, it was almost done.
Seriously, why only 38.4K?  Makes me think back to the DOS days and Hayes modems.

[ab2tc]

Hi,

I don't know how long your nap was, but if it takes more than a few minutes something else is wrong. 38400Bd is not an unreasonably low baud rate for a small processor such as the one in the K3. I have never understood why most radios, including the K3 have so underpowered main processors. But higher serial speed may not materially speed up the firmware updates anyway, since it may be limited by the time it takes to write to flash.

AB2TC - Knut

Barry wrote

Did a firmware update this morning.  After I awoke from my nap, it was almost done.
Seriously, why only 38.4K?  Makes me think back to the DOS days and Hayes modems.

[Scott Manthe-2]

I've never had a firmware update take more than a couple of minutes. But
I'm using a Mac, so maybe that is one of the many benefits of my
decision to transition away from Windows...

73,
Scott, N9AA



On 4/3/13 9:04 AM, Barry wrote:
> Did a firmware update this morning.  After I awoke from my nap, it was almost
> done.
> Seriously, why only 38.4K?  Makes me think back to the DOS days and Hayes
> modems.
>
>
>
> --
>

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[Matt Zilmer]

Some possible answers:

1.  The K3 isn't a networked computer, so Ethernet is out.
2.  USB is way overkill in terms of speed, but would work.  USB can
produce significant amounts of RF noise, depending on the quality of
the cable used.
3.  Even paged Flash writes take a few 10's of mS to execute, plus
each page write needs to be verified.  Raising the transfer rate
wouldn't help much.  I'm sure Wayne buffers incoming data while
executing the Flash write, but clearing the write is probably the
bottleneck to transfer performance.
4.  Single-ended serial is relatively RF-quiet and it's ubiquitous.
Well, at least it *used* to be.

:)

73,
matt W6NIA

On Wed, 03 Apr 2013 06:04:15 -0700 (PDT), you wrote:

>Did a firmware update this morning.  After I awoke from my nap, it was almost
>done.
>Seriously, why only 38.4K?  Makes me think back to the DOS days and Hayes
>modems.
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[Chris Schrecengost]

I have to agree with the others here. There's something wrong on your end.
The update process takes no more than a couple of minutes and most of that
is just the time for the wipe and write processes in the radio itself, not
the transfer.

Keep in mind that most manufacturer's radios top out at a maximum of
38,400bps. That is a common serial top end. My prior FT-857D had three
choices, 4800, 9600, or 38400.

You aren't pushing volumes of data. This is a small file. What you are
experiencing is not normal. Look for other issues related to the computer
for the slowness.

Chris
AB3QV
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[Barry]

I didn't time it, but it seemed much slower than usual.  This brought two things to mind.  First, wondering why the max speed is 38K, when serial ports have higher speeds; and second, is something funky was going on?  I believe this is the first K3 firmware update I've done since adding a P3 to the line.  Does that slow it down?

Barry W2UP
P.S.  Apologies for not IDing in my original post - an oversight.

[Jack Brindle-2]

The time needed for a firmware update is more limited by the time needed to write each word of data to flash memory than the data rate. It takes about 5 milliseconds to write each word to flash, so if the program you are updating is lengthy, then it is going to take a while.

What this means is that even at 38400 bps, we still have to wait for the processor to write its data. Increasing the data rate would not speed things up.

Jack Brindle, W6FB

Sent from my iPad

On Apr 3, 2013, at 10:49 AM, Barry <[hidden email]> wrote:

> I didn't time it, but it seemed much slower than usual.  This brought two
> things to mind.  First, wondering why the max speed is 38K, when serial
> ports have higher speeds; and second, is something funky was going on?  I
> believe this is the first K3 firmware update I've done since adding a P3 to
> the line.  Does that slow it down?
>
> Barry W2UP
> P.S.  Apologies for not IDing in my original post - an oversight.
>
>
>
> --
> View this message in context: http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/K3-Why-is-the-serial-data-transfer-rate-so-slow-tp7572129p7572148.html
> Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
> ______________________________________________________________
> Elecraft mailing list
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[GARY-2]

Barry,
Do you have the TRACE function enabled in your K3 utility software (VIEW>
TRACE)? If so then I suggest you deselect it. The trace function will slow
down the firmware upload significantly. Trace and Verbose Logging both are
best used when needed then turned off (unchecked).
Gary N6LRV

-----Original Message-----
From: [hidden email]
[mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Barry
Sent: Wednesday, April 03, 2013 6:04 AM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: [Elecraft] [K3] Why is the serial data transfer rate so slow?

Did a firmware update this morning.  After I awoke from my nap, it was
almost done.
Seriously, why only 38.4K?  Makes me think back to the DOS days and Hayes
modems.



--
View this message in context:
http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/K3-Why-is-the-serial-data-transfer-rate
-so-slow-tp7572129.html
Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
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